SURVEY: Did the US elect the right person as President?

[Time Traveller]

10 hours ago, Jingthing said:

That is correct.

I wonder if the Syrian and Libyan people believe that

[Gary A]

14 minutes ago, Time Traveller said:

Slavery? That's the dumbest thing I have read in a long time. 

Most democracies use a similar system in tallying up electorates and not the total number of votes across the nation.

 

 

 

Are you aware that the democratic party was created to preserve the slave trade? The republican party freed the slaves.

[pgrahmm]

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=598130190359668&id=363765800431935

 

If the shoe <deleted> fits.......!

 

Every adult should watch/listen to this.....

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

2 hours ago, JDGRUEN said:

 

Your Leftist Anti - American Education is showing ... 

 

Well that didn't take long. Now liberals are anti-American.

 

When will the House be convening the Committee on Un-American activities.

http://www.rightwingwatch.org/report/the-rise-of-the-new-mccarthyism/

 

You think the election concluded your revolution? There is a long way to go yet and those at whom your sneer have a lot more energy and a lot more time available than you.

 

#werestillhere

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

7 hours ago, dcutman said:

Well the way you are ranting, raving,  and attacking people, as well as giving your opinion on the 12th amendment, it sure does seem you have a serious issue with the outcome of this election and by the law that determined this outcome.

In no way did I instruct you to anything, but a mere suggestion.

A few more suggestions for you.

Take a deep breath

Try and relax

Have a great day

 

Read your Madison.

 

If I have a serious issue with the legal basis for the last election, then I am in good company.

 

Your instructions are ill-advised and equally ill-received. But hey, I guess it means you don't have to respond to the issue, just keep on crowing we past the due date.

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

3 hours ago, simple1 said:

 

Donald Trump's gift to Australia worth billions in the long run

 

 

 

http://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/donald-trumps-gift-to-australia-worth-billions-in-the-long-run-20161111-gsn8me.html

 

Note there is a lot of discussion in Oz on whether or not Trump will adhere to this campaign promises and the resultant pros and cons on the Oz economy, plus additional defense costs. The TPP being negated by the USA is considered by many in as a step backward as Free Trade Agreements have overall increased jobs and profits. Attacking Free Trade and Tariff agreements - primarily based on outright lies by certain parties is nonsensical.

 

Thank you for the link. I will be interested in what it says.

[seedy]

Derogatory post Removed

 

Edit:   As well as some off-topic, bickering, troll posts and replies.  

Edited November 14, 2016 by Scott

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

28 minutes ago, Si Thea01 said:

 

Thank you for your assessment; your hypophora question; your knowledge, and lastly, your ability with words has not been missed and has been duly noted.  You have a nice day too.

 

 

I did not answer my own questions. They were Socratic, not hypophoric. You provided no basis for your claims. Simple1 sent a link to the reference so now I can look at the reasoning that has produced the claims that you bandied about with such bluster.

 

You may keep your notebook on its dusty shelf. This thread is not about me or my writing style.

 

Enjoy your proxy victory while it lasts. The shine started wearing off within hours of the election result. The election result has deepened issues, not resolved them and in no way provides a mandate for opposition.

 

#werestillhere

[Si Thea01]

I thought in America that anyone, regardless of race, ethnicity, or creed, could aspire, if capable, to become president of the US of A.  Even HRC said this to young women in one of her speeches.  So when this happened, when an outsider and not a Democrat won, the left and elitists went ape and despite saying they would accept the result, now they will not.   

[silent]

23 minutes ago, fvw53 said:

 

...and you believe that ....55555555

Listen it's no laughing matter. When Noah finishes building his ark in that great big huge, huge, I mean huge swamp way bigger than the ocean, there won't even be enough to float his rubber ducky. 

[maewang99]

Trump Caught Picking His Feet in Poughkeepsie.
 

Myron Ebell says "of the leading Climate scientists it's (at best, only) a 60:40 debate".... not 99.9% consensus.
 

Okay.  make my day.
 

I do 6. a Trump supporter/denier follows up with their best 4. then we repeat the whole deal over and over....

my first 6.....

