Waterford

[Number 6]

I guess there are a few of these developments, so Im admittedly a bit clueless. Poking about the Phra Kanong development, the prices are almost reasonable for a twenty yo condo 1km from the old, broken bts. But my question is why so many units up for sale?

 

Theres a few more ok sort of boxes in Pathumwan, freehold. Look ok, price ok...maybe infected with renters and air bnb disease?

 

Over in Pinklao a few waterview units up for sale. OK its BangO, other side river and area is sketchy as hell. Also, River and Ivy. Some units are ridiculously priced, others only silly.

 

Anyway, my general question, is this a flag when multiple units sitting on market or could just be owner issues such as mortgage or relo, etc?

 

Anything reasonable on the MRT line? I like N/S exposure and big balconies. Mid rises +1.

 

Thank you

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I've always wondered the same about the Waterford project out near the Phra Kanong BTS station (a few hundred meters away). Always seem to be a lot of units there for rent or sale.

 

I visited the complex in person a few years back, looked OK from the outside, but the units themselves on the inside looked very old and dated (at least the couple that I saw).

[smutcakes]

From memory and specifically referring to the one just off Thonglor there was some major problem with the developer relating to Common Area, management etc. 

[trogers]

That's where opportunity lies.

 

The old school Thais don't know about investment. They only speculate on capital appreciation.

 

Bought 3 units cheap (Bt30+/sqm) back in 2008, refurbished and let out with rental yields 8-9%.

[trogers]

32 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

I've always wondered the same about the Waterford project out near the Phra Kanong BTS station (a few hundred meters away). Always seem to be a lot of units there for rent or sale.

 

I visited the complex in person a few years back, looked OK from the outside, but the units themselves on the inside looked very old and dated (at least the couple that I saw).

They have 8 buildings with almost 400 units in total. Even with a 6% vacancy rate, that would be 48 units looking for tenants.

 

And guess what, those refurbished units would be the units to be rented out first. My two 1-bedrm units have long term tenants.

[trogers]

1 hour ago, trogers said:

They have 8 buildings with almost 400 units in total. Even with a 6% vacancy rate, that would be 48 units looking for tenants.

 

And guess what, those refurbished units would be the units to be rented out first. My two 1-bedrm units have long term tenants.

My maths is slipping. That's 24 units.

[Number 6]

On 9/3/2017 at 4:34 PM, trogers said:

That's where opportunity lies.

 

The old school Thais don't know about investment. They only speculate on capital appreciation.

 

Bought 3 units cheap (Bt30+/sqm) back in 2008, refurbished and let out with rental yields 8-9%.

This is a general statement or you own units here?

 

Yeah, the place looks ok. Most likely the common interior is suffering like all condos this old. But I'm curious why so many up for sale. I'm tempted to take the wife and just have a poke around the place.

 

Google maps shows it 1km away from BTS which is not walking distance imo (700m max). 1km is pretty far and I do walk.

 

On 9/3/2017 at 4:34 PM, smutcakes said:

From memory and specifically referring to the one just off Thonglor there was some major problem with the developer relating to Common Area, management etc. 

I think I know the one from maps. Interesting, thanks.

 

 

 

Another one is Suan Luang, Floraville, huge condos 90-120sqm, well priced but condo mnt looks dicey and it's connection to city is broken airport link. It's very boring out there and overlooks a Muslim cemetery. Seems like a stampede for the door.

Edited September 4, 2017 by Number 6

[trogers]

31 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

This is a general statement or you own units here?

 

Yeah, the place looks ok. Most likely the common interior is suffering like all condos this old. But I'm curious why so many up for sale. I'm tempted to take the wife and just have a poke around the place.

 

Google maps shows it 1km away from BTS which is not walking distance imo (700m max). 1km is pretty far and I do walk.

 

I think I know the one from maps. Interesting, thanks.

 

 

 

Another one is Suan Luang, Floraville, huge condos 90-120sqm, well priced but condo mnt looks dicey and it's connection to city is broken airport link. It's very boring out there and overlooks a Muslim cemetery. Seems like a stampede for the door.

I own 3 units in Waterford Park Rama 4. What drew me to buy into this project are:

 

1.  The price

2.  The pool and landscape is on ground level, which you can no longer find for such a price range.

3.  Its distance from the main roads insulates it from air and noise pollution. You can have breakfast on the balcony and hear the birds chip.

4. There are no studio units nor imitation 1-bedroom units.

5.  Over half of the project is still owner occupied.

 

I have said in some earlier posts, small units would mostly be put on sales when the owner occupants have children reaching schooling age. They need the money for down payments towards a house, as the condo units would be too small for a family.

[VocalNeal]

3 hours ago, Number 6 said:

Google maps shows it 1km away from BTS which is not walking distance imo (700m max). 1km is pretty far and I do walk.

You must have an elastic version of google? It is about 760m. But from memory ( I have one or two acquaintances who live there) take a mocy to the end of the soi and walk the other 300m. There is a 7-11 and a Tesco lotus and pharmacy within 200m. MaxValue at the BTS. An expat  pub of sorts and small soi restaurant, street food everywhere. Not far from W District, et al.  Convenient for expressways if one drives. 

