Blatant abuse of entry denials at Phuket Airport

lamyai3 · July 11, 2019

3 hours ago, Parker2100 said:

4 hours ago, fhickson said:

you left and returned after only 8 days. i think you have to stay out of country for at least 30 days even with a new visa.

That sounds like an Immigration internal policy. While, it may be reasonable, I have never seen it in print.

No such policy exists.

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

44 minutes ago, lamyai3 said:

No such policy exists.

We don't know what policies Immigration has Internally. They do not tell us unless we are sent to see a Immigration Supervisor and they say "not allowed" (as they do).

Usually, I have never heard of what they say is not allowed. I have not been denied entry but came close twice.

I wouldn't even try if I thought I was doing anything wrong. But the treat me as if I am gaming the system. BTW, "Gaming the system" means you are following their rules but they don't like it. That is why I was let in both times.

This time they noted my passport and put me in their database so, even though I am not banned, they can deny me entry in the future even though I have broken no rules.

Btw, an official banning has a time limit. The notation does not.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Parker2100

lkv · July 11, 2019

29 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

This time they noted my passport and put me in their database so,

Care to share that note that they made in your passport, so that we better understand what we are talking about here?

athousand · July 11, 2019

Your days in Thailand are limited unless you find a better way. Basically they have given you a warning, so its best to take notice. You don't impress them as a tourist. It was nice of them to admit you this time. Next time if you present as a tourist, I think you'll be SOL.

You don't impress me as a person. You seem to take delight in the misfortune of others and twist your arguments to br able to do so. How will you respond if and when the Thai authorities change the rule that you have been living here without notice? Will you defend them then and say that you have not been following the rules?

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

lamyai3 · July 11, 2019

40 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

We don't know what policies Immigration has Internally

True, and it's pretty clear that immigration has been given unofficial instructions, given their approach is so different now than it was before. But it's possible to make an educated guess at what kind of measures they're taking due to certain stories come up repeatedly on here.

One policy that I've never seen cited though is the requirement of "30 days out". Given that this is the interval required in using Vietnam's 15 day visa exempt entry programme, it might be the other poster is getting confused with this.

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

43 minutes ago, FredGallaher said:

Your days in Thailand are limited unless you find a better way. Basically they have given you a warning, so its best to take notice. You don't impress them as a tourist. It was nice of them to admit you this time. Next time if you present as a tourist, I think you'll be SOL.

You are proving my point. There is no limit to the number of times a person can be a tourist. A person who comes over just to meet friends can be tourist. Just to sit by a swimming pool can be a tourist. Thailand is a big place. Few people have seen all of it. Even if they have been everywhere, things change.

Their are 0 public rules that restrict me.

What is the Thai word for arbitrary?

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

35 minutes ago, lkv said:

Care to share that note that they made in your passport, so that we better understand what we are talking about here?

The note on the stamp simply says Non O only.

They claim I am trying to live here even though this year I spent 20 days in Burma, 30 days in Indonesia, and 60 days in Malaysia.

A Non O requirement is a blacklist. Not only do I not qualify, I am touring all Asean and I don't want to live here. I am touring.

Edited July 11, 2019 by Parker2100

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

3 minutes ago, FredGallaher said:

No problem then. You can chill out somewhere else. BTW a Non O can be a number of things, but may require a financial deposit.

I already have the flight to Cambodia and hotel booked.

I have already informed my landlord I am being kicked out of the country. I was renting a small room because it was cheaper than getting a hotel every time. And it was a place to get my mail.

It's to bad I have to leave like this.

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

2 minutes ago, FredGallaher said:

Thai authorities have always treated me fairly and I've never had a problem

Good for you!

lkv · July 11, 2019

2 hours ago, Parker2100 said:

The note on the stamp simply says Non O only.

We have never seen one of those before, it would be nice if you shared it. It does not contain any identifiable info anyways.

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

15 minutes ago, lkv said:

We have never seen one of those before, it would be nice if you shared it. It does not contain any identifiable info anyways.

She wrote a note in Thai and English.