 1. Paul Hearty   
    U North Carolina

 

 2. Evgeniya Kandiano   
    Helmholtz Centre for Ocean Research
 

 3. Isabella Velicogna   
    UC Irvine
 

 4. Karina von Schuckmann   
    University of Toulon
 

 5. Junji Cao   
    Chinese Academy of Sciences (China..... oh yeah.... China!!!!!!)
 

 6. Makiko Sato   
    Columbia

Now gimme 4 "no problemo" guys and gals.
 

 

Edited November 14, 2016 by maewang99

[Rob13]

6 minutes ago, maewang99 said:

Trump Caught Picking His Feet in Poughkeepsie.
 

Myron Ebell says "of the leading Climate scientists it's (at best, only) a 60:40 debate".... not 99.9% consensus.
 

Okay.  make my day.
 

I do 6. a Trump supporter/denier follows up with their best 4. then we repeat the whole deal over and over....

my first 6.....

 1. Paul Hearty   
    U North Carolina

 

 2. Evgeniya Kandiano   
    Helmholtz Centre for Ocean Research
 

 3. Isabella Velicogna   
    UC Irvine
 

 4. Karina von Schuckmann   
    University of Toulon
 

 5. Junji Cao   
    Chinese Academy of Sciences (China..... oh yeah.... China!!!!!!)
 

 6. Makiko Sato   
    Columbia

 

 

what are you on about?

[maewang99]

Climate.  this is the new EPA head guy for Donald Trump. 

he says 40% of climate scientists believe as he does that Co2 is "not something to worry about at all"
 

most folks say 99% say the ****opposite****
 

so I listed my first 6.  now a Trump person can give me 4.  then we repeat.

or is it all just nonsense?

 

p.s. I was a Trump supporter.  Hillary is just nonsense too.

 

 

Edited November 14, 2016 by maewang99

[simple1]

1 hour ago, Time Traveller said:

Well there's your mistake. You gone believing that media propaganda again. Will the loony left never learn?

 

If you are referring to Free Trade Agreements and associated tariff advantages, at least in Australia, the main criticism against reversal of current agreements is from the centre right of politics.

 

When will those indulging in hypocrisy and negativity learn? At this stage looks as though Trump is doubling down on right of centre elitist appointees - what a joke with his claims of 'draining the swamp'.

Edited November 14, 2016 by simple1

[dhream]

My views are liberal.  

Clinton NOT liberal.

Better Trump.

He's nothing if not authentic.

[Si Thea01]

1 hour ago, Tawan Dok Krating Daeng said:

 

I did not answer my own questions. They were Socratic, not hypophoric. You provided no basis for your claims. Simple1 sent a link to the reference so now I can look at the reasoning that has produced the claims that you bandied about with such bluster.

 

You may keep your notebook on its dusty shelf. This thread is not about me or my writing style.

 

Enjoy your proxy victory while it lasts. The shine started wearing off within hours of the election result. The election result has deepened issues, not resolved them and in no way provides a mandate for opposition.

 

#werestillhere

 

Do you really believe everything you say? Oh, That's right, if one says it often enough it becomes fact.

Edited November 14, 2016 by Si Thea01

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

14 minutes ago, Si Thea01 said:

 

Do you really believe everything you say? Oh, That's right, if one says it often enough it becomes fact.

 

Is this a response to my post or just general musings to the universe at large? Not really much of a counterpoint and you still make this thread about me.

 

Let the revolution continue.

 

#werestillhere

[Tawan Dok Krating Daeng]

5 hours ago, JDGRUEN said:

 

American college / university educated people voted for Obama because they were given educations by Leftists, Socialists and Communists who spent inordinate time indoctrinating students in their slanted Anti-American rewrite of history and politics... Many of those same people you speak of voted for Obama out of a false White Guilt instilled in them by the same professors I just mentioned.  They were taught to despise Capitalism upon which America was built.  They were taught that America must pay for its sins of oppression regardless of how imagined and manufactured as these sins actually were.  In short voting college educated Americans in 2008 and 2012 had and still have a distorted view of America and fell right in line with America hating Obama.  Obama went to a church for over 20 years headed by a pastor (a converted Muslim|) who preached 'God Damn America' for those 20 years but Obama said it had no effect on his beliefs of what America is... hogwash.  Obama is the reason for the rise of Trump ... excesses of Obama spewing hate for traditional America for eight years laid the ground work for rejection of HRC as she was expected to further Obama's agenda and even worse ... 

