Meeting health insurance requirements for extending an O-A visa

[steven100]

On 7/6/2020 at 7:59 PM, Peter Denis said:

Since it is a MultipleEntry Visa, each time you exit Thailand and re-enter you will be stamped in by border-Immigration for the 1-year extension of stay that Non Imm O-A Visa entitles you to.

So by exiting Thailand and returning just before your Visa validity expires (mid Oct 2020), you will be able to squeeze a full 2nd year permission to stay out of that Non Imm O-A Visa.

does this also apply to a Non Imm O  based on retirement.  ?

Is it possible to get another 1-year stamped.  Visa expires Aug 6. 

or do i need to do the extension at immigration. 

thx.

 

[Peter Denis]

5 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

LMG is not offering the USD100K Covid insurance for people over 60....

Luma does, waiting for a response from Pacific....

Any other suggestions?

This thread is not about covid-19 insurance, but about the thai IO-approved health-insurance needed to apply for the 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

I did PM you the LMG Insurance Plan 1 info, so just delete it when not relevant for you.

 

As far as I know LUMA is an insurance broker.  Nothing wrong with that, but they are your 'middle-man' to the actual insurer.

> For those interested in the Non Imm O-A compliant LMG Insurance policy, better to contact LMG directly instead of using LUMA as an intermediary. 

[Peter Denis]

10 minutes ago, steven100 said:

does this also apply to a Non Imm O  based on retirement.  ?

Is it possible to get another 1-year stamped.  Visa expires 

No it does not.

A Non Imm O Visa will only provide you with a 90-day permission to stay on entry.

You can apply for a 1-year extension of that Non Imm O Visa at your local IO, which will provide you with a 1-year permission to stay.  However, that permission to stay is not MultipleEntry and needs to be protected by a Re-Entry permit when exiting Thailand to keep the permission to stay alive on re-entry.

[oldtrafford]

Hi Peter....thank you so much for your clear and comprehensive information....very much appreciated.

I am sure that it will help me when it is time for me to decide what option to take, but I suspect that a renewal of my OA based on MARRIAGE will be the best path for me.

As I mentioned earlier, I was not aware that this was possible.....but I think I will visit my local IO prior to make sure that they are aware also  ????

I really think that we expats should have some 'formal collective' here in Thailand to assist and to represent us when needed....you'd make a good president..!!!  ???? 

Thanks again for your help....hope that I can repay in some way later....

Cheers

[sqwakvfr]

Health Insurance for the Non Imm OA(application and subsequent extensions) have a minimum coverage of 400,000 IPD and 40,000 IPD.

 

The new mandatory insurance(not sure if it has to be health or travel insurance) has a minimum coverage amount of $100,000 USD or approximately 3.1 million baht.  

 

Just because one has the mandatory OA Health Insurance does not mean he or she meets the insurance requirement for the COE(Certificate of Entry).  My current Health Insurance from Pacific Cross does not meet the COE requirement.  Therefore my trip out of LOS will be One Way.  

[Peter Denis]

4 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

Health Insurance for the Non Imm OA(application and subsequent extensions) have a minimum coverage of 400,000 IPD and 40,000 IPD.

 

The new mandatory insurance(not sure if it has to be health or travel insurance) has a minimum coverage amount of $100,000 USD or approximately 3.1 million baht.  

 

Just because one has the mandatory OA Health Insurance does not mean he or she meets the insurance requirement for the COE(Certificate of Entry).  My current Health Insurance from Pacific Cross does not meet the COE requirement.  Therefore my trip out of LOS will be One Way.  

When needing a health-insurance policy to meet the IO requirements when applying for the 1-year extension based on your Non Imm O-A Visa (for reason of retirement),

IO ONLY accepts:

- Thai IO-approved policies, and not all policies issued by thai insurers have such approval (even if they meet the 400K/40K in-patient/out-patient coverage requirement);

- Policies issued by TGIA-associated insurers (e.g. Regency for Expats issues a Non Imm O-A compliant policy which can be used when applying for the Non Imm O-A Visa in your home-country, but as RfE is not on the list of TGIA-insurers that policy is not accepted by IO).

