VAR catastrophe

[smokie36]

Looks to me like they quietly have shelved VAR.

[jenny2017]

On 6/16/2018 at 11:03 PM, RonniePickering22 said:

 

Clean your specs young man!!

He's lost his spectacles a long time ago. ?

[JemJem]

That Berg incident has left a very bitter taste in my mouth; and it's like it has made me lose some of my enthusiasm for the remainder of the Cup. Of course, this might change soon; but this is how I am feeling now.

 

If there had been no VAR, we would have said 'Bad mistake by the ref' or 'The ref probably wasn't able to see the position properly'. But, now that there is VAR, sorry but, it is totally silly and unfair that that position didn't at least go to video-inspection by the ref.

 

And, of course, it is needless to say that it was a very important incident. It could have been (and, in my opinion, it was) a penalty and a red card.

 

 

 

 

[electric]

It seems to me that this discussion is more about the inconsistency of refs calling for VAR review.

 

As a previous poster said several pages ago, perhaps a system where team captains have 3 VAR requests to the ref per game would be more fair.

 

If the review proves successful, you don't lose 1 of your requests.

 

If unsuccessful review, then 1 request is gone.

 

Refs can still request as many VAR reviews as they deem necessary.

 

VAR has already proven to be a game changer in this series, so the technology is worth persevering with, IMHO

 

Purists will say that reviews will slow the game down, and I do not disagree, but with soccer being such a low scoring game, every contentious decision in the box area is crucial to get right.

 

Other sports have successfully introduced the above requests system decades ago. The wrinkles just need to be ironed out for it to be successful in soccer also.

 

 

[mrbojangles]

1 hour ago, electric said:

It seems to me that this discussion is more about the inconsistency of refs calling for VAR review.

Agreed.

 

I think we are at the point in the introduction of VAR, where the powers that be have taken notice of the critics about it slowing the game down. I reckon they have told the ref's not to review every decision for fear of having too may stops and instructed them to only go to VAR when it is clear they have made a mistake. On the incident last night with Sweden, even the beIN pundits couldn't agree.

 

I really do think an official should come out and explain things

[smokie36]

Bit late for that now I think mrboj....I reckon we won't see more VAR decisions in this WC...but of course probably I'm waaaaay off the mark and Panama will get three penalties today.

 

Always the optimist! 

[alfieconn]

2 hours ago, electric said:

It seems to me that this discussion is more about the inconsistency of refs calling for VAR review.

 

As a previous poster said several pages ago, perhaps a system where team captains have 3 VAR requests to the ref per game would be more fair.

 

If the review proves successful, you don't lose 1 of your requests.

 

If unsuccessful review, then 1 request is gone.

 

Refs can still request as many VAR reviews as they deem necessary.

 

VAR has already proven to be a game changer in this series, so the technology is worth persevering with, IMHO

 

Purists will say that reviews will slow the game down, and I do not disagree, but with soccer being such a low scoring game, every contentious decision in the box area is crucial to get right.

 

Other sports have successfully introduced the above requests system decades ago. The wrinkles just need to be ironed out for it to be successful in soccer also.

 

 

I agree with you but a slight difference is that in other sports it is generally black or white, I.e tennis with a line call, Cricket with a ball hitting the stumps on playback, so even if a team ask for a review it is still down to the ref's opinion which if he and VAR have seen it in the first instance then he might not change his mind !

[champers]

22 hours ago, RonniePickering22 said:

 

You touched on the potential for corruption and with four nameless people sitting behind the scenes making vital decisions on games it opens football up to all kinds of shenanigans.

They are all named before kick off, 4 refs or linesmen with one as leader. Quite a few Italians and Americans, who have no need for bias.

[smokie36]

6 minutes ago, champers said:

They are all named before kick off, 4 refs or linesmen with one as leader. Quite a few Italians and Americans, who have no need for bias.

 

Can't see that happening at club level though.

[mrbojangles]

5 hours ago, RonniePickering22 said:

Bit late for that now I think mrboj....I reckon we won't see more VAR decisions in this WC...

Yeah we will Ronnie 

[JemJem]

Wow.....interesting match it was.......the Portugal-Iran one. So many VAR decisions. The ref was so busy with them during the match ?

 

Did the ref get it right with the 3 incidents that went to VAR ? Well.....I think they weren't easy-to-decide incidents. But I think the ref got it right with both the penalties, although I have to say that the one given to Iran was sort of less definite than the one given to Portugal. And.....the Ronaldo incident....well ? , I have a feeling that there was quite a high chance that if it hadn't been Ronaldo but another player from Portugal, he would have been shown the red. I think it was a red, although I can understand those who say the ref got it right by showing the yellow.

[JemJem]

Here is an interesting video. The title says 'Iran 1-1 Portugal post match analysis' , but it is mostly about VAR ? These folks discuss VAR in the light of what happened in that match and also in general. Their opinion is mainly anti-VAR.