I asked her if she banned me and she said 'You can come back with a non-O visa' the inspector with her interrupted 'yes, you can never come back'

Essecola · July 11, 2019

It's all so mind numbing. I also had to tell my building owner I was being kicked out. I wish I never came to Thailand. The horrible feeling of wasted years and money will likely never go away. I saw a guy shouting about Thailand the other day. There are loads of people in nearby countries that absolutely <deleted> hate Thailand now. By the way, Vietnam is very boring and much more difficult to do normal things. It is not the same at all. Food. Shopping. Access to health care. Cleanliness.... etc etc. It sucks.

jackdd · July 11, 2019

16 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

I asked her if she banned me and she said 'You can come back with a non-O visa' the inspector with her interrupted 'yes, you can never come back'

The hand written note says: Next time* get a non-o visa

(* could mean either "next time" or "in the future")

I assume that she just wanted to scribble something in your passport to show power and this has no relevance whatsoever. This is not even signed.

If you have some free time to visit your local immigration office, it would be interesting to know if there is anything about this in the system.

Isaanbiker · July 11, 2019

On 7/6/2019 at 3:17 PM, FredGallaher said:

I agree the reason might not make sense with the situation. But, its a refusal. The real reason probably something is amiss and they don't like it. Posters don't always tell the whole story especially when they change passports. If the IO suspects something then they act. The days of long term tourist visas appear to be over. If over 50 a retirement visa is available but under 50 options are more limited.

There isn't a problem, neither being under, nor over 50. I never had a problem to receive a Non-O ME based on staying with my Thai family for the last 17 years.

No financial proof needed in Savannakhet, but leaving the country every 90 days instead of Alien reports can be a pleasant trip when you're not mentally handicapped, or retarted. ( Only god knows how long that will last....)

And I can keep doing that when I'm over 50. I'm 59 now and had quite a lot of visas and extensions here to be able to make this statement/ comment. Good Day.

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

4 minutes ago, jackdd said:

The hand written note says: Next time* get a non-o visa

(* could mean either "next time" or "in the future")

I assume that she just wanted to scribble something in your passport to show power and this has no relevance whatsoever. This is not even signed.

If you have some free time to visit your local immigration office, it would be interesting to know if there is anything about this in the system.

I was planning to as I would like to come back at some point.

But I have disagree with it's significance. As they brought up my entire travel history from 2018, I think it is a safe bet they entered the note in their system.

This was not the counter IO. It was the back office with 3 juvenile officers asking for documents that they refused to look at and asking questions and talked over me when I answered.

ThomasThBKK · July 11, 2019

46 minutes ago, Isaanbiker said:

There isn't a problem, neither being under, nor over 50. I never had a problem to receive a Non-O ME based on staying with my Thai family for the last 17 years.

No financial proof needed in Savannakhet, but leaving the country every 90 days instead of Alien reports can be a pleasant trip when you're not mentally handicapped, or retarted. ( Only god knows how long that will last....)

And I can keep doing that when I'm over 50. I'm 59 now and had quite a lot of visas and extensions here to be able to make this statement/ comment. Good Day.

Well, most people don't have kids...

Only option is elite visa and that costs a good amount, nothing else available

herwin1234 · July 11, 2019

no question the OP was treated very unfair by Immigration. But some persepctive. For every foreigner treated unfairly or denied entry by Thai Immigration, there are a 100 foreigners treated unfairly or denied entry in the OP's homecountry the usa. (i dont mean illegal aliens but tourists and travelers to the usa).

Also, foreigners might feel they are treated unfairly by police occasionally, in the usa thougg unfair treatment translates inbeing tasered or shot.

Shit happens, but i think its unfair to think it only happens in Thailand. If anything, the shit here is relatively mild.

jackdd · July 11, 2019

40 minutes ago, herwin1234 said:

For every foreigner treated unfairly or denied entry by Thai Immigration, there are a 100 foreigners treated unfairly or denied entry in the OP's homecountry the usa.

You are comparing apples with oranges. A high percentage of Thais (and any other poorer country) travel to the USA to work there illegally, while only a very low percentage of people from the USA travel to Thailand to work illegally.

lkv · July 11, 2019

2 hours ago, jackdd said:

The hand written note says: Next time* get a non-o visa

(* could mean either "next time" or "in the future")

I assume that she just wanted to scribble something in your passport to show power and this has no relevance whatsoever. This is not even signed.

