Has anyone tried switching to Vegetarian food for 2 weeks?

[mania]

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

I just saw that on myth-busters and yes plants seem to have consciousness (at least some proof for it)

Actually there is lots of research & especially from 2014 onwards

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, BobBKK said:

Nah plants are not sentient. Anyway no point trying to convince you either you feel compassion or you don't. Period.

Actually you should watch myth busters it was entertaining there seemed to be some evidence and they are not the only one who have said so. Having said that not sure where i stand on that but it was interesting to see. 

[mania]

5 minutes ago, robblok said:

Actually you should watch myth busters it was entertaining there seemed to be some evidence and they are not the only one who have said so. Having said that not sure where i stand on that but it was interesting to see. 

Not just myth buster type shows but tons of scientific studies where plants were wired.

Plants can even be put under by local anesthetic, responds to noise, can learn patterns

actually not surprised to learn they are highly intelligent when one considers the cycles & messages they send to bees or other insects etc etc

 

Here is just a few of hundreds of studies

Quote

Pollan says that really freaks people out — "that the line between plants and animals might be a little softer than we traditionally think of it as."

https://www.pri.org/stories/2014-01-09/new-research-plant-intelligence-may-forever-change-how-you-think-about-plants

 

Quote

One scientist injected fir trees with radioactive carbon isotopes and saw that within a few days the carbon had been sent from tree to tree until every tree in the 30-meter-square area was connected. The scientist learned that the mature trees "communicated" to the network to share nutrients through their root systems to feed nearby seedlings until they were tall enough to take in light for themselves

https://science.howstuffworks.com/life/botany/plants-feel-pain.htm

Edited August 8, 2019 by mania

[stephenterry]

Just being alive causes pain and suffering - is the Buddhist way of teaching.   

[Handsome Gardener]

I gave up meat for 9 months once and felt so much better. Previously always felt tired, but when I cut meat out that went away and felt far more alert and generally healthier.

 

Then I met someone now a good mate who was a butcher - a 4th generation butcher who was giving up the game (in UK) as he disagreed with all the red tape and the crap that his suppliers were feeding their animals in order to artificially bulk them up (and you eat that). However buying decent stuff for what was a village butchers was unsustainable as everyone wants it as cheap as possible and sod the quality (or consequences)

 

Only relapsed as a bacon and tomato (brown sauce) sandwich wafted up my nose in a pub and in a moment of weakness which shames me to this day, I had to have it !!!

 

Very rarely eat red meat and generally as little meat as I can - its not healthy food, we don't need it and IMO directly contributes to cancer rates as people demand cheap food.

[brokenbone]

On 8/4/2019 at 2:39 PM, BobBKK said:

No but i can eat apples, carrots and bananas. You really can eat raw pig or cow?  I call that BS. I made a perfectly valid point and you deflect again. I just proved that Chimps can eat raw and we cannot - we can only eat by COOKING - Chimps can do that can they?  Just listen to yourself.

err, no, the mongol horde armies would just leave a piece

of raw meat under the saddle to make it tender,

and here in thailand  they make sun dried meat, -not tender by any stretch but they still eat it, i have eaten raw meat like this myself.

or how about living larvae ?

i draw the line there myself but i have

seen a few thai girls consume it,

...and then offer me a kiss afterwards

Edited August 8, 2019 by brokenbone

[BobBKK]

49 minutes ago, mania said:

Yeah keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better...Period

Bored after 44 years of hearing 'plants feel too' as an ignorant response to "so I can eat meat too". Don't compare a carrot to a Pig or a Dog it's absurd.

[JimmyJ]

Plants have no nervous system and no brain.

Thus they do not feel pain.

 

Suddenly the meat eaters, who lack all empathy with the suffering of animals raised for slaugher, are really really concerned about those plants. Really they are.

OK.

