Just Received Some Bad News For US Citizens. No More Income Affidavits.

[Pattaya46]

1 hour ago, Lovethailandelite said:

Immigration met with ALL embassy representatives. The meetings concluded with the released statements that the embassy's have posted. Banked money OR minimum foreign income.

That's a lot of speculation... IMHO.

And if such a meeting with such a conclusion had happen, I can't believe that none of embassies had quickly published that news on its website. 5-6 months is absolutely not a normal delay to inform us.

[Thaidream]

28 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

s for what anyone else should do: Up-To-You.

Sounds like a good plan- I almost am starting to think an elite  visa  is the way to go- no bank transfer; no money in the bank crap-you buy your visa for 5 years. End of story- Cheers.

[mogandave]

Sounds like a good plan- I almost am starting to think an elite  visa  is the way to go- no bank transfer; no money in the bank crap-you buy your visa for 5 years. End of story- Cheers.

Thinking about it, this could all be a marketing device....

I’d rather draw interest on the 400 or 800k...

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 hours ago, Lovethailandelite said:

No combination,

 

Obviously, everyone here is waiting for some answers directly from Thai Immigration.

 

But IF they end up moving to a Thai bank deposits method only for monthly income based extensions, there's nothing inherent about that that would not allow Immigration to continue accepting combination (monthly income plus bank deposit) method applications, as Joe likewise pointed out above.

 

BTW, to the poster who asked about people making inquiry of their local Immigration offices, in fact, several posters in this long thread have done that and have posted their versions of those conversations.

 

Of course, there's at least two issues about that: 1. did the poster correctly and accurately understand and repost what they heard. And 2. did the Immigration person they were talking with have any factual basis for the advice they gave, and did it in any way reflect what Immigration HQ intends to do.

 

Of the two posts I recall, in one case, the version was that Immigration was only going to accept Thai bank deposits for monthly income purposes. In the other post, I believe the poster said they were told that government pension statements would be accepted as proof of monthly income. But neither of those reports were from CW BKK Immigration staff, but instead, outlying Immigration offices.

 

While we wait to hear something official from Immigration HQ, I'd certainly be interested to hear any guidance that anyone hears in the meantime from the extension supervisors at BKK CW Immigration, since they are probably closer to the HQ thinking than those in outlying offices.

 

 

Edited November 5, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Mike Teavee]

58 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Sounds like a good plan- I almost am starting to think an elite  visa  is the way to go- no bank transfer; no money in the bank crap-you buy your visa for 5 years. End of story- Cheers.

Also my Plan B, though at 52 (53 when Extension is due) would be the 20 year option.

 

On the fence about getting one anyway as I'm still working & the only reason I got my Non-O was because I enter/exit 2-3 times a month & had concerns about being denied on a Visa Exempt stamp (Thanks to them clamping down on perceived VIsa Runners), an Elite VIsa would enable me to use Fast Track Arrivals/Departure & save me 2-3 hours a month (average 30mins each side). 

 

I use the 800K in the Bank + Wire over 80-120K a month for spends, but any significant changes to valid proof of Income (e.g. If they insist on seeing it even if you have 800K & insist on it coming from a State Pension that's 15 years away for me) would be the final  straw to  push me over.

 

Prepare for the worse & hope for the best...

 

[Thaidream]

16 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

use the 800K in the Bank + Wire over 80-120K a month for spends, but any significant changes to valid proof of Income (e.g. If they insist on seeing it even if you have 800K & insist on it coming from a State Pension that's 15 years away for me) would be the final  straw to  push me over.

Mike- makes sense- but I really don't want throw away   1 Million on the 20 year plan  because of my age. (70) The only problem I see is once you  stop the  retirement extension you have lost the  right to be grandfathered. I suppose I could also apply for  Permanent Residence which costs  around 100K if approved but takes  about 1-2 years to get approved.

 

I am going to get the Embassy Letter and try and use it one more time- I just got an email back from the US Embassy who said it  will be good for 6 months/ so i have to believe them.  Then after my extension end of May- will  move to  the next stage. Hopefully- everything will be much clearer but when I see reports of  Phuket  accepting only Government Pensions- it makes me wonder  where is the guidance.  I am hopeful both CW; Jomtien and the others simply accept the Embassy letter as is until  mid 2019. It would give everyone time to adjust till the next extension.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

40 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

I use the 800K in the Bank + Wire over 80-120K a month for spends, but any significant changes to valid proof of Income (e.g. If they insist on seeing it even if you have 800K & insist on it coming from a State Pension that's 15 years away for me) would be the final  straw to  push me over.

 

 

Not sure I'm understanding your comment above.

 

If you're keeping 800K in a Thai bank account for 3 months prior to your extension application coming due, there should be no additional monthly income based requirements at most Immigration offices.

 

Normally, if you keep 800K in a Thai bank, you don't have to worry about the monthly income issues. And on the flip side, if you meet whatever the future monthly income rules are going to be, you don't have to worry about keeping 800K locked up in a Thai bank account.

