Absolute latest from Immigration on Insurance...

[Pib]

2 hours ago, domdom said:

Hello

 

I come to update the situation in Jomtien.. Yesterday a friend with extension of stay expiring on 14th november made his extension (at the early beginning he had a OA visa).. They told him he did not need any insurance and he got back his passport this morning with the extension

 

I went myself this morning to check what they would tell me.. I spoke with the officer of high rank who is located on the left hand side of the entrance door and asked him if I would need an insurance to extend my stay.. His question was " how long is your current extension of stay" I answered one year and he said "no Need"

I insisted, but I heard insurance is compulsory for OA visas now.. His answer was " BUT you don t have a OA visa, you have an extension of stay"

I told him then that I have a foreign insurance and am covered and showed him.. He gave me the paper back.. and repeated 3 times "No need"

 

 

Have a nice day

But your friend renewed his extension before 31 Oct when the new police order goes into effect.  So, it's understandable his extension was approved without the insurance need.

 

And where you asked the officer will insurance be required to renew you next extension of stay instead of the officer saying "No" immediately instead he asked before answering "...how long is your current extension of stay..." like that would make a difference in what his answer would be. 

 

You answered one year and then he said "no need."  But it's quite possible what he meant you will not need insurance during that one year of your already approved extension of stay "but will when it comes time to renew that extension next year." 

 

I think you should have also asked him come next year when it time to renew your current extension that runs for another year "will insurance then be required or not?"

 

 

 

[Mango Bob]

1 hour ago, Tanoshi said:

All O-A Visas are valid for 1 year to enter Thailand regardless of the issuing Thai Embassy/Consulate.

Perhaps your memory isn't what it once was Bob.

Look at the 'issue' date and the 'enter before' date of your old O-A Visa, I guarantee it is 1 year.

You should learn to read.  I said one year once you enter Thailand.  But you have three months to use the visa.  i.e. if issued on 1 May you have to 1 Aug to enter Thailand.   

[domdom]

Hello.

 

The friend, as said had his current extension valid till november 14th and so, even done yesterday extension was given till nov 14th 2020..

In the same situation another friend from Cha Am was refused last thursday for an extension due on november 18th which he wanted to do 30 days before as usual.

I showed my passport with extension dated october 4th and of course asked him about next one..

As stated he told, insurance for OA visas only and after oct 31st..

To my question "but I also have a OA visa" he said " no you don t have OA visa, you have an extension of stay"

Anyway, I go friday for my 90 days and will still ask somebody else

I thought I would maybe make a letter with copies of my documents and a payed envelope and try to get a written answer from the boss ?

Have a nice day

[gaviny]

And that would mean you would only have 9 months in Thailand and not a year then , correct ?

You should learn to read.  I said one year once you enter Thailand.  But you have three months to use the visa.  i.e. if issued on 1 May you have to 1 Aug to enter Thailand.   

[Mango Bob]

24 minutes ago, gaviny said:

And that would mean you would only have 9 months in Thailand and not a year then , correct ?

No not correct.  Once you get your visa you have three months to enter Thailand.  Once you enter Thailand you have one year from that date not the date you got the visa the DATE YOU ENTER THAILAND.

[flexomike]

3 hours ago, Mango Bob said:

If you got an O/A in the U.S. the visa would state that you have three months to enter Thailand.  If you did not enter during that time your visa is invalided.  I did my O/A in New York in 2005 and I remember it stating that.

 

Once you arrive in Thailand your have 1 year.

 

I got mine from Chicago in 2016 and it gives a one year period of entry on the visa

 

[flexomike]

1 hour ago, Mango Bob said:

You should learn to read.  I said one year once you enter Thailand.  But you have three months to use the visa.  i.e. if issued on 1 May you have to 1 Aug to enter Thailand.   

wrong just looked at mine from 2016 and it gives one year to use it

[Mango Bob]

5 minutes ago, flexomike said:

wrong just looked at mine from 2016 and it gives one year to use it

Wrong.  

[TheAppletons]

10 minutes ago, flexomike said:

wrong just looked at mine from 2016 and it gives one year to use it

 

  This is correct.  You have until the "valid until ________" date to enter Thailand.  That is one year after the issue date.