 

Most of those thai IO-approved insurance policies have been specifically created to meet the IO-requirements for Non Imm O-A extension purposes.

It is therefore obvious that these policies will not meet the 100.000 US $ insurance covid-19 coverage requirement presently required for those specific categories of people that want to re-enter Thailand.

And conversely those policies that meet that 100.000 US $ insurance covid-19 coverage requirement, will NOT meet the very restrictive requirements of the IO-approved Non Imm O-A compliant policies.

 

Two very different animals, and created for completely different purposes.

[sqwakvfr]

Mr. Denis everything you said is true but in my case and this maybe true of many currently who hold a Non Imm OA and have the required TGIA approved health insurance and are waiting to return to Thailand(or are planning to leave and return) then they might have to purchase an additional policy.  I checked with several Thai Embassies and Consulates and the specific wording to complete the COE(Certificate Of Entry) states “Health Insurance”.  

 

Therefore, if appears a second Health Insurance Policy could be required or upgrade one’s TGIA Health Insurance to meet the $100.,000 USD requirement.  This would in my case double my annual Pacific Cross Premium.  I am just saying to those who are in this predicament to carefully consider everything before making any purchase.  If one has no need to leave Thailand and return then any TGIA approved policy will be suitable.  

[Peter Denis]

9 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

...in my case and this maybe true of many currently who hold a Non Imm OA and have the required TGIA approved health insurance and are waiting to return to Thailand(or are planning to leave and return) then they might have to purchase an additional policy.  I checked with several Thai Embassies and Consulates and the specific wording to complete the COE(Certificate Of Entry) states “Health Insurance”. 

When you need to meet the requirements of either of these specific policies (Non Imm O-A compliant and/or covid-19 coverage), just go for separate policies and take the cheapest option possible.

Re covid-19 coverage > If not already covered in an existing health-insurance policy which you have, it will most probably be more expensive to 'upgrade' that existing policy to meet the covid-19 requirement than simply subscribing to an additional policy specifically created for covid-19 coverage.

[ubonjoe]

2 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

And conversely those policies that meet that 100.000 US $ insurance covid-19 coverage requirement, will NOT meet the very restrictive requirements of the IO-approved Non Imm O-A compliant policies.

Not sure that is correct. If the insurance meets the $100k for covid that would be higher than the inpatient care and the Pacific Cross policy can have outpatient care that meets the 40k baht requirement. 

[JimGant]

On 7/7/2020 at 8:58 AM, Peter Denis said:

Thanks for sharing this useful checklist/reminder!

I will insert a slightly amended version of your checklist in the (next update of the) comprehensive Guideline Document I compiled to apply for a Non Imm O retirement Visa and subsequent 1-year extension.

The amendments to your document will consist of

Peter (Thaivisa staff), why can't your excellent articles just be pinned to this forum? They're way ahead of the many "dead" articles than lanquish at the top of this forum, needing updating years ago. Your advice, packaged as it is, is superior. I've PMed you several times for the info -- but I feel having to PM you time after time per every update is nonsensical. So, why not pin your articles?

 

I'm sure you have your reasons. And, the current guru, UbonJoe, also must feel frustrated from posting the same answers -- to questions best answered in a pinned listing. But, it sure would allow new -- and old hands on this forum -- to cut to the quick, without having to peruse all the new, and related, threads.

[HAPPYNUFF]

Thanks for all the info Peter Dennis..  My OA  extension is due  mid August. As I am 79 years of age,  I cant get  any insurance. as  we all realise Icant do a border run to change to an O visa, my alternatives at this time appears only to return to Perth, Australia, for which Qatar airlines are offering me a ticket at just over A$6000 one way, BKK/Qatar/Perth,  while Cathay is  m ore generous at A$ 5760 one way, BKK/Hk/Pth...  Can you suggest someway I can   get around this.. I am looking at agents, but with no insurance, who knows..

