theguyfromanotherforum Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 15 hours ago, NancyL said: The time for your friend to have seen a lawyer was when he was considering investment in the business, not after he's on the losing end of the business shutting down. This. Case closed. Time to part another fool with money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Crank Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 Smells of scam to me. The owner probably got more money selling shares then he paid for the bar in the first place (if he even paid for and owns it at all!) then basically just stops paying bills and feigns bankruptcy. any buy in like this you got to be pretty gullible to think your going to get anything out of it, esp in a place like pattaya with a go-go. I mean it is a destination for low life's and criminals the world over. next lesson would to be not getting involved or giving your friend any loans or collateral. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geronimo Posted May 6, 2018 Share Posted May 6, 2018 16 hours ago, janclaes47 said: That would be a first that a foreigner can own a bar in Thailand. I think we can own a bar, just not the land it sits on ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cornishcarlos Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 10 minutes ago, geronimo said: I think we can own a bar, just not the land it sits on ...... Sounds like they bought into a rented premises ie the business operating out of the building and not the building itself.. It's kind of irrelevant anyway, as the Ops "friend" has been scammed fully 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geronimo Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Getting involved in any business in Thailand is fraught with risk, but if you dare to venture into the entertainment industry, you need very big balls and bottomless pockets!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KittenKong Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 No mystery, I bought a company owning a business and I have earned in excess of my expectations from day one. I suspect that you only bought a small half of a company, and that is the first downside of "owning" a business in Thailand. Then you can add on the potential problems with partners, staff, scams, suppliers, shake-downs, landlords ....... the list is endless. I dare say that your business does return an income: many do. But I would rather have one elsewhere than here due to the many downsides here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peterw42 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Why would you chase up a 10% share of a company that owes 1 million in rent and has no premises to operate in ? Please send me a bill for my 10% share of the liabilities ???? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torrzent Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 This is a "deja vu all over again" type story, a bit like the wife's "brother" story . Can't believe people fall for this! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobz Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 18 hours ago, FritsSikkink said: "Con man Or is he just outsmarted me?" My friend ......... If the bar is sold and he took 100% of the proceeds out of the company while not 100% owner, you have a case of fraud. He probably made the sale for 1 THB on paper. Probably related to the 1 million rent debt. So there is no profit to be shared with the shareholder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FinickyOne Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Not just Thailand - - you take a small silent interest in a business - you have no say, no importance, you are saying you trust the majority partner 100% and give them 100% control... I would never give someone 100% of my investment. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 19 minutes ago, hobz said: He probably made the sale for 1 THB on paper. Probably related to the 1 million rent debt. So there is no profit to be shared with the shareholder. You are just guessing and don't know with what majority a sale decision can be made in the company, so time for a lawyer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulic Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Your friend was swindled as many have been. Just move on and take the loss. Especially if the business partner is as well connected as you have indicated. As the saying goes. To make a small fortune in the bar business in Pattaya, start with a large one. Sorry for your friend's loss. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Henricus Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VocalNeal Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 (edited) 19 hours ago, thesetat2013 said: Irrelevant reply as the owner of the bar is a foreigner In Pattaya one is more likely to get screwed by a fellow farang than a Thai person. Depending on how much he put in, a lawyer will cost him at least 50,000 baht for something like this and there still might be enough money in the bar to recoup his loss. He has 10%. If all the other 90% got together and decided to close the business and then open a new business without the 10% guy I am not sure there is much he can do. I know a guy who had 49% of a large company in Spain. There was some problem with missing 600,000 Euros. First the other 51% fired him from his job as company director, so no income. Then they started a new company for on-line selling and marketing so now the old company only did the manufacturing. Then the old company sold its manufactured goods to the marketing company almost at cost etc, etc etc. OR one or more of the shareholders have been trousering money and now they don't have enough to pay to renew their rental agreement. ( The rent or declared rent is probably quite low for tax reasons but the under the table key money tops that up unofficially). So they are going to form a new company and look for a couple of new 10% shareholders to get the rental money and start again. Edited May 7, 2018 by VocalNeal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post poanoi Posted May 7, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted May 7, 2018 2 hours ago, Dick Crank said: esp in a place like pattaya with a go-go. I mean it is a destination for low life's and criminals the world over. nah...some, like myself for an instance, is the creme de la creme of mankind 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keith89 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 20 hours ago, janclaes47 said: I have always said, doing business with Thais is the way to go..................if you want to lose money Or farangs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baerboxer Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 15 hours ago, thesetat2013 said: He has a legal contract agreement for his shares. i have seen it Sadly with only 10% of the shares, and a foreigner, and the Thai justice