Walking Street land owners again scuttle demolition plan

[Bangkok Barry]

18 hours ago, impulse said:

 

Tame the walking street a little bit, along with the criminal vermin that are always drawn to ply their trade around sin, vice and the easy money they lure in.  (Think ladyboys braining guys with spiked heels for their bling)   Perhaps families and non sex-oriented tourists will fill the gap.  Notice I said Tame the walking street.  Not do away with it completely.

 

The question is the balance between the easy money from appealing to the vices, against a tougher job to actually compete for money from families with accommodations, goods and services worth paying for. 

 

One of those paths throws Thailand's daughters into prostitution and servitude to the depravity of sex tourists.  The other one may be less lucrative for the Elite who control it all.  I know which way I'd like to see it go.

 

To attract families Pattaya needs to do far more than raze a few bars on Walking Street. Like provide a decent beach, ensure there are no turds in the sea, remove traffic that chokes Beach Road, provide a decent and reliable transport system and not Baht Buses which visitors have no idea of the routes they go, get rid of the preying ladyboys once and for all instead of hauling them in once a month and fining them a few hundred baht......

As for the prostitutes being in servitude, they might be to their leeching family. That is a cultural issue that will probably take generations to overcome and if they can't send money home from WS then they'll find somewhere else to ply their trade. And I don't think you've chosen the right word to describe sex tourists. Depravity means perversion. But if two adults having consensual sex is your view of depravity, then you are of course allowed that opinion.

[Sparkles]

1 hour ago, Dukeleto said:

Like all the beach stalls, restaurants and beach chairs they removed from Patong beach. Now all I can smell walking down the walkway next to the beach is the very strong smell of urine. If you going to knock everything down you need to put people there to look after it in place of those who had a vested interest to look after it. Part of the allure of tourist and repeat tourists is the slap dash way things are put together here. If they wanted pristine sanitised "expensive" developments most of them need not leave home. In an effort to clean things up they are slowly but surely killing the very thing the tourist industry in this country is based on. If you leave business operators alone to get on with making money and concentrate on extracting the appropriate taxes it's a win win for both sides. Governments have no idea how to make money they only know how to spend it. That stems largely from the fact that anyone with half a business brain would not seek employment in such an institution so they are devoid of sufficiently business thinking individuals. Yet these are the folk making the decisions that affect business people who understand the business. When business wanes it's these folk who need to adapt or go under. People flock to Pattaya because of walking street....not a park! There must be a million other government owned land parcels they could turn into a park or anything they wish to turn it into. But no, lets flatten the no.1 tourist attraction for the city and replace it with a park. They really are experts in the art of foot shooting 101. One only has to look at the tourist numbers 3 years ago and compare them to now to know they are strangling the goose that lays the golden egg.

It will never be a park.Thats a bit like suggesting the  Sydney Opera House will be demolished to extend the adjoining park.

Walking Street has become an iconic part of Thailand.

It's a human zoo where you can roam and see every species known to man.You dont have to partake,its selfie heaven

In fact I would suggest that "Walking Street" outscores any other attraction in Pattaya if there were any.

 

[Grubster]

15 hours ago, fforest1 said:

'Walking Street property owners again have successfully thwarted '

 

What does this title imply? That the property owners are a greedy nasty lot that

are standing the way of some glorious new development?

 

Walking street put Pattaya on the map and is Pattayas #1 tourist attraction..

 

Every business in Pattaya profits directly or indirectly from Walking Street..from the noodle stand to the Hilton to dental offices to 7-11s...

Every one with a business or job in Pattaya should stand behind the Walking street property owners to stop any tear down...

 

Every one should take a good long look at how much land would be gained from a tear down..There would be one small narrow stretch of land and a bit more beach and that is it...There will be NO park,because there is

no land for a park,or any other glorious development...

 

Walking street is what it is...Its for sure different from where the tourist come from...Thats why the tourist travel, to see some thing different.

Thats why they have all flocked to see Walking street for almost

50 years....

 

Man....All people involved need think this thing through with a little critical thinking.... 

 

 

 

They may want to take a look at what happened in Cuba when they shut down the night life there.  Apples to Oranges maybe, but when you start to shut down a very profitable industry there will be ramifications.

[impulse]

2 minutes ago, Sparkles said:

It will never be a park.Thats a bit like suggesting the  Sydney Opera House will be demolished to extend the adjoining park.

Walking Street has become an iconic part of Thailand.

It's a human zoo where you can roam and see every species known to man.You dont have to partake,its selfie heaven

In fact I would suggest that "Walking Street" outscores any other attraction in Pattaya if there were any.