[HAPPYNUFF]

Re My original entry on Page 3, and Peter Dennis:s  response same page.. This AM , with my wife, off to Immigration armed with every conceivable document, and a full wallet. On explaining my problem to the  Immigration girl at the counter, and a male officer who joined in, I got the VERY STRONG impression allowances WERE being made for those too old,  (not sick) to obtain Insurance, and Yes, I could alter my OA Retirement to OA Family, but need to make appointment, Poo Yai Bahn to  verify  residency, marriage etc.  My wife started talking. I was told to go outside and wait. Later called in after wife spoke to someone (higher up the ladder)  The long and short of it, a  brown envelop was passed, everything was fixed, showed bank book, signed papers, photos taken, marriage  certificates copied, wifes ID and house papers  copied. I left with a OA Retirement, same as b4, advised when  virus clears, leave Thai and get O Visa.  Peter Dennis, dont know where/who you are, should I ever meet you, and you imbibe, its on me, as long as you want, and I dont mean Chang or Lao Khao.

[Sheryl]

On 7/7/2020 at 1:53 PM, HAPPYNUFF said:

Thanks for all the info Peter Dennis..  My OA  extension is due  mid August. As I am 79 years of age,  I cant get  any insurance. as  we all realise Icant do a border run to change to an O visa, my alternatives at this time appears only to return to Perth, Australia, for which Qatar airlines are offering me a ticket at just over A$6000 one way, BKK/Qatar/Perth,  while Cathay is  m ore generous at A$ 5760 one way, BKK/Hk/Pth...  Can you suggest someway I can   get around this.. I am looking at agents, but with no insurance, who knows..

I have had reports of people succeeding through an agent. Since once in Oz you will not be able to return soon-- or possibly for a long time -- I would try that route first. 

[Peter Denis]

36 minutes ago, HAPPYNUFF said:

Re My original entry on Page 3, and Peter Dennis:s  response same page.. This AM , with my wife, off to Immigration armed with every conceivable document, and a full wallet. On explaining my problem to the  Immigration girl at the counter, and a male officer who joined in, I got the VERY STRONG impression allowances WERE being made for those too old,  (not sick) to obtain Insurance, and Yes, I could alter my OA Retirement to OA Family, but need to make appointment, Poo Yai Bahn to  verify  residency, marriage etc.  My wife started talking. I was told to go outside and wait. Later called in after wife spoke to someone (higher up the ladder)  The long and short of it, a  brown envelop was passed, everything was fixed, showed bank book, signed papers, photos taken, marriage  certificates copied, wifes ID and house papers  copied. I left with a OA Retirement, same as b4, advised when  virus clears, leave Thai and get O Visa.  Peter Dennis, dont know where/who you are, should I ever meet you, and you imbibe, its on me, as long as you want, and I dont mean Chang or Lao Khao.

Hi HappyNuff,

Very glad to hear that it worked out well for you!

The one thing I do not understand is why the 'brown envelope' was needed.

1 - There have been cases where IO showed leniency and did not require the thai IO-approved health-insurance policy (which in your case was impossible to get - a perfect reason for applying leniency), and simply extended the 1-year permission to stay of the Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

2 - Your IO confirmed that when applying for the 1-year extension based on your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of marriage, they would process your application.  Obviously in that csse you would have had to meet the additional requirements to prove that you are still married to your thai wife.

So you could have taken that perfectly legal way, but indeed some admin hassle to get the documents for the extension for reason of marriage.

= = = = =

I understand from what you write that your local IO actually applied option 1 - issuing the 1-year permission to stay based on your current Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement WITHOUT having to show the normally required thai IO-approved health-insurance policy.

I agree that your IO showing leniency in this matter deserved some gratitude from you your part, but I do hope that it was not a Big brown envelope but some modest amount you gave them for not being difficult.

And yes they are fully correct, in course of next year you should do a border-run at a time convenient for you to 'kill' your present Non Imm O-A permission to stay.  And when returning VisaExempt you can then apply at your local IO for the 90-day Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement.  And in the last month of that 90 days apply for the 1-year extension of stay based on that Non Imm O Visa for reason of retirement.  Having done so, you will have gotten rid of the thai IO-approved health-insurance scam.