 

Your civics teachers certainly let you down. Perhaps instead of accusing educators of being commies, you may want to apply yourself to some lessons.

 

You confuse system of government with structure of government. Only the insane Right Wing nativists claim that America is not a democracy. They do this to peddle their selfish, elitist economic policy of 'self improvement' and keep up or be left behind. These nuts have a fear that a democracy allows lazy people to vote themselves entitlements.

 

Democracy is a system of government. Republicanism is one structure of democratic government.

 

You have zero authority to critique African American pastors preaching about African American experiences. Please be clear in your terminology. You use 'traditional' when you clearly mean 'white'.

[maewang99]

I want names.  From Trump supporters.  names.  not Hillary nonsense.

 

Myron Ebell... Donald Trumps designate for the EPA says 40% of climate scientists believe Climate is not a worry.  he was countering an interviewer who believes it is less than 1%.

so I give 6... a Trump supporter who believes Trump talks straight gives me 4 names... and we repeat...

6 who say "worry".

then someone gives me 4 "no problemo" scientists..... that ****I**** can Google...... or Baidu!  
 

1. Paul Hearty    U North Carolina
2. Evgeniya Kandiano    Helmholtz Centre for Ocean Research

3. Isabella Velicogna    UC Irvine

4. Karina von Schuckmann    University of Toulon

5. Junji Cao    Chinese Academy of Sciences (yes, China)

6. Makiko Sato    Columbia

 

Edited November 14, 2016 by maewang99

[Si Thea01]

1 minute ago, maewang99 said:

I want names.  From Trump supporters.  names.  not Hillary nonsense.

 

Myron Ebell... Donald Trumps designate for the EPA says 40% of climate scientists believe Climate is not a worry.  he was countering an interviewer who believes it is less than 1%.

so I give 6... a Trump supporter who believes Trump talks straight gives me 4 names... and we repeat...

6 who say "worry". now somebody give my 4 "no problem" scientists that I can Google...... or Baidu!  

 

1. Paul Hearty    U North Carolina
2. Evgeniya Kandiano    Helmholtz Centre for Ocean Research

3. Isabella Velicogna    UC Irvine

4. Karina von Schuckmann    University of Toulon

5. Junji Cao    Chinese Academy of Sciences (yes, China)

6. Makiko Sato    Columbia

 

What in the heck are you on.  This is not the topic so get back on otherwise you and  a couple of others will see this topic closed.

[maewang99]

the topic says Trump.... my post is about Trump.  how is that off topic?

about the only thing a president does is make speeches and ****appointments****... and this is one of the first of those.  helloooooo????

 

Edited November 14, 2016 by maewang99

[pgrahmm]

 

Intermission......With a little poke at the lunatic fringe/rioters.....

Just for fun.....

 

Jousting - measuring the longest lance - restarts in 5 minutes....

 

 

[pgrahmm]

 

[Si Thea01]

Just now, maewang99 said:

 the topic says Trump.... my post is about Trump.  how is that off topic? 

 

 

Aren't you talking about climate change and just throwing in the name of Trump to get those who supported him to comment.

 

This is what it is about.  "Did the US elect the right person as President?"   Not about who says what about climate change.   

[charmonman]

On November 12, 2016 at 1:06 PM, thai3 said:

Clinton was a corrupt, arrogant liar so how could anyone vote for the <deleted>? Of course the best candidate won.

So you don't think Trump is a corrupt, arrogant liar? 

 

I'm not a US citizen, so I really don't care what he does to the US. As long as he doesn't spread the inevitable damage of his ignorance to the rest of the world I am completely fine with a Trump presidency. I might start studying Russian or Mandarin because the era of the US as the dominant world power will be over once Trump has his way with it for four years.

[abrahamzvi]

23 hours ago, Si Thea01 said:

 

 

Who gives  tinker about HRC, she is over and out now.  What occurred is the way America has voted democratically for decades and no matter how much people bleat and cry it ain't going to change a thing.  Get over it and get on with it.

