EU, UK to step up Brexit talks to try to close 'significant gaps' over trade deal

[Rookiescot]

3 minutes ago, transam said:

Has anyone used the word Nazis, I don't think so, well I haven't, but I have said, the "German government of the day" regarding their atrocities........ 

Why mention them at all. Utterly irrelevant to todays world. 

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, transam said:

Has anyone used the word Nazis, I don't think so, well I haven't, but I have said, the "German government of the day" regarding their atrocities........ 

It is faux outrage by the remainers, they don't bat an eyelid when posters keep referring to the British Empire. They are running out of sticks to hit the democratic side of our country that voted leave, it's called double standards.

[sandyf]

14 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

As I understand it, the tech bods at Public Health England made the screw up. They used an old Excel format with lower capacity when downloading all the data. 

 

Yet another example of poor management and slack oversight at PHE. Not the government's fault, but hopefully some heads will be bashed together at PHE by the government. 

 

But opponents of the Tories / Brexit / the Union are of course going to jump on this and make as much political capital as possible out of it. Sad really. 

 

Remind me, when did Bojo claim he would have a "world beating" system.

Of course you are perfectly free to try and defend those that continually make promises that they fail to keep.

What is really sad is those that got taken in by the clown. Without a gallery to play to, his speech yesterday was like a fish out of water.

[Rookiescot]

1 minute ago, vogie said:

It is faux outrage by the remainers, they don't bat an eyelid when posters keep referring to the British Empire. They are running out of sticks to hit the democratic side of our country that voted leave, it's called double standards.

Faux outrage?

Physician heal thyself.

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, Loiner said:

I think you need to make your Brit-bashing, or Anglo-bashing or Tory-bashing, or Cummings-bashing, a little clearer please. What have you drifted into now, or have you simply got the wrong topic?

That is what happens when people say the first thing they think of, can't remember what they said.

[sandyf]

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

It is faux outrage by the remainers, they don't bat an eyelid when posters keep referring to the British Empire. They are running out of sticks to hit the democratic side of our country that voted leave, it's called double standards.

Only the mentally challenged would believe it was a democratic vote to leave at any cost.

The majority voted on promises that have not been kept. There can be no complaints from them about government incompetence, what they put their faith in.

Four years down the line and with less than 3 months to go, business still do not know how they will trade. If people had been told that before the referendum do you really think there would have been the same result. Only one word for it "conned" into the self interest of the few. Of course that is something that the "few" will never acknowledge, will you.

[transam]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

Only the mentally challenged would believe it was a democratic vote to leave at any cost.

The majority voted on promises that have not been kept. There can be no complaints from them about government incompetence, what they put their faith in.

Four years down the line and with less than 3 months to go, business still do not know how they will trade. If people had been told that before the referendum do you really think there would have been the same result. Only one word for it "conned" into the self interest of the few. Of course that is something that the "few" will never acknowledge, will you.

"The majority voted on promises that have not been kept".....Chummy, nothing has been sorted yet, I think you are jumping the gun, besides, You don't know what an individual voted for..............????

It took six years to sort the last Euopean problem out and YOU are complaining about a time schedule this time round.......... ????..............................????

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Only the mentally challenged would believe it was a democratic vote to leave at any cost.

The majority voted on promises that have not been kept. There can be no complaints from them about government incompetence, what they put their faith in.

Four years down the line and with less than 3 months to go, business still do not know how they will trade. If people had been told that before the referendum do you really think there would have been the same result. Only one word for it "conned" into the self interest of the few. Of course that is something that the "few" will never acknowledge, will you.

We get it Sandy, you don't believe in democracy and never will unless it suits what you want, you have also ignored your very own democratic referendum. Ignoring democratic referendums would have catastrophic effect on our country, referendums should not be ignored and the losers should respect and accept the referendum outcome whether it went their way or not.

Time for the remainers to grow up and get on with their lives and realise we have left the EU.

[JonnyF]

31 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

Why mention them at all. Utterly irrelevant to todays world. 

Are you one of those book burners? Or is it just selective history that you wish forgotten? 

 

Would you go to a Black History event and tell them to shut up about slavery? Tell them it's utterly irrelevant in today's world? While you're at it, tell the native Americans to shut up about the rape and pillage and theft of their country by European settlers. Tell them not to mention it again. "Sheesh, get over it already" is a good phrase to use, they love that 

 

Because if you believe WW2 is totally irrelevant, then slavery and colonialism is even less relevant (it was much longer ago) and should never be mentioned.

 

Or is this another double standard from the king of double standards?