Note: I hope and trust you did not buy a Re-Entry Permit when applying for your 1-year extension of stay, as such a Re-Entry Permit will force you to wait till the end of the new 1-year permission to stay you got, before you can do the border-run as precursor for your Non Imm O retirement Visa application.

= = = = =

I live some 280 km from Khorat, so chances are slim we will bump into each other at the local supermarket. ????

But by all means, do open a nice bottle of wine or beer, when celebrating your successful application with your wife and drink it to my health & happiness.

Cheers!

[Peter Denis]

3 hours ago, JimGant said:

Peter (Thaivisa staff), why can't your excellent articles just be pinned to this forum? They're way ahead of the many "dead" articles than lanquish at the top of this forum, needing updating years ago. Your advice, packaged as it is, is superior. I've PMed you several times for the info -- but I feel having to PM you time after time per every update is nonsensical. So, why not pin your articles?

 

I'm sure you have your reasons. And, the current guru, UbonJoe, also must feel frustrated from posting the same answers -- to questions best answered in a pinned listing. But, it sure would allow new -- and old hands on this forum -- to cut to the quick, without having to peruse all the new, and related, threads.

Hi Jim,

Thanks for the Thumbs Up and glad to hear that you consider my various Guideline documents useful.

 

But I am not a ThaiVisa staff-member.  Actually I am just a relative Newbie on the Forum who did get good advice and help from senior TVF members when I discovered the Forum some 2.5 years ago.  And now I am on my turn sharing the limited knowledge I have acquired on Thai Visa matters with those that could benefit from it.

 

Indeed several TVF members already suggested to pin my Guideline documents on the board.

But reason I refrain from doing so (apart from the fact that I wouldn't know how to do that) is that the direct interaction with those reading it allows me to continually review and update the documents based on the questions, comments and suggestions I receive on it.

 

You could do me a favor though (unintended Trump speak...) and that is by referring to my Guideline documents on the Forum when you come across a post of someone who could benefit from the document.

Just refer to the Guideline document and that I will PM it over on simple request.  When you add my name Peter Denis preceded by @ like this @Peter Denis , the address will turn blue and you created a link to my Profile.  Doing so, I will get a notification that you mentioned me in a post so that I can react on it.  It's also easy for those wanting a copy as they can simply click that blue @Peter Denis address and my Profile will open allowing them to send me a PM message.

[Dogberry]

Of course, in my usual "nothing works as planned" life, I cannot get the fill-able PDF application to work...  Nothing seems to work. Anyone here has success filling out their application?

[ProbPossConf]

Are you using Adobe Acrobat Reader DC?  

Two weeks ago I was able to fill in the application with no problem...was even tried to make the appearance colorful using "blue" check marks and "X"s.

[OJAS]

On 7/7/2020 at 10:09 AM, JimmerJJ said:

Hi Peter, Thank you for the great info on the Health Insurance. I am on an Retirement visa extension of stay due to expire in December so please also PM me your information. I really appreciate your help.

Also I have another Health Insurance obstacle that you (or anyone) may have information about.  I am currently stranded on Bali....

 

On 7/7/2020 at 1:58 PM, Peter Denis said:

Hi Jimmer,

1 - I just PM-ed you the requested information on how to apply for the cheap thai IO-approved LMG Insurance, including tips & caveats.

 

@ubonjoe - seeing as he is currently stranded on Bali, what would be his chances of obtaining a single-entry non-O at the Thai consulate there, which he could then use to re-enter Thailand in due course in place of the re-entry permit which he has presumably obtained to safeguard his existing permission to stay? Might mean that he would need to apply for a fresh retirement extension sooner than December, but at least he would then be spared the mandatory health insurance requirement without having to make a special trip for a fresh non-O if this were possible!