 

  (It used to say "enter before" date; now it's "valid until" date.)

  

[flexomike]

4 minutes ago, Mango Bob said:

Wrong.  

OK Bob, this is what my visa says, issued on 12 May 2016 enter before 11 May 2017 one year to use, not three months I am talking OA not O which you must be referring to

[lkv]

33 minutes ago, Mango Bob said:

Wrong.  

You keep providing wrong information, when other posters have clarified above.

 

A Non O-A visa has a validity of 12 months AND, upon entry, the holder receives a permission of stay of 12 months. Currently, non O-A comes only in a multiple entry version, although it has been issued as single entry in the past, as far as I recall, and the memo regarding insurances indirectly suggests it may be also issued as a single entry visa in the future. 

 

A Non O visa (single) has a validity of 3 months, and allows a permission of stay of 90 days upon entry.

 

A Non O visa (multiple) has a validity of 12 months and allows a permission of stay of 90 days per entry.

 

There is no visa that has a validity of 3 months and allows a permission of stay per entry of 12 months, as you are suggesting in your posts.

Edited October 22, 2019 by lkv

[Andrew Dwyer]

wrong just looked at mine from 2016 and it gives one year to use it

+ 1

Indeed I have had visas in the past ( for different countries ) that had a validity of 3 months but that is certainly not the case with the OA.

Give it up Bob you’re outnumbered !!

A photo of your visa will resolve this, one way or the other !!

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, Mango Bob said:

No not correct.  Once you get your visa you have three months to enter Thailand.  Once you enter Thailand you have one year from that date not the date you got the visa the DATE YOU ENTER THAILAND.

Perhaps you'd like to post a copy of this extraordinary O-A Visa Bob.

Under the 'number of entries' on this Visa does it have the letter 'S' or 'M'.

 

If the Visa is only valid for entry for 3 months, perhaps you could explain how just before the 'enter before date' of the Visa, your able to cross a border, re-enter and get another years permission of stay, totalling almost 2 years.

 

 

[Pib]

I just checked my OA Visa (multi entry) from 2008....it was issued in Aug 2008 and had to be used  by Aug 2009 (i.e., had a  12 month validity period).    I arrived Thailand Oct 2008....been doing annual retirement extensions of stay ever since. 

[Mango Bob]

20 minutes ago, Pib said:

I just checked my OA Visa (multi entry) from 2008....it was issued in Aug 2008 and had to be used  by Aug 2009 (i.e., had a  12 month validity period).    I arrived Thailand Oct 2008....been doing annual retirement extensions of stay ever since. 

 

38 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Perhaps you'd like to post a copy of this extraordinary O-A Visa Bob.

Under the 'number of entries' on this Visa does it have the letter 'S' or 'M'.

 

If the Visa is only valid for entry for 3 months, perhaps you could explain how just before the 'enter before date' of the Visa, your able to cross a border, re-enter and get another years permission of stay, totalling almost 2 years.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

+ 1

Indeed I have had visas in the past ( for different countries ) that had a validity of 3 months but that is certainly not the case with the OA.

Give it up Bob you’re outnumbered !!

A photo of your visa will resolve this, one way or the other !!

 

38 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

 

 

1 hour ago, lkv said:

You keep providing wrong information, when other posters have clarified above.

 

A Non O-A visa has a validity of 12 months AND, upon entry, the holder receives a permission of stay of 12 months. Currently, non O-A comes only in a multiple entry version, although it has been issued as single entry in the past, as far as I recall, and the memo regarding insurances indirectly suggests it may be also issued as a single entry visa in the future. 

 

A Non O visa (single) has a validity of 3 months, and allows a permission of stay of 90 days upon entry.

 

A Non O visa (multiple) has a validity of 12 months and allows a permission of stay of 90 days per entry.

 

There is no visa that has a validity of 3 months and allows a permission of stay per entry of 12 months, as you are suggesting in your posts.

I guess I am wrong.  

