Good time to buy or wait?

[khunPer]

On 6/10/2020 at 12:24 PM, DrJack54 said:

So my question is buy now or hold off till later?

Might well be depending of area. If in a turist-area wait some month, maybe half a year. But as @worgeordie wisely said, don't stop looking...????

[DrJack54]

6 minutes ago, khunPer said:

Might well be depending of area. If in a turist-area wait some month, maybe half a year. But as @worgeordie wisely said, don't stop looking...????

Thanks for advice. Mean that.

One of the problems is that "the area" is too flexible from my side. 

Here is my thinking....The Thai partner will (I think) always wish to be central.

Currently we Phra Ram 9. Perfect. Love it.

In few years I'm thinking over condo life and might like see out the end game in detached condo or even home in sticks.

[Tomahawk21]

On 6/11/2020 at 5:18 AM, mr mr said:

no advice just a simple offer.

 

just give me the money i'll kick you in the balls and you'll feel the same as you will when you get punked.

maybe the guy knows this lady well and she will not and does not want to rip him off , there not all the same.

[Lacessit]

13 hours ago, madmen said:

"Disclaimer: Investments made through a P2P lending platform are not protected and are subject to risks including credit risk (defaults) and liquidity risk. These investments are not subject to review by theAustralian Financial Complaints Authority."

 

good luck with that.

Quite correct. My luck seems to be holding up quite well after 5 years.

Maximum single investment is $500. It's called risk spreading.

[peter harrison]

the aus dollar is best its been for a long time but the next month or so might get a little better and house prices are down so tread lightly take your time

 

 

 

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, Tomahawk21 said:

maybe the guy knows this lady well and she will not and does not want to rip him off , there not all the same.

Yeah, they are.

[robertson468]

19 hours ago, kenk24 said:

I think the reason that some of the information is vague is that unlike most Western places, it is rare that an agent is given an exclusive. 

 

It has been a buyer's market for a long time and often that has merely meant that there were a lot of properties on the market, not so much a compromise or a meeting of a real market price. Until the owner wants to drop the price to a reasonable point, it likely will not sell, but I have seen when people do drop the price, it sells quickly... so, you are of course best to take the time and learn the market in the area you want to buy... 

 

Also, since this is pretty much a gift - get some feedback from the lady... not everyone wants to be a landlord.. it can be a real pain. If you are not planning on living there, there might be better investments, like gold or vacant land... land appreciates, buildings depreciate... 

 

I have a lot of experience w/these types of investment/gifts... mostly at first we bought farmland for the family to make a living... though we recently bought a nice home that had been reduced in price about 35%... when the owner needs to sell, it becomes a different game...

 

if you need any further info, you can PM. - - glad to help if I can. 

If you are buying to rent, please remember the three golden rules - location, location, location.  Good luck!

[1FinickyOne]

2 minutes ago, robertson468 said:

If you are buying to rent, please remember the three golden rules - location, location, location.  Good luck!

Thanks but I am not really buying/nor buying to rent... 

[CanadaSam]

I'm guessing these days you have ample time on your hands?

 

Build a home for her, but please do not use any standard designs.

 

Do exactly what you feel would make both of you happy, put in things like electric gates, Jacuzzi in a corner of the living room, perhaps near the bbq sundeck, walk in closets, do whatever you feel like!

 

4 million is doable in the countryside, with all the features you like.  You will thank yourself in years to come..... 

[HashBrownHarry]

On 6/10/2020 at 10:43 PM, Mama Noodle said:

Its been my experience that finding a 'deal' on a property is a matter of finding someone desperate, which is rare, and thais whether it be land, homes, or condos will just ask for a high price and hold it for 10 years if they have to in order to get it. 

One would think they're should be a lot of desperate people about in the coming months, i'd wait another 6-12 months.

 

Bargain hard, as someone has mentioned 50% of asking price is what i'd offer.

[unblocktheplanet]

I do suggest that it is pretty easy to take advantage of a detached house owned by an absentee. There's some security in a gated community and very minor fees for street sweeping, lights, guardhouse. They're a lot more resistant to rascality.

[Mama Noodle]

3 hours ago, HashBrownHarry said:

Bargain hard, as someone has mentioned 50% of asking price is what i'd offer.

I think even a desperate person would likely take that as an insult. 

[HashBrownHarry]

8 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

I think even a desperate person would likely take that as an insult. 

If you're not embarrased by your initial offer then it's too low.

[wordchild]

16 minutes ago, HashBrownHarry said:

If you're not embarrased by your initial offer then it's too low.

Wrong way around, for this market.
If, as a buyer, you are not embarrassed by your offer it is, very likely , too high!

