Racism, anger and why dual pricing makes sense to Thai people

[NoshowJones]

17 hours ago, fruitman said:

I buy a LOT from Banggood.com so i get everything for a cheaper price than the Thai vendors....i love that. And they even bring it to my house for free, give excellent service and give me birthdaypresents.

 

 

"Banggood.com"    what sort of a website is that?

[digibum]

8 minutes ago, hugh2121 said:

Wonder how many Thai people would think it's ok if EVERY other country charged Thais more than the "locals" price.

 

Glad to see how you skipped over reading anything in this thread so you could peck out a response.  Thanks.  

 

So are you suggesting that, let's say the US, specifically targeted Thai people?  Because that's not what is happening in Thailand.  They have one price for citizens of the country and another price for non-citizens.  

 

And yes, you can find plenty of examples of pricing that discriminates against tourists in almost any Farangland country.  

 

So what's your point?  

[Spellforce]

5 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

Does it have to be a Thai man I ask?

 

There's plenty of Thai men getting their hair done in salons and happily paying over the odds extra for it. It's just you don't know any personally. Now carry on being happy getting your 80 baht 'special' and patting yourself on the back regarding your prowess in all things Thai.

LOL I'm living for 15 years in Thailand, I can speak thai and I have many thai friends.

Those "salons" where all the farangs are going have nothing special, they may charge 200 or 300 bahts the farangs but the thais wont be charged more than 80 bahts.

[Dipterocarp]

37 minutes ago, Shawn0000 said:

 

You need to be a resident of the country, you need to live there.  And if it were me making the rules I would allow foreign residents the same price as Thai's.  Regardless, it is based on citizenship in Thailand not race, so actually your point is completely invalid.  Your anecdote regarding the white Thai merely confirms this, if it were a racial issue then his Thai ID would not change things for him, the fact being Thailand is not a very racially diverse country and so people are not expecting a white Thai, that is all.

The fact that I met one white Thai in 18 years invalidates my point is like saying the DPRK is democratic because they have elections. It is much easier for a American to get citizenship in Japan even than Thailand. I have seen a white Korean on TV once also. 

 

 I agree with you that Foreign Residents (what shall be the definition of residency) should get local pricing. but things are going in the opposite direction it appears, certainly not in the markets etc. My bestie is a US citizen based on Marriage and having a green card the minimum amount of time. Typically once she was with her husband in a Chiang Mai market and one of the ladies there said "Hey sister help me get some good money out of this Buffalo".  "Thats my Husband and its my money too Lady!"

 

I could speak Thai perfectly and pull out a Thai ID, still won't get any slack from Chiang Mai Tuk-Tuk drivers. UBER just started here best thing about it is it is not racist pricing.

Edited January 14, 2017 by Dipterocarp

[moto77]

Two things:

 

1. I understand and agree with this when the pricing is at national parks and other places that are supported with tax money as long as the lower price is also offered to permanent residents that are paying tax here. Otherwise, I don't.

 

2. I understand it when variable (negotiated) pricing is in effect as in the case of street vendors. In this case the objective is to negotiate the most favorable price. If your bargaining skills are not as good, your price will be higher. Same everywhere including car dealerships in the West.

[NoshowJones]

16 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

I am fortunate that I am good looking so I always get quoted the best price at the gogos.

I wonder how much I would get charged if I was a monger? Probably get her for free?

[Grubster]

14 hours ago, Shawn0000 said:

 

 When I pay to enter a national park it goes to the national park and enables them to run the park without increasing fees for Thais, that is directly subsidising the poor.

In the west we charge 10% tax on the working poor, and zero tax on billion dollar corporations. Many times we give huge subsidies to these corporations. 

[digibum]

Just now, moto77 said:

Two things:

 

1. I understand and agree with this when the pricing is at national parks and other places that are supported with tax money as long as the lower price is also offered to permanent residents that are paying tax here. Otherwise, I don't.

 

2. I understand it when variable (negotiated) pricing is in effect as in the case of street vendors. In this case the objective is to negotiate the most favorable price. If your bargaining skills are not as good, your price will be higher. Same everywhere including car dealerships in the West.

 

On your first point, how many permanent residents are there in Thailand?  

 

I'm guessing not many and I would be surprised if even one of them is commenting in this thread.  

 

Having a long-term visa, or rolling visas for many years is not the same as permanent residency.  

 

While I agree that if you are on a long-term visa like a retirement visa or have a work permit that you should get the local pricing at national parks, but if they draw the line at permanent residency or even citizenship, that's their prerogative.  

