Motorcycles technologies lag 30 years behind cars and bicycles

[leonidpattayski]

Before moving to Thailand i never rode motorcycles, but only cars and bicycles. I was very happy with every car and bicycle I bought and had no problems with them. Basically if you by a car or bicycle even the cheapest, you and every family member can use it with comfort.

 

Bicycles. When I was a child i have many bicycles, all of them had adjustable seat and handlebar. Any person of any size can use same bicycle and ride it in comfort no matter is he or she tall or short. Even the oldest bicycles had slipper clutch and allow not only to raise handlebar but also to rotate them for better rider comfort. Gears can be shifted on modern bicycles just by pressing buttons on handle bar, very easy even for 7 years baby. There are also a lot of bicycles with combined braking, so you press one brake and it stops both front and rear wheel. If you have bicycle without combined braking you can buy it and install for about 50$.

 

Cars. For many years cars have automatic transmissions of different types CVT, Standart auto or DST. You shift to drive mode and car moves slowly without throttle, you apply acceleration and it runs, very very easy. Every car even 50 years old have combined braking. You press break and it stops all 4 wheels. All cars sold in Thailand have ABS now and many entry levels cars have traction control. In car you can adjust everything for your comfort: mirrors, seat position, can move it forward, backward, up, down and even change an angle, good! All cars on market have low revving engines with most power and torque in middle or low rev range, this approach reduce fuel consumption and make cars easy to drive.

 

Motorcycles and scooters. Only scooters and Honda DST have automatic transmissions, everything else is just a crap manual.The problem is scooter and DST auto  does not work same as cars. You put in on drive or start scooter and it stays without moving, you turn throttle slightly it vibrates but still not move, you turn it more it run to fast. Many people told you just need to more practice and you get how to use it. Yes I got how to use and can drive now both manual big bike and cvt scooter, but the price for learning  was a motorcycle accident with rib injury due to how auto scooter work. If auto on scooter worked same as on car i did not have this accident.

 

Motorcycles and scooters with combined braking are very rare 96% of them have one separate brake control for every wheel. You need to press two brakes to stop two wheels, in car you need one brake for 4 or even 6 wheels. I know an opinion it is not so much difficult to use two brake. Yes i can go barefoot and can eat just with hands without fork and spoon, just eat porridge with your left hand and wash hands after breakfast.

 

There is no motorcycle on the market with adjustable seat, footpeg and handle bar. You buy a motorcycle and it does not fit your body, you can only sell it or maybe rebuild. You cannot buy a motorcycle for use by many family members, for someone seat will be very high for another no space for legs. Due to the fact big bikes are not adjustable for different body types, at least motorcycle producers could put size body size on motorcycle, same as with clothes( L, M, XL) at least when you are going to buy first bike you know what bike could fit you.

 

Slipper clutch is very rare even on modern motorcycle, but all 30 years old bicycles had slipper clutch. More than half of motorcycles have crap high revving engines, due to this factor not comfortable to ride in city and have same fuel consumption as cars.

 

Final worlds.

I wish for all motorcycle designers and motorbike companies workers and owners to drive cars with manual transmission only with four brakes pedals, each pedal for every wheel. With absolutely not adjustable seat, distance between pedals and seat depends on car size. If you are tall but bough compact car and later discovered you have no space for legs you have two options sell car and buy bigger one with 3 litres high revving engine but bigger space for legs or go to service they rebuild car and move seat backward but you lose warranty on car. Also no full front windshield in stock. Let them drive cars like that until they start selling usable motorcycle with fully automatic transmission working same as car, with combined braking, low rev engine, fully adjustable seat, handlebar, footpeg and windscreen.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Pdaz]

Not even worth an answer.........

[johng]

I much prefer a manual gearbox on car and motorbike, disc brakes front and rear

(separately operated on bike)

carburetor and aircooled is fine too... less to go wrong.

 

 

[Denim]

Be inclined to agree with OP.   Always hot in Thailand so why no air conditioned bike. Be so much better if I could ride around at 25 degrees in the hot season. Give it time I guess.

[OmegaRacer]

"Crap manual".....Lo

I think you better stick to cars and bicycles

[leonidpattayski]

43 minutes ago, johng said:

I much prefer a manual gearbox on car and motorbike, disc brakes front and rear

(separately operated on bike)

carburetor and aircooled is fine too... less to go wrong.

 

 

Modern automatic transmission beat manual in all aspects, less fuel consumption and faster acceleration.

I can understand 10 years ago people choose manuals, cause they had better mileage and acceleration, but now automatic wins.

[leonidpattayski]

38 minutes ago, Denim said:

Be inclined to agree with OP.   Always hot in Thailand so why no air conditioned bike. Be so much better if I could ride around at 25 degrees in the hot season. Give it time I guess.

