Laos - 1 year business visa, WP & ID card received - easy!

[simon43]

Not sure if the Mr. Xi and his billion relatives have turned up in Luang Prabang yet but if they do they will really wreck what is/was a very nice place to chill out.

 

Nothing is being wrecked (yet) in LP by Mr Xi et Al. The authorities are no doubt aware of the UNESCO status of the old town.  No one is allowed to smoke outside, the Chinese workers building the railway are accommodated out near the sports stadium and the high speed train station for LP has deliberately been built about 10 Km away from the town.

 

I see Chinese railway workers and Chinese tourists.  No flag-following hoards, no drunken driving (the main road in the old town is closed to traffic in the evening), polite Chinese couples etc.

 

It ain't Sihoukville....

[Number 6]

I wouldn't have bothered with the bank account and especially the work permit.

 

I'd perhaps split my time between Lao, Cambodia and cool season in south of Thailand.

 

Luang Prabang for me has been totally ruined culturally. It's been slow to change but it looks nothing like even 20 let alone 25+ years ago. Country was really amazballs pre 1998-9.

 

Food in Lao 25% more expensive than Thailand due to lack of economies of scale. Everything is imported from China.

 

Other options - June to August in Papua, Indonesia or Northern India. Autumn in Kyoto.

 

Lao is a snooze even for a geezer like me. Working VIP kids...well I'd rather have my chest waxed.

 

In your shoes, I'd just cut my expenses and enjoy life. But up2you.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Number 6

[simon43]

12 hours ago, Number 6 said:

I wouldn't have bothered with the bank account and especially the work permit.

 

I'd perhaps split my time between Lao, Cambodia and cool season in south of Thailand.

 

Luang Prabang for me has been totally ruined culturally. It's been slow to change but it looks nothing like even 20 let alone 25+ years ago. Country was really amazballs pre 1998-9.

 

Food in Lao 25% more expensive than Thailand due to lack of economies of scale. Everything is imported from China.

 

Other options - June to August in Papua, Indonesia or Northern India. Autumn in Kyoto.

 

Lao is a snooze even for a geezer like me. Working VIP kids...well I'd rather have my chest waxed.

 

In your shoes, I'd just cut my expenses and enjoy life. But up2you.

I first visited Luang Prabang with my English wife in the 1980's.  Then again in the early 2000's investigating business opportunities, headmaster of the school in 2013, and now returned again.  I don't see many changes in the old town, mainly due to the UNESCO protection.  I see improvements in the internet (vast improvement!), stability of the electricity supply etc.

 

Sure, there are many more Chinese here.  But Laos is essentially a southern Chinese province, has been for years.  I'm OK with the type of Chinese that visit/live in LP - it's not like Snookyville.

 

Not sure about your problem with food costs.  I know that LP is more expensive than other places in Laos.  I spend no more than 300 baht a day on food and alcohol for 3 healthy meals a day.

 

As for teaching, I wouldn't touch VIPKids with a bargepole!  I mostly teach Science to students in Burma, China, the USA, Russia and Korea.  I do not work for any of the big Chinese employers.

[KarlosInBKK]

Hi Simon,

 

Thank you for sharing your experience. It's very interesting. I live in Thailand. I'm currently studying Thai and also teaching online. Staying here long term is becoming increasingly difficult, so I'm considering moving to a neighbouring country. Laos has a special place in my heart, so I was super happy when I read that you can get a visa to teach online.

 

Which service provider are you with for your fibre-optic? I was pleasantly surprised to see that 50mbps is available. Have you had any issues with it so far, such as speeds dropping too low or completely losing service for a while?

 

Your back-up SIM data package sounds great, too.

 

Cheers! ???? 

[simon43]

Hi Karlos, Lao Telecom fibre was already installed in the house that I rent.  I have a 50 MB/sec connection and in 3 months, I have never had to use my back-up mobile data connection.  I can reliably teach using Skype, Zoom/Zhumu and other bespoke teaching platforms ????

[Number 6]

3 hours ago, simon43 said:

I first visited Luang Prabang with my English wife in the 1980's.  Then again in the early 2000's investigating business opportunities, headmaster of the school in 2013, and now returned again.  I don't see many changes in the old town, mainly due to the UNESCO protection.  I see improvements in the internet (vast improvement!), stability of the electricity supply etc.

