Cheap decent red wine

[jacko45k]

Send your Mrs out to buy some with her own money......she  will find the cheapest......

Laughing Bird Dry  Red (Oz)

Castle Creek Bin 569 (Oz) Large bottle.

I think they are awful but Mrs is into the glass before bed health kick... what do I know, I drink SML. BUT... don't go near some local attempt Hola Velvet Red.... you will regret!

[Rimmer]

Off topic baiting and bickering posts removed

[xylophone]

17 hours ago, clivebaxter said:

Mont Clair is from S Africa

And on that note Clive, I've now seen fruit wines here in Thailand from many countries, including, as you say South Africa (and not only Montclair), France, Italy, Australia, New Zealand, Chile, and probably a few I've missed!

 

One has to wonder why countries like France and Italy, as examples, who make vast quantities of everyday average drinking wine for the masses (excluding the fine wines they make) which is priced at peanuts, have to produce a fruit wine.........well the answer lies in getting around the tax and duty and whatever else Thailand decides to put on a bottle of wine, so it's my belief that these wines are made specifically for countries like Thailand where the taxation regime is punishing.
 

[BigStar]

On 7/27/2021 at 2:43 PM, xylophone said:

Sorry to disappoint you but it is a Fruit wine. Made from grapes and fruit juice.

Don't forget the egg. The secret sauce, goes well with bacon and toast. 

 

[xylophone]

1 minute ago, BigStar said:

Don't forget the egg. The secret sauce, goes well with bacon and toast. 

 

Don't know if it was meant as a joke or not, however egg whites have been used forever, for fining wines (wine clarification and stabilisation process)..........not sure about how well it goes with bacon and toast though!!!!!

[BigStar]

Just now, xylophone said:

Don't know if it was meant as a joke or not, however egg whites have been used forever, for fining wines (wine clarification and stabilisation process)..........not sure about how well it goes with bacon and toast though!!!!!

I don't see "egg" listed as one of the ingredients on any of the wines I normally drink, however. So I assume Laughing Bird appeals more to those taste buds appreciate their egg brought out a bit more prominently.

[xylophone]

6 minutes ago, BigStar said:

I don't see "egg" listed as one of the ingredients on any of the wines I normally drink, however. So I assume Laughing Bird appeals more to those taste buds appreciate their egg brought out a bit more prominently.

LOL, no it won't be listed as an ingredient in wine, because it doesn't stay there, it and the other odds and ends in wine which need clarifying are separated out before the wine is bottled.

 

Didn't get the link to the Laughing Bird fruit wine – my bad!

[spidermike007]

On 7/27/2021 at 8:40 AM, millymoopoo said:

One would question the motivation for acquiring economically priced wine.?

After all life is too short to waste it on cheap wine.

Quality costs.!

Would saving up to buy a decent bottle of wine for example once a week be better for enjoyment than five bottles of cheap plonk in a week.?

Or do they just want to get <deleted>.?

Well, I tend to agree with you, but Thailand may be an exception to that rule. In the US I get decent red wines for $10, good ones for $20, and outstanding wines for $30-50 a bottle. Here those same bottles are 300 to 400% higher. So, it tends to be a ridiculous exercise to chase good bottles here. I recently bought a good Chianti reserva, of a nice vintage, for 1,300. It is a good wine, and does not disappoint. But, for that same amount of money in California, I would be drinking a truly inspiring wine. Or buying a nice bottle of tequila. 

 

I often spend 1,000 to 1,500 on a bottle here that ends up being disappointing. And that is after I have researched the bottle. Storage here is an issue, as a good bottle can turn in as little as two weeks, if not stored in a cool enough environment. And getting a refund on a bad bottle is about as difficult as getting a refund on anything here. 

 

I was recently at a French restaurant on Koh Phangan. A fancy place. We ordered two bottles of wine. Both were disappointing, at 1,100 and 1,800 baht. The second more expensive bottle had turned. It was awful. Nothing there. And the French owner refused to take the bottle back. Later, when I started complaining online, I nearly started a social war on the island, with the petty provincial politics there. 

