Retirement visa refused in Chiang Mai

[Kadilo]

5 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Argue it/complicate it all you want.

 

I plan on just keeping the 800 k in an account no need to fool with the time or 400 k.

Cannot think of a simpler way to do things here so easy peasy.

 

And yes, in my mid 60's I have no problem letting the 800 k sit in an account. Unlike some,  I actually planned my financial life for many years so absolutely no worries.

 

 

 

 

I’m on the income method as not fully retired yet but rest assured once I am I will be following your example. 

My Immigration experience thus far tells me to reduce all probability as far as reasonably practicable of them refusing and this is the least complicated method. 

[Thaidream]

2 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

And yes, in my mid 60's I have no problem letting the 800 k sit in an account. Unlike some,  I actually planned my financial life for many years so absolutely no worries

I also planned my long term financial life and while I also have the income as well as the cash- I refuse to be held hostage by the Thai Banking system and Immigration. I have  many other things to do with my 800K than allow the greedy Thai banks to lend it out to others

 

While I am not crazy about the income method- it at least is easy to prove one has a secure  monthly income.  However- there is no argument- everyone has their own experiences and  ways of looking at issues.

[Kadilo]

1 minute ago, Thailand said:

Yet to see what they are charging in Chiangmai, I assume BJ 's  fanfare was all for nowt but I guess if people are getting hassle it is probably way up there.

Not used an agent so far and never intended to do so but in my limited experience so far I can see why people do. 

[tonboy]

Just now, Kadilo said:

Not used an agent so far and never intended to do so but in my limited experience so far I can see why people do. 

yep, I used same method, was helped by OS Thai Visa Express Ltd. 

[jmd8800]

Since you are headed back to your home country anyway, wouldn't the easiest route to take from there is a Non-Imm O-A?

[CMNightRider]

Retirement visa extensions are being rejected everyday in any number of Thai Immigration offices over some of the most idiotic reasons.  As for the American retirees, the American Embassy and Consulate are pretending it is business as usual.  Of course for us retirees who have to deal with the new anti-Western Thai Immigration staff we know better.

 

The ring leader of the American Embassy circus could put an immediate stop to all this unnecessary nonsense by just issuing "Income Verification Letters."  Apparently, this is too much to ask.  After all, it would require their clerks busy warming seats until their next duty assignment to actually do something.

 

I am so disappointed with how the American Embassy has abandoned American retirees who call Thailand their home.

 

Actually, this is common amid federal employees to do nothing when presented with decision making.  If you don't do anything you can't be blamed for making a wrong decision.  This will be interesting to watch as this visa problem worsens during the year. ????

 

 

  

[thequietman]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

The general requirements are here. https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_80 (click Eng at the top of the page to change from Thai) It says you need at least 15 days remaining on your entry but CM wants at least 21 days. I suggest you check with them to confirm what the want.

It think will have to check in at immigration to have them stamp the receipt for your TM30 report to update it.

and here lies the problem. Current immigration rules or 'law' says 15 days BUT CM says no, to hell with the rules, we have decided that it's 21 days. And on and on and on and on and on and on it goes.

[thequietman]

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

CM Immigration was visited by the Us Embassy and shown  the actual documentation that US Citizens get  and they should be aware of what it looks like and means.

The very moment US embassy officials left that office ........... it was all forgotten. ????

[onera1961]

1 hour ago, bkk6060 said:

And yes, in my mid 60's I have no problem letting the 800 k sit in an account. Unlike some,  I actually planned my financial life for many years so absolutely no worries.

Good for you. Gives you peace of mind at least for now. But is the use of announcing it in the forum? 

[jonwilly]

I had a friend, serious businessman, now deceased, in CM.

He had extensive experience with Thai officials.

He used to say that Thai Laws/rules are drawn up deliberately 'Loose' so to leave much flexibility for the officials enforcing them.

 

john

 

[onera1961]

8 minutes ago, thequietman said:

The very moment US embassy officials left that office ........... it was all forgotten. ????

They really don't care. Smile is a facade in Thailand. 

Edited March 12, 2019 by onera1961

[Thaidream]

3 minutes ago, thequietman said:

The very moment US embassy officials left that office ........... it was all forgotten

I agree and I believe  Thai Immigration  would be glad to accept new Income Letters from the US Embassy as it would make their life easier.  From simply an economic perspective- The Us Embassy in stopping the letters has most likely thrown away almost $300,000 worth of income per year in lost fees. Not a very smart way to do business especially since  virtually every other Embassy (except 4) are still issuing the letters.