system, do you think that the agreement makes any difference? It seems many Thais regard "investing in their business" in much the same way as they regard a loan i.e. something that doesn't ever have to be paid back. Maybe some of the other investors were beginning to also ask questions prompting this. Or perhaps he just wants to clear some debts and then set up again "under new ownership". These things used to happen in farangland many moons ago. Hence the reason developed countries have strict laws on business organization and operation, which are enforced. Here, sorry but even if he did find a competent lawyer to pursue his claim, the costs and time involved would probably be much greater than he realizes. An expensive lesson that leaves a nasty taste. But maybe time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfinityandBeyond Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 With potential for being on the hook for 10% of liabilities as well as the owner's connections to influential people, your friend should just walk away before he becomes another victim of a "business dispute." "You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em,Know when to walk away and know when to run." - Kenny Rogers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watcharacters Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 20 hours ago, FritsSikkink said: "Con man Or is he just outsmarted me?" My friend ......... If the bar is sold and he took 100% of the proceeds out of the company while not 100% owner, you have a case of fraud. "you have a case of fraud." And now he just needs to be able to prove it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hobz Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 1 hour ago, FritsSikkink said: You are just guessing and don't know with what majority a sale decision can be made in the company, so time for a lawyer. Of course I'm just guessing. True. Let me make another guess. Getting a lawyer will most likely just lead to further losses and waste of time. I'm pretty good at guessing btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, watcharacters said: "you have a case of fraud." And now he just needs to be able to prove it! That is why he needs a lawyer, to get his hands on the company paperwork required. Why are people going into business, who clearly haven't got a clue on how to do business in the first place. If you invest in a company, you should have these papers to start with and have regular shareholder meetings. Edited May 7, 2018 by FritsSikkink 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watcharacters Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 1 minute ago, FritsSikkink said: That is why he needs a lawyer, to get his hands on the company paperwork required. Why are people going into business, who clearly haven't got a clue on how to do business in the first place. Ok, so if he pursues it he will need an honest and competent lawyer. Do you have any recommendations? And what paperwork? Sounds like the place was run haphazardly with intention. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FritsSikkink Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, watcharacters said: Ok, so if he pursues it he will need an honest and competent lawyer. Do you have any recommendations? And what paperwork? Sounds like the place was run haphazardly with intention. I do and I am done with giving a free handbook on how to run your business. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
watcharacters Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Just now, FritsSikkink said: I do and I am done with giving a free handbook on how to run your business. Time for a smoke break? Who asked for a free handbook or any advice on "how to run YOUR business"? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerkinsCuthbert Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Oh dear, a farang "well connected with both the Thai government and the local police", who is now "threatening to have him (your friend) arrested, blacklisted and deported". Your friend's first mistake was to get involved with a bar-owning (which is illegal in itself, if true) fantasist who makes ridiculous and unsupportable threats to his co-owner. Clearly it has gone downhill since then. In my opinion he has two unsavoury options - either walk away, write the money off, and stop being so gullible, or employ a decent lawyer, stand up to the owner's threats and fantasies and hope to get something returned, likely after a many sleepless nights. I don't see a civilised third option, though some may think that payments to large, well-built men with two-by-fours might expedite things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torrzent Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 1 hour ago, VocalNeal said: He has 10%. Maybe 20 other people also have 10%? Reminds me of the old Yogi Berra saying, Baseball is ninety percent mental and the other half is physical. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight8 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 22 hours ago, thesetat2013 said: Irrelevant reply as the owner of the bar is a foreigner Not entirely as you did say yourself, "the bar is well connected with Thai gov & local police" which technically makes it also dealing with Thai's as it would appear they can make or break you!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Straight8 Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 13 hours ago, KittenKong said: It's a complete mystery to me why anyone would ever get involved in any sort of business venture in Thailand. Nothing but downsides. More dollars than sense, perhaps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scorecard Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 22 hours ago, thesetat2013 said: Do you say the even though the owner of the property closed the doors due to non payment of rent? Because then the owner can claim it's closed... and get new lease with different name on bar.. and reopen with full ownership again. Let's go to the bottom line, the whole arrangement (as explained by the OP) is way outside of any logical / sensible business set up. Can we assume that the 10% shareholders already knew the 'owner' was rarely on the premises and left the management up to the girls on site? Is that's true nobody in there right mind would invest 1Baht in this 'business'. Suggest OP and other shareholders learn some basics of business and learn to have proper clear documentation and learn that any business should have proper accounting available for all shareholders to see. Etc., etc. Fools and their money are soon parted. Or is this a group of farang who think it's just great to say to their friends 'I own 10% of a go go bar'. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lucky mike Posted May 7, 2018 Share Posted May 7, 2018 Negative gearing at its best ! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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