[cyril sneer]

On 7/27/2021 at 2:43 PM, xylophone said:

Sorry to disappoint you but it is a Fruit wine. Made from grapes and fruit juice.

says it's 100% shiraz on here

 

https://winelovebangkok.com/laughing-bird-dry-red

 

also nothing on the label when I buy it says fruit wine (like the fruit wines)

[xylophone]

42 minutes ago, cyril sneer said:

says it's 100% shiraz on here

 

https://winelovebangkok.com/laughing-bird-dry-red

 

also nothing on the label when I buy it says fruit wine (like the fruit wines)

Last time I looked it said fruit wine so I will look again!!

 

I have just had a scout around and although I'm sure I did see fruit wine on one of the bottles, it could well be that I was confused with one called "kookaburra laughing red wine", which is a fruit wine!

 

If that is the case, please accept my apologies and I need to look at more of these wines to ensure that my memory doesn't play tricks on me, which it seems to be doing as I'm getting on a bit.

 

It is made by Cranswick wines in south-east Australia and they do produce cheap wines because previous to the current owner buying it, the winery used to make bulk wine.

 

I must get out more!!!!!!

Edited July 28, 2021 by xylophone

[Skeptic7]

As a "vegan" for 31 years (or so I thought) THIS SUX! Have noticed it on many wines recently. No way giving up red wine tho! Guess I'm just an ovo-lacto vegetarian for all these years after all.

 

Lindeman's Cawarra Cab-Merlot 2019 bought today. Egg & Milk and traces may remain. Ewwww. ???? 555

 

 

[xylophone]

9 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

As a "vegan" for 31 years (or so I thought) THIS SUX! Have noticed it on many wines recently. No way giving up red wine tho! Guess I'm just an ovo-lacto vegetarian for all these years after all.

 

Lindeman's Cawarra Cab-Merlot 2019 bought today. Egg & Milk and traces may remain. Ewwww. ???? 555

 

 

Wine drinkers often ask about the ‘milk products’ which can be used in winemaking, and which are often declared on the back-labels of wine bottles. This is usually in small type, hidden away at the bottom among the mandatory information such as contents, alcohol and standard drinks.

 

Milk itself is not often used in winemaking, but a milk by-product called casein is. It can be used as a fining agent as well as egg whites.

 

Fining processes are used to clarify wine. The winemaker adds a small quantity of casein to the wine, which is mixed thoroughly, and then left to settle. Unstable proteins, which might otherwise cause a haze if left in the wine, are removed electrolytically. In other words, the casein molecules are electrically attracted to the protein molecules and they stick together and precipitate, ie. they fall to the bottom of the tank of wine, and the wine is racked or drained off, leaving the lees behind. Hence the fining agents are omitted. They don’t remain part of the wine.

 

The warning on the label is there to protect the winery against the possibility of litigation if someone has a seriously bad reaction caused by milk residue, which is something that I have never heard of happening. There should not be any residue in the wine but the possibility cannot be entirely ruled out. For the vast majority of drinkers, it’s not something to be concerned about.

 

This fining has no effect on the taste or healthfulness of the wine, but a clear, bright-looking wine is much more pleasant to contemplate than one which is murky.

 

Also wine has been made this way for eons and you are not dead yet, so continue to enjoy one of the finest drinks around!!

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by xylophone

[xylophone]

2 hours ago, BigStar said:

I don't see "egg" listed as one of the ingredients on any of the wines I normally drink, however. So I assume Laughing Bird appeals more to those taste buds appreciate their egg brought out a bit more prominently.

See the post listed by Skeptic7 and it would seem that in this day and age the fining agents have to be listed!! 

[BigStar]

28 minutes ago, xylophone said:

See the post listed by Skeptic7 and it would seem that in this day and age the fining agents have to be listed!! 

Not seeing the agents listed yet on the wines I have at present. But I appreciate your explanation.

Edited July 28, 2021 by BigStar

[BigStar]

50 minutes ago, xylophone said:

Last time I looked it said fruit wine so I will look again!!

 

Me too. I'm sure you're correct. We're referring to the Laughing Bird Dry Red sold so cheaply and commonly. If it were a real wine, it would have the type of real wine it is. I haven't seen any real wine sold under the Laughing Bird label, but I think it does exist.

Edited July 28, 2021 by BigStar

[Skeptic7]

19 minutes ago, xylophone said:

This fining has no effect on the taste or healthfulness of the wine, but a clear, bright-looking wine is much more pleasant to contemplate than one which is murky.

