11 minutes ago, jacko45k said:

That is worrying. On one hand so many claiming we have zero Omicron deaths, yet this 'unexplained' number of deaths. Suggesting a cover up?

Deaths lag infections. Recorded deaths lag deaths. 

 

In other words, it takes time to record a Covid death, especially if the victim dies at home. 

Just now, Danderman123 said:

Deaths lag infections. Recorded deaths lag deaths. 

 

In other words, it takes time to record a Covid death, especially if the victim dies at home. 

The deaths are already being logged if the Excess deaths is rising... what may lag is the diagnosis. Usually that is only a matter of days.....

My feeling is that Omicron indeed is milder than Delta. The sample we have so far in South Africa should not be much different than the younger unvaccinateds of six months ago who were hit with Delta. But I am not seeing a single doctor reporting that Omicron is as bad as Delta.

 

The unsettling reports about cases involving children may indicate future bad news, though.

 

But …. There are always news reports about the virus attacking young people, but the final reports always show the vast majority of cases killing old people.

3 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

The science community recommends getting a booster to maximize protection against Omicron.

 

Do you disagree?

So are you saying that every scientist in the Science community are recommending getting a booster against Omicron? 

4 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

The fraud case has nothing to do with the Pfizer vaccine.

Correct, but why would anyone trust a convicted criminal?

On 12/9/2021 at 1:50 PM, Mac Mickmanus said:

Why would you want to know that , that's not really any of your business 

I have an inquiring mind ????

2 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

So are you saying that every scientist in the Science community are recommending getting a booster against Omicron? 

It's called the " Scientific Consensus". 

2 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

Correct, but why would anyone trust a convicted criminal?

Every major corporation probably has had a fraud conviction at some point. 

4 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

Every major corporation probably has had a fraud conviction at some point. 

But they don't have a vaccine where they cannot be held responsible for the outcome 

18 minutes ago, Danderman123 said:

It's called the " Scientific Consensus". 

Really! Theres enough leading scientists around the world questioning the safety and efficacy of the vaccine and calling for vaccinations to stop. 

On 12/9/2021 at 7:03 AM, cyril sneer said:

i've heard it starts off weak then kills you a few months later

Really ???? Given it has not been around a few months to support this theory was it the local fortune teller that told you this  or perhaps you read it in your tea leaves .....

35 minutes ago, Tonypandy said:

But they don't have a vaccine where they cannot be held responsible for the outcome 

Nor do they have a vaccine that has saved millions of lives. 

22 minutes ago, Tonypandy said:

Really! Theres enough leading scientists around the world questioning the safety and efficacy of the vaccine and calling for vaccinations to stop. 

There are always scientists on the fringe. The problem with scientists working the fringes is they don't produce data, they just attack the data used by the mainstream scientists. 

 

Yes, sometimes scientists overturn the consensus, but they do so using the Scientific Method. Immunology requires clinical trials, but none have shown safety issues with Covid vaccines. 

3 hours ago, monty1412 said:

Really ???? Given it has not been around a few months to support this theory was it the local fortune teller that told you this  or perhaps you read it in your tea leaves .....

It wasn’t a serious post.

On 12/9/2021 at 10:03 AM, Danderman123 said:

There is a big contradiction between hospitals filling up, and a mild virus.

Not necessarily, as your very next paragraph points out.

 

Many (if not most) of them were not being admitted because of Covid and it was only discovered on admission that they had Covid, precisely because the infections they had were mild or even asymptomatic.

3 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

There are always scientists on the fringe. The problem with scientists working the fringes is they don't produce data, they just attack the data used by the mainstream scientists. 

 

Yes, sometimes scientists overturn the consensus, but they do so using the Scientific Method. Immunology requires clinical trials, but none have shown safety issues with Covid vaccines. 

Are you saying there are no safety issues with Covid vaccines? 

1 hour ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

Not necessarily, as your very next paragraph points out.

 

Many (if not most) of them were not being admitted because of Covid and it was only discovered on admission that they had Covid, precisely because the infections they had were mild or even asymptomatic.

You are not exactly on point.

 

It has been reported repeatedly that hospitals in South Africa are filling up. If true, why?

1 hour ago, Tonypandy said:

Are you saying there are no safety issues with Covid vaccines? 

No medication is 100% safe.

 

More to the point, I get that you are an anti-Vaxxer, and you are desperately trying to misinform people here about vaccines that can save them from an agonizing death.  If you understood how dangerous Covid is, and the process by which it kills people, perhaps you might want to save lives, rather than engage in your fairly crazy Right To Die campaign.

 

The world is fighting Covid, with the exception of a tiny minority who are mostly misinformed but keep the epidemic alive by serving as carriers for Covid, until it kills them.

On 12/9/2021 at 11:29 AM, AustinRacing said:

What were the two Thai women doing in Nigeria?

According to reports I've seen from various sources including Thai PBS World, they were translators working for a religious organization, attending a church meeting in Lagos.

 

2 more Omicron cases detected in Thailand

16 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

No medication is 100% safe.

 

More to the point, I get that you are an anti-Vaxxer, and you are desperately trying to misinform people here about vaccines that can save them from an agonizing death.  If you understood how dangerous Covid is, and the process by which it kills people, perhaps you might want to save lives, rather than engage in your fairly crazy Right To Die campaign.

 

The world is fighting Covid, with the exception of a tiny minority who are mostly misinformed but keep the epidemic alive by serving as carriers for Covid, until it kills them.

