Horrific collision spurs plan to cut number of passenger vans

[webfact]

Horrific collision spurs plan to cut number of passenger vans
By The Nation

 

 

Fatigue suspected as cause of tragedy and drivers to face stricter regulations

 

BANGKOK: -- THE TRANSPORT Ministry plans to strictly control passenger vans and replace them with buses after the fiery accident in Chon Buri on Monday caused 25 fatalities.

 

The Bangkok-bound minivan from Chanthaburi province ran into a pickup truck loaded with passengers and both vehicles burst into flames, killing 14 people in the van and 11 in the pickup. 

 

Two passengers survived the crash. 

 

Transport Minister Arkhom Termpittayapaisith said yesterday that exhaustion might have been a major factor in the accident.

 

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/30303353

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-01-04

 

 

[Somtamnication]

It will never happen. Impossible to manage / underpaid police / overpaid politicians, etc etc etc.

[watcharacters]

 

 

 

 

First of all the problem's not the number of vans,   It's how the  idiots DRIVE!

[jackinthebox]

Like someone else in this forum said months ago (at the 14467th Tour-bus/Van/PickUp-accident): "Just build the f...ing railway and establish a functioning train-system. It will save 10 000s of lifes"

[ezzra]

 

Have a replacement driver,  as they do with the big buses,

who's job will also be to monitor the alertness of the driver

at any time, proving of course he doesn't fall a sleep himself.....

[doremifasol]

 

I don't know in the city, but out here in the sticks

there are so many taxi/van drivers high on drugs.

They look , move and sound like maniacs.

 

So scary.

 

 

[trogers]

3 minutes ago, doremifasol said:

 

I don't know in the city, but out here in the sticks

there are so many taxi/van drivers high on drugs.

They look , move and sound like maniacs.

 

So scary.

 

 

 

Bingo!

 

The problem is with quality, and not quantity, as always...

[selftaopath]

29 minutes ago, Somtamnication said:

It will never happen. Impossible to manage / underpaid police / overpaid politicians, etc etc etc.

Can you tell me/us what the starting salary of a policeman/woman is? How about advancement e.g. time in service/promotion etc.? What might be their educational background etc. in relation to a factory workers salary? I often hear a/b low salaries of police/teachers but would LOVE to see the facts. 

[z42]

Like others have said before, the problem with the vans is generally (not always) not the vehicle itself, it is partly the attitudes of the drivers and the companies who operate them, for example in many vans i have travelled in (necessity more often than not) the seatbelts are intentionally disabled and the driving is intentionally borderline suicidal almost as standard.

The authorities are by the statistics chart alone completely inept at understanding what constitutes safe mass transit operation. The lack of timetabling or regulation of staffing requirements, it is all very 3rd world and has a "do as you please" mentality at its core.

 

And the actual law enforcement arms, well they are conspicuous by their action and subsequent inaction. They are completely bereft of proactive enforcement tactics. days after the 25 death crash, this report emerges

It is reprehensible that this happens, it sends out completrely the wrong message to a society who probably now more than ever need reassurance that the authorities are doing their duties. An utter disgrace

[trogers]

31 minutes ago, selftaopath said:

Can you tell me/us what the starting salary of a policeman/woman is? How about advancement e.g. time in service/promotion etc.? What might be their educational background etc. in relation to a factory workers salary? I often hear a/b low salaries of police/teachers but would LOVE to see the facts. 

 

The fact is - some are paying good money to secure a post as a lowly paid cop...with its silver lining...

[craigt3365]

32 minutes ago, selftaopath said:

Can you tell me/us what the starting salary of a policeman/woman is? How about advancement e.g. time in service/promotion etc.? What might be their educational background etc. in relation to a factory workers salary? I often hear a/b low salaries of police/teachers but would LOVE to see the facts. 

It's not about the starting salary of the policeman.  Yes, it's low, but many make big money via corruption.  Many VERY wealthy policeman.  Positions are bought, not earned.

 

IMHO, the #1 problem in Thailand is the judiciary, especially the police force.  Hard to enforce laws when the enforcers are corrupt to the bone.

[selftaopath]

3 minutes ago, craigt3365 said:

It's not about the starting salary of the policeman.  Yes, it's low, but many make big money via corruption.  Many VERY wealthy policeman.  Positions are bought, not earned.

 

IMHO, the #1 problem in Thailand is the judiciary, especially the police force.  Hard to enforce laws when the enforcers are corrupt to the bone.

I agree with you. This country reeks of corruption. Hell the entire world realizes that.

