Just now, Just Weird said:

Of course they know who they are, we all know who we are, it's what they are that is the subject.

 

Katoeys want everyone to pretend, just like they do, that they are women, that they are something that they are not.  They are not women, they are men, and if they cannot fit into a normal society because of their own choice to be abnormal, and their own pretence, that is no one's fault but their own and they should learn to live with it.

Again, I do not agree with any of the sentiments you post here.

 

 

Imagine the outcry if someone had been told "We don't accept men". Oh, wait, there wouldn't be one. Never mind.

35 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Could not agree less.

That is your prerogative but what I stated was objective fact, not opinion, regardless of your agreement.

Just now, Just Weird said:

That is your prerogative but what I stated was objective fact, not opinion, regardless of your agreement.

Once more I feel you are quite wrong.

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

Again, I do not agree with any of the sentiments you post here.

Those are not "sentiments", they are objective facts.

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

Once more I feel you are quite wrong.

"Feel" all you want, doesn't change the facts.

1 minute ago, Just Weird said:

Those are not "sentiments", they are objective facts.

No, they weren't facts.

 

They were quite nasty "sentiments"...

Just now, Just Weird said:

"Feel" all you want, doesn't change the facts.

You have presented no facts, just rather unsavoury "sentiments"...

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

No, they weren't facts.

 

They were quite nasty "sentiments"...

 

Here's what I said...

6 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Katoeys want everyone to pretend, just like they do, that they are women, that they are something that they are not.  They are not women, they are men, and if they cannot fit into a normal society because of their own choice to be abnormal, and their own pretence, that is no one's fault but their own and they should learn to live with it.

Specifically, what parts of that are not factual?

30 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

 

Here's what I said...

Specifically, what parts of that are not factual?

Everything.

 

But to be specific

 

Transgenders are not abnormal.

 

They consider themselves transgender men/women and if they do so, that's fine by me. It really isn't my concern.

 

It's societies responsibilty to accept that not everything is as simplistic as you claim.

Transgender men in USA have a 40% suicide rate. They are not very stable individuals. And liberals say that if a straight man will not date a transgender, then he is a transphobe. Peoplecare crazy. Thailand accepts them as a part of society, but they really aren't normal people. And in Thailand, a high percentage of them are violent. It's best to stay away from them altogether. 

5 hours ago, greenchair said:

There are many companies that lose a lot of business because their staff are ladymen. Then there are many companies that gain a lot of business because they hire mostly or all ladymen. It depends on the needs of the company and their customer base. It's ludicrous not to consider the grassroots issues. They are over 18, they are not boys at all. They are men. Or transgender men to be precise. Most understand this and prosper very well in the areas of life where they can excel. Such as healthcare services, in the beauty industry, elderly care, fashion, jewellery. A company that was involved in male body building might not be suitable. Be who you are and get over it for goodness sake. 

Transgender WOMEN you mean.

Transgender MEN are people that were born female and identify as male. 

You claim to be an expert on these matter yet you don't even know basic elementary facts about them. Amazing!

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans_woman

 

Also your POV on what occupations transgender people should limit themselves REEKS of decrepit bigotry.

All people should feel free to pursue ANY work they can qualify for.

They should not be limited by the ignorance of bigots. 

Whoever wrote the email should have said: Sorry, we choose another more suitable candidate.
I know, I would.

9 minutes ago, soistalker said:

Transgender men in USA have a 40% suicide rate. They are not very stable individuals. And liberals say that if a straight man will not date a transgender, then he is a transphobe. Peoplecare crazy. Thailand accepts them as a part of society, but they really aren't normal people. And in Thailand, a high percentage of them are violent. It's best to stay away from them altogether. 

You need to back up such stats with sources but I would expect it to be high. They face unusual stress from societal rejection, even family rejection, just based on who they are. Also, you are lying -- it is in no way a mainstream "liberal" POV that it's transphobic to not be sexually interested in transgender people. 

4 minutes ago, kcpattaya said:

Whoever wrote the email should have said: Sorry, we choose another more suitable candidate.
I know, I would.

They surely will next time, but they've been outed for unfair discrimination.

25 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

Of course they know who they are, we all know who we are, it's what they are that is the subject.

 

Katoeys want everyone to pretend, just like they do, that they are women, that they are something that they are not.  They are not women, they are men, and if they cannot fit into a normal society because of their own choice to be abnormal, and their own pretence, that is no one's fault but their own and they should learn to live with it.

Correct.

3 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

People have the right to be identified as the gender they know them selves to be. It's not a choice, it's who they are.

 

Companies should not be allowed to discriminate against someone because of who they are.

 

This applies whether they are gay, straight, transgender, male, female.

 

And let's not forget the unacceptability of discrimination based on colour, age, faith...

Ladyboys don't 'know themselves to be women' because they aren't, unless they have lost all contact with reality, they just have to look at their junk or the bills for removing it. They want to be, I want a lot of things as well, I feel as if I'm 30, just ignore my birth certificate. I would feel so upset if a firm said sorry we don't employ 70 year olds, how dare they, deep inside I'm 30, respect that.

A buffalo in a giraffe suit is still a buffalo.