Although the final tally is not completed yet (some districts in California are still counting and reporting) HRC is ahead in the popular vote by over 1 Million!!! Although I do say that President Elect Trump was democratically elected under a system, which again is proven to be undemocratic, he will be the President of ALL Americans on January 20th and all just have to accept it. However, it is, or should be, obvious to all that the EC system is undemocratic and has to be changed. Or is it democratic that over a million votes have to be ignored????

[pgrahmm]

 

Interesting - worth watching ---> 100% on topic.....

................Please watch..............

 

Leadership -        versus subservience ..... 

Edited November 14, 2016 by pgrahmm

[charmonman]

19 minutes ago, Si Thea01 said:

 

 

Aren't you talking about climate change and just throwing in the name of Trump to get those who supported him to comment.

 

This is what it is about.  "Did the US elect the right person as President?"   Not about who says what about climate change.   

The point is that the right person was NOT elected because he believes in pseudo-science rather than real science on the subject of climate change. I think the "right" person to be President is the one who will solve real problems with real solutions, not just send out angry tweets and pander to every right-wing Breitbart-sponsored conspiracy theory out there.

[Thakkar]

11 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Pure hype. Economists never predicted a depression. The recession hit rock bottom a month before Obama was even in office and started to recover a few months later. Barrack Obama had very little to do with any of that.

 

http://www.investors.com/politics/policy-analysis/did-obama-really-prevent-a-second-great-depression/

 

As far as Heath insurance goes, he passed it without a single Republican vote and it is imploding exactly as they predicted. He also lied his head off to the American people about Obamacare and was awared Lie of the Year for doing so. These are the policies that Hillary intended to double down on which is why she was not elected.

 

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/article/2013/dec/12/lie-year-if-you-like-your-health-care-plan-keep-it/

 

Tv 16

Sorry for the long post, but to respond properly it's necessary. It is easier to fire off flippant criticisms than it is to elucidate nuanced facts.

 

In early 2009, the economy was not at all recovering. It hadn't even hit rock bottom yet. In fact, the legacy harm from the Bush recession was so sever that unemployment continued to rise long after the end of the Bush presidency.

ARRA, (the 2009 stimulus passed under Obama) succeeded in boosting the economy by several percentage points and creating the equivalent of several million jobs, according to economists and the Congressional Budget Office.
http://mediamatters.org/research/2012/09/07/fox-edits-history-of-the-stimulus-to-falsely-cl/189803

 

Weeks after [not before!] stimulus went into effect, unemployment claims began to subside (but still rising). Twelve months later, the private sector began producing more jobs than it was losing, and it has continued to do so for twenty-three straight months, creating a total of nearly 3.7 million new private-sector jobs. 
http://washingtonmonthly.com/magazine/marchapril-2012/obamas-top-50-accomplishments/

 

(See below for chart from a rare honest Republican website I will talk about later).

 

The above article is dated April 2012. Since then, jobs growth has continued till today.

 

There's more in that article, including this:
Passed Mini Stimuli: To help families hurt by the recession and spur the economy as stimulus spending declined, signed series of measures (July 22, 2010; December 17, 2010; December 23, 2011) to extend unemployment insurance and cut payroll taxes. [The kind of tax cut that helps the people who need help as well as helps the economy because they tend to spend this money by loosening their tightened belts instead of hoarding it like the rich, often abroad.]

 

And this:
A ten year assistance program for returning veterans to improve their job prospects.

Later in 2009, President Obama helped General Motors and Chrysler transition through bankruptcy, a move that experts estimate saved well over a million jobs.

Without the federal assistance that Obama authorized, the companies would have been liquidated.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/02/10/us-usa-campaign-romney-michigan-idUSTRE8190YM20120210

 

President Obama also signed significant consumer protections into law with the passage of new credit card regulations in 2009 and the 2010 financial reform law that created the Consumer Finance Protection Bureau. Another of Obama's significant regulatory accomplishments was his push for the regulation of greenhouse gasses after the Environmental Protection Agency determined that they were a pollutants that threatened human health. The first bill Obama signed into law was the Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, which expands opportunities for women to sue over pay discrimination. He also seated two female Supreme Court justices in his first term, including the first Hispanic justice, and oversaw the end of the discriminatory "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy, which banned openly gay Americans from serving in the military during his first term in office.

