Seven police officers in Rochester, NY suspended over Black man's death, mayor says

[mrmicbkktxl]

7 hours ago, Pattaya Spotter said:

No real facts on what occurred on the night in question from this Reuter's report (I wonder why?) so I'll provide them:

 

In the middle of the night a naked man, in a state of delirium (later found to be acute intoxication by phencyclidine (PCP)) runs out into the street and tells passersby that he has Covid. When officers respond to calls for assistance, he starts spitting at/on them. Officers, following standard police protocols, place a mesh barrier mask over/around his head. The subject is held on the ground for a couple minutes and looses consciousness and is revived. He dies a week later in hospital. 

 

What to take from this: Don't take PCP, Don't run into the street naked, Don't tell people you have Covid and start spitting on them. End of story.

 

Yeah end of story now he is dead,but what i don't understand is,the guy is handcuffed,he has a spit bag over his head....why to continue to restrain him more?This is total stupidity or sadism

[Emdog]

Rather than the idiotic phrase in use "Defund the police", a more reasoned approach would be to emphasize that funds now spent on cops forced into role of social workers, etc ought to be spent on mental health intervention crisis specialists. Cops could go back to doing what was their original duty, so fewer would be needed for duties they are not trained or equipped for.

Legalizing PCP is not going to make it's effects any less (responding to "end war on drugs!" views). That is some very nasty stuff. If I recall correctly, when Rodney King was beaten for extended periods by group of cops, he was high on PCP. It's not pot or shrooms.

Spitting on cops while infected with covid could be considered attempted murder, or at least attempt to maim.

I consider myself a liberal, and given the resources cops had available, I don't know what else they could have been expected to do.

[George Aylesham]

9 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

I’m more inclined to believe it was the fact that he was buck-naked high on PCP spitting on police during a pandemic while resisting arrest. 

And therefore obviously mentally disturbed.

[EVENKEEL]

42 minutes ago, George Aylesham said:

And therefore obviously mentally disturbed.

Mentally disturbed because he smoked some PCP, not sure a side effect of PCP is mental illness. 

Edited September 4, 2020 by EVENKEEL

[simple1]

52 minutes ago, Emdog said:

Rather than the idiotic phrase in use "Defund the police", a more reasoned approach would be to emphasize that funds now spent on cops forced into role of social workers, etc ought to be spent on mental health intervention crisis specialists. Cops could go back to doing what was their original duty, so fewer would be needed for duties they are not trained or equipped for.

Legalizing PCP is not going to make it's effects any less (responding to "end war on drugs!" views). That is some very nasty stuff. If I recall correctly, when Rodney King was beaten for extended periods by group of cops, he was high on PCP. It's not pot or shrooms.

Spitting on cops while infected with covid could be considered attempted murder, or at least attempt to maim.

I consider myself a liberal, and given the resources cops had available, I don't know what else they could have been expected to do.

given the resources cops had available, I don't know what else they could have been expected to do.

 

The cause of death was asphyxiation. For a start it would have been a good idea not to have forced his face into the road and held him in the position for two minutes whilst he was handcuffed and hooded. Given the vast amount of street drug users in the US, police must have training to recognise and deal with people having a psychotic event whilst waiting for medics or don't they?

 

[olfu]

From my real life experience with police in USA I should say police consider itself higher than Gods.

[bodga]

3 hours ago, simple1 said:

A challenge when they are dead

but  not so when theyre  alive and Im guessing up until his  death he was  alive and  choosing to  take  pcp

[rvaviator]

4 hours ago, animalmagic said:

On total numbers alone you are correct.  However in the number of Nobel prizes per capita, which gives a more realistic view of claims to being smarter than others, the United States is 15th in the world.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_Nobel_laureates_per_capita

I see Nigeria have a solid lead over Thailand in that ranking .. ????

[katana]

15 hours ago, simple1 said:

17 hours ago, Mama Noodle said:

I’m more inclined to believe it was the fact that he was buck-naked high on PCP spitting on police during a pandemic while resisting arrest. 

What you saying is effectively condoning extrajudicial killing. There is no excuse for the guy dying from asphyxiation allegedly due to police action. Will have to wait and see the outcome of the enquiry to ascertain level of fault by all parties involved.

Seems you contradict yourself a little there. First you say it was an "extrajudicial killing", then "Will have to wait and see the outcome of the enquiry to ascertain level of fault by all parties involved".