If you have some free time to visit your local immigration office, it would be interesting to know if there is anything about this in the system.

Maybe it's not in the system, but wanna take a guess what the next IO will do when he sees it?

Maybe another case of "he had no money this time around...12.2".

Yeah, what @Parker2100 can do, is come via a land border until he changes the passport. Highly advisable.

Would you come through an airport with that one, @jackdd. What do you reckon?

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

57 minutes ago, lkv said:

Maybe it's not in the system, but wanna take a guess what the next IO will do when he sees it?

Maybe another case of "he had no money this time around...12.2".

Yeah, what @Parker2100 can do, is come via a land border until he changes the passport. Highly advisable.

Would you come through an airport with that one, @jackdd. What do you reckon?

Good advice. Thank you

lkv · July 11, 2019

28 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

Good advice. Thank you

And if you do decide you want to risk it through an airport, common sense tells me you may want to avoid Don Mueang. ????

Please don't go back to the same place with this stamp.

But yeah, land borders should keep you going for a while.

Out of interest, if you were to count your visa exempt entries, how many are in total in this passport?

And you mentioned they also grilled you on your previous entry, was it also at Don Mueang? Visa exempt?

Answers to the above would help me understand better how much it can be "pushed" nowadays on visa exempt.

Thx.

Edited July 11, 2019 by lkv

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

12 minutes ago, lkv said:

And if you do decide you want to risk it through an airport, common sense tells me you may want to avoid Don Mueang. ????

Please don't go back to the same place with this stamp.

But yeah, land borders should keep you going for a while.

Out of interest, if you were to count your visa exempt entries, how many are in total in this passport?

And last time they grilled you, was it also at Don Mueang? On visa exempt also?

3 total visa exempt including this one.

Yes, all my trouble has been Don Mueang.

Regarding a suggestion above, it will not help, anymore, to get a new passport if it is in their system. When they scan your fingerprints, it will bring up your old passport.

They knew, this time, that I got a new passport in January (because it was full, not to fool them). I am not sure how they knew as they didn't have the biometric system then. I read recently that the USA and Thailand are sharing info now to fight crime. So maybe my own Government is giving out info on citizens now.

lkv · July 11, 2019

21 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

3 total visa exempt including this one.

Yes, all my trouble has been Don Mueang.

Regarding a suggestion above, it will not help, anymore, to get a new passport if it is in their system. When they scan your fingerprints, it will bring up your old passport.

They knew, this time, that I got a new passport in January (because it was full, not to fool them). I am not sure how they knew as they didn't have the biometric system then. I read recently that the USA and Thailand are sharing info now to fight crime. So maybe my own Government is giving out info on citizens now.

Why, do you appear in the system?

Yes, there was a poster linking a video earlier on in this thread, that was claiming the US shares their databases of people commiting crimes, serious or even less serious. Nevertheless, he was claiming that those people get rejected.

You were not rejected so....

Anyways, not sure what to make of that. I don't know to what extent would the US give information to a third world country run by a Junta.

Maybe you have exceeded 6 in total including the ones in your old passport, which is why they grilled you on the last one, but let you in, and this was number 7? And now that they saw you keep going, they thought "enough"? Use a visa next time?

But the flag on the 6 visa exempt is also old information, who's to say they did not put the flag at 3 and we don't know about it......

Complicated stuff.

One thing I forgot to ask: non O for marriage or non O for retirement?

Meaning, were they telling you: " get married with your gf", or were they telling you: " use a proper visa for retirement?".

Edited July 11, 2019 by lkv

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

41 minutes ago, lkv said:

Why, do you appear in the system?

Yes, there was a poster linking a video earlier on in this thread, that was claiming the US shares their databases of people commiting crimes, serious or even less serious. Nevertheless, he was claiming that those people get rejected.

You were not rejected so....

Anyways, not sure what to make of that. I don't know to what extent would the US give information to a third world country run by a Junta.

Maybe you have exceeded 6 in total including the ones in your old passport, which is why they grilled you on the last one, but let you in, and this was number 7? And now that they saw you keep going, they thought "enough"? Use a visa next time?