To paraphrase, The lights have gone out all over Bangkok, they will not come on again during our lifetime.

Edited June 12, 2020 by wordchild

[Airalee]

17 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

I think even a desperate person would likely take that as an insult. 

Agreed...even though some owners ask crazy prices, where 50% off would actually be a fair value (thinking about the ฿250k+/sqm 1BR condos), those units are better off just left on the shelf with the owners living in their fantasy land.  Some people price their units more realistically and 20-25% below asking price would be more reasonable (all things considered).

[blackcab]

@DrJack54

 

The problem with timing the market is that many, many properties here have large mortgages or other encumbrances secured on them. The property simply cannot be sold cheaply because the debt must be paid off in full prior to the sale being allowed by the Land Office.

 

If you find unencumbered land/property then there is a very high likelihood that you will be dealing with someone that does not need to sell at a discount.

 

One point to consider is that whatever you buy, your partner should transfer her house registration to that property. Doing this will exempt her from the new land and building tax as it will be classed as her primary residence.

 

Personally, I also would steer clear of condos and gated communities. There is something rather nice about owning a property and not having to pay monthly service fees.

 

Only buy chanote title (Nor Sor 4). There are too many issues that can come and bite you with lesser titles. It's just not worth it unless you are an experienced property agent who can realistically assess the risk.

 

Do not ever be rushed into buying. There are so many deals that appear time limited. In reality that is not the case. Even if it is the case, there will always be many other properties to buy.

 

My last piece of advice, as you well know, would be that if you are buying to rent then do not buy based on surface appearances. Buy a solid, convenient rental that will have the same tenant in for years. That way forward is a happy life and easy days.

 

Best of luck with your purchase, I like your way of thinking.

[scubascuba3]

On 6/13/2020 at 2:58 PM, blackcab said:

There is something rather nice about owning a property and not having to pay monthly service fees.

 

I agree about the monthly fees, yesterday i looked at a condo, it looked half run down, staff sitting about not doing much but the maintenance fee was pretty high at 2,000 baht a month, at least half must be spaffed up the wall.

 

A legalized con these common maintenance fees

[Mama Noodle]

21 minutes ago, Airalee said:

Agreed...even though some owners ask crazy prices, where 50% off would actually be a fair value (thinking about the ฿250k+/sqm 1BR condos), those units are better off just left on the shelf with the owners living in their fantasy land.  Some people price their units more realistically and 20-25% below asking price would be more reasonable (all things considered).

Yeah but consider the poster demographic on here. Experts on every subject and billionaires in their own minds. 

 

Seriously though walking around and spending all your time offering 50% to people selling property is going to net a person exactly zero properties and 100% of their time wasted.

 

Its safe to assume most people who are advertising property for sale are listing them near their asking price with room to negotiate. Nobody is going to take 50% and if a person actually owns the property they can take a loan out against the value and just not pay it back, forfeiting the chanote and that alone would probably net more than 50% back. 

 

It'll be hard for anyone to find a value without boots on the ground and spending alot of time in it, with cash in hand, because online websites are agents that get a fee, and if someone knows a person selling, they are going to upsell and get a fee too. 

 

And the markets are going to recover in the next couple of years in the short term anyway, so most people will be able to weather the storm, and those that can't, the desperate ones, will be rare and hard to find. 

[Mama Noodle]

On 6/10/2020 at 5:24 PM, DrJack54 said:

So my question is buy now or hold off till later?

 

Hold off a bit more but watch the news and keep looking. Anyone that depends on tourism and/or international economics will be watching too, and if it looks like things are going to open back up the owners are going to hold too. 

Your best bet is to scour the internet looking for desperate foreigners trying to offload and leave. Ive bought 2 properties like that for a nice profit but thats all timing and patience. 

[Airalee]

36 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

It'll be hard for anyone to find a value without boots on the ground and spending alot of time in it, with cash in hand, because online websites are agents that get a fee, and if someone knows a person selling, they are going to upsell and get a fee too.

I used an agent for my recent condo purchase and will be using him again in order to help my gf buy a condo too.  I can’t stress enough how important it is to have a good agent who can understand why you are offering what you are, but can also intelligently explain that to the seller.

 

My advice would be...

 

1.  Only use agents that are fluent in your language.  

2.  Find the condo you want (on your own) and are ready to make an offer on before contacting the agent.  Only use the agent to make the offer and write up the deal.  Don’t waste the agent’s time having them show you condo after condo after condo.  Be ready to close quickly.  