 

Sure, there are many more Chinese here.  But Laos is essentially a southern Chinese province, has been for years.  I'm OK with the type of Chinese that visit/live in LP - it's not like Snookyville.

 

Not sure about your problem with food costs.  I know that LP is more expensive than other places in Laos.  I spend no more than 300 baht a day on food and alcohol for 3 healthy meals a day.

 

As for teaching, I wouldn't touch VIPKids with a bargepole!  I mostly teach Science to students in Burma, China, the USA, Russia and Korea.  I do not work for any of the big Chinese employers.

The 80s? Well, the Russians, Viet's and Chinese would have been running all about. My movements very, very restricted in 95.

 

Well, we agree on VIP kids.

 

Ive not been back to LP in years but Lao gutted all the markets and moved them out of town. LP morning market that completely changed the vibe of the area. Further, too much tourism has made it sterile. Every nice place that used to be someone's home is selling kitch and coffee.

 

B300 in Lao for food? Yeah, exactly. I spend half that in BKK. Fancy food court city center you can eat for b50-100. The famed beer no longer cheap. I have to stick with spirits anyway bc beer makes me fat. All the whiskey is fake.

 

Yeah, just loads of Chinese.

 

Communists...yuck.

 

You can get a flat in Kyoto and Bangkok for what you pay for your place. Yeah, smaller but with mod cons. I've got my eye on Kyoto. Never ending places to explore. Great spring, autumn. Sushi for b30 a plate.

 

Guess you're content for the moment. I've honestly thought of moving there on retirement with wife. I find the backpackers annoying and as I'd said expensive. I'm certain as you get settled in you find cheaper places.

 

Both they and Khmer don't really use krapow much. Especially in North.

 

Presume if you've a WP you're planning on giving them money for work - despite the country doing nothing to support the effort other than harboring  you. Bet that's gonna end in a tussle over taxes.

 

Lao people really lovely though.

Edited November 3, 2019 by Number 6

[simon43]

When we visited LP and Vientiane in the 80's, we also visited Vietnam and drove (were driven) from the southern tip of the country to the northern tip.  Both were trip[s organised via the governments and yes - everyone thought we were Russian!

 

I recall the big changes in Vientiane along the riverfront, don't like to visit or live there.

 

Of course the LP night market is just for tourists.  But you cannot expect a place to not change.  IMHO, LP has managed to change in a reasonable way and to keep those changes to small areas.  The influx of young backbackers means that there's plenty of fresh salads and fruit for sale.  I usually jog at 5.00am, then go to the local market to buy fruit and veg.

 

Out of choice, I rent an 'expensive' house ($500/month), because it is within metres of the river and old town.  If I moved further out of town, I could easily half that rent.

 

I don't understand your comment about the WP and 'giving them money for work'.  I work for myself, no need to employ anyone.  My WP allows me to work online, but not to open a bricks and mortar business.

 

From your many negative comments, you sound like a 'glass half-empty' sort of guy.  I'm not ????

[Ventenio]

Now this is a good thread.   Keep the updates coming, best of luck.  Enjoy your daily run, it's really magical for the body.  

[KarlosInBKK]

On 11/3/2019 at 10:31 AM, simon43 said:

Hi Karlos, Lao Telecom fibre was already installed in the house that I rent.  I have a 50 MB/sec connection and in 3 months, I have never had to use my back-up mobile data connection.  I can reliably teach using Skype, Zoom/Zhumu and other bespoke teaching platforms ????

That's brilliant! Happy to hear that. Thank you again for the info ????

[Hackney35]

Very interesting post - thanks for sharing. 

[brewsterbudgen]

Great, informative thread.  I'm married to a Laotian and we've built a house in her family's village near Pakse, but we live in Thailand, as I work here and our (British) son goes to school here.  Eventually we may move more permanently to the house in Laos, but the visa/WP situation has always worried me.  Also, our UK marriage is not recognised in Laos, which complicates matters!

[SteveK]

Just goes to show that there is no need for the ridiculous paperwork debacle which Thailand insists upon. Unless of course they are using to it make things as difficult as possible for foreigners and earn some cash on the way.