Edited August 8, 2019 by JimmyJ

[JimmyJ]

This article makes several good points about the pseudo-scientific statement that "Plants feel pain":

 

http://www.skoolofvegan.com/plants-have-feelings-too.html

 

Can one of the people (or perhaps it's only one person) who claim "Lots of studies say..." link to a few peer reviewed articles stating that plants - while lacking a nervous system and a brain - feel pain? Or one peer reviewed article?

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer_review

 

 

[balo]

2 hours ago, mania said:

actually not surprised to learn they are highly intelligent

Now your'e stretching it.  

[BobBKK]

BBC Today

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-49238749

[dontoearth]

    I am not all the decided and do switch back and forth on many different diets.  I am concerned more with the health aspects of a diet than anything else.  I will say that vegan and vegetarian food in Thailand was a helluva a lot better than the crapola we get here in the USA.

[dontoearth]

On 8/7/2019 at 6:24 AM, xylophone said:

 

There seems to be a lot of info out there with regards to psyllium husks etc, this especially for people who suffer from constipation like yours truly.

 

I went to see Professor A here at the hospital and took a long all of the "fibres" (both soluble and insoluble) that I had been trying to ease my constipation and these things included: – psyllium husks, Metamucil, apple fibre, oat bran, glucomannan (konjac root), Fibily (from Watsons) and a few others.

 

He suggested that I needed to drink more water and I did explain that my total water capacity was usually around 2 L plus a day and I didn't do much exercise, so I wasn't really sweating it out, and even when I did take the fibre, I ensured that I took it with plenty of water.

 

What he did say was that I was to steer away from any of the fibre products that turned into a sort of gel when water was added, and that includes many of those above I have mentioned.

 

By luck I happened upon a website specifically dealing with constipation and the causes thereof and one which caused me a great deal of joy was one which dealt with those folk, like me, who have a very slow digestive system – – called slow motility syndrome, and no matter how much fibre I take, it does nothing more than move very, very slowly through my system and even though I take a lot of water with it, it tends to have the effect of – – yes, constipation.

 

No amount of water helps it to move through my system any faster than my system will process it, so I'm pretty well stuck.

 

Getting onto the diet/vegetarian aspect of this thread, I don't eat much in the way of meat and if I do, it is usually chicken, with perhaps a little bit of ground pork when I make a Thai meal.

 

Pasta is a favourite as are my home-made pizzas with a very thin crust and laden with such things as tomatoes, onions or chopped leek, olives, artichoke hearts and occasionally chopped avocado, accompanied by a side salad.

 

Because I drink red wine, I do take a multivitamin and I suppose I am relatively healthy for a 72-year-old and now that I have conquered my constipation problem I am feeling better than ever – – – and the secret is not fibre per se, but drinking one large glassful of prune juice every morning and it is the natural sorbitol in the prune juice which seems to do the trick.

 

The object of this post was to make people aware that there are those folk out there who will not respond favourably to all sorts of wonderful "fibre solutions".

   I found I needed both high fiber and BULK for constipation.  The powder in liquid stir-ins did nothing and neither did any of the pills.  I use old-fashioned Post Cereal Original All-bran.  My granny ate a small cup of it everyday at breakfast and lived to be 94!  Most likely the grocery stores catering to the ex-pats will have a few boxes.  Give it a try for 3 or 4 days.  You will be amazed.

[meand]

THere are people who get so passionate about this stuff and swear you are "poisoning" your body by eating a potatoe chip. 

 

I personally think the end result of decades of worrying about what you eat will result in an abysmal return measured in years on your life expectancy. 

[stephenterry]

10 hours ago, dontoearth said:

   I found I needed both high fiber and BULK for constipation.  The powder in liquid stir-ins did nothing and neither did any of the pills.  I use old-fashioned Post Cereal Original All-bran.  My granny ate a small cup of it everyday at breakfast and lived to be 94!  Most likely the grocery stores catering to the ex-pats will have a few boxes.  Give it a try for 3 or 4 days.  You will be amazed.

