Expat group launches online petition calling for TM.30 to be scrapped

[CaptainJack]

8 minutes ago, HLover said:

Or you simply filled out your form.

You have no idea what attention I can bring to this issue.   Get ready.   Those of us who are not cowering,  we will stand up to oppression. I am just getting started......

Edited July 29, 2019 by CaptainJack
Better wording.

[CaptainJack]

5 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

Skipped to last page here, went to the link and under terms and conditions it states: 

"13. By providing Content to this website you grant to this website a royalty free, perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, non-exclusive licence to use, edit, moderate, copy and make the Content or any part of it available as it sees fit on the this website or on any other website or third party services in any media or technology now known or later developed."

 

Call me paranoid, this seems to say after signing and sending in the petition,  everyone will have access to my name and email address?  Is this normal?  

Don't be afraid!

[phetpeter]

I don't understand the fuss, I registered my main residence, and had my name added to the joint ownership with my wife, the official insisted has we purchased the house as a married couple. then received yellow book. later I got pink ID. all show my home address. When we stay at a hotel, details are the responsibility of the hotel. On return home, I do nothing, except pop in to immigation every 90 days. That's it! That has been done that way for 15 years. Never had even the slightest query about reporting my every move. even when resident during the week working at an international school 300kms from my house for 4 years, and going home at weekends. When I return in a few weeks from working overseas. I will do nothing as I will have stated address at arrivals in airport and it will have been updated on the national computer.

[notmyself]

Better the devil you know I say because the money involved will still have to come from somewhere. Good luck.

[metisdead]

Some offensive posts and replies have been removed. 

[inalyat]

Agree and have signed it. 

The reporting rule is ridiculous and serves no purpose. The visas to stay are irrelevant and in some circumstances not covered or applicable. Example, I was married to a thai woman (before she fleeced me and had numerous affairs with Thai boyfriend, but now I digress) to who e I have 2 children aged 6/7. As we are divorced she was awarded her full custody due to my international work. Therefore I was not eligible to enter thailand and stay despite still be fully financially supportive to my children. A long and costly court battle ensued, I was eventually awarded “joint custody” and I be my children with me from after school Friday’s until school starts again Monday or longer if there are holidays.

despite having joint custody, I still can not get a visa without having to leave the country every 90 days (and if I don’t have a multi entry which is hard to get as the rules change at every location and always missing some documentation). This is an out dated rule that serves no purpose for the people trying to support family’s to ensure children grow up knowing their parents are good people. U fortunately the burden this rule puts on people like me gets to the point where I can’t see or support my kids because the thai government is making it impossible to do. 

In Australia on the other hand, if I had a spouse (marriage) visa for my wife, even after we are divorced she is entitled to stay, work, get government Medicare, and not have to report at any location no matter where or how long she stays. Simply she is then treated the same as an Australian citizen. Simple, it works and there are no discussions ever about treating foreigners unfair, particularly when family and children are involved.

 

my (long and drawn out argument) 2 cents worth. 

 

Either way, you now have 1 more signature on the petition. 

[Skallywag]

25 minutes ago, CaptainJack said:

Don't be afraid!

OK Captain - have not been an expat very long and never had any problems with Thai IO.  

I do not travel out of Thailand but maybe once a year and not a big time waster IMO for a retiree.  

 

WIll join the revolution and sign the petition to "fight the man"

 

[wwest5829]

12 hours ago, jackdd said:

Section 37 = form TM28 not TM30

Foreigners who entered Thailand under section 34, this is probably everybody here, are exempt from this 24 hours reporting when going to another province under section 37.

 

The author should understand the laws before making a petition about them.

And yet in Chiang Mai you are told to report. If nothing else perhaps an official clarification of your point sent to all immigration offices stating need for consistency with the law. Not holding my breathe.

[RBOP]

12 hours ago, NCC1701A said:

yes it is in Thai

Looks like it was translated from Thai first. That's probably why it doesnt very read well and full of mistakes. 

[Dukeleto]

12 hours ago, Jonathan Fairfield said:

TM30 is outdated and causes far too many problems which would did not exist in the past.

I am pretty sure that is grammatically incorrect.  As I am unsure exactly of what they wanted to convey I cannot correct it. I would suggest the author of the article does so before submitting it, not that anyone on the Thai side would notice as It will be submitted with a Thai translation but it would look better to those of us who read and speak English.

 

ps. My interpretation is that the word “would” should be removed completely from that sentence?

[moto77]

“What happens to people residing in AirBNB accommodation?“

 

um? They get fined for staying in an illegal accommodation? ????  