[Mavideol]

1 hour ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Great, informative thread.  I'm married to a Laotian and we've built a house in her family's village near Pakse, but we live in Thailand, as I work here and our (British) son goes to school here.  Eventually we may move more permanently to the house in Laos, but the visa/WP situation has always worried me.  Also, our UK marriage is not recognised in Laos, which complicates matters!

do you know or does your wife knows if there are no amount restrictions transferring money out of Laos or is it like Thailand, thanks for the input

[brewsterbudgen]

18 hours ago, Mavideol said:

do you know or does your wife knows if there are no amount restrictions transferring money out of Laos or is it like Thailand, thanks for the input

Not sure as we are continually transferring money into Laos from Thailand and not the other way round.  As the OP has stated, Lao banks pay good interest rates on savings!  

[GalaxyMan]

29 minutes ago, brewsterbudgen said:

As the OP has stated, Lao banks pay good interest rates on savings!  

Is that in local currency only or does the good interest rate also apply to 'foreign' currency accounts?

[Mavideol]

3 hours ago, brewsterbudgen said:

Not sure as we are continually transferring money into Laos from Thailand and not the other way round.  As the OP has stated, Lao banks pay good interest rates on savings!  

thks and that's why I was asking, rates very good but if can not take the full amount out after the deposit period,  then trouble

[verstrickters]

On 11/2/2019 at 8:14 PM, simon43 said:

.. the high speed train station for LP has deliberately been built about 10 Km away from the town.

 

that's purely so the scamming tuk-tuks can still get their cut not for any other reason

[verstrickters]

can we have clarification here, all one needs to do is walk into LP immigration with passport, had over 600usd and shortly a 1 year multi-entry visa will appear?

have tried similar in vientien some time back and was directed to some other place, perhaps labour department.  didnt figure out how to get there so gave up, werent told of the other places requirements.

you also mention something different for retirees, more info on that process? with no work permit cannot open a bank account even with the long term visa?

[Mavideol]

6 minutes ago, verstrickters said:

can we have clarification here, all one needs to do is walk into LP immigration with passport, had over 600usd and shortly a 1 year multi-entry visa will appear?

have tried similar in vientien some time back and was directed to some other place, perhaps labour department.  didnt figure out how to get there so gave up, werent told of the other places requirements.

you also mention something different for retirees, more info on that process? with no work permit cannot open a bank account even with the long term visa?

no idea about the WP situation but opening a bank account it's possible without having long term visa or WP, some bank offer account for non resident

[CNXexpat]

On 11/3/2019 at 12:42 PM, Number 6 said:

B300 in Lao for food? Yeah, exactly. I spend half that in BKK. Fancy food court city center you can eat for b50-100.

Do you have seen, that he spends 300 Baht per day for 3 meals inkl. drinks (partly alcohol)? And not everybody likes to eat every day at cheap food courts like you. 

[Number 6]

3 hours ago, CNXexpat said:

Do you have seen, that he spends 300 Baht per day for 3 meals inkl. drinks (partly alcohol)? And not everybody likes to eat every day at cheap food courts like you. 

I don't believe Simon drinks at all (any more).

 

Breakfast is cheap

Can't see paying more than 100 for lunch

Dinner, eat the same Thai food as lunch.

 

I just eat and live as Thais do. Food courts or no. My lunches are gratis. I'm not comparing budgets simply stating I find Lao more expensive than Thailand for most everything.

 

Thats 9000b in food per month. That's nearly half my monthly budget living in the center of Bangkok. My wife and I were eating ten plates of sushi at a go in four cities in Japan for b300 (b30 plate).

 

 

 

Why would you want a bank account? Worthless Communist Kip. High inflation. SCB has a branch in VNE just keep the money in THB.

Edited November 5, 2019 by Number 6

[CNXexpat]

16 minutes ago, Number 6 said:

I don't believe Simon drinks at all (any more).

 

Breakfast is cheap

Can't see paying more than 100 for lunch

Dinner, eat the same Thai food as lunch.

 

I just eat and live as Thais do. Food courts or no. My lunches are gratis. I'm not comparing budgets simply stating I find Lao more expensive than Thailand for most everything.