But the flag on the 6 visa exempt is also old information, who's to say they did not put the flag at 3 and we don't know about it......

Complicated stuff.

One thing I forgot to ask: non O for marriage or non O for retirement?

Meaning, were they telling you: " get married with your gf", or were they telling you: " use a proper visa for retirement?".

I didn't use any visa exempts in the old passport. I used all Tourist Visas (this was last year). According to Benjamin Hart from Integrity Legal, visiters are allowed 6 months in a calender year. So assuming I remember that right, they shouldn't be adding anything from last year. Maybe they decided to do it in a 12-month rolling period but forgot to tell travellers. IDK

They didn't specify the kind of Non-O. But I assumed retirement. But as I said, my plans are travelling so I am not going to tie up $26,000 in a country I am not living in. I don't even have 26,000 in a lump sum. And I sure don't earn 65000 baht a month. So a Non-O requirement is a blacklist for me.

All I need is a place to get mail and chill between trips.

lkv · July 11, 2019

15 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

I didn't use any visa exempts in the old passport. I used all Tourist Visas (this was last year). According to Benjamin Hart from Integrity Legal, visiters are allowed 6 months in a calender year. So assuming I remember that right, they shouldn't be adding anything from last year. Maybe they decided to do it in a 12-month rolling period but forgot to tell travellers. IDK

They didn't specify the kind of Non-O. But I assumed retirement. But as I said, my plans are travelling so I am not going to tie up $26,000 in a country I am not living in. I don't even have 26,000 in a lump sum. And I sure don't earn 65000 baht a month. So a Non-O requirement is a blacklist for me.

All I need is a place to get mail and chill between trips.

How many days in total did you spend last year in Thailand? That's the key issue for them.

If less than 180, keep doing what you're doing and avoid Don Mueang.

If more, you should be looking at more solid visas, such as METV, ED.....

Or at least SETVs.

They don't fancy visa exempt much.

Also, if you are stretching your visa exempts with extensions, it would red flag it even more.

"Why did you extend here" was a question I was asked, in a polite manner.

I believe that the reason it was polite was because in 2019 my stay in Thailand probably totals less than 2 months so far.

2018 was 10/12 months SETVs.

So less extensions.

How many genuine tourists extend repeatedly?

Not saying people should not extend, but be considerate about them and don't extend all, and don't stretch to the max.

Can't give any more accurate advice than this, based on putting together multiple sources and personal experience.

Edited July 11, 2019 by lkv

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

3 minutes ago, lkv said:

How many days in total did you spend last year in Thailand? That's the key issue for them.

If less than 180, keep doing what you're doing and avoid Don Mueang.

If more, you should be looking at more solid visas, such as METV, ED.....

Or at least SETVs.

They don't fancy visa exempt much.

Yes, to many. I think they said 192. It was a mistake on my part. I explained that to the IO Supervisor at DMK last December and he said "No more Tourist Visas" but said I could do 30-day stamps. That is why I have only done 30-day stamps with this passport.

I am blacklisted m from Thailand because of a 12-day error? Keep in mind, I have never been here illegally. All of my stays we're approved by immigration. I didn't even know it was up to me to keep count. That was the first year I was out of the USA, much less in Thailand.

In any case, I will go to Cambodia and get my mail there. It would be nice to be able to come back sometimes though to see friends.

lkv · July 11, 2019

17 minutes ago, Parker2100 said:

I think they said 192.

Out of 2 visa exempt stamps? ????

Cos the current one is number 3.

2×30=60. Extended to max +60 =120.

Edited July 11, 2019 by lkv

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

1 minute ago, lkv said:

Out of 3 visa exempt stamps? ????????

You asked about last year. 192 days on Tourist Visas.

I have had 3 VE stamps, this year.

lkv · July 11, 2019

So they counted last year but not this year?

Means it's not rolling?

What exactly did they count? I'm confused now.

Edited July 11, 2019 by lkv

Parker2100 · July 11, 2019

5 minutes ago, lkv said:

Out of 2 visa exempt stamps? ????

Cos the current one is number 3.

2×30=60. Extended to max +60 =120.

I extended only one of the VE stamps this year. Only because I needed to wait for important mail. I was outta here as soon as I got it.

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