EU launches legal case against UK over Internal Market Bill

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, david555 said:

Only on your island , so stick on it , as outside you would have a very narrow "pad" to walk or trade 

 

Forget any deal as long Boris keep that Bill alive , you may rely on that , it is high game play now  , the negotiation going on is just for showing good intentions.....

 

Remember once in Germany a very high so person from a SEA country  private plane was legally" grounded" because unpaid kerosene bill.....and only released when finally the bill was paid …...

Stop, the UK is quaking in its boots.????????????

[welovesundaysatspace]

1 minute ago, vogie said:

When the EU stops breaking international law then maybe they might have a case,

I’m afraid they have a case anyway because...

1 minute ago, vogie said:

but for them to try and take the moral high ground is truly farcical.

...it’s not about “moral” but the law. 

[sawadee1947]

5 minutes ago, vogie said:

When the EU stops breaking international law then maybe they might have a case, but for them to try and take the moral high ground is truly farcical.

Another s. C. 

It's about laws and regulations and not about morals or virtues. 

[david555]

Just now, vogie said:

When the EU stops breaking international law then maybe they might have a case, but for them to try and take the moral high ground is truly farcical.

Here some funny but correct remarks from brexiteers on The Telegraph comments about Boris bill …. they gave it a consideration about treaty's ……  I kept copy past's  it as it would become useful one day  I knew 

 

 

David Jordan 4 Aug 2020 8:48PM
stupid call for the WA to be reopened which has been rejected by the EU, may I just point out that the UK has rejected Spain’s call for the Treaty of Utrecht to be reopened

 

Paul Bradshaw 4 Aug 2020 8:51PM
And if the UK unilaterally abrogates the legally binding treaty that is Boris’s WA, how could they complain if Spain unilaterally abrogated the legally binding treaty ceding Gibraltar to the UK?

 

Giovane Nel Cuore 4 Aug 2020 8:42PM
Oh dear - did we not read the small print when we got Brexit done!  Ho ho

 

????????????

 

[luckyluke]

22 minutes ago, vogie said:

We have left, we make our own rules now, however should you wish to follow the EUs Brave New Worlds rules, feel free, the UK will not stop you. 

I am honestly extremely curious about these " Brave New World Rules".
I suppose I will have to wait till next year.

Or are you, in one or another way, already in the know, and can you reveal already a tip of the iceberg?

[vogie]

43 minutes ago, david555 said:

Here some funny but correct remarks from brexiteers on The Telegraph comments about Boris bill …. they gave it a consideration about treaty's ……  I kept copy past's  it as it would become useful one day  I knew 

 

 

David Jordan 4 Aug 2020 8:48PM
stupid call for the WA to be reopened which has been rejected by the EU, may I just point out that the UK has rejected Spain’s call for the Treaty of Utrecht to be reopened

 

Paul Bradshaw 4 Aug 2020 8:51PM
And if the UK unilaterally abrogates the legally binding treaty that is Boris’s WA, how could they complain if Spain unilaterally abrogated the legally binding treaty ceding Gibraltar to the UK?

 

Giovane Nel Cuore 4 Aug 2020 8:42PM
Oh dear - did we not read the small print when we got Brexit done!  Ho ho

 

????????????

 

Your very own Mark Rutte called it "more of a necessary administrative step than political." I'm afraid the 'grim reapers' are going to have to do better than this. Lets be honest when has the EU bothered about international law and treaties, do unto them as you'll have them do unto you.????

[from the home of CC]

19 hours ago, ukrules said:

It's irrelevant, the UK has already left, the transition period is over in 3 months time.

 

This legal action was fully expected (and there may be a fine) and will go nowhere, fast.

 

Plenty of EU countries ignore laws and pay fines when it suits them, same thing works for the UK but it's something we've not really done before.

 

Times are changing, they better get used to it!

if they decide to play hardball beware of the tit for tat, could be right painful..

[RayC]

1 hour ago, vogie said:

When the EU stops breaking international law then maybe they might have a case, but for them to try and take the moral high ground is truly farcical.