3 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

Ladyboys don't 'know themselves to be women' because they aren't, unless they have lost all contact with reality, they just have to look at their junk or the bills for removing it. They want to be, I want a lot of things as well, I feel as if I'm 30, just ignore my birth certificate. I would feel so upset if a firm said sorry we don't employ 70 year olds, how dare they, deep inside I'm 30, respect that.

If you'd like to read on in this thread, I say age discrimination is also wrong.

 

If someone can do the job and have the best qualifications, then that is what matters.

 

As for what transgender people know themselves to be, they know who they are better than you.

1 minute ago, Justfine said:

A buffalo in a giraffe suit is still a buffalo.

It doesn't even give a good impression of a giraffe, there's the horns...

2 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

If you'd like to read on in this thread, I say age discrimination is also wrong.

 

If someone can do the job and have the best qualifications, then that is what matters.

 

As for what transgender people know themselves to be, they know who they are better than you.

They think they know who they are but they aren't fooling anyone else.

Just now, soalbundy said:

They think they know who they are but they aren't fooling anyone else.

Transgender men and women know who they are and that's the way it is.

 

You may not like the fact, but that's not their problem.

1 hour ago, greenchair said:

He's a man. He'll always be a man. He is a transgender male. Even if his knob is cut off with his danglers, he'll still be a male. The transgender that understand and accept this don't have the same problems as transgenders that insist they are a female and want everyone else to play pretend. What's wrong with saying, I'm a man and I like to behave feminiely and I'm fine with that. 

Get real. 

You have no idea what "transgender" means, right!?

You are confusing them with transvestites or crossdressers!

Get educated!

1 hour ago, Just Weird said:

They are actually being diametrically opposed to "who they are" (whatever that means).  They are men, they are not being "courageous" and they are certainly not being "punished".  They are simply suffering the consequences of their own decisions to masquerade as females.

This is so stupid, it shouldn't even warrant a response.

I try it anyways: "to masquerade as females" is super insulting!

Maybe you should -for once in your life- try to read up on a subject and learn something!

I am really sick and tired of people like you, who think, someone woke up in the morning, put on his wife's dress and demands. everybody should call him Loretta!

Transgenders are living with a lifelong problem, one that I do not even pretend to understand, but sure don't want to go through!

And it is people like your Ignorancy, who make life more complicated and downright dangerous for them, in some cases!

 

1 hour ago, Get Real said:

So it´s better to lie, than to tell the truth? 

It's better to be polite then to openly discriminate...for sure!

I bet, this lady has enough problems to fight with, she doesn't need to be told "we despise, who you are, that's why we don't give you a job!"

Overall...it would be better not to discriminate!

45 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

 

Here's what I said...

Specifically, what parts of that are not factual?

Mostly all of it- but especially this rather dumb and insulting part: "They are not women, they are men, and if they cannot fit into a normal society because of their own choice to be abnormal, and their own pretence, that is no one's fault but their own and they should learn to live with it.

I hope the story will generate enough media attention to change the law with regard to discrimination in Thailand, it has happened before, Samart Meecharoen successfully sued the Thai Army. I am friends with her and she now holds a senior position at Google's main offices for SE Asia in the department that is responsible for adapting and porting android app's for the Thai market and Thai language. Hardly a criminal or massage girl but some people especially those on Thai Visa are so closed minded and immature I wonder how or if the function as normal human beings at all.

 

Hopefully the Ladyboy in the news story can take her case further like Samart did and I wish her every success in her career.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Have other people had a similar experience in your life to this Thai person, where you were rejected for a public accommodation, to purchase goods or services, employment, etc. and explicitly TOLD the reason was based on discrimination only based of your identity status as company policy?

I have. 

It's radicalizing. 

In my case, there was no legal recourse. 

There should be in all countries for all such unfair discrimination.

But the point of generally not being told the reason is definitely true. 

So laws don't actually change all that much. 

But better than nothing. It gives a message to the society what the ideals are. 

8 minutes ago, DM07 said:

It's better to be polite then to openly discriminate...for sure!

I bet, this lady has enough problems to fight with, she doesn't need to be told "we despise, who you are, that's why we don't give you a job!"

Overall...it would be better not to discriminate!

we despise, who you are, that's why we don't give you a job! ?????? Where did they say that. They said that they do not employ ladyboys or 2nd type woman.

They can´t be more polite, without lying.

2 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

A: I agree that people are born as who they are. I just don't share your extremely narrow vision of what this means.

 

B: No one is born a criminal. That is what they are, not who.

 

C : A child molester is a criminal scum bag. Not the same thing at all. It is disgusting that you try to link such filth to this story.

 

D : Someones sexual orientation or gender does not make them unsuitable for a job. That is discrimination.

 

E :  What you post does not in any way undermine what I said.

 

 

 

Someones "gender" does make them unsuitable for many jobs.  If your sex is male but you think someone attached the wrong bits and your gender should be female you have some mental health problems (like those who think they are Jesus, Napoleon or a gorilla).  I think that an employer should have the right to decide if they want an employee with mental issues.

 

In fact the situation with the child molester would be exactly the same as they have similar identity/mental issues although obviously if they act on them the results are much more horrific.