 

Las Vegas certainly didn't miss a $$$ beat when they made their human zoo "family friendly".  It was kind of nice to walk down the strip without being accosted by guys on every block pushing business cards with naked hookers into my hands.  I don't think anyone's suggesting doing away with Walking Street.  Just making it a little less dodgy.

 

There's money in those family bank accounts and piggy banks.  Looking for a place to get spent on holiday.  They'd be more likely to spend it on Walking Street if they didn't have to put up with aggressive ladyboys, dildo vendors and the like.

[impulse]

19 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

And I don't think you've chosen the right word to describe sex tourists. Depravity means perversion. But if two adults having consensual sex is your view of depravity, then you are of course allowed that opinion.

 

Sorry.  Anyone who selects a travel destination in an economically disadvantaged country for the express purpose of satisfying their sexual urges at a discounted price is depraved in my book.

 

It's not so much the consensual sex, as it is taking advantage of the economic disparity to get a cut rate.  And the fact that "consensual" generally means "out of economic necessity" under those conditions.

 

Feel free to disagree, or to put me on ignore.

Edited December 17, 2016 by impulse

[craigt3365]

6 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Las Vegas certainly didn't miss a $$$ beat when they made their human zoo "family friendly".  It was kind of nice to walk down the strip without being accosted by guys on every block pushing business cards with naked hookers into my hands.  I don't think anyone's suggesting doing away with Walking Street.  Just making it a little less dodgy.

 

There's money in those family bank accounts and piggy banks.  Looking for a place to get spent on holiday.  They'd be more likely to spend it on Walking Street if they didn't have to put up with aggressive ladyboys, dildo vendors and the like.

Being from Vegas, I agree with what you said.  Walking down the strip and being accosted by hookers wasn't always fun.  That was in the 70's.  Vegas blossomed very nicely.  Great party city.  And like you say, there's lots of dodgy stuff going on there.  Some love it, some hate it.  Cleaning up the corruption wouldn't be a bad thing.

 

I like that layout of a potential marina.  Something this area desperately needs.  But then again, you and I are boat people! LOL

[thhMan]

I think Walking Street has lost a lot of its allure, more so when they removed the iconic sign in favor of that BLINDING billboard

 

This latest holiday coming up may be worth noticing as the expats and locals actually see what sort of impact that so much of whats happened to Thailand is reflected on the tourist numbers to places like Walking Street.

 

It maybe the case that Walking Street will continue to be the meca of Pattaya;s tourist industry.

 

We may see more buses holding up traffic, more buses taking up a whole street as they take every available and "No Parking" spots as tourists are carted to places like Walking Street and "designated" places

 

Then again, it may be the opposite as the damage has been done and continues to be done and in some twisted way, the Govt. is actually helping shop owners in Walking Street to make that inevitable decision to close up now, rather than continue to lose money.....

 

I do know that the Ramayana water park is spamming me daily to get my business, as I went there with the family once and was grossly disappointment and never went again.... This maybe a sign of desperation, that is an indication of things to come as tourists vote with their presence (or lack of)

 

Who knows, cleaning up that part of Pattaya might be good in the long run and make the Walking Street area a nice place to have some vacation time with the family.... and at night, perhaps those still running "those" establishments may offer better deals services as well as pay closer attention for the well-being of the tourists as they band together to make sure the extinction of "tourist" is not due to those few who continually damage the reputation of the area....

[farcanell]

18 hours ago, Seismic said:

Why do people always point the finger at "Sex Tourists" when they mention prostitution and servitude in Thailand??. It accounts for less than 10% of the total trade.

 

10% is a big number.... a huge number

 

[Destiny1990]

34 minutes ago, pegman said:

You admittedly have absolutely zero knowledge about  Walking Street but  condem it anyhow. There is 3km of beach just north of it where any "decent hotels" can be built.

 

Name me one thing what you like about walking street in its current condition.?

These buildings are illegally obstructing the breath taking sea views.

now there is to much of the same thing bars bars bars...discos discos discos all illegally built.

How about Stunning  Seaviews  with an seaside park, Marina ,Hotels ,shops ,nearby Casino,some disco bar so u still have your ping pong balls.??

[Bureaucrat]

3 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

The law needs to be enforced.  Otherwise, under the table payments continue and corruption is allowed to flourish.  Lots of money being handed around in this area. 

Laws need to be enforced... rlol 

[Rimmer]

Multiple off topic posts and replies have been removed, topic is about Walking Street and its possible demolition.

[kalidescopemind]

In the year I lived in Pattaya,  Walking Street was the most fun place to go dancing, drinking, and out to dinner.   A park would not be an improvement.  It would be just like the beach with all the katoeys.   At least businesses can control them to some degree.  