Exactly. Here in Thailand and certainly in Rimping, packets of Organic Flax seed at low cost are readily available. Loaded with nutrients, high in fibre and Omega 3, they are a wonderful way of avoiding constipation. Essential to blend the seeds into powder otherwise the seeds would pass through your system without any benefit. You can sprinkle one tablespoon per 55 kilos (100 pounds) of body weight of the ground powder on about anything sweet or savoury as it has a 'neutral' taste.

 

It's worth trying a two day experiment, as it's a whole lot cheaper than prune juice. And IMO, Xylophone, your favourite pasta and pizza nutrition diet - unfortunately - is not the most healthy owing to the high concentration of wheat produce - which I'm assuming isn't whole grain - that could be toxic to your system and could be the most likely cause of your 'slow motility syndrome'.  Just eat the (very) healthy veggies instead. Also, a contributing factor is that lack of exercise - so how do you expect digestion to be other than slow? 

 

In other words treat the cause of your disorder, not just the symptoms, to fully regain a healthy digestive system. BTW, I am not a doctor or have anything other than a keen interest in nutrition and prostate/colon cancer protection, but my suggestions  - if implemented - are healthy options and backed up by science.

 

BTW, with apologies, Xylophone - I'm not aiming to be offensive - I would suggest your lifestyle and nutrition tends to indicate that you're an American (brought up on SAD) and now overweight. Easy check: if your waist measurement is more than half of your height, you need to lose body fat - as I do! 

 

 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2019 by stephenterry
correction

[xylophone]

11 hours ago, dontoearth said:

   I found I needed both high fiber and BULK for constipation.  The powder in liquid stir-ins did nothing and neither did any of the pills.  I use old-fashioned Post Cereal Original All-bran.  My granny ate a small cup of it everyday at breakfast and lived to be 94!  Most likely the grocery stores catering to the ex-pats will have a few boxes.  Give it a try for 3 or 4 days.  You will be amazed.

Thanks for the tip DTE and as it happens I have just gotten onto something similar from the Casino brand and I am including that in my occasional morning breakfasts, however I will keep a lookout for the Post Cereal Original All Bran and I think I know where I can buy it.

 

However as I said in my original post it is as much to do with my slow motility as anything else and no amount of bran or any such thing has any real effect, but I am and will keep trying other things, thanks.

[alan grice]

Ive had a Nice handful. of Garden Weeds, now off to an ANTIFA Protest.!????


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, stephenterry said:

Exactly. Here in Thailand and certainly in Rimping, packets of Organic Flax seed at low cost are readily available. Loaded with nutrients, high in fibre and Omega 3, they are a wonderful way of avoiding constipation. Essential to blend the seeds into powder otherwise the seeds would pass through your system without any benefit. You can sprinkle one tablespoon per 55 kilos (100 pounds) of body weight of the ground powder on about anything sweet or savoury as it has a 'neutral' taste.

 

It's worth trying a two day experiment, as it's a whole lot cheaper than prune juice. And IMO, Xylophone, your favourite pasta and pizza nutrition diet - unfortunately - is not the most healthy owing to the high concentration of wheat produce - which I'm assuming isn't whole grain - that could be toxic to your system and could be the most likely cause of your 'slow motility syndrome'.  Just eat the (very) healthy veggies instead. Also, a contributing factor is that lack of exercise - so how do you expect digestion to be other than slow? 

 

In other words treat the cause of your disorder, not just the symptoms, to fully regain a healthy digestive system. BTW, I am not a doctor or have anything other than a keen interest in nutrition and prostate/colon cancer protection, but my suggestions  - if implemented - are healthy options and backed up by science.

 

BTW, with apologies, Xylophone - I'm not aiming to be offensive - I would suggest your lifestyle and nutrition tends to indicate that you're an American (brought up on SAD) and now overweight. Easy check: if your waist measurement is more than half of your height, you need to lose body fat - as I do! 