Unlikely that anyone could seriously suggest that Johnson took the 'high ground'; moral or otherwise.

[david555]

52 minutes ago, vogie said:

Your very own Mark Rutte called it "more of a necessary administrative step than political." I'm afraid the 'grim reapers' are going to have to do better than this. Lets be honest when has the EU bothered about international law and treaties, do unto them as you'll have them do unto you.????

First of all it is not my Mark Rutte  ????….it s Holand 's Mark Rutte and he is most moderate to U.K. as he thinks about the Dutch flowers sales ….???? 555

He only hopes for the best and also hopes the bill would become vanished ….,

 

which I know Boris can not …., as he do vanish Boris Bill.... his hardcore  group finish him???? , and  if he does not  the soft Conservatives go finish him on the little bit longer run ????….. he put himself with his back to the wall ….and on a corner wall 

 

But I just let you see by those brexiteers Telegraph remarks about breaking treaty's what if would be a consequence of it if followed..... I know you like only the consequences in favor ….. but that is not how it works 

 

Treaty's can be changed but not unilateral ….only by the party's involved by common agreement 

Edited October 2, 2020 by david555

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, david555 said:

First of all it is not my Mark Rutte  ????….it s Holand 's Mark Rutte and he is most moderate to U.K. as he thinks about the Dutch flowers sales ….

He only hopes for the best and also hopes the bill would become vanished ….,

 

which I know Boris can not …., as he do vanish his hardcore  group finish him???? , and  if he does not  the soft Conservatives go finish him on the little bit longer run ????….. he put himself with his back to the wall ….and on a corner wall 

 

But I just let you see by those brexiteers Telegraph remarks about breaking treaty's what if would be a consequence of it if followed..... I know you like only the consequences in favor ….. but that is not how it works 

 

Treaty's can be changed but not unilateral ….only by the party's involved by common agreement 

But when the EU say to the UK must not make new laws to protect themselves from future eventualities, it is like a murderer telling a thief not to pick daisies on his way home through the park.

[david555]

Just now, vogie said:

But when the EU say to the UK must not make new laws to protect themselves from future eventualities, it is like a murderer telling a thief not to pick daisies on his way home through the park.

if the law can break a treaty....the Spaniards would welcome that ….. Gibraltar again under Spanish flag ???? ….. an example for your allowing to break international treaty unilateral …. they would welcome that if possible ????

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, david555 said:

if the law can break a treaty....the Spaniards would welcome that ….. Gibraltar again under Spanish flag ???? ….. an example for your allowing to break international treaty unilateral …. they would welcome that if possible ????

Are you saying that Spain would invade Gibraltar?????????????

[dunroaming]

22 hours ago, vogie said:

It is truly gratifying that something has brought tears of joy to the remainers at last, a foreign power has just said that they will sue our country and they are ecstatic, speaks volumes, "I love my country" of course you do. ????????????

Just part of the process.  Johnson... I mean Cummings, had until the end of September to withdraw their threat of reneging on the withdrawal agreement and therefore breaking international law.  He failed to do so and so we get the warning that the EU will respond accordingly.

 

Johnson immediately responded himself and called  Ursula Von Der Leyen. They have booked a telephone meeting for Saturday afternoon.  It's all pretty standard stuff at this stage with continued posturing on both sides.

 

It was reported a few days ago that the UK had offered some more concessions on fishing rights but they were rejected by Brussels as being too little.  I am sure behind the scenes there are all sorts of "negotiating" going on that is not made public.  Let's see where we are when crunch time comes.

[david555]

7 minutes ago, vogie said:

Are you saying that Spain would invade Gibraltar?????????????

No , you can ridicule it but I know you understand it better ,as  but it bumps on your defense for breaking treaty , as U.K. also don't like reopen  a treaty ….

Only U.K. is now an international treaty breaker , and as long not wit draw that bill....no deal shall be voted in E.U parliament by the 27 ….. unanimous is needed , so if only 1 oppose …..so no deal you are on your so wished  no deal 

Always your U.K. wins so wished  no deal it seems ????