 

 

[mrbojangles]

3 hours ago, JemJem said:

Here is an interesting video. The title says 'Iran 1-1 Portugal post match analysis' , but it is mostly about VAR ? These folks discuss VAR in the light of what happened in that match and also in general. Their opinion is mainly anti-VAR.

I gave up on watching that after a few minutes. Those luddites have always been against VAR and nothing will ever change their minds. They are accusing the ref of being told what to do and even said FIFA are so corrupt they will have said not to give Ronaldo a red card. They really aren't up to being on TV throwing accusations around like that with absolutely no proof

[smokie36]

1 hour ago, mrbojangles said:

I gave up on watching that after a few minutes. Those luddites have always been against VAR and nothing will ever change their minds. They are accusing the ref of being told what to do and even said FIFA are so corrupt they will have said not to give Ronaldo a red card. They really aren't up to being on TV throwing accusations around like that with absolutely no proof

 

The Iran VAR decision was very questionable in my opinion.

 

Some of these refs need to visit the optician!

[stud858]

VAR is there to help in most situations.  You can't have a system that pleases everyone all the time.  But to suggest it was better without the VAR, that's cooky talk.

 

[473geo]

There is a place for VAR and has already been shown to be beneficial if a little cumbersome

Just needs smartening up a bit.

[mrbojangles]

8 hours ago, RonniePickering22 said:

 

The Iran VAR decision was very questionable in my opinion.

 

Some of these refs need to visit the optician!

You're quite right Ronnie but it would be the same ref on the field needing glasses, with or without VAR. VAR doesn't change the ref, it only assists his chance to see the incident again. If a decision isn't black and white like an offside, it will be down to the ref's opinion/interpretation as he has the last word 

[Bredbury Blue]

I think the Iran VAR handball incident only proved that the world referees view handball differently than we do in the uk, and there have been a few similar handball incidents in this world cup, as opposed to VAR is flawed. No way was that a penalty!

[smokie36]

2 hours ago, mrbojangles said:

You're quite right Ronnie but it would be the same ref on the field needing glasses, with or without VAR. VAR doesn't change the ref, it only assists his chance to see the incident again. If a decision isn't black and white like an offside, it will be down to the ref's opinion/interpretation as he has the last word 

 

All the more shocking a decision I thought.

[smokie36]

VAR in the Argentina game was good.

 

Jury remains divided I guess.

[JemJem]

25 minutes ago, RonniePickering22 said:

VAR in the Argentina game was good.

 

Jury remains divided I guess.

 

Yes. Overall, it was good.

 

By the way, this is nothing against VAR, but maybe there was one major error by the ref. I mean, Nigeria could have gotten a penalty again, when it was 1-1. It went to VAR and the ref didn't give it. Wasn't it quite similar to the penalty incident where Iran was awarded a penalty against Portugal via VAR ?! Oh, well...

 

I actually didn't want Argentina to go out in the first round, but seeing how efficient and dynamic the Nigerians played most of the match, I felt really bad for their going out; especially with the Argentina winner coming very near the end.

[JemJem]

Check out this video. For the incident I mentioned in the above post (the penalty that wasn't given to Nigeria), Lineker and Zabaleta say the ref made the right decision, while Drogba and Ferdinand say it was a wrong decision ?

 

It's between 03.50 and 06.30 in the video.

 

 

[alfieconn]

10 hours ago, Bredbury Blue said:

I think the Iran VAR handball incident only proved that the world referees view handball differently than we do in the uk, and there have been a few similar handball incidents in this world cup, as opposed to VAR is flawed. No way was that a penalty!

So are you saying that World referees use a different law to Ref's in the UK ?

[mrbojangles]

5 hours ago, JemJem said:

Lineker and Zabaleta say the ref made the right decision, while Drogba and Ferdinand say it was a wrong decision ?

That's the biggest obstacle for VAR to overcome. Opinions and interpretations of the laws vary from pundit to pundit, ref to ref and ex-player to ex-player but at the end of the day it's down to the ref on the pitch. It's his opinion and interpretation of the law that matters, no matter if it's at the time of the incident or via VAR.

 

The more I watch the more I'm leaning more to Ronnie's suggestion. The ref can ask for as many reviews as he wants but also the teams have 2 or 3 challenges each.

[smokie36]

If the players are given the responsibility it has to be done in a way which discourages any type of gamesmanship.

 

A tough call...maybe one each half allowed?

 

We don't want stop start shenanigans.

[jellydog]

Tonight in the VAR room.

 

 

[mrbojangles]

Blimey. Did anyone see the nailed on penalty shout for Sweden? Chiccorito (sp) used his arm to control the ball on purpose. Correctly went to VAR and the ref still didn't award a pen. VAR can only do so much but when you have a proper idiot of a ref you have no hope

[mrbojangles]

VAR has just correctly knocked Germany out of the WC. Now tell me again who doesn't like VAR ???

[jellydog]

Well, I'm kinda liking VAR right about now.

[mrbojangles]

4 minutes ago, jellydog said:

Well, I'm kinda liking VAR right about now.

? I knew it'd grow on you if you gave it time jelly ?