 

 

 

 

Firstly, let me say that I take no offence with anything you have posted as I know you have done so with the best intentions, so thank you for that, however I will address a few aspects of your post as they apply to me.

 

I have tried everything from flaxseed powder through to pure fine oat bran, to broccoli powder to........just about everything else and all to no avail.

 

You are right in some respects inasmuch as I probably don't have the healthiest diet, however I do eat salad or vegetables with everything I prepare and although it sounded as if I exist on pizza and pastas that was probably as much my fault in the way I posted, as every meal I eat has some sort of vegetables or salad with it.

 

As an experiment just a couple of weeks ago, and after reading a recipe book, I decided to try a broccoli and Stilton recipe which consisted of buying a whole broccoli and cooking it slightly, even the stalk (separately and in a little milk and chicken stock), then liquidising the lot and eating it as a soup, and I have to say there was a lot of it but it was delicious!

 

I ate too much of it but thought that as it was healthy it would do me good, however that wasn't the case because my system being slow meant that I had to sit upright in bed all night as the food was not being digested but simply sitting in my stomach, and I felt terribly full all of the next day whilst waiting for the magic moment to arrive when I would deposit something, which did happen 24 hours later!

 

As for the cause of my "disorder", and the fact that I now don't do much in the way of exercise, I remember back in the early 80s when I was still playing a good standard of football and also training a couple of times a week, when I had the same problem and after an extensive set of tests in the BUPA Hospital in London (barium swallow, barium meal, x-rays etc) the specialist determined way back then that I had a slow motility problem and there wasn't a lot I could do about it apart from eating slowly and frequently rather than eat big meals.

 

So this has been with me for quite some time, exercise or not and it is something I will just have to live with as it hasn't gotten any better, perhaps a little worse if anything.

 

I know your post was meant in my best interests, but for the record, I played football for 40 years, before retiring after too many broken bones and also played tennis during that time as well as playing on until I was about 58. 

 

I was always a keen athlete and a very good middle distance runner and it's only since I moved here in 2006/7 that I have just about given up exercise, although I do walk a few kilometres a day.

 

And for the record again, I was born in the UK and was always a sportsman, then moved to New Zealand half way through my life, where I also played football and tennis (at a good standard), and although I am now about 92 kg, so a little overweight, I am not grossly so and feel more comfortable at about 90 KG as I am about 5'11" tall.

 

Obviously I will continue to experiment with various things, however going vegetarian for a few days didn't do much, and I could fill a whole page with the various vegetables and fibres I have tried, all to no avail – – apart from the prune juice which seems to be my saviour at the moment!!

 

I posted because there may be others out there who have "slow systems" which seem to defy the fibre diets logic.
 

[meand]

We do not understand the effects different diets have on our health nearly as well as we think we do. 

 

People wont admit that, but it is the truth. 

 

If twins were brought up, one of them eating a "proper" three square meals a day, never miss a meal, grains starch, proteins. If he ate exactly what we have been told to eat. Then the other twin ate pizza with sardines on it, drank wine, and had a lettuce and tomatoe salad with olive oil on it everyday, but fasted in between meals... we have no idea who would be healthier when they reached old age. We think we know, but the people who thought the earth was flat thought they knew too. 

 

We do not know what a good diet is. We don't know if what we eat is more important than when and how often we eat. In fact, much of the current research is beginning to point at when and how often we eat being more important.

 

Our bodies evolved going through periods of frequent starvation. So, do you think every single time you feel a little hungry it is "healthy" to stuff your face with "good" foods? That is actually what people think, but it is not the truth. Just because you eat "good" food, that does not have to help you much if you do not control the when and how often you eat it. 

 

And notice, nobody ever brings up when and how often we eat. That is because people want to eat when they get hungry. They have totally blocked out the fact that when they eat could be as important as what. But what we eat gets 100% of the attention. It proves our absolute ignorance. And even if we did know "the proper diet" how on earth would it apply to every single living human, as if there is no variation. 