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by david555

[3NUMBAS]

 

Bullying legal threat shows that frustrated EU is being outmaneuvered by UK dirty tricks in Brexit negotiations

Damian Wilsonhttps://www.rt.com/op-ed/502267-eu-uk-brexit-negotiations/

As the Brexit endgame moves ever closer, the EU says it will sue the British government over its intention to breach the Withdrawal Agreement. But it’s a hollow threat borne out of exasperation over the UK’s tactics.

As the European Union launches legal proceedings against the UK over its stated intention to breach the agreement, in reality the bullies of Brussels are simply trying to pile on the pressure until a deal is finalized or we leave without one.

Hollow threats are a go-to weapon in the EU arsenal.

Because it looks like a deal of some description will happen after all the ill humor of 2020. Despite sticking points, behind-the-scenes briefings and a broad disagreement about how to approach an agreement, this latest move is really just for show.

The legal procedure the Commission has flagged up takes a notoriously long time to achieve anything, and will join the other 800 infringement procedures already open on the EU books.

Read more

‘The deadline lapsed yesterday’: EU launches legal action against UK over ‘problematic’ Brexit bill

Sure, it sounds good with European Commission President Urusula von der Leyen standing at the podium before the world’s press to have a crack at the British government as the UK nears the inevitable Brexit transition period deadline of December 31. But it’s a token gesture.

The UK has been here already this year, with legal action launched by the EU against it for ignoring freedom of movement rules during the Brexit transition period and a decision announced by the European Court of Justice for handing city traders what was determined to be an illegal tax break, to which Brussels objected.

Then there was the action against the UK last year prompted by the refusal to appoint a commissioner to the bloc of which we were about to leave. It was crazy procedural nonsense, costing lord knows how much to the taxpayer but, as you can imagine, the lawyers in Brussels just love this stuff. Oooooh, money, money, money!

Dealing with the EU, even from inside the club, is like a neverending boxing match. It’s about assessing your opponent’s strengths and weaknesses. Feinting and parrying. Using clever footwork. Playing rope-a-dope until either contestant is legally punched out. If you can stay on your feet, there is always a 50-50 chance of success.

[david555]

Just now, 3NUMBAS said:

 

Bullying legal threat shows that frustrated EU is being outmaneuvered by UK dirty tricks in Brexit negotiations

Damian Wilsonhttps://www.rt.com/op-ed/502267-eu-uk-brexit-negotiations/

As the Brexit endgame moves ever closer, the EU says it will sue the British government over its intention to breach the Withdrawal Agreement. But it’s a hollow threat borne out of exasperation over the UK’s tactics.

As the European Union launches legal proceedings against the UK over its stated intention to breach the agreement, in reality the bullies of Brussels are simply trying to pile on the pressure until a deal is finalized or we leave without one.

Hollow threats are a go-to weapon in the EU arsenal.

Because it looks like a deal of some description will happen after all the ill humor of 2020. Despite sticking points, behind-the-scenes briefings and a broad disagreement about how to approach an agreement, this latest move is really just for show.

The legal procedure the Commission has flagged up takes a notoriously long time to achieve anything, and will join the other 800 infringement procedures already open on the EU books.

Read more

‘The deadline lapsed yesterday’: EU launches legal action against UK over ‘problematic’ Brexit bill

Sure, it sounds good with European Commission President Urusula von der Leyen standing at the podium before the world’s press to have a crack at the British government as the UK nears the inevitable Brexit transition period deadline of December 31. But it’s a token gesture.

The UK has been here already this year, with legal action launched by the EU against it for ignoring freedom of movement rules during the Brexit transition period and a decision announced by the European Court of Justice for handing city traders what was determined to be an illegal tax break, to which Brussels objected.

Then there was the action against the UK last year prompted by the refusal to appoint a commissioner to the bloc of which we were about to leave. It was crazy procedural nonsense, costing lord knows how much to the taxpayer but, as you can imagine, the lawyers in Brussels just love this stuff. Oooooh, money, money, money!