 

3.  Understand the market.  This means understanding the “value” of the condo based on realistic rental income (P/E ratio) and realistic opportunity costs.  For example....buying a unit at 450x rent is insane, but also thinking you will forever get 7% risk free return on your money is also wrong.  I have had many solid companies cut, or completely eliminate their dividends.  Capital gains on stocks can be quickly wiped out too and you can’t spend those anyways unless you are going to chip away at your portfolio.
 

4.  Relating to #3, understand when condos were initially sold during the real estate cycle and sometimes that means that certain projects, as much as one may like them, will be forever overpriced.

 

5.  If you’re buying as an investment (rental), only buy what you would live in yourself.  There are many units that truly aren’t worth living in for various reasons (location flaw, poor layout, blocked view,  etc.)

 

6.  ALWAYS be looking.  I’ve lived here for 8 years and only now bought.  I don’t feel like the money spent renting during that time was wasted.

 

7.  Only buy if you are committed to living in Thailand for the long term.
 

8.  Don’t be swayed by people here on Thaivisa that try to goad you into buying with emotionally charged statements such as “renting is throwing money away” or “you can’t afford to buy”.

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, Airalee said:

I used an agent for my recent condo purchase and will be using him again in order to help my gf buy a condo too.  I can’t stress enough how important it is to have a good agent who can understand why you are offering what you are, but can also intelligently explain that to the seller.

 

My advice would be...

 

1.  Only use agents that are fluent in your language.  

2.  Find the condo you want (on your own) and are ready to make an offer on before contacting the agent.  Only use the agent to make the offer and write up the deal.  Don’t waste the agent’s time having them show you condo after condo after condo.  Be ready to close quickly.  

 

3.  Understand the market.  This means understanding the “value” of the condo based on realistic rental income (P/E ratio) and realistic opportunity costs.  For example....buying a unit at 450x rent is insane, but also thinking you will forever get 7% risk free return on your money is also wrong.  I have had many solid companies cut, or completely eliminate their dividends.  Capital gains on stocks can be quickly wiped out too and you can’t spend those anyways unless you are going to chip away at your portfolio.
 

4.  Relating to #3, understand when condos were initially sold during the real estate cycle and sometimes that means that certain projects, as much as one may like them, will be forever overpriced.

 

5.  If you’re buying as an investment (rental), only buy what you would live in yourself.  There are many units that truly aren’t worth living in for various reasons (location flaw, poor layout, blocked view,  etc.)

 

6.  ALWAYS be looking.  I’ve lived here for 8 years and only now bought.  I don’t feel like the money spent renting during that time was wasted.

 

7.  Only buy if you are committed to living in Thailand for the long term.
 

8.  Don’t be swayed by people here on Thaivisa that try to goad you into buying with emotionally charged statements such as “renting is throwing money away” or “you can’t afford to buy”.

How much did your purchasing agent cost you? if a buyer knows the market and value of properties I'm not sure what hiring an agent adds?

[Airalee]

3 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

How much did your purchasing agent cost you? if a buyer knows the market and value of properties I'm not sure what hiring an agent adds?

He didn’t cost me anything (well...they all cost someone something) as they were the listing agent for the condo I bought.  The agency is also the one of the rare ones that doesn’t do the “mark up” BS that you usually see but gets 4% from the seller.  The value added for me is that he understood me and didn’t treat me like a moron like most other agents I have encountered throughout life.  I also “incentivized” him.

[toho]

On 6/10/2020 at 5:41 PM, bkk6060 said:

Who knows when and where in a non transparent RE market.  Although you are looking for a house, I just read today that there are over 100,000 condo properties for sale in Bangkok.   Pattaya has over 20,000.

So, look around and make some very low offers. I would start at 50% below asking price and negotiate from there.  Maybe have the seller carry back paper for 7 years at a low or zero interest rate that way not all your cash is immediately tied up in the place.

Definitely a buyers market so things are in your favor.

Good luck.

Nice try, but bid 50%? Ridiculous, so would show vultures like these the door with the message never to show their face again. Even if they would come back and offer 110%. 

[wordchild]

sometimes getting on the "right" side of an agent works. However, especially in Thailand, remember who/what they are working for; ie their sales com!

Edited June 18, 2020 by wordchild

[Airalee]

22 minutes ago, wordchild said:

sometimes getting on the "right" side of an agent works. However, especially in Thailand, remember who/what they are working for; ie their sales com!

Of course they are working for a commission.  But, after doing your own due diligence...who would you rather work with?...a straight shooting, educated “farang” agent who can field your questions intelligently, where you know that nothing is “lost in translation”...or a “pretty” Thai girl, who when asked direct questions, gives you that “deer in the headlights” look and has little more to say than “this condo is good price...you should buy...cannot discount”.