[Saan]

Recently I noticed the cost of my laundry was rising considerably. I didn't get angry but told the woman I was thinking of buying a washing machine. The next week the laundry dropped back to the old price.

[richard_smith237]

1 hour ago, Shawn0000 said:

 

How have you arrived at the conclusion that Thailand is reliant on repeat tourism?  Numbers are up and revenue is up, the supposed importance of emphasis of this imagined impact does not reflect in any statistics.

 

... Of course Thailand is not solely reliant on repeat tourism, thats a leap you took in distorting my point and exaggerating the context... however, if hazarding a guess, I'd suggest that the Tourist industry does rely on repeat tourism. The tourist industry in any country needs to look after its tourists on which some areas are more heavily reliant than others, Thailand is no exception... 

 

Of course, you are welcome to put up a statistic which contradicts my opinion and I'll stand corrected, but for now I'll use the following example... People who visit New Zealand want to return, people who visit India do so as a one off, well at least that was my impression after speaking with a handful of people (so not really representative)... 

 

If people who visited Thailand do not return would the tourist industry be impacted? I would guess so, perhaps by only 10% (or more ? or less ?)..  that small amount still accounts for a significant loss in income.

 

Free to disagree with this.... we can then agree to disagree and end it there so we don't side track the thread.... 

 

 

 

 

[BaiLao]

Is it too difficult to learn "OK. Now give me the Thai price." in the vernacular? I'm sure there will be posters willing to give us the correct pronunciation...

[laislica]

5 minutes ago, digibum said:

 

On your first point, how many permanent residents are there in Thailand?  

 

I'm guessing not many and I would be surprised if even one of them is commenting in this thread.  

 

Having a long-term visa, or rolling visas for many years is not the same as permanent residency.  

 

While I agree that if you are on a long-term visa like a retirement visa or have a work permit that you should get the local pricing at national parks, but if they draw the line at permanent residency or even citizenship, that's their prerogative.  

 

Not only dual pricing by all and sundry but gender discrimination that is totally wrong!

A Thai man has a much easier life to get his western wife rights, as if she were Thai.

However, a Thai wife is totally bypassed, and that really is from the Top down!

[NoshowJones]

15 hours ago, Canceraid said:

There is nothing to get angry about dual-pricing, instead what we foreigners should do is to react to it in a subtle manner ie avoid all places that practice dual-pricing and inform all your relatives and friends and also your media back home to ask people to avoid these places. Lobby your politicans back home to also put into place dual pricings policies only for thai people visiting there and also to lobby your governmenta nd media to stop assiting thailand in any way be it investments etc as they the thais practice dual -pricing and racism. Avoid all thai products back home and urge others and the media back home to support these moves. Never impart know=how or knowledge to thais and when there is such a need , practice dual pricings. Lobby all the pharmaceutical companies to sue companies in Thailadn making generic medicine and whn selling selling such medicine to thailand, sell it at very high exorbitant prices. etc etc

Lobbying any UK MPs would just be a waste of time, they are only interested in their over the top expenses and jobs on the side while collecting their full MPs wages.

[David in the north]

I've not had much of a problem with this - but live out in the "sticks"
Only been tried on me a couple of times. Once at a restaurant where I knew the Thai price from a previous visit. Was given a menu in English & everything was at least 70 baht dearer. Told them to make their minds up what they were going to charge us - Thai price. However, I've not been back since. I don't regards it as "fair" myself but apparently some foreigners think it acceptable! 

[TravelerEastWest]

15 hours ago, The Man Who Sold the World said:

USA: 

 

I take full advantage of my military discount. 

There are resident vs. non-resident fishing and hunting licenses, resident vs. non-resident theme park (Disney/Great Flags/Dorney Park/Sesame Place) pricing schedules, teachers discounts, first responders discounts, police discounts...

 

I see no difference at all...

 

You are correct - in Hawaii they have the normal price and then, local discounts plus senior discounts and so on...

 

Also in the US we certainly follow a you have more money so you pay more philosophy - just look at our tax rates.

 

 

[Shawn0000]

28 minutes ago, SABloke said:

 

Oh please, how many Thais go in compared to foreigners 100 to 1, 1000 to 1. Even if it was only 100 - 1. Thats 4000 Baht to your 200 Baht contribution. Some places (Ban Pa-In palace is one) display their annual revenue on a board at the entrance. The foreign revenue is hardly a drop compared to Thai income.

 

 

Depends on the park, go to Erawan and look at the ratio, perhaps 3 Thais to 1 foreigner.

[NoshowJones]

15 hours ago, sinbin said:

Generalisation  and racist comments about Thais is against TV rules when it clearly is trueful? This is what Thai schools teach the children.