Dealing with the EU, even from inside the club, is like a neverending boxing match. It’s about assessing your opponent’s strengths and weaknesses. Feinting and parrying. Using clever footwork. Playing rope-a-dope until either contestant is legally punched out. If you can stay on your feet, there is always a 50-50 chance of success.

So the E.U. not dirty trick is just a no deal solution to offer  , and you can be all together be happy on Foggy Island and live long and have many children ????

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

No , you can ridicule it but I know you understand it better ,as  but it bumps on your defense for breaking treaty , as U.K. also don't like reopen  a treaty ….

Only U.K. is now an international treaty breaker , and as long not wit draw that bill....no deal shall be voted in E.U parliament by the 27 ….. unanimous is needed , so if only 1 oppose …..so no deal you are on your so wished  no deal 

Always your U.K. wins it seems ????

 

What you don't seem to understand is that the EU are breaking laws and treaties faster than I can break monkey nuts, let's not go down that road where it is ok for them to break a treaty but not us. Whether you like it or not Boris is not doing this for the good of his health, the UK must come before the EU at last, our laws come before international law now and in the future always will.

Just for the record I hope the WA is torn up and we just walk away.

[onebir]

23 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

The move comes as British and EU negotiators struggle to close the gap on state aid in parallel trade negotiations that have been overshadowed by the new controversy over the Internal Market Bill.

The irony is that fixed exchange rate area (+ Target) has converted the entire Euro area into a multi-state aid system for German industry. But that's ok.

[tomacht8]

15 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

 

Bullying legal threat shows that frustrated EU is being outmaneuvered by UK dirty tricks in Brexit negotiations

Damian Wilsonhttps://www.rt.com/op-ed/502267-eu-uk-brexit-negotiations/

As the Brexit endgame moves ever closer, the EU says it will sue the British government over its intention to breach the Withdrawal Agreement. But it’s a hollow threat borne out of exasperation over the UK’s tactics.

As the European Union launches legal proceedings against the UK over its stated intention to breach the agreement, in reality the bullies of Brussels are simply trying to pile on the pressure until a deal is finalized or we leave without one.

Hollow threats are a go-to weapon in the EU arsenal.

Because it looks like a deal of some description will happen after all the ill humor of 2020. Despite sticking points, behind-the-scenes briefings and a broad disagreement about how to approach an agreement, this latest move is really just for show.

The legal procedure the Commission has flagged up takes a notoriously long time to achieve anything, and will join the other 800 infringement procedures already open on the EU books.

Read more

‘The deadline lapsed yesterday’: EU launches legal action against UK over ‘problematic’ Brexit bill

Sure, it sounds good with European Commission President Urusula von der Leyen standing at the podium before the world’s press to have a crack at the British government as the UK nears the inevitable Brexit transition period deadline of December 31. But it’s a token gesture.

The UK has been here already this year, with legal action launched by the EU against it for ignoring freedom of movement rules during the Brexit transition period and a decision announced by the European Court of Justice for handing city traders what was determined to be an illegal tax break, to which Brussels objected.

Then there was the action against the UK last year prompted by the refusal to appoint a commissioner to the bloc of which we were about to leave. It was crazy procedural nonsense, costing lord knows how much to the taxpayer but, as you can imagine, the lawyers in Brussels just love this stuff. Oooooh, money, money, money!

Dealing with the EU, even from inside the club, is like a neverending boxing match. It’s about assessing your opponent’s strengths and weaknesses. Feinting and parrying. Using clever footwork. Playing rope-a-dope until either contestant is legally punched out. If you can stay on your feet, there is always a 50-50 chance of success.

I hope the stupid Brexit theater is over soon. Is meanwhile boring on the continent and no longer an issue for headlines on the first page of the print media. First the UK doesn't know what it wants, then TMs try negotiated and rejected, then a separation contract personally signed and cheered by Boris, and now it's back again to children theater by BJ.

It doesn't make sense to start all over again after so many years. The EU should just wait until the UK has a contractually reliable government again. 

Let the UK eat their fish and everyone will be happy. 

[welovesundaysatspace]

41 minutes ago, vogie said:

But when the EU say to the UK must not make new laws to protect themselves from future eventualities, it is like a murderer telling a thief not to pick daisies on his way home through the park.