Edited October 22, 2019 by Mango Bob

[nrasmussen]

Unfortunately my Thai is not yet at a level where I can sufficiently understand the Thai version of the new regulations, but assuming it says the same as the English version, then according to reports posted here by people who have been asking questions at various immigration offices around the country, at some of those there might be the same problem of poor reading comprehension as many posters here seem to suffer from.

At least one thing is clear from the English version: Insurance is needed only when doing an entry using a Non O-A visa issued on or after 2019-10-31. Nowhere does it say say anything else - just pure speculation by people arguing otherwise.

[Tanoshi]

2 minutes ago, nrasmussen said:

At least one thing is clear from the English version: Insurance is needed only when doing an entry using a Non O-A visa issued on or after 2019-10-31.

Where exactly in the order does it state only applicable to O-A Visa issued on or after 31/10.

The version I read states applicable to 'entering' on a O-A Visa from 31/10.

 

We won't know for sure how TI are applying this part of the order until after 31st Oct.

 

10 minutes ago, nrasmussen said:

Nowhere does it say say anything else - just pure speculation by people arguing otherwise.

Section 2.22 of Police orders deals specifically with the criteria for extensions based on retirement (not entry to Thailand). The fact that part of the order was amended strongly suggests 'extensions' from a Non O-A entry will be affected.

Again this will become clearer when we get reports from various IO's throughout the Country from members with O-A Visa types.

 

The only certainty, will be the uncertainty of how TI deal with it.

[Aforek]

3 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Where exactly in the order does it state only applicable to O-A Visa issued on or after 31/10.

The version I read states applicable to 'entering' on a O-A Visa from 31/10.

 

 

I have read the important passage for us in Thai and in English, they the same thing but they are not at the same place

first page of the Thai texte, yes it's said that people who ask for a first entry visa O-A need to have an insurance ( no reference of extension, so we think that if extension, no need of insurance ) from 31 th of october  BUT  and here, for me is the problem 

 

at the end of the text " ( 6) ", there is a sentence which says that " only for an alien , who has been granted Non immigrant Visa class O-A must buy a Thai health insurance online "

English is not my tongue language, but what does mean " has been granted visa O-A " ?; I understand everybody who has a O-A visa , independently  of the date; Jomtien understands the first page, it means no need of insurance, and others, like mine in Prachinburi ( I come back on friday to see this issue again ) understand the (6 ) text 

again, confusion, we are in Thailand

[Thaidream]

IMO- any reasonmable IO when reading this order would come to the conclusion that the insurance requirement applies only to an O-A Visa issued after 31 October 2019  and the key to determining this would be simply to look at the page in one's passport that states the type of Visa on received.. The Visa Class clearely shows on the Visa sticker and the  IO stemp upon entry- both places.

 

There is no steatement in the police order that indicates the order is retroactive baxk to any prior issued O-A Visa or extension. (All past police orders have never benn retroactive=  thus some older long stayers do NOT have to show income of 800K but 200K or 500K)   I have never heard of a 'law' change being retroactive.

 

The extension section was amended  simply because at some point an O-A holder will either get a new O-A or may decide an extension is needed. IMO when the  applicant goes to Immigration and the date on the O-A  is after 31 Oct 2019 the applicant needs the insurance for the extension.  

 

In addition- I cannot understand why an IO at an airport would have any ireason to check whether anyone has insurance-  The Embassy would not have issued the O-A without the insurance verification and if the  person entered on an extension of the O-A-  the insurance would have been checked by the  IO at Thai Immigration prior to getting the extension/

 

[KeeTua]

If it was not meant to be retroactive wording it like this would make sense:

Effective October 31, 2019 when an alien is granted Non-Immigrant Visa Class O-A from an overseas Royal Thai Embassy with the purpose of retirement (not exceeding 1 year), enters the Kingdom, an immigration officer shall abide by the following practices for permitting an alien to stay in the Kingdom...

 

From the actual order (notice the tense):

Therefore when an alien who has been granted a Non Immigrant class O-A Visa from an overseas Royal Thai Embassy with the purpose of retirement (not exceeding 1 year) enters the Kingdom, an Immigration officer shall abide by the following practices for permitting an alien to stay in the Kingdom, effective from October 31st, 2019 onwards.