You don't need to be a scientist to state that no medicine is 100% safe. But these covid vaccines have caused more deaths and adverse reactions than all other vaccinations put together in the last decade, and these covid vaccines have only been around for less than two years. 

 

Your claim that the world is fighting covid with only a tiny minority misinformed, that is misinformation. Only 42% of the world is fully vaccinated, so you may want to check again who is in the minority 

 

2 minutes ago, Tonypandy said:

You don't need to be a scientist to state that no medicine is 100% safe. But these covid vaccines have caused more deaths and adverse reactions than all other vaccinations put together in the last decade, and these covid vaccines have only been around for less than two years. 

 

Your claim that the world is fighting covid with only a tiny minority misinformed, that is misinformation. Only 42% of the world is fully vaccinated, so you may want to check again who is in the minority 

 

You are not thinking clearly. With 42% of 8 billion people getting vaccinated in a short time, wouldn't you be shocked if there weren't a significant number of adverse reactions? 

 

Here is some data for you:

 

1 in 1,000,000 UK residents have died after vaccination. 

 

1 in 1864 UK residents have died from Covid. 

 

Looking at those numbers, I wonder why you spend your time worrying about vaccines rather than Covid. You can help save lives by encouraging vaccination. 

16 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

You are not exactly on point.

 

It has been reported repeatedly that hospitals in South Africa are filling up. If true, why?

According to the South African Health Minister Joe Phaahla, in an article published just today, it's simply a consequence of the increased infections.

 

Quote

"Preliminary data does suggest that while there is increasing rate of hospitalisation ... it looks like it is purely because of the numbers rather than as a result of any severity of the variant itself, this Omicron," he said.

The same article also characterises him as saying that:

 

Quote

... the signs on severity were positive.

South Africa sees positive signs amid omicron wave

 

Also, a Reuters article yesterday about the findings in a report from Tshwane, South Africa says the following:

 

Quote

Early hospital data from South Africa shows less than a third of patients admitted for COVID-19 during the latest wave linked to the Omicron variant are suffering severe illness, compared with two thirds in the early stages of the last two waves.

Severe illness in S. Africa's Omicron outbreak lower than past waves

 

Although the report also cautions that, "It may take a few weeks for hospitalisation outcomes to accumulate."

 

Well I see this 9th omicron thread is degenerating splendidly.  ????  

2 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

You don't need to be a scientist to state that no medicine is 100% safe. But these covid vaccines have caused more deaths and adverse reactions than all other vaccinations put together in the last decade

Even if what you say is true, it is disingenuous in the context that I doubt more vaccinations of any other type, have been administered in the quantities the Covid ones have. Over  8 billion. That makes the adverse reactions minimal in relation. 

You are building your own Strawman.

 

2 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

The adverse reactions and deaths only prove that the vaccine is unsafe. Many of those who died would still be here today if they hadn't been vaccinated. Many of those who died with Covid would have died anyway through natural causes. Are mortality rates around the world much higher than previous years? 

 

You mention 1 in a million have died in UK from the vaccine, based on this with 60 million vaccinated you say 60 people died from the vaccines. ONS states 1656 deaths through till September. Far higher than you claim. 

 

Death rates in the UK from covid when the government decided to vaccinate children 12 to 18 was 2 in a million, now figures show in boys under 18 heart problems after the vaccine of 67.9 in every million and 8.6 per million for female. But the government still overruled thier vaccine committee experts and rolled it out. 

 

As usual, you are posting misinformation.

2 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

The adverse reactions and deaths only prove that the vaccine is unsafe. Many of those who died would still be here today if they hadn't been vaccinated. Many of those who died with Covid would have died anyway through natural causes. Are mortality rates around the world much higher than previous years? 

 

You mention 1 in a million have died in UK from the vaccine, based on this with 60 million vaccinated you say 60 people died from the vaccines. ONS states 1656 deaths through till September. Far higher than you claim. 

 

Death rates in the UK from covid when the government decided to vaccinate children 12 to 18 was 2 in a million, now figures show in boys under 18 heart problems after the vaccine of 67.9 in every million and 8.6 per million for female. But the government still overruled thier vaccine committee experts and rolled it out. 

 

Since you're unwilling to post data supporting your false insinuation regarding excess deaths here it is.

 

https://www.who.int/data/stories/the-true-death-toll-of-covid-19-estimating-global-excess-mortality

More positive news out today re Omicron posted in another thread:

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/south-african-doctors-see-signs-omicron-is-milder-than-delta/2021/12/11/6463d964-5a57-11ec-8396-5552bef55c3c_story.html

14 hours ago, Tonypandy said:

I understand fully what is going on, people have different views and that is fine. Only time will tell who is correct. 

Without action, there may well not be many left to say 'I told you so'......

11 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

as anti-Vaxxers die from Covid. It must be unpleasant to lose every day. 

The more anti vaxxers who remove themselves from the reproduction cycle and the gene pool the better it becomes for the rest of us!

It is self selection culling at it's best.

3 hours ago, fangless said:

The more anti vaxxers who remove themselves from the reproduction cycle and the gene pool the better it becomes for the rest of us!

It is self selection culling at it's best.

Absolutely beautiful statement.  

 

If someone doesn't think that COVID kills or can leave you with lifelong, life changing symptoms then they can roll the dice.  Darwin tells us all about you.  

 

Thrice vaccinated, nothing has fallen off yet.  ????