[kraxlhuber]

20 hours ago, tracker1 said:

One Government that seems set on creating unemployment one way or another

it is illegal to construct and build any structure  on land or in the seas in Thailand if  many become jobless or homeless (Som Na Na), its aiding and abiding by the Oh so mighty and wealthy criminal Mafia families in Thailand, you know about Mussolinis faith, he was hanged up side  down, teached him a lession

 

[moe666]

All I hear here is OOO please make this just like my home the place I chose to leave because it was boring me to tears. Come o folks like it or not Walking Street is a part of Thailand and by the way families do not spend that much money.

[Golden Triangle]

I was under the impression that city hall wanted to move a lot of the red light area of Walking Street away from there and relocate it to the Soi Bukhaow, Soi Diamond, LK Metro area ? There is a huge plot of land that used to be the old Xcite disc before it mysteriously burnt down.

 

I seem to recollect that sort of move being heralded by city hall so that families could enjoy a family friendly Beach road/Walking Street.  

[Thaidream]

Walking street as it is now set up is finished.  The government in power does not like the in your face sex that exists and is determined to end most of it.  There way of doing this is to start enforcing laws already on the books that have not be enforced.  The squatters will be handled and either leave voluntarily or be bulldozed out. They are just delaying the inevitable but the military government will not be put off much longer. What happened at Bali Hai and Koh Chang should give the squatters a forewarning of what is coming.

 

The tourist business as a whole is in decline and the sex industry more so  for a variety of reasons- prices; lack of talent and mostly owners who do not really understand how to do business and attract customers. Reduce the sex oriented business and much of the unsavory characters that it attracts will disappear .The goal of the government is to make Pattaya a family oriented destination and if they have to sacrifice numbers of Western  tourists to do this they will. 

The free wheeling, anything goes is on its way out and it will never come back. It is already taking place in Bangkok as the powers that be want gentrification and to rebuild the countries reputation. The numbers of entertainment places that are either going out of business; for sale or on the verge of bankruptcy is staggering. I expect Nana Plaza and Soi Cowboy will be gone in 5-10 years as the land they sit on is prime real estate and a developer will offer money that the land owner cannot refuse.  

I don't think the entertainment industry is going to go away but it will evolve and move to locations where it is not so packed together and obvious both in Bangkok, Pattaya and Phuket.

 

 

 

 

[elgordo38]

21 hours ago, Rimmer said:

But owners of those properties, including some of Pattaya’s wealthiest and politically connected families,

And there lies your political impasse for decades to come. Add in the possible loss of tourist dollars and you have hit a political hole in one. Episodes like this rear their ugly head from time to time to explain to the unwashed as who is really in charge. The unwashed are the window dressing the low paid who toil for the elites. The unwashed from time to time get to pick up the crumbs of life that fall off of the elites bountiful table. Its a modern version of how life was conducted in the past 100's of years. 

[Nemesis7]

It will be great to see if actually in reality they can even try to take an approach to demolish anything on that street. But I doubt that , drugs , clubs, oldest profession business made many filthy rich over the decades and the political influence along with it and the main revenue earning source of bib in that district won't let it happen . 

[pegman]

1 hour ago, Destiny1990 said:

 

Name me one thing what you like about walking street in its current condition.?

These buildings are illegally obstructing the breath taking sea views.

now there is to much of the same thing bars bars bars...discos discos discos all illegally built.

How about Stunning  Seaviews  with an seaside park, Marina ,Hotels ,shops ,nearby Casino,some disco bar so u still have your ping pong balls.??

The excitement! Don't give us your phony arguments about sea views and hotels. This country has 1,000's of Km's of beach shoreline where those things can be accommodated. But you are all twisted about 1km of Walking St. Why would that be?  

[Get Real]

Just a plan that has been on the table for how many years? Nothing happened yet, and probably at least 5 year more without change. Just my view on it. Too much interest and too much money involved.

[Gandtee]

Killing the goose that lays the golden egg! Not all tourists are sex tourists but the curiosity value is an attraction and I would suggest many tourists visit Walking Street just for this. And of course the sea view fish restaurants. Please stop trying to sanitise Pattaya. Enough damage has been done already. Built against the law? Years ago maybe when most people were in ignorance of it or ignored it, much the same as today. Let sleeping dogs lie.

[farcanell]

36 minutes ago, elgordo38 said:

And there lies your political impasse for decades to come. Add in the possible loss of tourist dollars and you have hit a political hole in one. Episodes like this rear their ugly head from time to time to explain to the unwashed as who is really in charge. The unwashed are the window dressing the low paid who toil for the elites. The unwashed from time to time get to pick up the crumbs of life that fall off of the elites bountiful table. Its a modern version of how life was conducted in the past 100's of years. 