 

Edit: Can you imagine the effect this will have on a Luk Krung child of Afro stock? Disgraceful. Thais should hang their heads in shame.

 

There is no point in having any forum if you cannot critisise anybody, as long as it is constructive, is it constructive to say that some Thais are racist? 

You tell me.

[TravelerEastWest]

18 minutes ago, digibum said:

...While I agree that if you are on a long-term visa like a retirement visa or have a work permit that you should get the local pricing at national parks, but if they draw the line at permanent residency or even citizenship, that's their prerogative.  

 

Actually let's be fair and give the discount to those with Thai work permits who are working and paying income taxes regardless of their visa type.

 

 

[Shawn0000]

10 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

... Of course Thailand is not solely reliant on repeat tourism, thats a leap you took in distorting my point and exaggerating the context... however, if hazarding a guess, I'd suggest that the Tourist industry does rely on repeat tourism. The tourist industry in any country needs to look after its tourists on which some areas are more heavily reliant than others, Thailand is no exception... 

 

Of course, you are welcome to put up a statistic which contradicts my opinion and I'll stand corrected, but for now I'll use the following example... People who visit New Zealand want to return, people who visit India do so as a one off, well at least that was my impression after speaking with a handful of people (so not really representative)... 

 

If people who visited Thailand do not return would the tourist industry be impacted? I would guess so, perhaps by only 10% (or more ? or less ?)..  that small amount still accounts for a significant loss in income.

 

Free to disagree with this.... we can then agree to disagree and end it there so we don't side track the thread.... 

 

 

 

 

 

I used your exact wording, no leap, no distortion, just your own words repeated.  LOL

 

Tourist revenue has seen a 14% year on year increase.  The main tourism is now from China, (lots of people) do you get it now?

[SaintLouisBlues]

Just now, possum1931 said:

There is no point in having any forum if you cannot critisise anybody, as long as it is constructive, is it constructive to say that some Thais are racist? 

You tell me.

Only white people are racist, that's a well-known fact. Ask any bleeding heart

[hotchilli]

Last year I went to Erawan national park in Kanchanaburi with Thai friends, the entry price for them was 40baht, the price for me was 10X at 400 baht !

My Thai friends were shocked & argued with the office to no avail.

They office said he is a farang so he can pay more, they said I've lived in Thailand for 8 years & is not a tourist, again it fell on deaf ears..

they refused to pay so our party of 12 people walked away..

I wish more tourists/residents would walk away the same, maybe they would get the message.
Or Thais in foreign countries should be charged double the price for food/beverages or 10X for entering national parks etc & see if the message gets through!!

Dual pricing is a form of racism pure & simple!

[TonyClifton]

When some low-class Thai scumbag tells my 100 percent Thai son that he has to pay more because he looks whiter than Thais, that is where the line is so clearly crossed.  

 

My son has a Thai passport, a USA passport, and a Thai ID card.  It is, because he is white.  

 

That is called bigotry and when it comes to pricing, is clear racism by obvious dolts.

[Shawn0000]

30 minutes ago, Dipterocarp said:

The fact that I met one white Thai in 18 years invalidates my point is like saying the DPRK is democratic because they have elections. It is much easier for a American to get citizenship in Japan even than Thailand. I have seen a white Korean on TV once also. 

 

 I agree with you that Foreign Residents (what shall be the definition of residency) should get local pricing. but things are going in the opposite direction it appears, certainly not in the markets etc. My bestie is a US citizen based on Marriage and having a green card the minimum amount of time. Typically once she was with her husband in a Chiang Mai market and one of the ladies there said "Hey sister help me get some good money out of this Buffalo".  "Thats my Husband and its my money too Lady!"

 

I could speak Thai perfectly and pull out a Thai ID, still won't get any slack from Chiang Mai Tuk-Tuk drivers. UBER just started here best thing about it is it is not racist pricing.

 

Wow, you completely misunderstood the point.  The point being it is not racism if the person adjusts their price once they understand the person is Thai, the other point being, how can you expect the ticket seller to instinctively know the white person is Thai, obviously in a country like Thailand, where almost every citizen is Asian, people are going to assume a white person is foreign.

The markets are a very different issue to official dual pricing, you will also get ripped off in markets in London and most anywhere else you take your tourism, in London they even went as far as to invent a coded language specifically to rip off outsiders, market traders increasing the price if they think they can is nothing unique to Thailand, it's not racism it is just ruthless business.