 

Thats 9000b in food per month. That's nearly half my monthly budget living in the center of Bangkok. My wife and I were eating ten plates of sushi at a go in four cities in Japan for b300 (b30 plate).

I am sure the TO can also eat cheaper, but he doesn´t want because he can afford to spend more. 

[Mavideol]

8 hours ago, GalaxyMan said:

Is that in local currency only or does the good interest rate also apply to 'foreign' currency accounts?

mainly foreign currency, rates around 4% for USD/ 12 months

[simon43]

The banks may have tightened up the rules about opening accounts.  At all the banks in Laos that I made inquiries, I was told 'no work permit, no bank account'.

 

One can stay long-term in Laos using just a business visa (effectively for retirement).  But it made sense for me to apply for a WP, both to cover my online teaching and to facilitate the opening of a bank account.

 

I was also advised that the high interest savings accounts were only available to those with a local ID card, ie living in Laos.  The LAK interest rate is the highest, then USD and THB at lower rates.

 

I bring my money into Laos in USD and then exchange it for LAK and drop most of it into the interest account.  Unlike USD-THB conversions, every month I get more LAK for my USD ????  That works out fine for me because I only have modest funds and don't intend to return to the UK/export my savings.

 

As for scamming tuk-tuks, I haven't yet found one in Luang Prabang like that.  In Vientiane yes, but in LP I use tuk-tuks to/from the airport for 50,000 kip maximum = 170 baht, which seems reasonable for an airport run.

 

As for drinking, I drink a couple of small bottles of cider a week, (usually after an online lesson with a 5 year old Chinese kid who screams the whole time....).

[GalaxyMan]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

The banks may have tightened up the rules about opening accounts.  At all the banks in Laos that I made inquiries, I was told 'no work permit, no bank account'.

 

One can stay long-term in Laos using just a business visa (effectively for retirement).  But it made sense for me to apply for a WP, both to cover my online teaching and to facilitate the opening of a bank account.

 

I was also advised that the high interest savings accounts were only available to those with a local ID card, ie living in Laos.  The LAK interest rate is the highest, then USD and THB at lower rates.

 

I bring my money into Laos in USD and then exchange it for LAK and drop most of it into the interest account.  Unlike USD-THB conversions, every month I get more LAK for my USD ????  That works out fine for me because I only have modest funds and don't intend to return to the UK/export my savings.

 

As for scamming tuk-tuks, I haven't yet found one in Luang Prabang like that.  In Vientiane yes, but in LP I use tuk-tuks to/from the airport for 50,000 kip maximum = 170 baht, which seems reasonable for an airport run.

 

As for drinking, I drink a couple of small bottles of cider a week, (usually after an online lesson with a 5 year old Chinese kid who screams the whole time....).

Great information. Thanks. Do you know of any issues getting money out of Laos? At that rate of interest, it would be worth it to move money into a foreign currency account (USD), but not if there were problems transferring it out of the country at some later date.

[Assurancetourix]

On 10/7/2019 at 12:22 PM, andy72 said:

by road vientienne to LP as much as 8hrs

Surely more ..

There are 400 km between the two towns and an average of 50 km/h is, for me, too optimistic

[Assurancetourix]

On 11/3/2019 at 1:04 PM, simon43 said:

When we visited LP and Vientiane in the 80's, we also visited Vietnam and drove (were driven) from the southern tip of the country to the northern tip.  Both were trip[s organised via the governments and yes - everyone thought we were Russian!

Hello Simon ,

 

I started visiting SE in the early 90's, starting with Vietnam where I went many times between January 1991 to May 1996; always 2 to 3 months each time ...
I went back in May 2007.
The first time I went to Laos it was also in 2007;
I am back twice and  one time   on my mountain bike to Luang Prabang from my province Sakon nakhon in Thailand .
For the moment I do not need to leave Thailand where I have been living since 14 years; I am officially married to a Thai woman; she speaks Lao because she is Issan (Sakon Nakhon).
What I will be able to do in Laos with a long-term visa will not be the problem of health insurance but rather that the amount of my retirement may be insufficient if the euro continues to fall.
I have heard for a long time that obtaining a B visa in Laos was a very easy thing;
 

something that you confirm in your first post.