 

It's usually either / or -- not both.  Unless you're doing a combo application with lesser amounts for both monthly income and the Thai bank deposit approach.

 

[Mike Teavee]

21 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Not sure I'm understanding your comment above.

 

If you're keeping 800K in a Thai bank account for 3 months prior to your extension application coming due, there should be no additional monthly income based requirements at most Immigration offices.

 

Normally, if you keep 800K in a Thai bank, you don't have to worry about the monthly income issues. And on the flip side, if you meet whatever the future monthly income rules are going to be, you don't have to worry about keeping 800K locked up in a Thai bank account.

 

It's usually either / or -- not both.  Unless you're doing a combo application with lesser amounts for both monthly income and the Thai bank deposit approach.

 

I'm keeping 800K in the bank to do the Extension and if nothing changes in this regard (or it doesn't go up significantly) I will use this.

 

The transfers are mainly for my monthly spends but might come in handy if they change the rules so you need to show money coming into the country (not necessarily income) as well as the 800K.  

 

NB there are no indications that anything will change wrt the money in the bank but I tend to prepare for the worse & hope for the best.

 

AS mentioned, the Thai Elite Visa offers other benefits that are of great use to me while I'm commuting between Singapore & Bangkok, if I decide to stay on 1 more year instead of retiring in March I will almost certainly get one as it will save me an average of around 1-1.5 hours per return journey which might not sound a lot, but adds up when you're doing the journey every other weekend (sometimes every weekend).

 

 

Edited November 5, 2018 by Mike Teavee

[HHTel]

I'm in Hua Hin.

 

Take this as you will:

I've just returned from Bluport after doing my 90 day report. (unusually busy for some reason). At the desk, the IO was giving out the extension rules for next year without without any questions from me. "Next year you will have to put 65K in the bank every month starting February, or 800,000 as normal. I asked "Is this just the Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

Every officer was giving out these rules to everyone without being asked! Being a Monday, I wonder if those rules came from Bangkok over the weekend.

[offset]

14 minutes ago, HHTel said:

I'm in Hua Hin.

 

Take this as you will:

I've just returned from Bluport after doing my 90 day report. (unusually busy for some reason). At the desk, the IO was giving out the extension rules for next year without without any questions from me. "Next year you will have to put 65K in the bank every month starting February, or 800,000 as normal. I asked "Is this just the Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

Every officer was giving out these rules to everyone without being asked! Being a Monday, I wonder if those rules came from Bangkok over the weekend.

did they say the monthly money must be for abroad 

 

[Peterw42]

15 minutes ago, HHTel said:

I'm in Hua Hin.

 

Take this as you will:

I've just returned from Bluport after doing my 90 day report. (unusually busy for some reason). At the desk, the IO was giving out the extension rules for next year without without any questions from me. "Next year you will have to put 65K in the bank every month starting February, or 800,000 as normal. I asked "Is this just the Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

Every officer was giving out these rules to everyone without being asked! Being a Monday, I wonder if those rules came from Bangkok over the weekend.

Can you post a copy of the handout ?

[moontang]

I just got back from CIMB..2 year fixed at 2.5%, interest paid monthly.  So it is confirmed.

[mogandave]

I just got back from CIMB..2 year fixed at 2.5%, interest paid monthly.  So it is confirmed.

2.5 is pretty good...

[Thaidream]

35 minutes ago, HHTel said:

Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

I hear what you are saying- but I just  today got an email back from the US Embassy verifying the Embassy letter was good for  6 months- as long as obtained before Dec 31, 2018. That doesn't sound like they are cancelled- unless the IO meant no longer being issued after Jan 1, 2019.  I suspect all this needs some type of clarification one way or the other.  In addition , source of bank deposit foreign or don't care.  More information needed/  And the 65K monthly deposit- can it be used or does it have to sit there for some months for seasoning.?

Edited November 5, 2018 by Thaidream

[garyk]

46 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

2.5 is pretty good...

 

If I were going to stay here for a while that is what I would be doing.

Might as well do the 800K, and at least get a little interest IMO.

[mogandave]

If I were going to stay here for a while that is what I would be doing.
Might as well do the 800K, and at least get a little interest IMO.

If I were going in and out a few times a month I would consider the elites, but I only travel every other month.

[garyk]

3 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

If I were going in and out a few times a month I would consider the elites, but I only travel every other month.

 

Yea, the 20 year looks ok. But, I just can't wrap my head around the cash outlay. Although, at my age and if I were planning to live here until death. I might consider it just for insurance against further changes.

 

Regards

[merijn]

1 hour ago, HHTel said:

I'm in Hua Hin.

 

Take this as you will:

I've just returned from Bluport after doing my 90 day report. (unusually busy for some reason). At the desk, the IO was giving out the extension rules for next year without without any questions from me. "Next year you will have to put 65K in the bank every month starting February, or 800,000 as normal. I asked "Is this just the Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

Every officer was giving out these rules to everyone without being asked! Being a Monday, I wonder if those rules came from Bangkok over the weekend.

OK, Interesting but how do the bank deposit proof if your extension is somewhere in July 2019 ?