 

I often hear police have low salary hence corruption. I don't accept this. What is their salary? What is their education? What are their increases annually?  Honestly how does the BIB salary compare to others with equal qualifications?  Or do some think the BIB ought to be paid the same as higher educated/trained/skilled individuals?  I think their salary is proportionate to what they know/do etc.  Upon a moment's reflection perhaps they are overpaid for what they know/do. :-) 

[craigt3365]

6 minutes ago, selftaopath said:

I agree with you. This country reeks of corruption. Hell the entire world realizes that.

 

I often hear police have low salary hence corruption. I don't accept this. What is their salary? What is their education? What are their increases annually?  Honestly how does the BIB salary compare to others with equal qualifications?  Or do some think the BIB ought to be paid the same as higher educated/trained/skilled individuals?  I think their salary is proportionate to what they know/do etc.  Upon a moment's reflection perhaps they are overpaid for what they know/do. :-) 

Positions are paid for.  They make money off how much they can collect in their area.  I can't remember the number, but I believe the chief of police here in Pattaya once went for some 20 million Baht.  You have to take in a lot of corruption money to make that back in a year.

[Wilsonandson]

I thought the fire killed the passengers not the crash. After a couple of days after the tragic crash have the authorities found out what caused the fire? LPG or NGV gas bottles exploding? Shouldn't that be looked into first before banning vans?

I also thought that people sitting in the back of pickup trucks was a dangerous way to travel. What are they going to do about that?

[daveAustin]

Van drivers are on the clock as opposed to schedule... no doubt they get paid more if they get to destination faster. Drugs keeps them awake longer to earn more etc. Scrap them all aside from private services and introduce scheduled minibus services with 90kph speed limiters/trackers. Drivers to undergo proper training, periodically blow into a bag/drug tests. Too ordered/logical?

[thailand49]

This type of solution is sadly the reason why things will never change. These officials need to be send out to the world to find the solution instead of living in their own little small world in Thailand. Sadly, solutions like these is just plain backwards.

Van, drivers need to be regulated, required to carry daily inspections logs which are kept by the companies for regulators inspection. Drivers all need to be vetted and protected from being fired because they report needed repairs and not have the necessary sleep.

The police who stopped this vehicle regardless should have contacted the owner that the vehicle was being taken out of service unless the tires were going to be replaced asap!  really end of story! 

The official in this country continue to be part of the problem instead of the solution.   Years ago, a problem with double decker buses tipping over they blame the driver for going around curves too fast. But the real problem was the buses were being modified by the owners illegally causing the buses to be out of balance. 

Unbelievable some of the stuff these official come up with while people continue to die!

Edited January 4, 2017 by thailand49

[maoro2013]

What is the logic behind reducing the number of vans?

 

I don't think that is the answer, maybe cutting them totally would work, but reducing!!

[Dellboy218]

2 hours ago, watcharacters said:

 

 

First of all the problem's not the number of vans,   It's how the  idiots DRIVE!

Plus there maybe unrealistic demands placed upon the drivers by the bus owners.   Bus owners should be continuously vetted as well.  But, who is to vet them?

[TheFishman1]

Maybe bald Tires TIT

[JAG]

The bottom line is that the carnage on the roads doesn't affect those in power so they don't care. The rampant corruption doesn't affect (probably benefits) those in power so they don't care. At the moment.

It does affect the ordinary people who are gouged by corrupt officials at every turn, and are the ones exposed to the destruction on the roads. They put up with it, at the moment.

It is also starting to affect the countries international reputation, hence the economic stagnation and slowdown in tourism. Thailand is I suggest starting to be regarded as a failing state, not in the African sense of lawless gangs toting AK47s around the streets, high or drunk, but as far as coherent law enforcement, governance and the treatment and welfare of its people is concerned. It hasn't had a major affect, at the moment.

All this talk of "Thailand 4.0", hubs of this that and the other, and improving education and becoming leaders regionally etc etc is worthless, unless the fundamental problem, a corrupt government machine is addressed.

A terrible shame, because in so many ways it is a lovely place to live and a lovely people to live amongst.

[AlQaholic]

As I said before, the solution to this problem is simple, just implement a fine of 10M Baht on the transport companies for every accident they are involved in, as well as paying compensation to all victims and their families, problem solved. Bullshit walks and money talks.

[scorecard]

52 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

This type of solution is sadly the reason why things will never change. These officials need to be send out to the world to find the solution instead of living in their own little small world in Thailand. Sadly, solutions like these is just plain backwards.

Van, drivers need to be regulated, required to carry daily inspections logs which are kept by the companies for regulators inspection. Drivers all need to be vetted and protected from being fired because they report needed repairs and not have the necessary sleep.

The police who stopped this vehicle regardless should have contacted the owner that the vehicle was being taken out of service unless the tires were going to be replaced asap!  really end of story! 