Edited July 9, 2020 by OJAS

[Peter Denis]

8 hours ago, OJAS said:

 

 

@ubonjoe - seeing as he is currently stranded on Bali, what would be his chances of obtaining a single-entry non-O at the Thai consulate there, which he could then use to re-enter Thailand in due course in place of the re-entry permit which he has presumably obtained to safeguard his existing permission to stay? Might mean that he would need to apply for a fresh retirement extension sooner than December, but at least he would then be spared the mandatory health insurance requirement without having to make a special trip for a fresh non-O if this were possible!

@JimmerJJ > As long as his re-entry permit is still valid, his application for a new Visa at a thai Embassy/Consulate abroad won't be accepted.

After expiry of this re-entry permit all options would be open again for him, but when planning to return to Thailand - once the borders are open again - he will most likely be confronted with additional entry-requirements (e.g. mandatory quarantaine, covid-19 insurance, health-certificate and fit-to-fly certificate, etc.).

As the process to obtain a Non Imm O Visa is easier when applying at a thai Embassy/Consulate abroad, than doing it in-country, I agree that doing that once his re-entry permit has expired, would probably be his best option.

Note: That is, unless he wants to apply for the 1-year ME Non Imm O Visa at the Savannakhet or HoChiMin City consulate, in which case a VisaExempt entry would be an easier starting point for doing so.

 

Edited July 10, 2020 by Peter Denis

[mosan]

On 7/6/2020 at 4:44 PM, david_je said:

Dear Peter, Pls also PM that to me? Thanks.

Could you forward that to me when you get a chance?

[Andrew Dwyer]

7 minutes ago, mosan said:

Could you forward that to me when you get a chance?

You need to use the signal to get Peters attention .

 

 

 

@Peter Denis

[Peter Denis]

10 minutes ago, mosan said:

Could you forward that to me when you get a chance?

Hi Mosan, PM-ed you the LMG Insurance info - and you are welcome.

[Dogberry]

For what it's worth, I processed my insurance application with LMG in about 6 hours yesterday. The agent I dealt with, a Ms. Kannika, was accomodating. My Linux computer which usually handles PDF files without issue refused to cooperate with LMGs PDF application form. So, I printed the form, filled it by hand and scanned it back to her. No problem.  She also accepted pics of my passport and entry documents so that was simple too. There was some nonsense about using the LINE app for payment but never mind I did a regular bank transfer and all is well. 

[JimGant]

8 hours ago, Dogberry said:

For what it's worth, I processed my insurance application with LMG in about 6 hours yesterday. The agent I dealt with, a Ms. Kannika, was accomodating. My Linux computer which usually handles PDF files without issue refused to cooperate with LMGs PDF application form. So, I printed the form, filled it by hand and scanned it back to her. No problem.  She also accepted pics of my passport and entry documents so that was simple too. There was some nonsense about using the LINE app for payment but never mind I did a regular bank transfer and all is well. 

What was the start date of your insurance, i.e., presumably in another 30 days or so your new one year extension will renew -- is that the date when your insurance begins?

[Dogberry]

On 7/11/2020 at 5:44 PM, JimGant said:

What was the start date of your insurance, i.e., presumably in another 30 days or so your new one year extension will renew -- is that the date when your insurance begins?

Hey JimGant... I took a break from TV and just saw your question. If it's still relevant, LMG was very accommodating and took pains to make sure my start date was what I wanted. In my case my permission to stay expired July 9th so I was under amnesty. Applied to LMG on the 10th. Not knowing when the paper policy would arrive I set start date to the 16th. Policy arrived on the 17th, went to immigration (Lamphun) that afternoon and was done in short order. One year less one day (insurance expiry date) good to go.

Edited July 18, 2020 by Dogberry
correction

[Anders Eriksson]

On 7/6/2020 at 8:19 AM, Peter Denis said:

 

 

 

In case you consider the LMG Insurance option (cheapest option to meet the Non Imm O-A retirement extension requirement for health-insurance), just PM me and I will provide you with full details on how to apply for it, including tips/caveats.

 

Peter Denis, can I ask you to PM me this info? TIA if you are kind to do!

[Peter Denis]

9 minutes ago, Anders Eriksson said:

Peter Denis, can I ask you to PM me this info? TIA if you are kind to do!

PM sent > and you are welcome.