 

 

[Number 6]

6 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

You must have an elastic version of google? It is about 760m. But from memory ( I have one or two acquaintances who live there) take a mocy to the end of the soi and walk the other 300m. There is a 7-11 and a Tesco lotus and pharmacy within 200m. MaxValue at the BTS. An expat  pub of sorts and small soi restaurant, street food everywhere. Not far from W District, et al.  Convenient for expressways if one drives. 

 

6 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

 

 

Google has a few walking routes mapped. 1km and 1.2km but there appears another route that might shave off 200+m. Id wondered before why Google didn't map this route. Thanks for all that info. 

 

Do you know how much the moto ride is from the bts, door to door? Im guessing 20-25b. I sort of lije walking, keeps me fit. Doubt Ill ever own a car again.

 

 

@trogerstrogers 

 

Yes, I specifically look for these types of balconies. Large with lots of ventilation.

 

Can you explain the pool thing? Im not understanding that pls? Ground level. You mean mist of the condos have a pool upside in the condo along with a patch of grass and three "trees"?

 

Agree about distance from main roadways. Im now 650m from mrt but set back from road about 400.m. Perfect.

 

[trogers]

44 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

 

Google has a few walking routes mapped. 1km and 1.2km but there appears another route that might shave off 200+m. Id wondered before why Google didn't map this route. Thanks for all that info. 

 

Do you know how much the moto ride is from the bts, door to door? Im guessing 20-25b. I sort of lije walking, keeps me fit. Doubt Ill ever own a car again.

 

 

@trogerstrogers 

 

Yes, I specifically look for these types of balconies. Large with lots of ventilation.

 

Can you explain the pool thing? Im not understanding that pls? Ground level. You mean mist of the condos have a pool upside in the condo along with a patch of grass and three "trees"?

 

Agree about distance from main roadways. Im now 650m from mrt but set back from road about 400.m. Perfect.

 

Most city condos would greet you with 5-6 floors of parking concrete structures and then have trees sprouting above them. That's where the pool would be, and thereafter the condo units.

 

Waterford Park Rama 4 spaced their 8-floor buildings far apart and have two swimming pools, children's playground and lots of trees on ground level. Parking is in a basement car park and a separate car park building.

 

Bt10 for a motorcycle ride.

 

Because of the distance from main roads, you can sleep with windows or sliding doors open, unlike those projects near to main roads. Open a window or door and a constant droning sound of traffic overwhelms you.

 

Edited September 4, 2017 by trogers

[trogers]

But be warned. Their railings at the balcony is only a metre high. If you're drunk often, choose a 1st floor unit.

[Aussieroaming]

1 hour ago, trogers said:

But be warned. Their railings at the balcony is only a metre high. If you're drunk often, choose a 1st floor unit.

or modify the railing if the Juristic allows that

[VocalNeal]

4 hours ago, trogers said:

Google has a few walking routes mapped. 1km and 1.2km but there appears another route that might shave off 200+m.

 Straight down the Soi across Rama 4 and up the remnants of Sukhumvit 46 to the BTS. How your elastic google gets anything more than 850m (pedestrian crossing misplaced by about 90m) so actually 760m is beyond me. 

 

20B on a mocy. 

 

If one is a bordering alcoholic and wannabee insomniac there is a wheelchair bound guy called Westy who holds court most nights near the children's playground.  Take your own beer, anecdotes and vernacular language  look for Xmas lights and listen for conversation.

Edited September 5, 2017 by VocalNeal

[trogers]

1 hour ago, VocalNeal said:

 Straight down the Soi across Rama 4 and up the remnants of Sukhumvit 46 to the BTS. How your elastic google gets anything more than 850m (pedestrian crossing misplaced by about 90m) so actually 760m is beyond me. 

 

20B on a mocy. 

 

If one is a bordering alcoholic and wannabee insomniac there is a wheelchair bound guy called Westy who holds court most nights near the children's playground.  Take your own beer, anecdotes and vernacular language  look for Xmas lights and listen for conversation.

I usually walk. Right through Soi Phumchit, cross Rama 4 and towards the traffic light, where Summer Hills shopping mall is being completed.

[Khun Jean]

On Soi Phumchit there is a condo named 'Morning dew'.

If you come from Rama4 and walking towards Waterford it is about half way on your left.

Older building, relatively large units. Maintenance and juristic office do a great job. No noise and regular maintenance on elevator,  everyday cleaning of hallways etc. 

I lived there for many years in a 4-bedroom 120m2 condo.

It has a small pool inside, great for when you have kids.

School is close by, 7-11/lotus express even Aikido within walking distance as it is very close to the BTS.

 

Very reasonable prices for rent and sale.

I considered Waterford first, as it was the one i found. I thought the units were a bit narrow and long which i dislike. Also going to the common area (swimming pool) requires you to go through the basement (parking area), which at that moment with small kids was a big no-no. The separate parking building with the tennis court on top looked like it would fall apart any moment.

At that time there was also some problem close to the bridge which you need to cross to reach Waterford. Right before that it was very dark and lots of robberies took place at night. We were warned about that several times when we spoke to owners of the small local shops there. I hear it is better now. Still better take a taxi or motorcy.