[Phulublub]

26 minutes ago, vogie said:

We get it Sandy, you don't believe in democracy and never will unless it suits what you want, you have also ignored your very own democratic referendum. Ignoring democratic referendums would have catastrophic effect on our country, referendums should not be ignored and the losers should respect and accept the referendum outcome whether it went their way or not.

Time for the remainers to grow up and get on with their lives and realise we have left the EU.

Sandy said "at any cost".  But of course you and every other Brexit voter knew what you were voting for.  Didn't you?  And they?

 

A very small majority of those who voted ticked the Brexit box.   How may would have abstained or crossed the aisle if they knew then what they know now?  How many of those who did not vote would have made the effort if they knew then what they know now?  (And how many wo voted to Remain would have abstained or crossed the aisle if they had known then what they know now?)  Reasonably impartial people on both sides can form a fair assessment to the answers to those questions. Diehards will stick their fingers in their ears and repeat their mantras ad nauseum; they "won" and do not care/accept/understand what the consequenses may be. 

 

Personal denial of evident truths is a sad thing to see

 

PH

Edited October 7, 2020 by Phulublub

[Rookiescot]

27 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Are you one of those book burners? Or is it just selective history that you wish forgotten? 

 

Would you go to a Black History event and tell them to shut up about slavery? Tell them it's utterly irrelevant in today's world? While you're at it, tell the native Americans to shut up about the rape and pillage and theft of their country by European settlers. Tell them not to mention it again. "Sheesh, get over it already" is a good phrase to use, they love that 

 

Because if you believe WW2 is totally irrelevant, then slavery and colonialism is even less relevant (it was much longer ago) and should never be mentioned.

 

Or is this another double standard from the king of double standards?

Wow. Good leap there.

I am not the one with double standards here. Its Brexiteers who wish to go on non stop about the second world war but want people to stop talking about the British empire or slavery. 

Personally I dont think Brexit or the EU is a suitable subject for ANY of those matters. 

If you want to discuss that then start a thread called "Bad things the nazis did".

[vogie]

13 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

Sandy said "at any cost".  But of course you and every other Brexit voter knew what you were voting for.  Didn't you?  And they?

 

A very small majority of those who voted ticked the Brexit box.   How may would have abstained or crossed the aisle if they knew then what they know now?  How many of those who did not vote would have made the effort if they knew then what they know now?  (And how many wo voted to Remain would have abstained or crossed the aisle if they had known then what they know now?)  Reasonably impartial people on both sides can form a fair assessment to the answers to those questions. Diehards will stick their fingers in their ears and repeat their mantras ad nauseum; they "won" and do not care/accept/understand what the consequenses may be. 

 

Personal denial of evident truths is a sad thing to see

 

PH

I'm guessing the result didn't go your way too?

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, RayC said:

 

Because rather than state that any extension might be a positive sign if a deal is to be brokered, you make a comment about EU backtracking.

 

The alternative to the EU extending the talks would be their failure, hence my question whether you think that is preferable.

I made the comment about the EU backtracking because, despite their apparent tough stance since the referendum, history shows that they consistently open doors at the last minute, especially w.r.t. extensions. That was my point.

 

If a fair, sensible and realistic deal is reached then that is the preferred outcome, IMO, yes. But getting these three together might be too much for the EU to offer, so I'm not holding my breath. 

 

Edited October 7, 2020 by nauseus

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

Only the mentally challenged would believe it was a democratic vote to leave at any cost.

The majority voted on promises that have not been kept. There can be no complaints from them about government incompetence, what they put their faith in.

Four years down the line and with less than 3 months to go, business still do not know how they will trade. If people had been told that before the referendum do you really think there would have been the same result. Only one word for it "conned" into the self interest of the few. Of course that is something that the "few" will never acknowledge, will you.

We were truly 'conned' in 1972 and 1975. In 2016, the only promise that counted was that the vote would be respected. Spurious noises from individuals on both sides were not seen as serious promises by anyone except, perhaps, by this 'mentally challenged' group that you mention.

[hotandsticky]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

  Spurious noises from individuals on both sides were not seen as serious promises by anyone except, perhaps, by this 'mentally challenged' group that you mention.

 

 

I have noticed that is often the mantra of losers.

[RayC]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

 

If a fair, sensible and realistic deal is reached then that is the preferred outcome, IMO, yes. But getting these three together might be too much for the EU to offer, so I'm not holding my breath. 

 

Notwithstanding the fact that existing agreements with individual 

companies - EU or otherwise - with an expiration date post-2020 should be honoured, imo the EU should modify its' demands re access to UK waters. It is unreasonable to expect the current CFA to continue post-transition.

 

In a similar vein, the UK request to have unfettered access to the single market, coupled with the ability of the UK government to support exporters without restriction is hardly "fair, sensible or realistic", and will have to be dropped if a deal is to be made.