 

Also wine has been made this way for eons and you are not dead yet, so continue to enjoy one of the finest drinks around!!

Yes, TBH was peripherally aware for some time, but only recently been noticing it on labels. Also known for decades that animal fats or byproducts are used in some beers. Not ever giving up beer either! ????

[BaanOz]

The Mrs used to like a drop or two of Mont Clair before the pancreatitis.

Edit: Now the closest to red is those occasional couple drops of bitters in some lemon and lime.

 

 

 

Edited July 28, 2021 by BaanOz

[xylophone]

23 minutes ago, BigStar said:

Me too. I'm sure you're correct. We're referring to the Laughing Bird Dry Red sold so cheaply and commonly. If it were a real wine, it would have the type of real wine it is. I haven't seen any real wine sold under the Laughing Bird label, but I think it does exist.

You may be onto something because I was also sure that I'd seen it labelled as a fruit wine, and it was "Laughing Bird Dry Red", but getting onto the Cranswick Estate website, I noticed that they've got another range of wines, whereby the actual grape variety is on the label, i.e. "Shiraz" for example, and that may well be an upgraded wine from the one which used to be a fruit wine, if indeed I'm correct??

 

More research needed Holmes!

[Puccini]

9 hours ago, xylophone said:

It stands for Grenache/Shiraz (Syrah)/Mourvedre, and that blend is very often labelled GSM in Australia, but it is in fact a blend that is very common and well liked in the Rhône (France) from whence it originated.

Thank you. Sounds interesting, I like all three grapes that are included in this blend. Will give it a try when I come across it.

[millymoopoo]

18 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Here those same bottles are 300 to 400% higher.

Agreed..!

Possibly a lot of import duty, I don't know the rate.?

Possibly also going through several 'middle men' all extracting their percentage.!

And don't forget, Thailand is not a wine nation, it's all new to their culture, compared to Europe for example.

Still doesn't excuse the pricing.

[xylophone]

6 hours ago, millymoopoo said:

Agreed..!

Possibly a lot of import duty, I don't know the rate.?

Possibly also going through several 'middle men' all extracting their percentage.!

And don't forget, Thailand is not a wine nation, it's all new to their culture, compared to Europe for example.

Still doesn't excuse the pricing.

Some information on tax and excise duty, and other taxes applied to wines here, along with some info on fruit wine.........very complicated!!!!!

 

Importing Alcohol into Thailand……

http://www.siamdevelopment.com/regulatory-services-in-thailand-company-registration/company-registration-thailand/import-alcohol-in-thailand/ 

 

AND…………..

The current effects of excise tax felt in the retail sector are most likely to be fruit wines, explains Bart Duijkers, Area Director – South for major distributor Bangkok Beer and Beverages (BB&B).

 

“The wine in question is categorised as ‘fruit wine’, which by law is normal wine mixed with at least 15% fruit juice, mainly apple, pineapple, passionfruit juice and so on,” he explains.

 

“Up until September last year this category enjoyed very low excise taxes, which are levied on many products including wines. Due to this ‘fruit wine’ category becoming very popular the government decided to raise the tax on this category which resulted in approximately 30% price increases.

 

Identifying fruit wines shelved among genuine wines in stores has often been perceived as a tricky practice, though Mr Duijkers notes that it is a lot easier than most people think.

 

“Wines which are in the fruit wine category are always marked ’fruit wine’ on the back label but most labels by law cannot mention the grape variety, such as pinot noir and so on, so usually the label simply refers to wine as a ‘dry white’ or ‘bold red’ or similar terms,” he says.

 

In short, the new form of excise tax has levelled the playing field among alcohol products. The tax instituted with effect from Sept 16 last year (2017) saw all wines, and other alcohol products, taxed on percentage volume of pure alcohol, not the prices charged in the market. (See Excise Dept schedule here; full Excise Act here.).

 

I will add that a certain importer of red fruit wines adds what they call, "dark fruits" to them..........blackcurrants, plums, blackberry etc to ensure the wine qualifies as fruit wine and also to give the wine a bit of "body".

