Mandatory Insurance: will it work?

[Mitkof Island]

On 11/27/2019 at 10:31 PM, Chazar said:

I went to Hua  Hin hospital recently and was  asked to pay ONLY after they had done the work,  no mention of prepayment.

Same with myself.

[HuskerDo]

At what age do they no longer offer this insurance? 70? 75? If so, how can a foreigner expect to continue living there if  they "require" insurance yet it's not offered if you are above the age limit?

[Bogbrush]

Up to 99 years with Pacific Cross.

[HuskerDo]

3 hours ago, Bogbrush said:

I’ll post this advice again as it might not have been picked up by all concerned a few weeks ago:

 

If you are on an OA and aged 65/70 years old, then:

 

A.   Keep your current insurance

B.   Take out Pacific Cross Maxima Plus policy at 57 000 baht

C.   Opt for 50% excess (300 000 baht)

D.   Pay premium of roughly 25 000 baht.

E.   Enjoy 10% discount for no claims for 2 years, and 20% thereafter.
F.   Rest assured you can be covered until 99 years old.

 

If you’re on an OA you already have 800 000 baht committed; what’s another 25 000 baht?

 

So, please; scare stories about premiums being 400 000 baht aren’t really helpful?

 

Thanks Bog. I posted a question related to the age limit before I saw your post. 

 

Question.... do you have a link to the cost structure for someone over 70? Their website states you can retain coverage up to age 99 yet the rates stop at age 65.

Edited November 29, 2019 by HuskerDo

[DaRoadrunner]

1 hour ago, emptypockets said:

Calm down and take a couple of deep breaths. The insurance issue is only pertinent to a small amount of expats and no tourists at all.

I bet you, the way this Govt is turning the screws down tight on everything, compulsory health insurance for all is coming. And they have the nerve to tell us we must only buy from an approved Thai insurance company that overcharges for poor quality cover.

 

Thailand continues to shoot itself in the foot.... yet I see this country has no insurance for itself!

Edited November 29, 2019 by DaRoadrunner

[Suradit69]

On 11/28/2019 at 1:31 PM, Chazar said:

I went to Hua  Hin hospital recently and was  asked to pay ONLY after they had done the work,  no mention of prepayment.

Yes, I visit Bangkok Pattaya Hospital once or twice a month and have never been charged until after being seen by a doctor ... usually the same doctor in their eye clinic.

 

One time  had abdominal surgery. I was informed of the probable total cost ahead of time and signed that document, but settled the bill after my stay in hospital. No demand for proof of insurance or anything of that sort.

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, DaRoadrunner said:

And they have the nerve to tell us we must only buy from an approved Thai insurance company

I believe at least Aetna and Pacific Cross are international insurers. 

 

I agree the policies are of dubious worth and if you're first signing up in your 70's are going to be overly expensive.

 

The big problem is that no one here, especially at immigrations or the hospitals, is able to sort through all the different foreign insurance documents that farang may have.

 

Most US military veterans have quite comprehensive insurance, but don't know if the US embassy has yet to get that accepted for immigrations purposes.

[MadMuhammad]

Self insuring expecting a 40-50K bill. I went through 30K on my Kor Ror Bro just having my lacerated finger cleaned and rebandaged daily over a couple of weeks. I also spent just over 6 days in a ward on an IV with antibiotics, no specialist care just vitals checks twice a day, with pneumonia. That bill? Just shy of 200K. 
So many say they’ll self insure but unless you have 3-5mil sitting in a seperate account you are most definitely covered for ‘disaster’ IMO

[Chazar]

12 hours ago, Bogbrush said:

I’ll post this advice again as it might not have been picked up by all concerned a few weeks ago:

 

If you are on an OA and aged 65/70 years old, then:

 

A.   Keep your current insurance

B.   Take out Pacific Cross Maxima Plus policy at 57 000 baht

C.   Opt for 50% excess (300 000 baht)

D.   Pay premium of roughly 25 000 baht.

E.   Enjoy 10% discount for no claims for 2 years, and 20% thereafter.
F.   Rest assured you can be covered until 99 years old.