 

 

Edited August 9, 2019 by meand

[stephenterry]

I agree, completely. That's why intermittent fasting is key to a healthy lifestyle.

 

[stephenterry]

5 hours ago, xylophone said:

Firstly, let me say that I take no offence with anything you have posted as I know you have done so with the best intentions, so thank you for that, however I will address a few aspects of your post as they apply to me.

 

I have tried everything from flaxseed powder through to pure fine oat bran, to broccoli powder to........just about everything else and all to no avail.

 

You are right in some respects inasmuch as I probably don't have the healthiest diet, however I do eat salad or vegetables with everything I prepare and although it sounded as if I exist on pizza and pastas that was probably as much my fault in the way I posted, as every meal I eat has some sort of vegetables or salad with it.

 

As an experiment just a couple of weeks ago, and after reading a recipe book, I decided to try a broccoli and Stilton recipe which consisted of buying a whole broccoli and cooking it slightly, even the stalk (separately and in a little milk and chicken stock), then liquidising the lot and eating it as a soup, and I have to say there was a lot of it but it was delicious!

 

I ate too much of it but thought that as it was healthy it would do me good, however that wasn't the case because my system being slow meant that I had to sit upright in bed all night as the food was not being digested but simply sitting in my stomach, and I felt terribly full all of the next day whilst waiting for the magic moment to arrive when I would deposit something, which did happen 24 hours later!

 

As for the cause of my "disorder", and the fact that I now don't do much in the way of exercise, I remember back in the early 80s when I was still playing a good standard of football and also training a couple of times a week, when I had the same problem and after an extensive set of tests in the BUPA Hospital in London (barium swallow, barium meal, x-rays etc) the specialist determined way back then that I had a slow motility problem and there wasn't a lot I could do about it apart from eating slowly and frequently rather than eat big meals.

 

So this has been with me for quite some time, exercise or not and it is something I will just have to live with as it hasn't gotten any better, perhaps a little worse if anything.

 

I know your post was meant in my best interests, but for the record, I played football for 40 years, before retiring after too many broken bones and also played tennis during that time as well as playing on until I was about 58. 

 

I was always a keen athlete and a very good middle distance runner and it's only since I moved here in 2006/7 that I have just about given up exercise, although I do walk a few kilometres a day.

 

And for the record again, I was born in the UK and was always a sportsman, then moved to New Zealand half way through my life, where I also played football and tennis (at a good standard), and although I am now about 92 kg, so a little overweight, I am not grossly so and feel more comfortable at about 90 KG as I am about 5'11" tall.

 

Obviously I will continue to experiment with various things, however going vegetarian for a few days didn't do much, and I could fill a whole page with the various vegetables and fibres I have tried, all to no avail – – apart from the prune juice which seems to be my saviour at the moment!!

 

I posted because there may be others out there who have "slow systems" which seem to defy the fibre diets logic.
 

Okay, thanks for responding in such depth. Much appreciated. Let's look at possibilities. First, there may be an adverse correlation and maybe causation between cheese (dairy) and other nutrients. I would suggest for a limited time you experiment with NO dairy, but continue with plant-based foods, and the occasional meat/fish products (albeit I wouldn't).

 

Secondly, at 92 kilos at your height, you ARE overweight. Full stop. No need to try and ignore it. Enough to consider dropping up to 15 kilos - yes, 15 kilos - which would be your maximum maintenance weight. it's not easy, but Intermittent fasting (IF), with a doctor's consultation and agreement that everything else being equal, there's no harm in it. I can advise how best to go about it if you want - because I've been there and succeeded in doing exactly that - even taking warfarin.

 

I also appreciate your sporting activities, and maybe that has helped you to retain a reasonable healthy body. But don't forget, it's easy to slide down towards an unhealthy state. 