 

RE: Affordable Care Act
Until Obama proposed it, this was a wholly Republican idea. In spite of having all the votes he needed, Obama went against his own party which demanded Universal Healthcare and adopted a plan proposed by the Rightwing Heritage Foundation, a plan Romney enacted as Gov of Mas. And a plan he initially praised. It is also a plan that was earlier proposed by a dozen Republican State governors.

 

Obama went out of his way and defied his own party and his own voter base to reach across the aisle to work with Republicans only for the Republicans to spit in his face. The ACA received zero Republican votes.

 

A good site for a quick rundown of the ACA is Republicans for Obama, one of the few Rightwing sites that backs up its praise AND criticism of Obama with credible data. http://www.republicansforobama.org/firstterm

 

A major reason the ACA hasn't worked as well as it could is due to obstruction from numerous Republican state governors who have been working harder to try to make Obama fail than to make the lives of their constituents better.

 

Re: your politifact link
Obama's assurance that people can keep the plan they already had was indeed declared by politifact as lie of the year. Obama acknowledged his statement was wrong, and apologized. But dig deeper into that politifact article and you see that there is nuance even with this "lie of the year":
"he fought back against inaccurate attacks with his own oversimplifications, which he repeated even as it became clear his promise was too sweeping...on Oct. 1, insurers started sending out cancellation letters for 2014. No one knows exactly how many people got notices, because the health insurance market is largely private and highly fragmented. Analysts estimated the number at about 4 million (and potentially higher), out of a total insured population of about 262 million.
That was less than 2 percent, but there was no shortage of powerful anecdotes about canceled coverage...Obama offered an administrative fix that same day, allowing state insurance commissioners to extend current plans. But only some have chosen to do so.
In announcing the fix, Obama again conceded he had exaggerated. "There is no doubt that the way I put that forward unequivocally ended up not being accurate," he said. "It was not because of my intention not to deliver on that commitment and that promise.  We put a grandfather clause into the law, but it was insufficient."

 

Since you trust politifact, you might want to also see their devastating take on Republicans and Trump. You will find that, on the whole, Republicans, Trump and right wing media lie more often and more egregiously than Democrats, MSM and left wing media.

 

The charts below are from politifact. Only 15% of Trump's statements are true/mostly true as opposed to 51% of Hillary's statements and 48% of Obama's.

All politicians lie, but Trump is an out and out conman, so he lies bigly and is in a league of his own.

Again, my apologies for the long post, which, even at at this length, barely begins to properly untangle the complex issues thrown up in your two sentences. As Twain said, "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." 

 

T

 

[mania]

33 minutes ago, abrahamzvi said:

Although I do say that President Elect Trump was democratically elected under a system, which again is proven to be undemocratic, he will be the President of ALL Americans on January 20th and all just have to accept it. However, it is, or should be, obvious to all that the EC system is undemocratic and has to be changed. Or is it democratic that over a million votes have to be ignored????

 

Is it Democratic that this is our system?

Why ask now?

 

Our system allows for changes....thru PROPER  channels. These bleating protesters know this...or should know. If they don't like it seek to change it....in the future elections...period

 

As you say Trump is President elect now......like it or leave it.

Those that claim not my president...go then...go to a country with one that is yours.

 

Is it as you ask democratic that some are ignored? None are ignored anymore than those that wanted x and got y

This is not a pure Democracy as explained many many times before In these threads. The USA is a special circumstance not like other countries.

 

Lastly I would also say those of you from other countries that think your country has a pure democracy.....think again

There is no such thing as one man one vote period

How about those voters that think both suck? Are their  votes or lack thereof ignored?

Does your pure Democracy's also have "none of the above" on the ballots?

 

In any case...done and dusted...protesters want to peacefully gather like snowflakes and sing kumbaya  go for it. Violent destructive protest ? ...up to you but...don't roll those dice if you can't pay the price.

Paper protestors that live in Thailand & talk large about resistance ......gimme a break..your water hose is not long enough to water that tree.

Edited November 14, 2016 by mania