By cons I still do not understand if there is a visa "retirement" in Laos;
apart from driving big trucks and coaches I cannot do anything else;
banned in Thailand and certainly also in Laos for a farang ...

The other thing that holds me back is the almost total lack of hospital infrastructure in Laos;
I am 71 years old; I do not smoke or drink alcohol, I ride about 15,000 km a year on my MTBike ; a very good health but with age ....
apart from Vientiane, the capital, there is, to my knowledge, no real hospital in Laos, even in LP.
I was treated to a day and a night to that of Kasi, how to say ...
It is not a hospital, it is hardly a dispensary;
must not have a broken limb or appendicitis;
they have NOTHING.

 

Thanks a lot for your instructive post 

[simon43]

At that rate of interest, it would be worth it to move money into a foreign currency account (USD), but not if there were problems transferring it out of the country at some later date.

 

At all the banks that I inquired, I was told that the fixed term savings accounts in LAK, THB or USD are only available for those with a Lao business visa and WP....  YMMV!

 

Concerning driving from Vientiane to LP, I did this a few months ago in the rainy season.  The new (upgraded) small road high in the mountains was closed due to landslides. So my taxi took the usual road and travel time was about 12 hours in the monsoon rain.

 

Hospital care is, as mentioned, of a VERY basic nature, and you definitely need Medivac insurance to Bangkok.  I hear that there is a new and modern hospital being constructed in LP by the local (and respected) clinic.  I also heard that a modern, Chinese hospital will be built.  Nevertheless, a sudden and serious accident or illness probably will result in a trip to the local temple and going up in smoke!

[Mavideol]

6 hours ago, simon43 said:

The banks may have tightened up the rules about opening accounts.  At all the banks in Laos that I made inquiries, I was told 'no work permit, no bank account'.

 

One can stay long-term in Laos using just a business visa (effectively for retirement).  But it made sense for me to apply for a WP, both to cover my online teaching and to facilitate the opening of a bank account.

 

I was also advised that the high interest savings accounts were only available to those with a local ID card, ie living in Laos.  The LAK interest rate is the highest, then USD and THB at lower rates.

 

I bring my money into Laos in USD and then exchange it for LAK and drop most of it into the interest account.  Unlike USD-THB conversions, every month I get more LAK for my USD ????  That works out fine for me because I only have modest funds and don't intend to return to the UK/export my savings.

 

As for scamming tuk-tuks, I haven't yet found one in Luang Prabang like that.  In Vientiane yes, but in LP I use tuk-tuks to/from the airport for 50,000 kip maximum = 170 baht, which seems reasonable for an airport run.

 

As for drinking, I drink a couple of small bottles of cider a week, (usually after an online lesson with a 5 year old Chinese kid who screams the whole time....).

I did follow up with the previous banking information you provided me with and contacted 3 banks over there, 2 of them required a WP visa to open bank account but do offer accounts to non residents, the government one BCEL appears to be very conservative but still wiling to open the account, the other a smaller one didn't answer my 2nd email requesting confirmation on their 1st statement indicating they would open the account for non residents, the 3rd bank it's an investment bank, always answered my emails on a timely manner, provided all the details about their products offers and they did confirm in 2 different correspondence they way of conducting business and opening FDFCA accounts for non residents, they asked me to provide copy of my Thai visa, Thai residence and some other docs but nothing very hard to supply. They also told me there were no restrictions from removing/transferring the full deposit amount out of Laos but I never had anybody else confirming that, do you know if there are any outbound transfers limitations as  they have in China (no more than 50K USD year) or In Thailand, if you could help here it would be appreciated. I did read the banks T&C and couldn't find anything related to amount restrictions but better (safer than sorry) and check again, since you live there and without wanting to forcibly use your kindness any additional input it's mostly appreciated.  THANKS for all previous answers/information

[simon43]

Mavideol, sorry cannot help about exporting money from Laos, because I have no intention of going down that route and my income is modest in any case ????

 

 

Also, with the banks that I asked about opening an account, I was also told by them that the fixed term deposit accounts were only available to local Lao nationals or resident foreigners who had a business or marriage visa, WP (if not on a marriage visa)and local ID card, all which fits my own situation.