[thequietman]

3 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

They really don't care. Smile is a facade in Thailand. 

Tis true ......... tis true. Unfortunately. But remember, we falang tink too mutt. ????

[elviajero]

19 minutes ago, thequietman said:

and here lies the problem. Current immigration rules or 'law' says 15 days BUT CM says no, to hell with the rules, we have decided that it's 21 days. And on and on and on and on and on and on it goes.

It doesn’t. The rules say “more than” 15 days.

[steve73]

This raises another potential problem for retirees who've been here a few years, perhaps with a well established bank account, but who've fallen (or will fall) foul of Immigration's latest crackdown on extension, could be providing adequate proof that the money originally came from overseas.

 

When used for annual extensions the source of the cash-in-the-bank matter not one jot. 

 

But if you have to leave to start again using a TV or a VE, and then apply to convert it to a non-O, then the money is supposed to have come from overseas... This may be difficult to prove if you previously be using transferwise, ATM's, or Cash deposits.

 

I just hope they won't be too pedantic for such applications.    

[rott]

43 minutes ago, onera1961 said:

Good for you. Gives you peace of mind at least for now. But is the use of announcing it in the forum? 

Because he is a smug git.

[Kadilo]

3 minutes ago, rott said:

Because he is a smug git.

I don’t see it as him being smug. It is a fact that it is the easiest way to guarantee the minimum hassle at Immigration. 

Clearly not all of us at this time are able to use that method but nevertheless it remains the best option imo. 

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, Thaidream said:

The 800K has to remain in the bank 2 months prior and 3 months after the initial extension.  In some offices one has to return after 90 days and show the bank book again-  then there must be 400K left in the bank and  2 months prior to the next extension topped up again-  Immigration will also check the balance  at the next extension to make sure one had the 400K still in the bank.

IMO this is not solid but  is causing  a headache for the applicant making sure of  amounts; visits to Immigration and resowing bank book  to make sure Immigration sees the right amounts at the right time

 

The income method while cumbersome each month can be backed up by statements or tax records showing  the source of income and amounts. Award letters from US Social Security; Pension statements and US Bank accounts will all match and serve as absolute proof one's income is generated abroad and meets the 65K monthly requirement.

 

 

The rules are very clear. SS letters, pension statements and the like  will not be accepted. The only thing that will be accepted is proof of deposit of 65K or more, every single month, in a Thai bank plus proof the funds originated abroad.

 

they will nto even look through the sort of documentation you mention.

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

1099's should be sent at the latest by Jan 31.

You just got it now?

Also, sorry I bet they will not accept an annual statement.  They will have no idea what it is and I bet reject it.

 

They will nto accept 1099s. annual statements from foreign financial institutions etc etc.  Only and solely, proof of transfer of funds from abroad to a Thai bank account as evidenced by Thai bank statement. Don't waste your time getting any other documentation together.

 

 

[wisperone]

4 hours ago, Thaidream said:

The 800K has to remain in the bank 2 months prior and 3 months after the initial extension.  In some offices one has to return after 90 days and show the bank book again-  then there must be 400K left in the bank and  2 months prior to the next extension topped up again-  Immigration will also check the balance  at the next extension to make sure one had the 400K still in the bank.

IMO this is not solid but  is causing  a headache for the applicant making sure of  amounts; visits to Immigration and resowing bank book  to make sure Immigration sees the right amounts at the right time

 

The income method while cumbersome each month can be backed up by statements or tax records showing  the source of income and amounts. Award letters from US Social Security; Pension statements and US Bank accounts will all match and serve as absolute proof one's income is generated abroad and meets the 65K monthly requirement.

 

CM Immigration was visited by the Us Embassy and shown  the actual documentation that US Citizens get  and they should be aware of what it looks like and means.

So doesn't it seem ironic that the US Embassy did that, but refuse to provide approval letters based on the same information? It appears they are just too lazy and don't care.

[lamyai3]

2 hours ago, wisperone said:

So doesn't it seem ironic that the US Embassy did that, but refuse to provide approval letters based on the same information? It appears they are just too lazy and don't care.

The UK embassy actually did require documentary evidence to be submitted (as opposed to sworn affidavits), and yet they led the way in stopping the income letters. 

[bigginhill]

In your shoes I would contact the Dutch embassy, if you are receiving pensions, even if you no longer have Dutch citizenship, I would have thought they would produce the income letter. Worth a call or email. 