 

Why is this example even in there? AirBnB is illegal for a weekend stay in the majority of cases (with few exceptions). Asking the government what happens if you knowing stay in a likely illegal accommodation is silly and detracts from the point. 

[lannarebirth]

18 minutes ago, inalyat said:

Agree and have signed it. 

The reporting rule is ridiculous and serves no purpose. The visas to stay are irrelevant and in some circumstances not covered or applicable. Example, I was married to a thai woman (before she fleeced me and had numerous affairs with Thai boyfriend, but now I digress) to who e I have 2 children aged 6/7. As we are divorced she was awarded her full custody due to my international work. Therefore I was not eligible to enter thailand and stay despite still be fully financially supportive to my children. A long and costly court battle ensued, I was eventually awarded “joint custody” and I be my children with me from after school Friday’s until school starts again Monday or longer if there are holidays.

despite having joint custody, I still can not get a visa without having to leave the country every 90 days (and if I don’t have a multi entry which is hard to get as the rules change at every location and always missing some documentation). This is an out dated rule that serves no purpose for the people trying to support family’s to ensure children grow up knowing their parents are good people. U fortunately the burden this rule puts on people like me gets to the point where I can’t see or support my kids because the thai government is making it impossible to do. 

In Australia on the other hand, if I had a spouse (marriage) visa for my wife, even after we are divorced she is entitled to stay, work, get government Medicare, and not have to report at any location no matter where or how long she stays. Simply she is then treated the same as an Australian citizen. Simple, it works and there are no discussions ever about treating foreigners unfair, particularly when family and children are involved.

 

my (long and drawn out argument) 2 cents worth. 

 

Either way, you now have 1 more signature on the petition. 

 

Is that an "O" visa for support of a dependent child?  You are made to exit the country every 90 days? I thought the requirements were m/l the same as a marriage visa.

 

https://awbiz.com/thai-child-support-visa/

[soalbundy]

12 hours ago, jackdd said:

Section 37 = form TM28 not TM30

Foreigners who entered Thailand under section 34, this is probably everybody here, are exempt from this 24 hours reporting when going to another province under section 37.

 

The author should understand the laws before making a petition about them.

I agree, this doesn't really concern us unless we go abroad for a holiday. I asked my IO if I and/or my wife have to do a TM30 if I travel to Bangkok for a couple of days, his answer ;- ''No, not unless you intend to stay there permanently we aren't interested where you go."

[lannarebirth]

I pity the IO officer that tries to fine my wife for me not reporting that we have returned to our home. That could be a Thai Visa headline all by itself.

[wotsdermatter]

Currently, I am in Canada and contemplate returning to BKK in late November/early December after completing necessary functions here.  Was prepared to sign the petition then I read the content I will not sign.  As a result of the incorrect language used, which makes it difficult to read and understand in places and the poor punctuation.  I changed my mind.  One important consideration would be to really tighten up the sloppiness of the content.  It is not a well written petition, nor thought through document and it is being sent to people in the Thai Government about whom many on TVForum have complained about and their lack of understanding regarding "correct education", whatever that may consist of, many of whom cannot read or speak very much English and who are not interested in helping us.  Review the postings and ask yourself, "Has any Thai Government in the past 20 years ever paid serious attention to what we, as non-Thais believe, think, suggest, or say, unless the latter consists of negative remarks about Thainess, etc.?"  Due to all of the unsettling proposals by the government, e.g. health insurance, excessive scrutinising of documents, must have xxx amount of money in a bank when wanting to live in Thailand upon retiring, etc., I will not return to Thailand but am contemplating another country where we are treated more as humans than ATM machines for use by the government to fund their useless proposals and line their pockets.

'nuf sed.

Edited July 29, 2019 by wotsdermatter
added more

[wwest5829]

Inclined to sign but must agree to "terms and conditions". Where are these terms and conditions stated please?

[CaptainJack]

What in my opinion,  everyone needs to understand, is that that over the last seven months, the very viability and value of the western expatriate community has been diminished and attacked.  The reasons why and the details are irrelevant.   What matters is this is an existential threat to the future of western expatriates in Thailand.   

 

If left unchecked and allowed to continue,  the western expatriate community as well as tourism and business will fade away.  We have a few brave individuals who have stepped forward to herald this issue and ask for a resolution.   Let's get on board.  The details may not be exactly correct,  but the essence is real and undeniable.   

 

Stand together now, or be divided and eventually made to leave.

