Possible mass shooting at bar in Thousand Oaks, California

[CharlieH]

Posts removed.

 

Please refrain from making or introducing Political comment or remarks in this topic.

Thank you.

[riclag]

16 minutes ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

I feel sure that all the innocent victims and families of these shootings in the USA will take great comfort from the "8 stubborn facts"on gun violence you referred to.   

What caused this individual  to commit this !  How would you prevent it in the future?

Edited November 9, 2018 by riclag

[BritManToo]

19 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Australia demonstrated what could be done, America refuses to absorb the lesson. Too many cold dead hands.

I rather live in the USA than Australia.

 

In fact, nearly all the countries with gun control are awful places in which to live.

Edited November 9, 2018 by BritManToo

[Spidey]

Just now, riclag said:

Whats caused this individual  to commit this !  How would you prevent it in the future?

Do what other countries do and ban guns.

[OneMoreFarang]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It's hard to imagine what his motivation might have been.

I guess it's clear he was failing in life so the only thing I can think of is some kind of final revenge against partying and promising young people that still had everything to live for.

The problem with nutters is that they don't think very clearly. I am sure they will find lot of "reasons" which don't sound very reasonable to normal people.

 

[riclag]

2 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Do what other countries do and ban guns.

How would you go about taking millions of guns away from criminals 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

The problem with nutters is that they don't think very clearly. I am sure they will find lot of "reasons" which don't sound very reasonable to normal people.

 

Well, yeah, but he was obviously depressed and suicidal evidenced by the fact that he shot himself. So a small subset of suicidal people have an impulse to make a really big splash and take others along with them. 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Jingthing

[Spidey]

Just now, riclag said:

How would you go about taking millions of guns away from criminals 

We had the same problem in the UK many years ago. Several methods were used. Cutting off the supply, gun amnesties, extremely punitive penalties for gun possession, to name but a few.

[mtls2005]

17 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It's hard to imagine what his motivation might have been.

 

Agreed.

 

We love our wars, and our warriors - seems like we should be taking better care of them?

 

And maybe not putting them in harm's way to begin with?

 

 

In 2013, the VA released a study that covered suicides from 1999 to 2010, which showed that roughly 22 veterans were dying by suicide per day, or one every 65 minutes. Some sources suggest that this rate may be undercounting suicides.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_military_veteran_suicide

 

 

 

 

[riclag]

1 minute ago, Spidey said:

We had the same problem in the UK many years ago. Several methods were used. Cutting off the supply, gun amnesties, extremely punitive penalties for gun possession, to name but a few.

How would you go about it in America?  Millions of illegal weapons are in the hands of criminals and people who don't obey the law ! You cut the supply off,ok! Gun amnesties ? We have extreme penalties but many aren't enforced

[Spidey]

Just now, riclag said:

How would you go about it in America?  Millions of illegal weapons are in the hands of criminals and people who don't obey the law ! You cut the supply off,ok! Gun amnesties ? We have extreme penalties but many aren't enforced

In the UK they are enforced. Gun amnesties took more guns off the streets than anything else. Many people possessed guns, not because they were criminals but because they had one as a momento (exs WW2) or were casual collectors. The problem was that many guns fell into the hands of criminals as a result of burglaries on these people. Gun amnesties allowed non criminals and criminals to hand their guns in to a police station without fear of prosecution. Many thousands of guns were handed in.

 

As an aside, these initiatives were implemented as a result of 2 mass shootings, Hungerford and Dumblane, which were very similar to the recent spate of mass shootings in the US.

[Jonnapat]

21 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

And still the pro-gun candidates for Governor and Senate in Florida got elected. I guess Americans just accept it.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Elected by old white people 

[metisdead]

Another troll post attempting to bring politics into this thread has been removed. 

[jvs]

2 hours ago, riclag said:

How would you go about taking millions of guns away from criminals 

It is not only known criminals that do the mass shootings.

So called normal people do it also!!

[Tongjaw]

3 hours ago, riclag said:

that source had 34(3 or more) from Jan - present and they don't mention if the guns were obtained illegally!

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting

So would you feel happier knowing that one of your loved ones was killed by a legal or illegally obtained weapon. 

[candide]

43 minutes ago, Tongjaw said:

So would you feel happier knowing that one of your loved ones was killed by a legal or illegally obtained weapon. 

This is not the right question. The right question is: "wouldn't you feel much more angry knowing that one of your loved one was killed by someone who could buy such a dangerous weapon as easily as a can of beans in a supermarket?"

[Jingthing]

OK, enough with the thoughts and prayers already!

 

Quote

Thousand Oaks parents: ‘I don’t want prayers. I don’t want thoughts. I want gun control.’

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2018/11/09/thousand-oaks-parents-i-dont-want-prayers-i-dont-want-thoughts-i-want-gun-control/

[Credo]

The entire discussion of mental health issues is nothing more than a ruse in the gun debate.   First, the Administration is making serious cuts to mental health provisions, so intervention is not going to be available for stopping potential serial shooters.