 

[molen02]

2 hours ago, bigginhill said:

In your shoes I would contact the Dutch embassy, if you are receiving pensions, even if you no longer have Dutch citizenship, I would have thought they would produce the income letter. Worth a call or email. 

 

I probably would have given that a try after reading some of the comments but because of the new visa rules I had to leave the renewal quit late so my visa has run out today. I'm now on a 7 day visa leaving on Friday. I still might give that a try next year but then a year is a long time in Thai immigration and who knows the rules might have changed again.

[morrobay]

13 hours ago, Thaidream said:

The 800K has to remain in the bank 2 months prior and 3 months after the initial extension.  In some offices one has to return after 90 days and show the bank book again-  then there must be 400K left in the bank and  2 months prior to the next extension topped up again-  Immigration will also check the balance  at the next extension to make sure one had the 400K still in the bank.

IMO this is not solid but  is causing  a headache for the applicant making sure of  amounts; visits to Immigration and resowing bank book  to make sure Immigration sees the right amounts at the right time

 

The income method while cumbersome each month can be backed up by statements or tax records showing  the source of income and amounts. Award letters from US Social Security; Pension statements and US Bank accounts will all match and serve as absolute proof one's income is generated abroad and meets the 65K monthly requirement.

 

CM Immigration was visited by the Us Embassy and shown  the actual documentation that US Citizens get  and they should be aware of what it looks like and means.

The 800k described  in the first paragraph is very solid. The income/combo option has unfortunately become one bag of hassles. Diverting all types foreign income into deposits into Thai banks? No way Norway. 

[jacko45k]

14 hours ago, molen02 said:

I'm renting a house so i assume that my TM30 would be still valid when I come back

You should submit a new one after having left the country.

[Joe Mcseismic]

14 hours ago, CMNightRider said:

Retirement visa extensions are being rejected everyday in any number of Thai Immigration offices over some of the most idiotic reasons.  As for the American retirees, the American Embassy and Consulate are pretending it is business as usual.  Of course for us retirees who have to deal with the new anti-Western Thai Immigration staff we know better.

 

The ring leader of the American Embassy circus could put an immediate stop to all this unnecessary nonsense by just issuing "Income Verification Letters."  Apparently, this is too much to ask.  After all, it would require their clerks busy warming seats until their next duty assignment to actually do something.

 

I am so disappointed with how the American Embassy has abandoned American retirees who call Thailand their home.

 

Actually, this is common amid federal employees to do nothing when presented with decision making.  If you don't do anything you can't be blamed for making a wrong decision.  This will be interesting to watch as this visa problem worsens during the year. ????

 

 

  

Still not accepting the REAL reason that these four embassy's stopped the letter, I see.

If you feel better making up your own conspiracy theory, fine. Just don't expect other people to believe it.

[holy cow cm]

Molen02 said he showed his bank statements that showed a Transfer from abroad, updated bank book showing funds of 600K, and all usual required paper work.

 

He did state that the IO had a problem with the previous applicant and lost over an issue (lost face), so this is where the problem came from. IO lost ego face by a low life old non Thai foreigner challenging wits, and regained a sense of Thai strength and pride by kicking and lashing out at the next retiree. What else could it be? Normally they will give you a chance to go and come back with what they need. Normally always. In this case if allowed, Molen02 could have went and paid extra to quickly have the Dutch doc translated into Thai and then end of problem as is usually the case. Which should never have been the case.

 

So if this is the case, then the retirees better be on better behavior and have all the ducks in a line so to not P off the IO's fragile sense of superiority by acting more intelligent being combative. It probably keeps an ever lasting feeling that will reverberate periodically on the foreigners that the IO doesn't like the look of. 

 

 

 

Edited March 13, 2019 by holy cow cm

[holy cow cm]

Molen02... BTW, was the IO a man or woman? Young or old?

[ICELANDMAN]

14 hours ago, Thaidream said:

I agree and I believe  Thai Immigration  would be glad to accept new Income Letters from the US Embassy as it would make their life easier.  From simply an economic perspective- The Us Embassy in stopping the letters has most likely thrown away almost $300,000 worth of income per year in lost fees. Not a very smart way to do business especially since  virtually every other Embassy (except 4) are still issuing the letters.

Who are these happy four embassies ?  ????

[NanLaew]

4 minutes ago, ICELANDMAN said:

Who are these happy four embassies?  ????

UK, US, AU & DK