 

If you’re on an OA you already have 800 000 baht committed; what’s another 25 000 baht?

 

So, please; scare stories about premiums being 400 000 baht aren’t really helpful?

 

Theyll  plug  that  loophoole  soon enough

[Chazar]

12 hours ago, Ireland32 said:

We’re you escorted to cashier

Nope  not  at  at all my staff went and paid  them, there was in no way anyone  following me around to make sure I did a  runner....................mind  you I had  cut my leg so  running wasnt so easy.

[Chazar]

9 hours ago, DaRoadrunner said:

Thailand continues to shoot itself in the foot.... yet I see this country has no insurance for itself!

risk too high!

[Chazar]

10 hours ago, gerry1953 said:

on the retirement crowd

I started on a Non O  Marriage never used retirement but am 56 but  havent worked for years.

[pookondee]

15 hours ago, pennine said:

And you don't even mention those who are over 75 and cannot get the insuance anyway.

 

There's been talk of it throughout the thread. 

Mainly that they will need to start some sort of 'tribunal' to look into these sorts of exceptions.

It was mentioned, if the Thai authorities do nothing, and there is no other option for these people than to be forced out (and estranged from partners)

its really starting to sound like a human rights abuse IMO.

[NoshowJones]

15 hours ago, possum1931 said:

What regard for human rights does Thailand have anyway?

Sorry Pookondee. Thailand would never disregard anyones human rights, would they?

[Letseng]

16 hours ago, DaRoadrunner said:

You have to buy one of the policies approved by the Thais. It is a rip off.

Provided they even want your business.

[pookondee]

6 hours ago, Letseng said:

Provided they even want your business.

Why wouldn't they want your business?

It will be virtually free yearly money for them in many cases.

 

They can ultimately set whatever conditions they choose, knowing people will be forced to pay up to get their extensions of stay renewed.

 

Reportedly charging older folks upwards of 200k upfront for max 400k cover..

5555

Its like the worst gambling stake you ever took on!

 

And of course there will be exclusions 

and the denied claims on whatever clauses they can come up with.

 

Which leads to another issue..

 

If you make a claim a few months into the policy, what's to stop them simply saying they dont cover those sorts of expenses in the first year.??

 

who you gonna call??

the government?? lol

who would even give a khrap??

 

 

 

[gamini]

On 11/28/2019 at 4:43 PM, BritManToo said:

Both amounts set by the Thai government, nothing to do with the insurance companies.

Designed as a scam by the government right from the start to line the pockets of their pals owning insurance companies.

What nonsense. If you go to a government hospital 400k is totally adequate for almost any procedure.

I have just had an operation at a govenment hospital for 80k. Same procedure at a private bospital is 1.6 million. 

[KKr]

On 11/29/2019 at 5:21 PM, Bogbrush said:

I’ll post this advice again as it might not have been picked up by all concerned a few weeks ago:

 

If you are on an OA and aged 65/70 years old, then:

 

A.   Keep your current insurance

B.   Take out Pacific Cross Maxima Plus policy at 57 000 baht

C.   Opt for 50% excess (300 000 baht)

D.   Pay premium of roughly 25 000 baht.

E.   Enjoy 10% discount for no claims for 2 years, and 20% thereafter.
F.   Rest assured you can be covered until 99 years old.

 

If you’re on an OA you already have 800 000 baht committed; what’s another 25 000 baht?

 

So, please; scare stories about premiums being 400 000 baht aren’t really helpful?

 

Another issue is that, by being double insured, the premier risk of the overseas insurance (similar to other posters cover well over a million $ no exclusions) takes into account the cover received from the local insurance.
so, as I understand it, and please correct me if I am wrong, one would have to pay a local premium, and in case of a major claim, would pay TWO premier risks. 
Sounds like a no-brainer this double insurance situation. (pun intended)

[oldcpu]

On 11/29/2019 at 7:51 PM, Tounge Thaied said:

Have you considered getting this form (link below) filled out. My understanding is this form only needs to "director" names printed on the bottom, and one signature from the any company representative. My understanding is, the IO for the OA should accept this form to satisfy the your insurance.

https://longstay.tgia.org/document/overseas_insurance_certificate.pdf

I am on a type OA (issued in March-2019 and valid to March-2020) and I entered Thailand in May-2019.   My insurance is Cigna International, and provides health coverage far exceeding that of the 400k/40k Thai requirement.   I have sent that form to Cigna International, and I am waiting to see if they return it to me signed/stamped ...

