France to change law after man cleared of raping 11-year-old in because 'relationship was consensual'

[webfact]

France to change law after man cleared of raping 11-year-old in because 'relationship was consensual'

Equalities minister Marlene Schiappa says France needs a minimum age under which a child cannot consent to sexual activity like other European countries

Caroline Mortimer 

 

France is poised to change its statutory rape laws after a man was acquitted of raping an 11-year-old after the prosecution was unable to prove it was not consensual.

 

Under French law, having sex with someone aged 15 or under is illegal but prosecutors have to prove it is non-consensual as there is no legal minimum age below which it is presumed in law that a child cannot consent.

 

But now equalities minister Marlene Schiappa wants a legal minimum age set at between 13 and 15-years-old.

 

Full story: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/france-man-rape-11-year-old-consensual-relationship-cleared-law-change-marlene-schiappa-a8052766.html

 

-- INDEPENDENT 2017-11-15

[steven100]

very strange ....  but it is the french. 

[Thaiwrath]

Strange, yes, but I would think the word 'sickening' is more appropriate, and he should have received a severe custodial sentence.

[Berkshire]

Lordy, 11 yrs old.  That's just sick.  I would think such laws would make France pedo-heaven.  If Roy Moore had known about this, he would have immigrated to France years ago.  (sorry, sick American joke)

[darksidedog]

A 29 year old man has sex with an 11 year old and doesn't go to jail? That in itself is sick. So by whatever coercion you need, all the French pedo has to do is get the victim to say they agreed and off you go? Yes, I think they need to take a very good look at their laws and change them ASAP.

[Andaman Al]

I can't imagine this. I have a daughter aged 11 who likes ballet, gymnastics, reading and barbie dolls. It is beyond sickening to imagine children of this age being persuaded to participate in sexual activities.

 

I imagine after publication of this news item today there will be a rush of a certain type of men in Bangkok and Laos etc booking tickets to France before the end of the week. The world or rather society really does have a lot of issues these days. It's a sick world we live in.

[boomerangutang]

'bout time.

 

Few people know this, but in dozens of countries ww, if a man rapes an early-teen girl, and then agrees to marry her, ...charges will be dropped.  Countries with such laws are in the Middle East, South and Central America.   

 

What it does in the mind's of some men:  They see a young girl, and think, "wow, I'd like to have sex with her every day and night.  All I have to do is rape her, and then say I'll marry her, and my sex dreams can come true.  How cool is that?!"

 

[Andaman Al]

1 minute ago, boomerangutang said:

'bout time.

 

Few people know this, but in dozens of countries ww, if a man rapes an early-teen girl, and then agrees to marry her, ...charges will be dropped.  Countries with such laws are in the Middle East, South and Central America.   

 

What it does in the mind's of some men:  They see a young girl, and think, "wow, I'd like to have sex with her every day and night.  All I have to do is rape her, and then say I'll marry her, and my sex dreams can come true.  How cool is that?!"

 

You may want to re-word that final sentence in bold. I just know one of the forum semi-literates will be on soon and after their first morning pint will totally misconstrue what you have written .  

[AGareth2]

1 hour ago, webfact said:

acquitted of raping an 11-year-old after the prosecution was unable to prove it was not consensual.

cart before horse

at 11 it should be statutory in that consent cannot be given

and therefore there is nothing to prove

[HarrySeaman]

4 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

'bout time.

 

Few people know this, but in dozens of countries ww, if a man rapes an early-teen girl, and then agrees to marry her, ...charges will be dropped.  Countries with such laws are in the Middle East, South and Central America."

 

You left out one big country, the USA where marriage can get you out of a charge of rape following underage sex.

 

More than 200,000 children married in US over the last 15 years

Girls as young as 10 were among the minors who wedded under legal loopholes

 

More than 200,000 children were married in the US over the past 15 years, new figures have revealed.

Three 10-year-old girls and an 11-year-old boy were among the youngest to wed, under legal loopholes which allow minors to marry in certain circumstances.

 

The minimum age for marriage across most of the US is 18, but every state has exemptions – such as parental consent or pregnancy – which allow younger children to tie the knot.

 

In May, the high-profile Republican governor for New Jersey declined to sign into law a measure that would have made his state the first to ban child marriage without exception. Chris Christie claimed it would conflict with religious customs.

 

At least 207,468 minors married in the US between 2000 and 2015, according to data compiled by Unchained At Last, a group campaigning to abolish child marriage, and investigative documentary series Frontline.

 

The true figure is likely to be much higher because 10 states provided no or incomplete statistics. 

Fraidy Reiss, the founder of Unchained at Last, said she was "literally shaking" when she first obtained data for New Jersey, where her group is based.

Nearly 3,500 children married in the state between 1995 and 2012. 

 

“That number was so much higher than I had thought it would be,” she told Frontline. “Then, the fact that the children were as young as 13 and the fact that it was mostly girls married to adult men.”

 

The article continues with more information:

 

 

[Rancid]

We get outraged at Muslims doing this, and here are the French up to the same thing...a sad old world riddled with banker, media, political, religious, war and sexual corruption. No wonder some groups say we don't have to look for hell as we are experiencing it already.

[oldlakey]

8 hours ago, Thaiwrath said:

Strange, yes, but I would think the word 'sickening' is more appropriate, and he should have received a severe custodial sentence.

No doubt he would have done had the prosecution proved their case, as in they had to prove it was not consensual 

The changes that have been mooted to the law to assist prosecution are nowhere near good enough

[oldlakey]

6 hours ago, AGareth2 said:

cart before horse

at 11 it should be statutory in that consent cannot be given

and therefore there is nothing to prove

Yes of course, but its not in France apparently, hence the talk of law change

Perhaps next time if they get off their backsides  

 

[tifino]

 

why does this case ring 'Bending over to the Sharia' bells to me?