 

The notion that the EU will agree to a deal that effectively grants the UK  better conditions than it had when it was a member of the EU, currently has under transition and is better than existing EU member states is ridiculous.

[CG1 Blue]

5 hours ago, sandyf said:

Remind me, when did Bojo claim he would have a "world beating" system.

Of course you are perfectly free to try and defend those that continually make promises that they fail to keep.

What is really sad is those that got taken in by the clown. Without a gallery to play to, his speech yesterday was like a fish out of water.

Patronise all you like, but I haven't been taken in by anyone. Boris and his team are doing what I wanted them to do - getting us out of the EU. No other major party leader would have delivered that. 

Mistakes have been made during the pandemic, but how many of the 193 countries have not made mistakes? 

 

[nauseus]

58 minutes ago, RayC said:

Notwithstanding the fact that existing agreements with individual 

companies - EU or otherwise - with an expiration date post-2020 should be honoured, imo the EU should modify its' demands re access to UK waters. It is unreasonable to expect the current CFA to continue post-transition.

 

In a similar vein, the UK request to have unfettered access to the single market, coupled with the ability of the UK government to support exporters without restriction is hardly "fair, sensible or realistic", and will have to be dropped if a deal is to be made.

 

The notion that the EU will agree to a deal that effectively grants the UK  better conditions than it had when it was a member of the EU, currently has under transition and is better than existing EU member states is ridiculous.

Like I said, I'm not holding my breath. 

[sandyf]

7 hours ago, vogie said:

We get it Sandy, you don't believe in democracy and never will unless it suits what you want, you have also ignored your very own democratic referendum. Ignoring democratic referendums would have catastrophic effect on our country, referendums should not be ignored and the losers should respect and accept the referendum outcome whether it went their way or not.

Time for the remainers to grow up and get on with their lives and realise we have left the EU.

I haven't ignored anything, in 2014 I would never have supported independence,  but as we have all come to learn the option to change your mind is not in the brexit vocabulary.

[sandyf]

2 hours ago, CG1 Blue said:

Patronise all you like, but I haven't been taken in by anyone. Boris and his team are doing what I wanted them to do - getting us out of the EU. No other major party leader would have delivered that. 

Mistakes have been made during the pandemic, but how many of the 193 countries have not made mistakes? 

 

Bit sad when all you are concerned about is getting out of the EU, whatever the consequences.

 

The PM said that the UK was suffering from “chronic underlying problems” even before the virus struck, with poor skills, inadequate transport infrastructure, insufficient homes and “far too many people… who felt ignored and left-out”.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-conservative-conference-coronavirus-building-back-better-b836324.html?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=INDNEWS%2307102020&utm_term=IND_Headlines_Masterlist_CDP

 

How long have the Tories been in government, do you really think the leopard can change it's spots.

Edited October 7, 2020 by sandyf

[vogie]

12 minutes ago, sandyf said:

I haven't ignored anything, in 2014 I would never have supported independence,  but as we have all come to learn the option to change your mind is not in the brexit vocabulary.

I haven't ignored anything, in 2014 I would never have supported independence, 

 

When you say you havn't ignored anything, well that is not strickly true is it. Whatever you supported in 2014 is totally irrelevant, you are ignoring the 2014 Scots Referendum now and the UKs EU referendum. That is 2 referendums you are ignoring c/w the democracy that goes with them.

[Phulublub]

16 minutes ago, vogie said:

When you say you havn't ignored anything, well that is not strickly true is it. Whatever you supported in 2014 is totally irrelevant, you are ignoring the 2014 Scots Referendum now and the UKs EU referendum. That is 2 referendums you are ignoring c/w the democracy that goes with them.

I see.  So by your "logic" once we have voted on something ONCE, then that is it. No further discussion, no further debate, no further dissenting voice. 

 

Maybe you should have told N Farage Esq that after he failed to be elected to the HoC in 1994?  You failed.  Go away.  Permanently.

 

PH

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

I see.  So by your "logic" once we have voted on something ONCE, then that is it. No further discussion, no further debate, no further dissenting voice. 

 

Maybe you should have told N Farage Esq that after he failed to be elected to the HoC in 1994?  You failed.  Go away.  Permanently.

 

PH

"Only the mentally challenged" would suggest having another referendum before the original one has been implemented.????

And as for your continuous remainer slogans like "you didn't know what you were voting for" not only is it condescending, but it has all been dealt with in the past and serves no purpose what-so-ever. 

[3NUMBAS]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-outlines-new-plans-for-freeports-to-turbo-charge-post-brexit-trade

 

News story

Government outlines new plans for Freeports to turbo-charge post-Brexit trade

The government has today set out further details around how it will create a number of new innovative Freeports across the UK to create jobs, drive investment and regenerate communities.