 

Second, most of the mass shootings are done by marginalized people without a lot of past criminal activity that would bring them to the attention of anyone.  After each event there is a backward glance at the warning signs, but none of them amount to much.   Certainly not legal action.

 

People who do these are often acting in an impulsive manner, with some planning.   They have essentially snapped and most everyone is capable of reaching the point of snapping, but not everyone who snaps takes a gun and starts shooting.   

 

If the guns are removed, whatever they do when they snap, it won't result in mass shootings.

[Trouble]

It's nice that many of you posters come up with the same old responses and whether one is or is not for gun control, it is not the guns that are at the crux of the matter.  It seems we have a serious problem in the USA with mental health issues. The young man who committed this horrible act was a 28 year old ex Marine who had served in Afghanistan. He had gone through a divorce and might have had PTSD. He had been living with his mother since his divorce. It seems that in every case these people have mental health issues. This man seemed to have functioned outwardly as somewhat normal if also reclusive.  One witness had mentioned playing pool with the guy at some point in the past at the Borderline Bar and Grill. He was described by the witness at quiet but seemed to enjoy playing pool with the witness. Certainly the Thousand Oaks community, where I lived for 10 years, is not a hotbed for problems formerly being one of the safest communities in the nation.  For some reason he snapped. It was not an AR-15 type weapon but a simple 45 caliber handgun with an illegal clip.  The mental health problem can be seen in the rising numbers of homeless around the nation, etc.  The other issue is the unhappiness of people across the USA with their political leaders. Neither side of the political spectrum likes each other. You can see that clearly on this forum. Thugs in Portland, Oregon, or at Tucker Carlson's house are not just peaceful protesters anymore, they threaten and intimidate. The nation is divided as never before and it did not just start with Trump. This has been coming to a boil for some time over various issues that the cable news media use nightly on both sides to fan the flames. So we have two social problems in the US that if not brought under control will eventually boil over.  Sad to say but I have little confidence that there will be any reconciliation between the extremes of the political spectrum because they are so far divided that they can't reach agreement on anything. We will see what happens in the coming session of Congress. My take is that mental health issues and the frustration of people in general will continue to grow and there will be continued violence which no one can stop. There are too many guns out there to stop it by gun control. All guns would have to be confiscated to stop shootings and then someone would figure out another way. 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Trouble

[ross163103]

Since they cant--or won't, do anything about changing the second amendment, tax ammunition heavily. You can own as many guns as you want but it'll cost you to shoot them.

[metisdead]

Posts in violation of fair use policy has been removed, a screen shot of a site is not a valid link. 

Edited November 10, 2018 by metisdead

[HooHaa]

On 11/8/2018 at 6:30 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

There is an even bigger connection between all those shootings:

Excellent point, well made. 

[metisdead]

An off topic baiting post has been removed. 

[ross163103]

Sad to say but there's going to have to be more shootings in the US before the majority get mad enough to do something about it. Obviously it's a LOT already but not enough for things to get changed, whether it's gun control or mental health issues, whatever the cause may be. It's many different factors in society not just one single issue. 

[carmine]

So the gun madness in the US continues.  Sandy Hook told the world guns are more important than children in the US.  Nothing will be done after this later atrocity and nothing it seems ever will.  Onwards to the next tragedy.

 

Thomas Jefferson must be turning in his grave. he wrote an amendment....amend it to modern times!  How can the NRA hold so much power?  The statistics are just unbelievable and yet it appears the majority still support the 2nd amendment in its existing format.  Just mental!!!

[carmine]

14 minutes ago, ross163103 said:

Sad to say but there's going to have to be more shootings in the US before the majority get mad enough to do something about it. Obviously it's a LOT already but not enough for things to get changed, whether it's gun control or mental health issues, whatever the cause may be. It's many different factors in society not just one single issue. 

Nothing will change.  Mass shootings (followed by lame politicians telling the victims families 'our hearts go out to you" before doing <deleted> all about it)   are part and parcel of American life now.  The figures show it, the apathy shows it, the politicians show it and the NRA nigh on accepts it.

 

Americans see the figures compared to other countries and they still don't get it.  Dumber and dumber or what!!!!

[stevenl]

18 minutes ago, carmine said:

Nothing will change.  Mass shootings (followed by lame politicians telling the victims families 'our hearts go out to you" before doing <deleted> all about it)   are part and parcel of American life now.  The figures show it, the apathy shows it, the politicians show it and the NRA nigh on accepts it.

 

Americans see the figures compared to other countries and they still don't get it.  Dumber and dumber or what!!!!

You forgot the prayers.

[carmine]

3 minutes ago, stevenl said:

You forgot the prayers.

Ah yes sorry....nauseating isn't it.

 

All the president needs to do is check out the figures in Canada regards gun crime and its a bit of a giveaway that the US has got it woefully wrong.  But he won't because he accepted millions in campaign funds from the NRA.