They sell already vests with aircon. I think it is expensive now, with time can be more affordable.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=4&v=1tWzELz66wM

[ktm jeff]

Front and rear brakes on a bike should be controled independantly  , as you dont want the front brake coming on half way around a bend. Many items can be adjusted for size , but not by an electric switch , as in a car. A correctly set-up / ridden automatic wont cause an accident.  Get well soon.

[leonidpattayski]

2 hours ago, ktm jeff said:

Front and rear brakes on a bike should be controled independantly  , as you dont want the front brake coming on half way around a bend. Many items can be adjusted for size , but not by an electric switch , as in a car. A correctly set-up / ridden automatic wont cause an accident.  Get well soon.

Kawasaki Z250sl user manual, section Safe operation.

 

"Use Both Front and Rear Brakes When applying the brakes, use both the front and rear brakes. Applying only one brake for sudden braking may cause the motorcycle to skid and lose control.

Edited September 10, 2017 by leonidpattayski

[VocalNeal]

16 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

automatic transmission working same as car,

 

16 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

If auto on scooter worked same as on car i did not have this accident.

Auto transmission on a CVT scooter work the same as a car with a CVT transmission. But yes scooters don't creep because they are always in gear so easier than cars? No shifting to do?

 

16 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

Slipper clutch is very rare even on modern motorcycle,

You are confusing "slipper clutch" with a freewheel. Which some cars used to have in the 60's.

 

16 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

Before moving to Thailand i never rode motorcycles,

..and herein lies the problem... Just think. When most of us on here learned to ride we had to learn about the clutch and do hill starts and the like.

 

And lastly 

 

16 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

Motorcycles technologies lag 30 years behind cars and bicycles

 

This is because most cyclists are vain and stand around in spandex discussing grams.  So the industry panders to their vanity.

 

That was fun...

Edited September 11, 2017 by VocalNeal

[OmegaRacer]

Get a 1980 Moto Guzzi Idroconvert. Automatic transmission and linked front and rear brakes (pedal activates front left and rear brake simultaneously, brake lever activates both front brakes). 

Install an air conditioning system, a rain repellent sunroof, a cupholder and voila'...your perfect bike.

[fxe1200]

Just read this one:   " ...Today all new Harleys feature even an electronic fuel injection system, besides the electronic ignition. Can you imagine, how does it feel, when just one of these devices fail on the Great Northern Highway in Western Australia? No? You'd better switch to the old style carb, contacts, and the antique auto advance mechanism, or move within the range of a Harley dealer, or just stay at home."

 

And this applies to all motorcycles. If you like to travel with them, you want to be able to fix them, if something happens.

 

[HooHaa]

i suggest the OP was not meant to ride a bike and understands absolutely nothing about motorcycle control.

 

i would also suggest he knows even less about bicycles.

Edited September 11, 2017 by HooHaa

[toofarnorth]

....................oldest bicycle had slipper clutch .  Excuse me  ; had a what ?

[VocalNeal]

49 minutes ago, fxe1200 said:

fail on the Great Northern Highway in Western Australia?

Harleys are designed so they don't get that far. Built in safety...? 

[toofarnorth]

I have a Forza , best all round machine I have ever had . Some in England were faster , some more economical and some looked wonderful but most leaked oil , clutch cables broke , brakes gave up in the rain . Now at 70 yo I want fully automatic, hydromatic , press button and gomatic. Too hot to fiddle and fettle before a ride out . Chok dee my orange Gentleman's Autocycle. ( Does it have a slipper clutch , no idea )

[atyclb]

http://lightningmotorcycle.com/product/specifications/

[portroyal]

As you say, you eat porridge...

your post was just a joke or are you actually stupid. ?

[Dene16]

when you are dead or seriously injured because you have use your front brake while riding in the rain, over a manhole or on very dusty roads you will finally understand what people have told you here. using both brakes will obviously give you more stopping power and stability but should only be used in normal dry circumstances.

Incidentally my/wifes Honda 125 scooter can be changed to apply both brakes at one time on the left brake lever I'm sure many of the other can also. Bigger bikes no, probably because its too dangerous and needs rider judgement

[thailand49]

Everything you say might be right?  The problem isn't the bike but you when you got into a accident.  You are kind of naive and selfish.  To produce the type of bike it isn't practical since a small % wouldn't be able to afford it here in Thailand especially the majority of Thais.

If you want to go in style I suggest you go get a custom golf cart.  Forget a TukTuk that is way over your head.

The bikes they make here although simple but yet you couldn't handle it, is to get to point A to B, which you and many Thais haven't learned.

[chrissables]

18 hours ago, leonidpattayski said:

Kawasaki Z250sl user manual, section Safe operation.

 

"Use Both Front and Rear Brakes When applying the brakes, use both the front and rear brakes. Applying only one brake for sudden braking may cause the motorcycle to skid and lose control.

The front brake give 70% + of the stopping power, combine with the back brake for emergency stop.

[HooHaa]

1 hour ago, atyclb said:

http://lightningmotorcycle.com/product/specifications/

alas no adjustable seat.