• next steps set out today for the creation of Freeports, driving investment and creating jobs after the end of the transition period
• Freeport bidding process in England to open before the end of the year
• the first Freeports on track to be open by the end of 2021

Responding to the consultation on the proposals the government confirmed that sea, air and rail ports in England will be invited to bid for Freeport status before the end of the year, with the government aiming for the first of the new sites to be open for business in 2021.

It also confirmed the Freeports will benefit from:

• streamlined planning processes to aid brownfield redevelopment
• a package of tax reliefs to help drive jobs, growth and innovation
• simplified customs procedures and duty suspensions on goods

Seizing on the opportunities presented by leaving the EU, Freeports will be created across the nation to help drive Britain’s post-Brexit growth.

[Phulublub]

29 minutes ago, vogie said:

"Only the mentally challenged" would suggest having another referendum before the original one has been implemented.????

And as for your continuous remainer slogans like "you didn't know what you were voting for" not only is it condescending, but it has all been dealt with in the past and serves no purpose what-so-ever. 

A refendum on the final details would be an excellent idea.   Suppose that makes me mentally challenged.

 

And "what you voted for" has NOT been dealt with.  Perhaps if Brexiters could properly explain what it was they voted for (and not just in meaningless slogans) then us Remainers could begin to understand.

 

PH

[kingdong]

9 hours ago, sandyf said:

Only the mentally challenged would believe it was a democratic vote to leave at any cost.

The majority voted on promises that have not been kept. There can be no complaints from them about government incompetence, what they put their faith in.

Four years down the line and with less than 3 months to go, business still do not know how they will trade. If people had been told that before the referendum do you really think there would have been the same result. Only one word for it "conned" into the self interest of the few. Of course that is something that the "few" will never acknowledge, will you.

they voted because the big red bus told them to

[kingdong]

8 hours ago, Rookiescot said:

Wow. Good leap there.

I am not the one with double standards here. Its Brexiteers who wish to go on non stop about the second world war but want people to stop talking about the British empire or slavery. 

Personally I dont think Brexit or the EU is a suitable subject for ANY of those matters. 

If you want to discuss that then start a thread called "Bad things the nazis did".

rookiescot has left the buiding.

[vogie]

3 minutes ago, Phulublub said:

A refendum on the final details would be an excellent idea.   Suppose that makes me mentally challenged.

 

And "what you voted for" has NOT been dealt with.  Perhaps if Brexiters could properly explain what it was they voted for (and not just in meaningless slogans) then us Remainers could begin to understand.

 

PH

Suppose that makes me mentally challenged.

I was quoting a remainer, remainers own the insults on here.

 

And "what you voted for" has NOT been dealt with.  Perhaps if Brexiters could properly explain what it was they voted for (and not just in meaningless slogans) then us Remainers could begin to understand.

It has been dealt with many of times, if you have arrived at the party late that is no fault of the Brexiteers.

There were two options on the referendum pamphlet, remain or leave, see how simple that was to explain.

As for the remainers understanding, they would understand if they didn't run around with their fingers in their ears shouting 'I can't hear you'.

 

 

[Rookiescot]

8 minutes ago, vogie said:

Suppose that makes me mentally challenged.

I was quoting a remainer, remainers own the insults on here.

 

And "what you voted for" has NOT been dealt with.  Perhaps if Brexiters could properly explain what it was they voted for (and not just in meaningless slogans) then us Remainers could begin to understand.

It has been dealt with many of times, if you have arrived at the party late that is no fault of the Brexiteers.

There were two options on the referendum pamphlet, remain or leave, see how simple that was to explain.

As for the remainers understanding, they would understand if they didn't run around with their fingers in their ears shouting 'I can't hear you'.

 

 

It has never been dealt with. All we got were tired slogans from the Brexit campaign. Then as details emerged of what Brexit actually means all we got were repeats of we knew what we were voting for.

Only Loiner (bless him) has been honest enough to actually admit he voted for Brexit because of immigration. To my understanding he does not care about the consequences just so long as immigration is stopped. 

Now his position is clear.

The rest of you Brexiteers just skirt the issue of why you voted for Brexit. Not one of you could have known what Brexit would look like because here we are four years later and we still dont know. 

[Phulublub]

18 minutes ago, vogie said:

It has been dealt with many of times, if you have arrived at the party late that is no fault of the Brexiteers.

There were two options on the referendum pamphlet, remain or leave, see how simple that was to explain.

Telling us what the options were in absolutely no way explains anything.  If you honestly think it does then I genuinely feel sorry for you.

 

PH

(Mentally Challenged)