[Is this real]

What makes anyone think that Thailand wants Tourists or Expats? 

 

Hasn't been so for years.

[Moonlover]

7 hours ago, BestB said:

7 hours ago, losername said:

I would not put my signature to such an appalling letter. Surely they can find native English language writers and prof readers.

 

7 hours ago, BestB said:

You do of course know authorities will

be reading thai version ? But I guess any excuse to bitch or moan is better than actually doing something . 

 

Here is a thought, instead of criticising, how about you re write it?

Good idea. But he'll need a good prof reader!

[transam]

Should have a poll, could put the result forward, but Thai folk are never wrong and do not like being "told", so I don't think it will get anywhere.

[Bundooman]

13 hours ago, jackdd said:

Section 37 = form TM28 not TM30

Foreigners who entered Thailand under section 34, this is probably everybody here, are exempt from this 24 hours reporting when going to another province under section 37.

 

The author should understand the laws before making a petition about them.

Many of us will agree that, however, a couple of years ago in Chiangmai, I went to Immigration to report change of address using TM28 and was promptly given TM30 to complete. 

When I challenged this, I was told that the TM30 was the correct form.

 

It is not the foreigner that doesn't understand the rules - it is Immigration

 

[Moonlover]

3 minutes ago, Is this real said:

What makes anyone think that Thailand wants Tourists or Expats? 

 

Hasn't been so for years.

The welcome and assistance I get whenever I visit almost anywhere, including Thai Immigration office.

[Paul Henry]

Criminals and non law abiding individuals do not fill in forms! Honest genuine people do, so what purpose do all these forms achieve?. They definatley do not help TOT with their statistics!

[IvorBiggun2]

14 minutes ago, soalbundy said:

I asked my IO if I and/or my wife have to do a TM30 if I travel to Bangkok for a couple of days, his answer ;- ''No, not unless you intend to stay there permanently we aren't interested where you go."

And when his back is to the wall he'll say he never said it. Do it. Stay legal.

[wwest5829]

9 hours ago, Isaanlawyers said:

Nothing is perfect. People will disagree, would have used other words, including other reforms.

 

The website crashed twice today because there was too much traffic. The petition text in English has been revised to be more readable.

 

I am part of this group and we need 10,000 signatures to change things, Below that, they will not listen to us. I have lived in Thailand for 15 years, I work for a law firm. There is nothing illegal to tell how you feel about a law. Some people in our group have Thai families, work hard, pay taxes. We tried to add testimonials with pictures but people are quite scared.

 

I would like to appeal the Thaivisa community to SIGN THIS PETITION as if nothing is done, nothing will change. Some applications online do not work, it is currently a mess and not necessary. We are screen by immigration, give our address every 90 days, checked at airports and country entrances, etc. How many foreigners live in Thailand? How many spend a weekend in another province? Do you imagine the lost of time to manage this? 

 

This is not to protect terrorism. My personal opinion, it is useless and bureaucracy. In the old law of 1979 and need a change.

 

If you do not like it, do not sign, and I won't answer comments here. I take care of 4 children and manage a law firm. I have permanent residency and don't even have to do TM30, TM28 or TM47. I did that to help this community after receiving TONS of complaints. Thanks.

 

Sebastian.

Where can I read the "terms and conditions" required to be agreed with before submitting petition?

[fourpack]

I read in horror yesterday on another Pattaya forum a guy express his views on this subject only for the OP who I presume to be the owner of this petition to become verbally abuse and patronising to the guy who only wrote his views.

I would not sign this now if that the sort of response the person who started this gives out. Shame on you.

[davidst01]

13 hours ago, jackdd said:

Section 37 = form TM28 not TM30

Foreigners who entered Thailand under section 34, this is probably everybody here, are exempt from this 24 hours reporting when going to another province under section 37.

 

The author should understand the laws before making a petition about them.

I think the author is an attorney and probably knows the law better than you

[MJKT2014]

21 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

Inclined to sign but must agree to "terms and conditions". Where are these terms and conditions stated please?

Just click the link, to a PDF.

[davidst01]

12 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

Where can I read the "terms and conditions" required to be agreed with before submitting petition?

click on the link terms and conditions. hover over it and you will be able to click on it

[MJKT2014]

Nothing on the terms says you cannot use a fake email address. Seems to work - so the count cannot be exact if everyone does this? I don't want my ID revealed as it seems too risky with IO watching! I have a wife an kids here and peed off at threats of TM30 fines to me when it is a landlords responsibility.

Edited July 29, 2019 by MJKT2014