 

[Geoff Snell]

Just a way of life I guess. If Australia was to do the same dual pricing as Thailand does then I am all for dual pricing. Naturally that will never happen. I just refuse to spend money when the Thais try to sting me. I never get angry and just walk away. Generally they get angry but as soon as I start to speak Thai they suddenly go quiet. Too many incidents to mention. I just walk away. No problem. 

[NoshowJones]

14 hours ago, Shawn0000 said:

 

Resident doesn't necessarily just mean you live somewhere, it can also be an official status, not many expats apply for residency in Thailand, those that do get some benefits.

Yes, like not risking their lives going on border runs every 90 days.

[Shawn0000]

6 minutes ago, hotchilli said:

Last year I went to Erawan national park in Kanchanaburi with Thai friends, the entry price for them was 40baht, the price for me was 10X at 400 baht !

My Thai friends were shocked & argued with the office to no avail.

They office said he is a farang so he can pay more, they said I've lived in Thailand for 8 years & is not a tourist, again it fell on deaf ears..

they refused to pay so our party of 12 people walked away..

I wish more tourists/residents would walk away the same, maybe they would get the message.
Or Thais in foreign countries should be charged double the price for food/beverages or 10X for entering national parks etc & see if the message gets through!!

Dual pricing is a form of racism pure & simple!

 

No, they are a ticket seller, those who make the rules will not get the message.  All you achieved was not getting to see one of the most beautiful waterfalls in the world because you were too tight to pay the price of a few beers, it's that simple.

[Shawn0000]

Just now, possum1931 said:

Yes, like not risking their lives going on border runs every 90 days.

 

So dangerous the border run!  What?

[poohy]

2 hours ago, digibum said:

I've seen my wife change clothes to go shopping because even though she's Thai, if they sense she has money they will try to charge her more.  

 

Anybody claiming this is racist or discrimination doesn't understand that Thais screw over Thais too.  It's not us against them. It's the fact that many Thais will try to make every last satang they can get.  If they sense you have money, they're going to try and get it.

Yep 100%

 

Mrs Poohy shops alone and certainly dressed down if i am there or she looks wealthy prices go up.( NB i mean where prices can  be variable i am allowed into Macro or Tesco)

 

But one thing has stuck with me  what she said many years ago......................... Thais dont trust Thais!

I think we should always remember this

[laislica]

2 minutes ago, BaiLao said:

Is it too difficult to learn "OK. Now give me the Thai price." in the vernacular? I'm sure there will be posters willing to give us the correct pronunciation...

 

 

I guess you can say:

Can you reduce the price, I don't have money. (Lot di mai? mi me nurn)

I often try it and it sometimes works, not that often though.

The best strategy is to get my wife to go alone and buy it for me and sometimes that means on another day.

I also agree with another posters comment.

If a Thai is very well presented/dressed then they will likely be offered a higher price.

 

As tp the 200-300 baht haircuts, my wife tells me that's the going rate for BKK!

She says that those salons use original products and everything is more expensive in those places.

She would expect to pay an astounding 2-3,000b for wash, colour and cut......

Locally almost free so if you want a BKK posh job, expect to pay.

Here in deep Samut Sakhon it's 60b but I tip 20b.

One time I presented a 100b note and the barber returned only 20b change so I took 40b from him, smiled and gave him back the 20b.

Mine to give, not his to take!

That was a few years ago and I still get my Thai style short back and sides, which suits me fine.

Back in Spain (I live in a non tourist area and it's quite cheap), I pay a minimum of €8, which is about 300b without a tip.

BTW, I actually get a hair cut that I prefer in Thailand, they use scissors, not just the clipper machine.....

 

My wife does not like the way that many Thai's treat farang.

She thinks it's pure greed rather than nasty racism.

Racial profiling sure but many of them are, in the main, simply GREEDY, not NASTY.

Just her opinion. (and mine)

 

For me to get a yellow book, it seems that local clerks expect nam jai, a gift, before they will do anything to help me along the way in the process.

They also add their friends into the loop, where I must also make a gift, they do their best to spread the farang bonus as far as they can.

My wife is "Bored" with this BS, so I will never get the yellow book.

For a Thai Bored means - enough - ENOUGH OK!!!

If you get my meaning.

 

 

 

[Chip Allen]

1 hour ago, Fore Man said:

...I was once told by a Thai cop that because the exchange rate was 35 to 1, this inferred that we Americans were 35 times more wealthy than Thais and therefore we could afford to pay far more than the typical Thai could for the same article or service. And that is a very commonly shared belief here. I tried to explain to him that while our incomes are certainly higher in the West, so too are our tax burdens, expenses and outlays, but It went in one ear and out the other.  

A sterling example of Thai racist logic and complete lack of understanding of simple economics.