Edited September 4, 2020 by katana

[thaibeachlovers]

20 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Does anyone know the race of the cops that were suspended?

Unless I missed it no one has said what colour the cops were, so I tried to find out with google and in none of the responses did it say what colour they are. In the only VDO I could find of the body cam it did look like some of the cops were black.

I'm pretty sure from previous incidents that if they were all white we'd have been left in no uncertainty that it was another "murder" by white cops, with "white" in all the headlines.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

13 hours ago, Emdog said:

Cops could go back to doing what was their original duty, so fewer would be needed for duties they are not trained or equipped for.

Not going to happen if a cop has to escort the social workers because of threats to their lives from the "clients".

[bodga]

12 hours ago, olfu said:

From my real life experience with police in USA I should say police consider itself higher than Gods.

my  experience  of  nypd  was  they  were  very  friendly Wife  had photo with one of them, nice  guy although to be fair Wife wasnt smacked out of her head on pcp or beating up someone or  robbing a  store or drink driving or  just being a jerk etc etc

[simple1]

6 hours ago, katana said:

Seems you contradict yourself a little there. First you say it was an "extrajudicial killing", then "Will have to wait and see the outcome of the enquiry to ascertain level of fault by all parties involved".

OMG - terrible huh. here you go - Appears to be an extrajudicial killing... 

Edited September 4, 2020 by simple1

[H1w4yR1da]

On 9/4/2020 at 6:49 AM, Tug said:

The police need to realize they are going to be held accountable the old Wild West days are over

Accountable for what? They did nothing wrong.

[simple1]

2 hours ago, H1w4yR1da said:

Accountable for what? They did nothing wrong.

yet to be proven one way or the other

[JCauto]

On 9/4/2020 at 8:01 AM, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO it's going to get to the stage that cops won't go near such persons as damned if they do and damned if they don't, but at least refusing to do their duty will attract less penalty than being accused of murder when just trying to do their thankless job.

Or, perhaps, we provide the same kind of training and insist upon the same sorts of qualifications that people who have to deal with those with mental health and drug issues undergo. Nurses need to study for several years to get qualifications, need certification, regular update training and testing, and are licensed and reviewed externally on a regular basis, especially when something goes wrong. These same people often show up at hospitals, where the orderlies somehow manage to take care of them without shooting them dead. 

Instead, we get the High School Bully/football player who can sign up after failing out of community college, take six months of training and be given a gun, a badge, and complete authorit-eh. And the pay they receive for being society's bullies is astonishing - they're literally being paid like Oil Rig and Logging workers without any of the concomitant danger.

I say make becoming a Police Officer much more difficult and require much more training and review, remove selective immunity and reduce their mandate so that those who have already demonstrated that they CAN deal with society's problems without extreme violence do so. 

[JCauto]

On 9/4/2020 at 8:59 AM, Pattaya Spotter said:

The United States has more Nobel Prize winners in hard sciences (and in general) than any other country...but we're always striving to do better. Your country?

Ah yes, this old canard. I think you had a different username before, no? When I called you out on it a couple of months ago, you quietly failed to respond. I suppose you must have been banned and come back.

[GinBoy2]

On 9/3/2020 at 7:14 PM, PatOngo said:

I'm more inclined to believe  he was discriminated against because he was black! It's an American thing!

This case is a lot more nuanced compared to other recent cases of blatant racial bias.

 

This one is a combination of mental illness, drug abuse and a lack of police training how to de-escalate.

 

So probably close to 20 years ago back in my home in California, parents of a 17 year old (white) kid, who was having a psychotic break called the cops, since that was their only option.

 

Cops showed up, kid was ultimately holed up under the cover of the family boat holding a kitchen knife. When he lunged at the cops they shot him dead. Of course none of you will have heard of this, it never made it past the local media.

 

We outsourced mental health to the police decades ago, thats why prisons are filled with the mentally ill!

[Credo]

As much as I am willing to look at the police with a jaundiced eye, I am conflicted about this one.   Anyone who has dealt with someone who is high, especially on PCP, knows how unpredictable they can be, they can also be extremely hard to control. It's a situation where what the police did, didn't work, but it's difficult to know what would have worked.   At a minimum, a medical person should have been there.   It's a medical situation more than a police matter.   

 

Regardless of who handles it, he had to be restrained.   It's a sad situation all around.