The official in this country continue to be part of the problem instead of the solution.   Years ago, a problem with double decker buses tipping over they blame the driver for going around curves too fast. But the real problem was the buses were being modified by the owners illegally causing the buses to be out of balance. 

Unbelievable some of the stuff these official come up with while people continue to die!

 

 

"... These officials need to be send out to the world to find the solution instead of living in their own little small world in Thailand.  "

 

Agree, but:

 

- Locals unfortunately have a total block on this approach.  Yes there are some trips but in many cases it's just a shopping expedition. A twist - I worked for an international company in Bkk for a number of years.  Several times young staff accompanied their seniors to help with projects in other regional cities. Several times there were complaints that no time had been allocated for side fun trips and / or shopping. 

 

- Not much point in sending many of these government officials abroad to observe, because they don't have the capability to know what to observe or why. Large numbers of senior officials are in these positions because of corruption (buying the position ) and / or reward for political favors. Pretty much all of them are incapable and inexperienced and not interested in contributing anything.  Until this all stops nothing much will change.

 

The police are a good example, they keep on adding more tents and free coffee along highways and the road toll continues to go up.  Anybody with half a brain would have realized years ago this doesn't reduce the road toll, doesn't reduce drink driving, doesn't reduce maniac speeding, etc., and doesn't increase enforcement of traffic laws. 

Edited January 4, 2017 by scorecard

[AlQaholic]

2 hours ago, selftaopath said:

Can you tell me/us what the starting salary of a policeman/woman is? How about advancement e.g. time in service/promotion etc.? What might be their educational background etc. in relation to a factory workers salary? I often hear a/b low salaries of police/teachers but would LOVE to see the facts. 

Police are paid about 6000 - 8000 baht/month initially. Usually if a police is posted in a new station i.e. there is no station there yet, they are expected to come up with the money themselves to build the station, check points, armament and motorcycles by themselves. Thats why you often see a little police shop by the side of the road in the countryside out in Nakhon Nowhere with a full range of checkpoint materials, this is the main source of their income.....and they borrowed the money to build the little police box....or it was donated to them with certain understandings, that's how it starts....

Edited January 4, 2017 by AlQaholic

[hdkane]

Thailand's idea is to limit the number of vans?  Thais demonstrate their stupidityon a daily basis .  The issue is not the van (usually), but the drivers who are intoxicated, overworked, and inept.  And of course, the corrupt and inept police who refuse to enforce even the basic laws of public safety.  From a Thai viewpoint, the patient is best cured by throwing away the thermometer.

[Emster23]

Couldn't find their backsides using both hands.

[Artisi]

3 hours ago, ezzra said:

 

Have a replacement driver,  as they do with the big buses,

who's job will also be to monitor the alertness of the driver

at any time, proving of course he doesn't fall a sleep himself.....

Hahaha haha - your last sentence say's it all...

[cooked]

1 hour ago, thailand49 said:

This type of solution is sadly the reason why things will never change. These officials need to be send out to the world to find the solution instead of living in their own little small world in Thailand. Sadly, solutions like these is just plain backwards.

Van, drivers need to be regulated, required to carry daily inspections logs which are kept by the companies for regulators inspection. Drivers all need to be vetted and protected from being fired because they report needed repairs and not have the necessary sleep.

The police who stopped this vehicle regardless should have contacted the owner that the vehicle was being taken out of service unless the tires were going to be replaced asap!  really end of story! 

The official in this country continue to be part of the problem instead of the solution.   Years ago, a problem with double decker buses tipping over they blame the driver for going around curves too fast. But the real problem was the buses were being modified by the owners illegally causing the buses to be out of balance. 

Unbelievable some of the stuff these official come up with while people continue to die!

That was my first thought also, double decker buses were going to be banned, new ones are still being constructed. Some of them may be modified butmostly they are built that way. I saw a BBC interview some years ago with a transport minister that insisted that all buses were built according to strict specifications, followed by an interview with a bus constructor that didn't even have any plans! Hats off to guys that can build buses without plans but legal/illegan construction doesn't come into i9t.

[impulse]

17 minutes ago, JAG said:

The bottom line is that the carnage on the roads doesn't affect those in power so they don't care. The rampant corruption doesn't affect (probably benefits) those in power so they don't care.

 

Could have just as easily been a high end Mercedes, BMW or Porsche the guy took out instead of a pickup.  We'd probably be seeing an entirely different level of urgency in the reaction if it had.

 

Nobody on the road is safe from these kamikazes.  Even the elite (and their loved ones).

[LannaGuy]

tachometers, licensing and spot checks with REAL penalties

 

RiP

[stament]

Very sad and totally avoidable. Sadly I am not surprised in the slightest and I often womder how there aren't more accidents. I always see drivers drinking energy drinks and am sure they are tired.. One of the reasons I avoid buses and fly.