[Stevemercer]

I reckon the OP has a point. 

 

Why don't motorbikes have adjustable seats - forwards/backward and up/down at the very least. That way you could get the seating position and reach to the handlebars perfect. Just a centimetre either way would be sufficient for most riders to tailor the perfect individual fit.

 

Why can't you adjust the handlebars to rotate them a little further or back, again to get the perfect individual setup. It should be easy to just add/subtract shims if you want to adjust the height. Similarly with the footpegs.

 

Most pushbikes have almost infinite adjustment so you can tailor the setup exactly right for your individual preferences. Furthermore, the adjustment mechanisms don't need specialist tools. Why do motorbikes have to lock you into the one seating position unless you get expensive upgrades?

 

 

[tweedledee2]

   I bought my first motorcycle in 1970. It had an seat height adjustment and so have the other bikes I have owned. I never bought a motorcycle without sitting on it and getting a feel of the controls, before test driving. I am of average height an weight and bought bikes that fit me.  A motorcycle is not a family vehicle, like a car. Motorcycles are usually bought for solo operators.  Cars on the other hand are designed and built for operators with different physics. Thus the need for

adjustable drivers seat, steering wheel positions and outside mirror controls.                                       

    Comparing the braking systems of  modern cars to motorcycles is like apples and oranges. Motorcycles and bicycles with independent braking systems allow an experienced rider alternatives for different riding situations. The electronic braking systems in modern vehicles do this for you. Also, your quote from a Kawasaki operators manual has more to do with avoiding liability lawsuits from the survivors of an inexperienced riders error.

    

   

 

  

   

[atyclb]

30 minutes ago, HooHaa said:

alas no adjustable seat.

  4 way power seats coming soon

[gintis0604]

21 hours ago, ktm jeff said:

Front and rear brakes on a bike should be controled independantly  , as you dont want the front brake coming on half way around a bend. Many items can be adjusted for size , but not by an electric switch , as in a car. A correctly set-up / ridden automatic wont cause an accident.  Get well soon.

Very dangerous if the front wheel brakes on a slippy road. Must be separated.

No automatic on a bike??

BMW 650 has if someone is to lazy to change gears.

[DiDiChok]

My Honda SH300 flatbed scooter has 16" wheels, tubeless tyres, ABS brakes, catalytic converter, electric starting, cigarette lighter socket and so on and so on.  Quite how you could achieve some of the things the OP wants, I wouldn't know.  Maybe he could make his fortune by designing some of those things he wants?  I see the previous poster (gintis0604) is insisting that front and rear brakes should be separate.  Wrong.  The way it works these days is that the dual braking works from the left hand brake lever and front brake only from the right hand lever.  The ABS works from both levers.

 

There is a move these days to try to make everything 'accessible' so that nobody feels 'excluded'.  I rather like the Japanese approach to motorcycles in that to be qualified to ride it you have to be able to pick it up when it is lying on its side.  If your feet don't touch the floor when you're sitting on it, that too disqualifies you.  The UK's approach of insisting on basic training before you're even allowed to ride on the public highway would certainly have prevented the OP's accident.

 

I find it amazing that people just think that you can operate any vehicle without needing any training whatsoever.  You wouldn't just jump in an aeroplane and fly off would you?  Maybe you can drive a car but that doesn't mean you could just jump in an articulated lorry and drive off in it safely.  Every kind of mechanical contrivance has its own dangers and limitations that you should understand before operating it.  We used to call it RTFM - Read the flipping Manual.

[BTB1977]

Some times you have to be smarter than the motorcycle. That is why some people can not ride them. Or walk and chew gum at the same time.

[thaiguzzi]

Recommendation to the Op;

If you had difficulties with an auto scooter (which 9 y/o kids can ride - both brakes on the h/bars, twist & go), stay away from any powered 2 wheeler and stick to bicycles. And cars. I'm serious. You are a danger to yourself and others around you.

[leonidpattayski]

1 hour ago, thaiguzzi said:

Recommendation to the Op;

If you had difficulties with an auto scooter (which 9 y/o kids can ride - both brakes on the h/bars, twist & go), stay away from any powered 2 wheeler and stick to bicycles. And cars. I'm serious. You are a danger to yourself and others around you.

From my personal experience all my friends come to Thailand and lived here for few years have at least one motorcycle or scooter accident. I think there is a big room in improving safety of scooters and motorcycles. 

 

In case of panic braking for example on motorcycle without ABS and no combined braking  there is a high chance driver react or start braking too late or lock wheels due to overbraking and falls. You need press clutch first and right after press both brakes one by foot and one by hand. You also need to consider the fact hand reaction is faster than foot, especially if you ride in motorcycle boots and yout foot is somewhere on foot peg.

 

If you drive motorcycle with automatic  transmission, combined braking system and ABS, you only need to press one brake by hand with full force. This give you and advantage for about 1 second, and zero chance to lock wheel.