 

As an opinion on the medical summation, I  believe there is always an answer based on correct nutrition. The difficulty we all have is finding the solution. Your prune juice remedy (high fibre content) needs further examination as to why that is so effective, because there are also adverse effects from consuming it on a regular basis..

[brokenbone]

3 hours ago, meand said:

We do not understand the effects different diets have on our health nearly as well as we think we do. 

 

People wont admit that, but it is the truth. 

 

If twins were brought up, one of them eating a "proper" three square meals a day, never miss a meal, grains starch, proteins. If he ate exactly what we have been told to eat. Then the other twin ate pizza with sardines on it, drank wine, and had a lettuce and tomatoe salad with olive oil on it everyday, but fasted in between meals... we have no idea who would be healthier when they reached old age. We think we know, but the people who thought the earth was flat thought they knew too. 

 

We do not know what a good diet is. We don't know if what we eat is more important than when and how often we eat. In fact, much of the current research is beginning to point at when and how often we eat being more important.

 

Our bodies evolved going through periods of frequent starvation. So, do you think every single time you feel a little hungry it is "healthy" to stuff your face with "good" foods? That is actually what people think, but it is not the truth. Just because you eat "good" food, that does not have to help you much if you do not control the when and how often you eat it. 

 

And notice, nobody ever brings up when and how often we eat. That is because people want to eat when they get hungry. They have totally blocked out the fact that when they eat could be as important as what. But what we eat gets 100% of the attention. It proves our absolute ignorance. And even if we did know "the proper diet" how on earth would it apply to every single living human, as if there is no variation. 

 

 

disagree, i think a steady supply of protein

is going to give the guy that ate protein daily

a better muscle to fat ratio.

i also think an over consumption of

rice at the cost of meat, as is common in asia cuisine, is a cause of diabetes

Edited August 9, 2019 by brokenbone

[stephenterry]

13 hours ago, brokenbone said:

disagree, i think a steady supply of protein

is going to give the guy that ate protein daily

a better muscle to fat ratio.

i also think an over consumption of

rice at the cost of meat, as is common in asia cuisine, is a cause of diabetes

 

I think the western world overestimates the amount of protein needed in a nutritious diet, particularly because plant and nut protein is readily available and is usually plenty to meet daily needs and is a healthy lifestyle. Meat and fish can bolster up protein intake if needed - and/or if you enjoy eating it. 

 

As for rice V meat, the main cause of type 2 diabetes (in any country) is the increased consumption of sugar and sugar-filled packaged products, NOT rice, per se - and recent increased rates of type 2 diabetes in Asian countries is probably caused by mimicking unhealthy western food styles.   

 

Blame Coca-Cola, Pepsi, McDonalds and Pizza hut... 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[zlodnick]

 Like Xylophone, I also have slow motility and constipation. It is recommended to eat a low fiber diet for slow motility and a high fiber diet for constipation. I've tried both and didn't notice a difference.

 

 I don't want to get hooked on laxatives, so I seldom use them. Prune juice has worked very well for me. Last night I took milk of magnesia, and this morning not so much as a fart. So, I drank a large glass of prune juice and 5 minutes later I was on the toilet. 

 

 Prune juice is the only thing keeping me going right now, but I really would like to figure out what I need to get my system somewhere near normal.

[xylophone]

20 hours ago, stephenterry said:

Okay, thanks for responding in such depth. Much appreciated. Let's look at possibilities. First, there may be an adverse correlation and maybe causation between cheese (dairy) and other nutrients. I would suggest for a limited time you experiment with NO dairy, but continue with plant-based foods, and the occasional meat/fish products (albeit I wouldn't).

 

Secondly, at 92 kilos at your height, you ARE overweight. Full stop. No need to try and ignore it. Enough to consider dropping up to 15 kilos - yes, 15 kilos - which would be your maximum maintenance weight. it's not easy, but Intermittent fasting (IF), with a doctor's consultation and agreement that everything else being equal, there's no harm in it. I can advise how best to go about it if you want - because I've been there and succeeded in doing exactly that - even taking warfarin.