 

[huangnon]

On 7/28/2021 at 2:06 PM, jacko45k said:

I think they are awful but Mrs is into the glass before bed health kick... what do I know, I drink SML. BUT... don't go near some local attempt Hola Velvet Red.... you will regret!

Serving suggestion: Alfresco, straight from the bottle. w/ fingerless gloves next to a burning oil drum.

[Skeptic7]

Laughing Bird Classic Dry Red 1.5L. Product of Australia. 

IS a "red fruit wine" as indicated on the back label...lower right corner. Pics snapped today in-store. 

 

 

[xylophone]

On 7/28/2021 at 4:21 PM, cyril sneer said:

says it's 100% shiraz on here

 

https://winelovebangkok.com/laughing-bird-dry-red

 

also nothing on the label when I buy it says fruit wine (like the fruit wines)

 

14 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

Laughing Bird Classic Dry Red 1.5L. Product of Australia. 

IS a "red fruit wine" as indicated on the back label...lower right corner. Pics snapped today in-store. 

 

 

Well done, and I took my reading glasses to the wine store today to have a look at the back label and also spotted, "Red Fruit Wine Product", so we are in agreement here.

 

I clicked on the link provided by @cyril sneer and on the website description of the wine it said it was 100% Shiraz, so they obviously don't know their wines, and it was from a wine supplier in Bangkok, so that doesn't surprise me.

 

Cranswick do make a Laughing Bird varietal wine, and it is clearly labelled in large letters with the grape variety used, on the front label, so I suspect that is their "bona fide" range of real wines.

 

I also checked on another wine which I call the fruit wine which I may have been a little hasty on, because there are two similar wines out there from the same vineyard, one called "Rumours" and one called "Gossips" and I believe it's the latter which is the fruit wine.

[KannikaP]

Cheap & decent do not belong in the same sentence!    LOL

[Bruno123]

On 7/27/2021 at 5:06 AM, wwest5829 said:

As has been observed individual palates/tastes' differ. while I have enjoyed very nice red wines in my travels, I have been reduced to the Aussie Mont Clare box wine for the "house" wine. That said, I have a few bottles of Eagle Creek Merlot and Shiraz which I find affordable and good for my taste. I left two bottles of Margaux wines with my Sons in the US to drink upon learning of my demise ... those bottles are now priced in the hundreds (USD).

 

Tesco were recently selling for 830 baht:

 

 

Now possibly up to 1600 baht.

[topt]

6 hours ago, Bruno123 said:

 

Tesco were recently selling for 830 baht:

 

 

Now possibly up to 1600 baht.

Yes I noticed that at Tesco Nua in Pattaya where any/all remaining stock of Tesco Finest which had been on a fair discount were back up to their previous pre sell off prices. 

 

I doubt the wine in the picture you posted bears much resemblance to the ones @wwest5829 was referring to other than coming from the same region unfortunately! 

[Espanol]

On 7/27/2021 at 7:39 AM, DBath said:

I’m a beer lover, so I don’t know a lot about wines, I prefer a good cabernet every now and then. I’m moving the La Rioja region on Aug 1st and have heard good things about the wines produce in that part of Spain. Can anyone here summarize what are the key differences of these wines versus what you might find at the upper middle of the range produced in the US? I’ve heard one can get good wine very cheap in La Riojas, particularly in Logroño. 

 

Rioja and Ribera de Duero are best red wine wines in Spain and a must in any Spanish bar or restaurant.

 

As a Spanish aficionado I highly recommend them and those are the wines that I bring with me in my luggage when I travel to Thailand, as well as some cheese and Iberic ham.

 

 

[Bruno123]

2 hours ago, topt said:

Yes I noticed that at Tesco Nua in Pattaya where any/all remaining stock of Tesco Finest which had been on a fair discount were back up to their previous pre sell off prices. 

 

I doubt the wine in the picture you posted bears much resemblance to the ones @wwest5829 was referring to other than coming from the same region unfortunately! 

I too am sure that it is likely not the best example. But then you aren't paying similar prices either.

[topt]

53 minutes ago, Espanol said:

Rioja and Ribera de Duero are best red wine wines in Spain and a must in any Spanish bar or restaurant.

They were a must in my wine rack back in UK but unfortunately relatively expensive here for decent versions. Even the latter was not cheap in the UK - if you could find it 15 years ago.