[HHTel]

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

Can you post a copy of the handout ?

When I said 'gave out', I meant verbally.  There is no handout but maybe that will come later.

 

I'm just reporting my experience at immigration this morning. The IO's had obviously been given some instructions, whether locally or otherwise.  They were offering information whether you wanted to know or not!

[garyk]

6 minutes ago, HHTel said:

When I said 'gave out', I meant verbally.  There is no handout but maybe that will come later.

 

I'm just reporting my experience at immigration this morning. The IO's had obviously been given some instructions, whether locally or otherwise.  They were offering information whether you wanted to know or not!

That may be all TI plans on doing. I would not be surprised in the least.

[Thaidream]

21 minutes ago, HHTel said:

When I said 'gave out', I meant verbally.  There is no handout but maybe that will come later.

 

I'm just reporting my experience at immigration this morning. The IO's had obviously been given some instructions, whether locally or otherwise.  They were offering information whether you wanted to know or not!

Thanks for clarifying that.  I am still going to get the Embassy Letter as both the US and UK Embassies have indicated they are good for 6 months hence.

[merijn]

11 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Thanks for clarifying that.  I am still going to get the Embassy Letter as both the US and UK Embassies have indicated they are good for 6 months hence.

I would do the same as we don't know how the requirements will be changed in the next few months.

At least you have then a income certificate if required and possible.

[HHTel]

I believe the 6 month validity has been confirmed by both sides.  The question is about what rules will be in place after June regarding the income route.  My extension is up for renewal next August, after the 6 month rule.  I think what the IO was saying is that showing income from February onward is to allow 6 months of income shown for extensions in the 2nd half of next year.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, HHTel said:

 My extension is up for renewal next August, after the 6 month rule.  I think what the IO was saying is that showing income from February onward is to allow 6 months of income shown for extensions in the 2nd half of next year.

 

Did the IO who was talking to you know the timeframe for your current extension to expire when she was talking about the February date?

 

Either way, it sounds like you're doing a bit of guessing on this point beyond what the officer actually said.

 

I'd be very surprised if Immigration doesn't honor the normal 6 months validity period for Income affidavits, beyond the final Dec. 2018 dates that the UK and US embassies will be issuing them.

 

BTW, thanks for reporting the encounter!

 

Edited November 5, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Kadilo]

1 hour ago, HHTel said:

When I said 'gave out', I meant verbally.  There is no handout but maybe that will come later.

 

I'm just reporting my experience at immigration this morning. The IO's had obviously been given some instructions, whether locally or otherwise.  They were offering information whether you wanted to know or not!

I believe what he said to you will be the way forward whether we line or or not. Obviously there needs to be more meat on the bones re detail, but makes sense in light of what they have done thus far. 

I’m going to see mine in about a months time so I will see if there is any consistency as mine is out in the sticks. I’m sure there will be many more verbal “handouts” in the meantime. Thanks for sharing. 

[mogandave]

Yea, the 20 year looks ok. But, I just can't wrap my head around the cash outlay. Although, at my age and if I were planning to live here until death. I might consider it just for insurance against further changes.

 

Regards

 

Yea, at 2.5% that B800k would be worth a little over B1.6M...

 

In 20 years...

[bkk6060]

2 hours ago, HHTel said:

I'm in Hua Hin.

 

Take this as you will:

I've just returned from Bluport after doing my 90 day report. (unusually busy for some reason). At the desk, the IO was giving out the extension rules for next year without without any questions from me. "Next year you will have to put 65K in the bank every month starting February, or 800,000 as normal. I asked "Is this just the Brits, US and Australians?" - "No it is everybody. All embassy letters are cancelled". So I said "Is this just the opinion of Hua Hin immigration". "No." she said "It comes from Bangkok to all offices"

Every officer was giving out these rules to everyone without being asked! Being a Monday, I wonder if those rules came from Bangkok over the weekend.

Just one IO "talking".

I have a Thai friend who is a Captain in Immigration no new directives have come out regarding any of this. Period..   

[HHTel]

2 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Did the IO who was talking to you know the timeframe for your current extension to expire when she was talking about the February date?

I guess so.  She had my passport in her hands and to update the 90 day report, she has to look at the extension.

[HHTel]

1 hour ago, bkk6060 said:

Just one IO "talking".

Each desk was giving the same info.  I could certainly overhear the same from the one to the left of me.  This time it was not one officer talking off the top of his/her head.

[JackThompson]

12 hours ago, Lovethailandelite said:

There will be no acceptance of 'Anything' other than 'regular monthly foreign transfers' into a Thai bank account of 40/65k or the banked funds of 800/400k baht.

If correct, best to invest in a business that facilitate rotating money out-and-back, then.  Dee-Money should be a gold-mine.  Many more will be able to retire here now, if you are correct.

 

I do see the practicality of that method - because all the data can be boiled-down to bank-statements/letters - vs a hodge-podge of various "income proof" docs, which I don't think is remotely possible - and it tallies with what the embassies have said.