 

Modern... or simply unevolved SE Asian equivalent?

[Surasak]

16 hours ago, bokningar said:

Have no idea if greedy and nasty, but NOT rightful owners.

That is the point!

 

Rightful owners or not, if it brings tourist to spend money, keeps people employed, gains nothing but a very narrow strip of land of little value, the best solution would be to charge nominal rent.

[Grubster]

There is a lot of beach in Thailand the only reason they are so interested in this short stretch is that the business owners there have made a booming metropolis out of Pattaya.  Had this been a family vacation spot 99.9% of us wouldn't even know where Pattaya is.

               Walking street is one of the most interesting destinations in the world because of those owners, Sin city yes. Thats why they come.

                Thailand has a lot of heavy industry on or near beaches, spewing their waste into the ocean,  go hang out there, you can have the beach to yourself.

[Gudge]

I cant beleive all the negative posts from all he holier than thou upight whining old goats that probably sneak out to walking street when there wives aren't looking. I don't go there often but enjoy it when I do I like to see  the looks on peoples faces as they seem to be enjoyng it. As said before it is one of the main tourist attractions in Pattaya so leave it alone. What next, the night market in Chaing Mai because too many people, too much noise, Siracha Tiger Zoo or Nong Nooch Gardens because the animals should not subjected to all this horrible treatment for the enjoyment of all these terrible tourists. If all these things bother you then maybe you should have stayed in the countries you have come here to scape.

[Minnehaha]

4 hours ago, whatproblem said:

If it's public land isn't that the same as stealing land from the king because thailands is a kingdom

clearly. but which one? the kingdom is a nation is what I think you mean to illustrate

[Thaidream]

None of it bothers me- but I am a realist and the new sheriff in town along with the military government does not like what it sees and is doing something about it.  You can dismiss it if you like but if I had a business on Walking Street, I would be making plans to get out as quick as possible.  The sex industry as it now stands in Pattaya, Bangkok and Phuket is under seige. The only solution is to make it more inconspicuous. It doesn't matter what any of us think- what matters is what the man in charge thinks and he or his representative will be around for a long time to come.

[elgordo38]

6 minutes ago, Gudge said:

I cant beleive all the negative posts from all he holier than thou upight whining old goats that probably sneak out to walking street when there wives aren't looking. I don't go there often but enjoy it when I do I like to see  the looks on peoples faces as they seem to be enjoyng it. As said before it is one of the main tourist attractions in Pattaya so leave it alone. What next, the night market in Chaing Mai because too many people, too much noise, Siracha Tiger Zoo or Nong Nooch Gardens because the animals should not subjected to all this horrible treatment for the enjoyment of all these terrible tourists. If all these things bother you then maybe you should have stayed in the countries you have come here to scape.

Your making a mountain out of a molehill or is it making a bigger mountain out of a smaller mountain. What was the question again. Please speak into my good ear. Hey what did you say. 

[Minnehaha]

2 hours ago, impulse said:

 

Las Vegas certainly didn't miss a $$$ beat when they made their human zoo "family friendly".  It was kind of nice to walk down the strip without being accosted by guys on every block pushing business cards with naked hookers into my hands.  I don't think anyone's suggesting doing away with Walking Street.  Just making it a little less dodgy.

 

There's money in those family bank accounts and piggy banks.  Looking for a place to get spent on holiday.  They'd be more likely to spend it on Walking Street if they didn't have to put up with aggressive ladyboys, dildo vendors and the like.

 

comparing the US management of tourist attractions, zoning, and mafia is unfair to the Thai context. Thais are different. The situation is different. The fact of the matter is: the govt and authorities have no clue what to do, will never go get help from a friendly (like Las Vegas for example?) and will only ever come up with their own creative solutions - night safari or a shopping mall. 

 

the Thai govt are powerless from controlling any kind of development. the only entity who could manage something like this is the crown property bureau. 

 

the mafia who own it all are far too ensconced to be dealt with. and furthermore, other posts are correct, in my opinion, it is something people want to see and visit, so the problem is not removing it but rather managing it. stop here and start over. 

[Minnehaha]

17 minutes ago, Grubster said:

There is a lot of beach in Thailand the only reason they are so interested in this short stretch is that the business owners there have made a booming metropolis out of Pattaya.  Had this been a family vacation spot 99.9% of us wouldn't even know where Pattaya is.

               Walking street is one of the most interesting destinations in the world because of those owners, Sin city yes. Thats why they come.

                Thailand has a lot of heavy industry on or near beaches, spewing their waste into the ocean,  go hang out there, you can have the beach to yourself.

 

there is a lot of crap beach in Thailand that is polluted and terribly unappealing in my opinion