 

I also appreciate your sporting activities, and maybe that has helped you to retain a reasonable healthy body. But don't forget, it's easy to slide down towards an unhealthy state. 

 

As an opinion on the medical summation, I  believe there is always an answer based on correct nutrition. The difficulty we all have is finding the solution. Your prune juice remedy (high fibre content) needs further examination as to why that is so effective, because there are also adverse effects from consuming it on a regular basis..

I think we are getting off track here because the thread is about switching to a vegetarian diet, so as regards the conversation with you, this will be my last one.

 

The reason being is that I believe you are not "inwardly digesting" (pun intended) what I have been writing or indeed taking note of the medical opinion.

 

The condition of slow motility is not one which can be cured with fibre/bran/vegetables/etc/wonder cures, because the peristaltic action of the digestive system is controlled, not by fibre and to quote "there’s actually a completely unrelated problem that can cause constipation, and that doesn’t respond well to fiber: slow-transit constipation". 

"Slow-transit constipation means that there’s something going wrong with the muscle contractions in the colon. The nervous system in the gut controls movement of the colon (which is necessary to push food and feces through it) and the cause has to do with inadequate levels of acetylcholine, an excitatory neurotransmitter that increases muscle contractions in the colon". 

So trying to find out a correlation between foods I eat and constipation, with what I have, doesn't do a lot of good according to the specialists in this area and the specialists who conducted my tests way back in 1982. 

The cause is slow motility, and that's probably why I suffered from gastric reflux later on in life and why my New Zealand specialist put me on Domperidone which is a medicine that increases the movements or contractions of the stomach and bowel. 

AND at 92 kg for my height, I know I am overweight but not greatly so, and if I can get down to 88 kg I will be happy and I'm in the process of doing that now.

IMO it is completely ridiculous for me to drop 15 kg and be at the weight I was when I was an 18-year-old soccer player 54 years ago!!! And I don't know from where you obtained that weight for me, but if it's anything to do with the BMI, something which was devised 170 years ago, I don't have a lot of faith in it, as don't many scientists and dietitians of today.

In fact many of them point out that if you followed the BMI calculations, many of the sports folk today would be classified as overweight or obese, and that's just not the case, so it's a bit of a shotgun approach (the BMI cannot tell the difference between excess fat, muscle or bone and the adult BMI does not take into account age, gender or muscle mass, nor nationalities come to that).

At the end of your post you state that on a medical summation you believe there is always an answer based on nutrition, and perhaps that's the case in some things, but, and I say this again BUT my condition has nothing to do with nutrition, because no matter what I put down my pipes, it doesn't get moved along, as it is a medical condition, not a nutritional condition.

Please, no more of your supposedly helpful information, although I'm sure you thought you meant well.
 

[jak2002003]

On ‎8‎/‎1‎/‎2019 at 7:30 AM, simon43 said:

I'm not a vegetarian, but I mostly eat non-meat foods because of the poor choice of quality meat in Thailand, (unless you pay good money for it).

 

Having a Scientific background, (and teaching Science every day to my students), I've learnt a lot about the human digestion system and the composition of foods, healthy diets etc.  I get most of my non-plant minerals from eating oily fish.  My daily diet typically consists of raw vegetables, fruit, nuts, muesli, keffir milk, oily fish, eggs for protein.

 

I can say that since embarking on a mainly vegetarian diet about 3 years ago, I have never felt more healthy than I do right now.  I never have stomach problems, but do get some wind of course (non-threatening odourless sort!)

What do you mean poor quality meat in Thailand?

 

They have good quality freshwater fish and seafood.  The pork is amazing.. better than in the UK, and the chicken is also... well... chicken.  Often the fish (and frogs) are also so fresh they are still alive when you buy them.... and you can't get better 'quality' than that.