No. It’s like taking out a loan and then telling the bank that you will only pay half the interest rate because that’s the sovereign decision of you and your wife after realizing that 5% is too much. 
 

And when the bank tells you that it doesn’t care what you and your wife decide internally, you’re pulling out a video of two loan officers discussing what would happen in case of you defaulting and call that “bad faith”. 
 

For both cases, good luck finding a judge to support your position. 
 

 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by welovesundaysatspace

[Scott Tracy]

23 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

Such so-called infringements could lead to hefty fines being imposed by the EU’s top court but that takes years, leaving plenty of time for the UK to change tack.

 

London now has one month now to reply to a formal letter of complaint from the Commission, which will then assess whether the answer is satisfactory and can then request that the UK falls back in line. If that fails, it can sue at the Luxembourg-based European Court of Justice.

So has the EU launched legal proceedings? Is writing the letter part of the legal process? I guess so. Well and good, I say. Let's all have our day in Court. Which one though? ECJ? This interprets EU laws. UK will not be a member of the EU, and therefore not subject to EU law. How does that work then? If someone breaks a law, it is a criminal act normally, not a civil offence. How can someone be sued in a criminal court?

 

The comedy continues.

 

My brain hurts.

[welovesundaysatspace]

 

3 minutes ago, Scott Tracy said:

ECJ? This interprets EU laws. UK will not be a member of the EU, and therefore not subject to EU law. How does that work then?

Four more years after 31 Dec 2020. Average time for such disputes is 35 months. You do the math. 

 

 

[vogie]

9 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

No. It’s like taking out a loan and then telling the bank that you will only pay half the interest rate because that was the sovereign decision of your wife. And when the bank tells you that it doesn’t care what you and your wife decide internally, you’re pulling out a video of two loan officers discussing what would happen in case of you defaulting and you call that “bad faith”. 
 

And in both cases, good luck finding a judge to support your position. 

If that bank keeps changing the rules over the loan period that is not our problem.

[welovesundaysatspace]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

If that bank keeps changing the rules over the loan period that is not our problem.

The EU wasn’t changing the terms of the WA. Unlike the attempts of the UK, it respected the contract. 

[Loiner]

6 minutes ago, Scott Tracy said:

So has the EU launched legal proceedings? Is writing the letter part of the legal process? I guess so. Well and good, I say. Let's all have our day in Court. Which one though? ECJ? This interprets EU laws. UK will not be a member of the EU, and therefore not subject to EU law. How does that work then? If someone breaks a law, it is a criminal act normally, not a civil offence. How can someone be sued in a criminal court?

 

The comedy continues.

 

My brain hurts.

Nah, it's only a Final Demand from a woman in Brussels, who's club we have already left anyway. Boris will chuck it in the bin. She's heard something about us overriding one of her rules for after her transition period. She probably read in one of the TVF Euro lawyer's posts that her court can still make rules for an ex-member's sovereign borders.

There's no agreement even broken yet, as it's a Bill which is still passing through Parliament. The HOC voted for it massively but the HOL will try and block it for a while. We will probably be still in the transition period when the Bill becomes UK law, but still no agreement is broken. After transition and we are fully free, when the EU does not keep to their part of the WA, our new law will override the EU's actions. Again no laws broken so the four year ECJ ruling period will be irrelevant. Boris will probably override that Clause too soon.

 

All very Shakespearean comedy: Much ado about nothing. 

[vogie]

1 minute ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

The EU wasn’t changing the terms of the WA. Unlike the attempts of the UK, it respected the contract. 

I am not sure that the EU knows the meaning of respect, it has tried to pull a fast one from day 1. Infact I am so concerned about the mismanagement of that bank I shall immediately transfer my funds to the Bank of America where they appreciate good customers and also treat them with the utmost respect, I will never ever use that EU bank again, cowboys.