 

I think that would require a grace period before they start enforcing it on entry.

 

We will know soon enough.

[Sheryl]

IMO- any reasonmable IO when reading this order would come to the conclusion that the insurance requirement applies only to an O-A Visa issued after 31 October 2019  and the key to determining this would be simply to look at the page in one's passport that states the type of Visa on received.. The Visa Class clearely shows on the Visa sticker and the  IO stemp upon entry- both places.
 
There is no steatement in the police order that indicates the order is retroactive baxk to any prior issued O-A Visa or extension. (All past police orders have never benn retroactive=  thus some older long stayers do NOT have to show income of 800K but 200K or 500K)   I have never heard of a 'law' change being retroactive.
 
The extension section was amended  simply because at some point an O-A holder will either get a new O-A or may decide an extension is needed. IMO when the  applicant goes to Immigration and the date on the O-A  is after 31 Oct 2019 the applicant needs the insurance for the extension.  
 
In addition- I cannot understand why an IO at an airport would have any ireason to check whether anyone has insurance-  The Embassy would not have issued the O-A without the insurance verification and if the  person entered on an extension of the O-A-  the insurance would have been checked by the  IO at Thai Immigration prior to getting the extension/
 

But people on an OA visa can make additional entries and many do right near the visa expiration so as to get an additional year out of it.

At that point the policy checked by the Embassy will be expired or near expiration and in order to get a second year people will have to have renewed their policy and show proof of same on entry.

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[nrasmussen]

Where exactly in the order does it state only applicable to O-A Visa issued on or after 31/10.
The version I read states applicable to 'entering' on a O-A Visa from 31/10.
We won't know for sure how TI are applying this part of the order until after 31st Oct.

Section 2.22 of Police orders deals specifically with the criteria for extensions based on retirement (not entry to Thailand). The fact that part of the order was amended strongly suggests 'extensions' from a Non O-A entry will be affected.
Again this will become clearer when we get reports from various IO's throughout the Country from members with O-A Visa types.
 
The only certainty, will be the uncertainty of how TI deal with it.

To answer your first question: That can be inferred from the fact that only visas issued from that date and onwards will have remarks made by the issuing embassy regarding insurance.

Your second comment is just speculation.

[nrasmussen]

IMO- any reasonmable IO when reading this order would come to the conclusion that the insurance requirement applies only to an O-A Visa issued after 31 October 2019  and the key to determining this would be simply to look at the page in one's passport that states the type of Visa on received.. The Visa Class clearely shows on the Visa sticker and the  IO stemp upon entry- both places.
 
There is no steatement in the police order that indicates the order is retroactive baxk to any prior issued O-A Visa or extension. (All past police orders have never benn retroactive=  thus some older long stayers do NOT have to show income of 800K but 200K or 500K)   I have never heard of a 'law' change being retroactive.
 
The extension section was amended  simply because at some point an O-A holder will either get a new O-A or may decide an extension is needed. IMO when the  applicant goes to Immigration and the date on the O-A  is after 31 Oct 2019 the applicant needs the insurance for the extension.  
 
In addition- I cannot understand why an IO at an airport would have any ireason to check whether anyone has insurance-  The Embassy would not have issued the O-A without the insurance verification and if the  person entered on an extension of the O-A-  the insurance would have been checked by the  IO at Thai Immigration prior to getting the extension/
 

To answer your last comment: They can only grant permission to stay until the end of the insurance coverage which may be less than a year from entry.

[theoldgit]

Troll post removed

[GRS]

I’m retired military 21 years in service and a 100% disabled veteran myself I called TRICARE on Friday and it’s actually not all that hard after all to get the medical certificate. You just call OCONUS TRICARE NOT the Embassy. Make sure you are enrolled in FMP. If anyone has questions OCONUS TRICARE’s information is right here:

https://tricare.mil/ContactUs/CallUs/OverseasResources

I’m on a NON-O anyway so I could care less. But yeah it would be nice if the Embassy would coordinate this with TRICARE and VA for us as they did with the International Direct Deposit Program which is great by the way from the VA. But just so you know the phone number for OCONUS TRICARE Pacific is in the attached weblike above I called and checked on ours last Friday and we’re good, although I’m not really very concerned about this because I’m on a NON-O extension I have been for 5 years now. But this information could help other retired military veterans here like myself. If you are retired military as long as you are enrolled in FMP you are covered way above their standards and getting the coverage certificate is not that hard to do, hopefully the Embassy will eventually make it easier for those of you but it’s not needed for NON-OA extensions either regardless of what people are saying it isn’t. Good luck




Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, Thaidream said:

In addition- I cannot understand why an IO at an airport would have any ireason to check whether anyone has insurance-  The Embassy would not have issued the O-A without the insurance verification and if the  person entered on an extension of the O-A-  the insurance would have been checked by the  IO at Thai Immigration prior to getting the extension/

There are members of this forum who obtained their Non O-A prior to any announcement, but will enter on or after 31st October. They won't have any annotations on their Visas.

 

Where do they stand …… on thin ice at the moment.

[Pib]

22 minutes ago, GRS said:

I’m retired military 21 years in service and a 100% disabled veteran myself I called TRICARE on Friday and it’s actually not all that hard after all to get the medical certificate. You just call OCONUS TRICARE NOT the Embassy. Make sure you are enrolled in FMP. If anyone has questions OCONUS TRICARE’s information is right here:

https://tricare.mil/ContactUs/CallUs/OverseasResources

I’m on a NON-O anyway so I could care less. But yeah it would be nice if the Embassy would coordinate this with TRICARE and VA for us as they did with the International Direct Deposit Program which is great by the way from the VA. But just so you know the phone number for OCONUS TRICARE Pacific is in the attached weblike above I called and checked on ours last Friday and we’re good, although I’m not really very concerned about this because I’m on a NON-O extension I have been for 5 years now. But this information could help other retired military veterans here like myself. If you are retired military as long as you are enrolled in FMP you are covered way above their standards and getting the coverage certificate is not that hard to do, hopefully the Embassy will eventually make it easier for those of you but it’s not needed for NON-OA extensions either regardless of what people are saying it isn’t. Good luck
 

 

You can log onto Tricare or VA right now and get a letter saying your are enrolled in their medical coverage...but it just a letter saying such.  It does not provide any specifics on coverage like Bt400K inpatient and Bt40K outpatient.  Yes, I know the Tricare/VA/FMP coverage is basically unlimited but in order for that coverage to be accepted by immigration the insurance company (Tricare/VA/FMP in this case) would need to sign the special the form (at the link below) addressed to the Thailand Ministry of Public Health.  No insurance company, civilian or govt, is going to sign such a form. 

 

http://longstay.tgia.org/document/overseas_insurance_certificate.pdf

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

30 minutes ago, GRS said:

it’s not needed for NON-OA extensions either regardless of what people are saying it isn’t.

 

[Regarding required insurance] And your basis for knowing that is what exactly?

 

I ask because, the "people" who are saying OA-based retirement extensions of stay will be covered by the new insurance requirement include BKK CW Immigration and quite a few of the other Immigration offices around the country.

 

[Skallywag]

26 minutes ago, GRS said:

from the VA......... If you are retired military as long as you are enrolled in FMP you are covered way above their standards and getting the coverage certificate is not that hard to do,

There are no U.S. veteran hospitals in Thailand. 

So how is VA health insurance policy from the U.S. applicable to making sure you are insured for health problems while in Thailand?  Am not referring to disability related medical care in which you are reimbursed

VA Health Care for Expat Veterans

By Utley, January 24, 2017 in Health and Medicine

[Tanoshi]

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

But the key point for the coverage to be accepted by immigration is the requirement for the medical insurance coverage provider (i.e., Tricare/VA) to complete and sign the Thailand Ministry of Public Health letter--you are not going to get anyone in Tricare/VA to sign such a letter....not going to happen.  And the Thai govt knows this, but it allows them to say "Well, if you could get the letter signed....."

 

That also only works for the initial entry on an O-A Visa.

For further entries/extensions the Insurance must be provided by one of their list of 'approved' Thai Insurers.

 

It makes no difference what the hospitals will accept, it's what TI will accept.