 

I have been searching this forum to see if anyone on a Type-OA has been successful using that form (properly filled in) in lieu of the 'recommended Thai government list of approved insurance' companies'. 

 

I have yet to find a single example of one using the completed "Foreign Insurance Certificate" properly filled in (when proof of health insurance was deemed necessary by an IO), and having it accepted or refused.

 

It would be good to read of a positive experience where such a form has been filled in.

.

Edited December 1, 2019 by oldcpu

[ukrules]

On 11/28/2019 at 2:34 PM, Sheryl said:

The highest I have seen is over 400,000 baht for age 85. (yes - premium 400k for 400/40 in cover. Completely unbeleivable).

That's proof positive that it's a scam cooked up by the insurance industry with their cronies in central government.

[Sheryl]

On 11/29/2019 at 5:21 PM, Bogbrush said:

I’ll post this advice again as it might not have been picked up by all concerned a few weeks ago:

 

If you are on an OA and aged 65/70 years old, then:

 

A.   Keep your current insurance

B.   Take out Pacific Cross Maxima Plus policy at 57 000 baht

C.   Opt for 50% excess (300 000 baht)

D.   Pay premium of roughly 25 000 baht.

E.   Enjoy 10% discount for no claims for 2 years, and 20% thereafter.
F.   Rest assured you can be covered until 99 years old.

 

If you’re on an OA you already have 800 000 baht committed; what’s another 25 000 baht?

 

So, please; scare stories about premiums being 400 000 baht aren’t really helpful?

 

I think yoy mean Standatd Extra. Maxima Plus plan is much more than that. Even at age 61 it is over 91k (45,500 with the maximum deductible).

 

Standard extra with maximum deductible of 300 k is 28,500 for someone 66-70

 Rising to 35,000 at age 1 and over 83,000 at age 81 (todays prices; there will be inflationary increases so actial will be more.) And this assumes no claims.

 

[ukrules]

1 hour ago, oldcpu said:

I have yet to find a single example of one using the completed "Foreign Insurance Certificate" properly filled in (when proof of health insurance was deemed necessary by an IO), and having it accepted or refused.

There have been a couple of reports of people getting this certificate signed, maybe from a German insurance company but I'm not 100% sure on that.

 

I believe this was for the first year, it will be interesting to find out if this foreign certificate is acceptable when it's time to extend the visa after the first year of insurance and while inside the country.

 

The Thai government should make some changes to this scheme, many people have excellent insurance with foreign insurance companies which offers far more cover than you're going to get with any mainstream local policy.

 

The foreign insurance giants will not be happy with this development, it's anti competitive and I suspect it may even be illegal. If someone were to look into global trade and competition laws I'm going to be surprised if this doesn't fall foul of some of the WTO regulations.

 

I read somewhere else that the British and US embassies have already been speaking to the Thai government about this 'no foreign policies' problem.

 

[oldcpu]

54 minutes ago, ukrules said:

The Thai government should make some changes to this scheme, many people have excellent insurance with foreign insurance companies which offers far more cover than you're going to get with any mainstream local policy.

I hope that will be the case ... ie hoping Thailand will allow foreign health insurance (that can be proven to exceed the Thai health insurance requirements) for type-OA.

 

My health Insurance comes with my pension plan, hence I have this insurance for life (I am currently age-65).  Having health insurance assured for life is a major factor.  As part of my pension, my health insurance is subsidized (with subsidy increasing as I go older such that my payments do not increase).  For me it is cheaper than my going on my own to get Thai health insurance.  