 

 

there's not enough data to discount it was a 'refuge' at it...

[oldlakey]

1 minute ago, tifino said:

 

why does this case ring 'Bending over to the Sharia' bells to me?

 

 

there's not enough data to discount it was a 'refuge' at it...

Your Post is racist BS

The accused was found NOT GUILTY as French law stands, well thats how I read it anyway

[sanuk711]

Quote

But now equalities minister Marlene Schiappa wants a legal minimum age set at between 13 and 15-years-old.

So 13 and over will be OK if the minister gets her way ??

.

Well I guess an 11 year old will be safe.....(until their 13..)

[EcigAmateur]

Nice country there <3

 

 

[HerbalEd]

4 hours ago, HarrySeaman said:

 

You left out one big country, the USA where marriage can get you out of a charge of rape following underage sex.

 

More than 200,000 children married in US over the last 15 years

 

 

 

Why don't you give the date this article was published, and where?

[7by7]

25 minutes ago, HerbalEd said:

5 hours ago, HarrySeaman said:

You left out one big country, the USA where marriage can get you out of a charge of rape following underage sex.

 

More than 200,000 children married in US over the last 15 years

Why don't you give the date this article was published, and where?

 Why don't you click on the link at the end of HarrySeaman's post?

 

5 hours ago, HarrySeaman said:

“That number was so much higher than I had thought it would be,” she told Frontline. “Then, the fact that the children were as young as 13 and the fact that it was mostly girls married to adult men.”

 

The article continues with more information:

 

For your benefit, CLICK HERE TO GO TO THE ARTICLE and you will see that it is dated 6th July 2017.

[Naam]

2 hours ago, oldlakey said:

Your Post is racist BS

The accused was found NOT GUILTY as French law stands, well thats how I read it anyway

[nasanews]

15 is the legal age for children to be grown ups, look at Thailand for example.

[Jools]

I simply cannot understand this verdict. This must be unprecedented.

[Tchooptip]

11 hours ago, steven100 said:

very strange ....  but it is the french. 

That is the French laws (translation) so something very strange in this article

The lack of consent given to the sexual relationship is the decisive factor that will qualify the sexual offenses. These are included in Articles 222 and following of the Penal Code . The statutory rape is an offense punishable with Article 227-25 of the Penal Code (Law, "minor under fifteen years" means "person under fifteen years" ² )

"The fact, for a major, to exercise without violence, coercion, threats or surprise a sexual assault on the person of a minor under fifteen years of age is punishable by five years' imprisonment and 75,000 euros of fine . "

-  Article 227-25 of the Criminal Code ³

Similarly, article 227-22-1 of the Penal Code punishes the seduction of a minor under the age of fifteen by Internet:

"The fact of a major to make sexual proposals to a minor of fifteen years or to a person posing as such using a means of electronic communication is punishable by two years imprisonment and 30,000 euros fine.

These penalties are increased to five years imprisonment and 75,000 euros fine when the proposals were followed by a meeting. "

-  Article 227-22-1 of the Penal Code ⁴

[oldlakey]

6 minutes ago, Jools said:

I simply cannot understand this verdict. This must be unprecedented.

Neither can the French, thats why law changes are on the way

I believe an appeal is to be lodged, lets hope the prosecution can prove their case this time

 

[Tchooptip]

11 hours ago, steven100 said:

very strange ....  but it is the french. 

Translation of the French law,  so what is very strange is this story

The lack of consent given to the sexual relationship is the decisive factor that will qualify the sexual offenses. These are included in Articles 222 and following of the Penal Code . The statutory rape is an offense punishable with Article 227-25 of the Penal Code (Law, "minor under fifteen years" means "person under fifteen years" ² )

"The fact, for a major, to exercise without violence, coercion, threats or surprise a sexual assault on the person of a minor under fifteen years of age is punishable by five years' imprisonment and 75,000 euros of fine . "

-  Article 227-25 of the Criminal Code ³

Similarly, article 227-22-1 of the Penal Code punishes the seduction of a minor under the age of fifteen by Internet:

"The fact of a major to make sexual proposals to a minor of fifteen years or to a person posing as such using a means of electronic communication is punishable by two years imprisonment and 30,000 euros fine.

These penalties are increased to five years imprisonment and 75,000 euros fine when the proposals were followed by a meeting. "

-  Article 227-22-1 of the Penal Code ⁴

[7by7]

16 minutes ago, Jools said:

I simply cannot understand this verdict. This must be unprecedented.

 

It is the law in France that even if the victim is under the age of consent, currently 15 in France, to convict of rape the prosecution have to prove the sex was non consensual.

 

If this cannot be proven, or if it was consensual, then they could, and should, use the lesser charge of sexual abuse of a minor; but that only carries a maximum sentence of 5 years in prison and a fine of 75,000 euros.

 

See France to reassess child sex laws after controversial cases for more detail than that given in the OP.

 

Edit: Tchooptip beat me to it!

[jobsworth]

oo la la

[gk10002000]

Very disgusting.

[rosst]

Now please tell me that the "European Court" of interference is not going to stand back and allow this? 

Where is the International outrage of this? 

Every single French citizen needs to be ashamed of themselves and why was this "loophole" not addressed before, shame on you France. 

[rosst]

12 hours ago, Naam said:

You are correct and if you believe that that is OK, you and a whole lot of people are out of step with civilised standards of morallity.