 

I understand about the beef.  That is a different matter, but the other animals you can eat are not poor quality... unless you are buying the very cheapest stuff you can get.  

 

Also, most people with a scientific background would know that fish is MEAT.. not a vegetable and not part of a vegetarian diet in any way.... so you are not actually eating a mostly vegetarian diet at all.  Sorry. 

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, zlodnick said:

 Like Xylophone, I also have slow motility and constipation. It is recommended to eat a low fiber diet for slow motility and a high fiber diet for constipation. I've tried both and didn't notice a difference.

 

 I don't want to get hooked on laxatives, so I seldom use them. Prune juice has worked very well for me. Last night I took milk of magnesia, and this morning not so much as a fart. So, I drank a large glass of prune juice and 5 minutes later I was on the toilet. 

 

 Prune juice is the only thing keeping me going right now, but I really would like to figure out what I need to get my system somewhere near normal.

I sympathise with you and if you look at my post above (#196) you will find some more information on this particular syndrome, and why forcing more fibre and so on into one's diet will not do any good, in fact it can exacerbate the problem (as I have found out).

Like you, I have taken milk of magnesia and that hasn't worked for me, neither have many other so-called "constipation relief remedies".

Although prune juice does contain some fibre, it is the sorbitol in the juice which gives you the reaction you had, so try experimenting with different measures, and now that you know a large glass will have an immediate effect, try cutting that down to something which will allow you to live a bit of a life without having to always be near a toilet because you don't know what's going to happen!.

Nothing wrong with having prune juice on a daily basis, because I recall from the old days that my dad and my grandad and grandma were very keen on a daily helping of stewed prunes to start the day, as were many folk back then, and it appeared to do them no harm.

There can be some very mild side effects, but the joy of being able to pay a regular visit to the toilet, far outweighs them!!!!
 

[balo]

The 6:1 and 5:2 diet by Dr Mosley has been discussed before, just search for the thread.  Just want to add that eating less even if you feel hungry is a good way to start losing weight, smaller portions, and more water instead of juice/soda drinks.  You will notice the difference quickly. 

Your brain is programmed to tell you when its time to eat but it will adapt to your eating habits. 
So after 2 weeks you will not feel as hungry, even if you eat less food. 

 

 

Edited August 10, 2019 by balo

[robblok]

On 8/9/2019 at 5:41 PM, stephenterry said:

Okay, thanks for responding in such depth. Much appreciated. Let's look at possibilities. First, there may be an adverse correlation and maybe causation between cheese (dairy) and other nutrients. I would suggest for a limited time you experiment with NO dairy, but continue with plant-based foods, and the occasional meat/fish products (albeit I wouldn't).

 

Secondly, at 92 kilos at your height, you ARE overweight. Full stop. No need to try and ignore it. Enough to consider dropping up to 15 kilos - yes, 15 kilos - which would be your maximum maintenance weight. it's not easy, but Intermittent fasting (IF), with a doctor's consultation and agreement that everything else being equal, there's no harm in it. I can advise how best to go about it if you want - because I've been there and succeeded in doing exactly that - even taking warfarin.

 

I also appreciate your sporting activities, and maybe that has helped you to retain a reasonable healthy body. But don't forget, it's easy to slide down towards an unhealthy state. 

 

As an opinion on the medical summation, I  believe there is always an answer based on correct nutrition. The difficulty we all have is finding the solution. Your prune juice remedy (high fibre content) needs further examination as to why that is so effective, because there are also adverse effects from consuming it on a regular basis..

You have no clue what his body composition is.. BMI is outdated. I am 180cm at 92.5 kg with visible abs (low bodyfat). So I might be overweight but its not fat all muscle. BMI is outdated especially for people who exercise a lot.

[Chivas]

I know plenty who claim they're veggies or bogans or vegans or whatever they're called this week when getting on a plane so that they get served their grub first