 

Edited September 5, 2017 by Khun Jean

[David B in Thailand]

I stayed two nights at Waterford in May 2016. The inexpensive nightly rental unit had some odd interior wall placements. The  unit door lock was sub par. The gypsum walls were not of a high quality. The kitchen was compact in this unit.  The common grounds were quite nice, with a nice pool. It was quite a walk from BTS. The place did have a shuttle service. Not full of rowdy guests when I stayed in May 2016. It could be a worthwhile place to look as a home or investment property, based on my casual experience of the better features. I know nothing of the management and ownership fees. The "vibe" by the pool was great. More greenery as you enter than many condo units I have stayed in Bangkok. 

[trogers]

2 hours ago, David B in Thailand said:

I stayed two nights at Waterford in May 2016. The inexpensive nightly rental unit had some odd interior wall placements. The  unit door lock was sub par. The gypsum walls were not of a high quality. The kitchen was compact in this unit.  The common grounds were quite nice, with a nice pool. It was quite a walk from BTS. The place did have a shuttle service. Not full of rowdy guests when I stayed in May 2016. It could be a worthwhile place to look as a home or investment property, based on my casual experience of the better features. I know nothing of the management and ownership fees. The "vibe" by the pool was great. More greenery as you enter than many condo units I have stayed in Bangkok. 

What gypsum wall? All original walls are solid masonry walls, unless you resided in a unit that was modified to house the undergraduates near by.

 

But as I have mentioned earlier, here lies the opportunity for investment when the interior is at fault, but the architecture and maintenance of common areas are good.

Edited September 6, 2017 by trogers

[Number 6]

At 40k+ per sqm meter, I'm not seeing much value there. At this price there are newer condos in better locations. 

 

Still might be worth a Sunday stroll when we've nothing better to do. I do like the grounds and balconies.

 

Thanks everyone

[smutcakes]

47 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

At 40k+ per sqm meter, I'm not seeing much value there. At this price there are newer condos in better locations. 

 

Still might be worth a Sunday stroll when we've nothing better to do. I do like the grounds and balconies.

 

Thanks everyone

Would be interested to hear these sub 50K newer condos available at better locations.

[trogers]

1 hour ago, smutcakes said:

Would be interested to hear these sub 50K newer condos available at better locations.

Perhaps the OP is thinking of Jomtien.

[Number 6]

Sorry to dig this back out but I just wanted to state that I stand corrected.

 

There are a few units that are similar in price, distance to BTS/mrt and amenities but nothing clearly superior.

 

Bangkok, remains way overpriced and it's no more telling than in decades d condos the better part of a km off mass transit.

 

Had a look at morning dew, 6m for second hand condo lol.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Number 6

[Khun Jean]

6m for a condo in morning dew? Was that a whole floor? :)

They normally went for 1.2-1.5 Mb per condo (40m2) about two years ago.

 

 

[Number 6]

On 09/23/2017 at 11:36 AM, Khun Jean said:

6m for a condo in morning dew? Was that a whole floor? :)

They normally went for 1.2-1.5 Mb per condo (40m2) about two years ago.

 

 

DD property, have a look.

 

No doubt but just goes to show how insane asking prices (expectations?) are.

[trogers]

On Sat Sep 23 2017 at 11:36 AM, Khun Jean said:

6m for a condo in morning dew? Was that a whole floor? :)

They normally went for 1.2-1.5 Mb per condo (40m2) about two years ago.

 

 

I don't fancy a project where most of the units are laid out as large studio units with the kitchen at the balcony. And the swimming pool is on the second floor under shade, like an indoor pool positioned away from falling snow.

[Khun Jean]

The swimming pool is good for kids as it is not that big. It is not in the blazing sun all day which is good. Their fitness room is small but rarely used and equipment is more then adequate. Sure it does not compare to newer fancier condo's but it gets you more sqm's for your baht. I rented 120m2 for 11.000 baht a month. Hard to beat. Best thing though is management, they are great.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

5 hours ago, Khun Jean said:

The swimming pool is good for kids as it is not that big. It is not in the blazing sun all day which is good. Their fitness room is small but rarely used and equipment is more then adequate. Sure it does not compare to newer fancier condo's but it gets you more sqm's for your baht. I rented 120m2 for 11.000 baht a month. Hard to beat. Best thing though is management, they are great.

Which project are you talking about?

 

[trogers]

3 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Which project are you talking about?

 

He and I were referring to Morning Dew.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 hours ago, trogers said:

He and I were referring to Morning Dew.

So I'm confused then. Because you were talking about most of the units being laid out as large studio units. And Jean was saying he/she rented a 120 sq mt unit for 11K, and I'm presuming 120 sq mt. isn't a studio.

 

[VocalNeal]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

So I'm confused then. Because you were talking about most of the units being laid out as large studio units.

I've only been in one ground floor unit . It has separate bedrooms but a common living area.

 

15 hours ago, Khun Jean said:

The swimming pool is good for kids as it is not that big.

There are two pools but yes they are not in direct sunlight.