[Rookiescot]

56 minutes ago, 3NUMBAS said:

 

Bullying legal threat shows that frustrated EU is being outmaneuvered by UK dirty tricks in Brexit negotiations

Damian Wilsonhttps://www.rt.com/op-ed/502267-eu-uk-brexit-negotiations/

As the Brexit endgame moves ever closer, the EU says it will sue the British government over its intention to breach the Withdrawal Agreement. But it’s a hollow threat borne out of exasperation over the UK’s tactics.

As the European Union launches legal proceedings against the UK over its stated intention to breach the agreement, in reality the bullies of Brussels are simply trying to pile on the pressure until a deal is finalized or we leave without one.

Hollow threats are a go-to weapon in the EU arsenal.

Because it looks like a deal of some description will happen after all the ill humor of 2020. Despite sticking points, behind-the-scenes briefings and a broad disagreement about how to approach an agreement, this latest move is really just for show.

The legal procedure the Commission has flagged up takes a notoriously long time to achieve anything, and will join the other 800 infringement procedures already open on the EU books.

Read more

‘The deadline lapsed yesterday’: EU launches legal action against UK over ‘problematic’ Brexit bill

Sure, it sounds good with European Commission President Urusula von der Leyen standing at the podium before the world’s press to have a crack at the British government as the UK nears the inevitable Brexit transition period deadline of December 31. But it’s a token gesture.

The UK has been here already this year, with legal action launched by the EU against it for ignoring freedom of movement rules during the Brexit transition period and a decision announced by the European Court of Justice for handing city traders what was determined to be an illegal tax break, to which Brussels objected.

Then there was the action against the UK last year prompted by the refusal to appoint a commissioner to the bloc of which we were about to leave. It was crazy procedural nonsense, costing lord knows how much to the taxpayer but, as you can imagine, the lawyers in Brussels just love this stuff. Oooooh, money, money, money!

Dealing with the EU, even from inside the club, is like a neverending boxing match. It’s about assessing your opponent’s strengths and weaknesses. Feinting and parrying. Using clever footwork. Playing rope-a-dope until either contestant is legally punched out. If you can stay on your feet, there is always a 50-50 chance of success.

I dont think the threat of no deal is empty as this muppet claims. The EU will be perfectly happy with no deal because it sets an example to other countries who may toy with the idea of leaving in the future.

All this over access to some fish? An industry which is insignificant to both the UK and EU's GDP.

But of course it has become a totemic issue for Brexiteers because of buzzwords like sovereignty.

 

Look on the bright side guys. In three months you can move on from "bluff and bluster" onto another hobby horse called "Blaming everyone else for Brexit being a disaster".

[david555]

EU threat to cut off City unless it gets answers over regulation after Brexit 
Candidate to be the EU's financial services commissioner demands to know how far UK will split from Brussels's rules and regulations 

By James Crisp, Brussels Correspondent 
2 October 2020 • 11:41am 

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2020/10/02/eu-threat-cut-city-unless-gets-answers-regulation-brexit/

Candidate to be the EU's financial services commissioner demands to know how far UK will split from Brussels's rules and regulations 

Brussels will refuse the City of London access to the EU’s market from next year unless the UK sets out its plans to diverge from the bloc’s financial rules. 

Mairead McGuinness, an Irish centre-Right MEP, is the candidate to be the EU’s financial services commissioner. If approved by the European Parliament, which is expected, she will be the City’s gatekeeper to the Single Market. The Fine Gael politician and former member of the parliament’s Brexit Steering Group, told MEPs at a hearing into her candidacy that Brussels needed answers from the UK. 

 

Edited October 2, 2020 by david555

[kingdong]

11 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Whataboutary.

 

It’s all you’ve got.

can,t address the point raised? don,t worry just deflect typical remainer tactic.

Edited October 2, 2020 by kingdong

[david555]

1 hour ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

No. It’s like taking out a loan and then telling the bank that you will only pay half the interest rate because that’s the sovereign decision of you and your wife after realizing that 5% is too much. 
 

And when the bank tells you that it doesn’t care what you and your wife decide internally, you’re pulling out a video of two loan officers discussing what would happen in case of you defaulting and call that “bad faith”. 
 

For both cases, good luck finding a judge to support your position. 
 

 

 

That's their dream scenario ….????