 

Plus, given its coverage is excellent,  it means my health insurance will subsidize my going to the most expensive Thailand hospitals, and hence help to support those Thailand hospitals and Thai expensive/quality medical services ... and hence helping Thailand.    I think that with only a minimal 400K/40K health insurance coverage (that would cost me more money than my current subsidized insurance), I likely would not be supporting the more expensive Thailand hospitals.

[HuskerDo]

2 hours ago, Sheryl said:

I think yoy mean Standatd Extra. Maxima Plus plan is much more than that. Even at age 61 it is over 91k (45,500 with the maximum deductible).

 

Standard extra with maximum deductible of 300 k is 28,500 for someone 66-70

 Rising to 35,000 at age 1 and over 83,000 at age 81 (todays prices; there will be inflationary increases so actial will be more.) And this assumes no claims.

 

Sheryl - Do you have a link to the Pacific Cross price chart for age 70 and up?

 

[gamini]

A friend of mine wants to spend his last few years in Thailand. He wants to enjoy the nice climate. He is in good health and 86 years old. He has the 800 K to put in a Thai bank. Please can anyone advise me on this forum how and where he can get the necessary health insurance required for new retirement visas.

[Tounge Thaied]

7 hours ago, gamini said:

A friend of mine wants to spend his last few years in Thailand. He wants to enjoy the nice climate. He is in good health and 86 years old. He has the 800 K to put in a Thai bank. Please can anyone advise me on this forum how and where he can get the necessary health insurance required for new retirement visas.

At that age, getting coverage will not be easy. Try getting in touch with the company here in this video. 
 

 

[pookondee]

On 11/30/2019 at 9:54 PM, gamini said:

What nonsense. If you go to a government hospital 400k is totally adequate for almost any procedure.

I have just had an operation at a govenment hospital for 80k. Same procedure at a private bospital is 1.6 million. 

But Isn't insurance supposed to be for bills you CANT pay?

My thoughts are why throw away 50k+ every year for cover that doesn't even cover you for a major disaster? 

 

For the worst case i expect to be insured for millions, in case of some freak illness/accident.

But for this useless Thai insurance i have to pay for anything over 400k and give them 50k per year for the pleasure.

 

This is a SCAM plain and simple!!

 

And to think we hear people contemplating putting a 300k deductable on a 400k max plan to reduce the cost!!

how absolutely ridiculous is that?

 

If you are allowing yourself to be scammed like this 

(for what might be 10-15 years retirement time)

then i strongly urge look at the Elite visa!

 

It may not be better in some cases, but if you are 80 y.o and the insurance premium is 200k+ a year it will certainly be cheaper.

and you have the satisfaction of not giving it to these insurance xxxxxx's

 

Actually if you think about it, its probably just better to leave this country and all the headaches behind FULL STOP

!!!

 

Edited December 6, 2019 by pookondee

[tingtongtourist]

On 12/5/2019 at 1:44 PM, gamini said:

A friend of mine wants to spend his last few years in Thailand. He wants to enjoy the nice climate. He is in good health and 86 years old. He has the 800 K to put in a Thai bank. Please can anyone advise me on this forum how and where he can get the necessary health insurance required for new retirement visas.

If have 800k in Thai bank no need for insurance get the Non-O base on retiremnt better to be done from inside Thailand.

Just he come in on short tourist visa and arrange later.

 

If to get O-A visa first from home country is trouble because reports is they rejecting the foriegn insurance and now seems the mess still havent been sorted.

 

Actually for long term at that age 86

many people reccomended Elite visa.

 

It is expensive but at age 86 he might even be force to pay 200k baht a year for the throw away Thai insurance anyway which as they say above, only covers 400k which make no sense to me.

 

But Elite visa, no insurance, no problem at all can come and go at will which is good.

 

I did have plan to do this also but like many others i will now plan for another country if i am forced to buy insurance.

 

A budget for a unknown time of life remaining is difficult and to throw away 100+ baht per year, every year

its just out of the question for

me.

 

Is a even worse deal if to healthy and live to long will probably have to pay 300k per year for 400k cover!!

Edited December 9, 2019 by tingtongtourist

[Tounge Thaied]

THAI OA VISA insurances Matrix...

ThaiOAvisaInsurances.xlsx