Warning. Covid19 Thai Insurance.

[kennw]

18 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

If your not sick and not receiving treatment, then why should they pay for your isolation ?

 

I am not protecting insurance companies, I am insured, but if infected and was at a hospital that picked it up, I would be putting my foot down to be isolating at home, rightfully so, if I am not being treated for a sickness if that makes sense.

 

Naturally if I am sick and being treated in the hospital, that is a different story, isn't it ?

 

Hotels are not hospitals.

 

If your not sick and not receiving treatment, then why should they pay for your isolation ?

Answer! Because it is Thai Law that you isolate in a hospital, the same government that set the "must have covid insurance law" as condition of entry. And the same policy that Thai Pass approves for your entry. 

[Tropicalevo]

18 hours ago, tlcwaterfall said:

Genuine tourists do not have the option of isolating at home. 

They do when they rent a villa.

We have had 8 or 9 occasions now where the villa guests have quarantined in their villa (home).

[Tropicalevo]

12 minutes ago, ding said:

I've heard reports that there are no 'hospitels' yet due to unclear requirements. Are there actual hotels that qualify for quarantine?

Yes there are hospitels.

A number have been identified in various newspaper articles.

If asymptomatic or mild symptoms, one can also quarantine in a private villa as if booked via Airbnb and others.

Some larger hotels also have private villas but there may be issues regarding using the shared open spaces.

[tlcwaterfall]

9 minutes ago, Tropicalevo said:

They do when they rent a villa.

We have had 8 or 9 occasions now where the villa guests have quarantined in their villa (home).

Great but most tourists book hotels.

[4MyEgo]

15 minutes ago, kennw said:

If your not sick and not receiving treatment, then why should they pay for your isolation ?

Answer! Because it is Thai Law that you isolate in a hospital, the same government that set the "must have covid insurance law" as condition of entry. And the same policy that Thai Pass approves for your entry. 

Your confusing the two, i.e. one is a health insurance policy that will cover you if you are "sick", not infected with the virus, e.g. you could be asymptomatic and have no symptoms, therefore you will not be prescribed with any drugs or care, therefore you are not being treated which therefore isn't part of your health care policy.

 

Yes the government mandated this policy for isolation/quarantine, look at it another way, you have insurance for the treatment of Covid, however you tell your health insurer that you have tested positive for Covid, but are not sick, you are well, and the government said I must stay in quarantine in my hotel, do you honestly think the insurer is going to pay for your hotel accommodation, I should think not, why, because you are not sick, albeit it the government makes you isolate/quarantine, this is nothing to do with health insurance because you are not sick, you are carrying an infectious disease, that is all, you are not being treated for it, and the government doesn't want you on the streets spreading it, again, nothing to do with the health insurer.

 

If you don't get it, can't help you, this is a problem with the government and the health insurer shouldn't have to pay for it, period.   

 

Edit: One the other hand, if your sick and require hospitalisation and are on meds etc, then the insurer will pay, fair is fair. It's like you going to work having this virus and spreading it to all your work mates, would that be fair on your boss having to pay for their sick leave and effecting his/her business when he could have told you not to come to work and if you didn't have any sick leave left, you would cry foul.

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by 4MyEgo

[sandyf]

15 hours ago, daveAustin said:

Who will categorically cover the above scenario? List them here please. Not a dig. Would genuinely like to know. 

This is what I got from AIG, note Item 3.

 

 

[ding]

56 minutes ago, sandyf said:

This is what I got from AIG, note Item 3.

 

 

 

Thanks sandyf. $150 a day sounds good - about 5,000B.

But I've read it's usually 10,000B a day - from a previous post;

https://scandasia.com/warning-against-traveling-to-thailand/

 

AXA advertises they cover asymptomatic quarantine but I haven't seen the policy.

[stigar]

16 hours ago, dj230 said:

Manulife covered me for quarantine due to covid-19, medical treatment, quarantine in a medical facility or hotel/food/travel delays (plane ticket) etc. , when I planned my trip I wasn't going to rely on a Thailand company to insure me if things went south. I paid more, but I was completely covered. 

 

From what I see people are just trying to buy the cheapest insurance they can get that qualifies from for entry into Thailand and then they're hit with a bill and get no coverage. It's cheap for a reason, you get less coverage.

I have incurance from my home country that covers everyhing.It only cost about 6000 bath a year.

I really dont understand why people buy incurance from a thai company.

[Thalueng]

When I went through 14 days sandbox in Phuket last year the rule was

1. Prepaid accommodation and tests

2. If tested positive and symptomatic: hospital, prepaid accommodation not used will be repaid, hospital covered by insurance 

3. If tested positive and asymptomatic: quarantine hotel, if different from prepaid hotel the unused will be repaid, but new hotel covered by myself

 

As I tested negative 3 times I did not experience any of the above.

 

Like others mentioned, as far as I can judge all Asian governments do not take chances when it comes to trust the rules are being followed. 

[NoshowJones]

22 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

If your not sick and not receiving treatment, then why should they pay for your isolation ?

 

I am not protecting insurance companies, I am insured, but if infected and was at a hospital that picked it up, I would be putting my foot down to be isolating at home, rightfully so, if I am not being treated for a sickness if that makes sense.

 

Naturally if I am sick and being treated in the hospital, that is a different story, isn't it ?

 

Hotels are not hospitals.

 

If any such cases involved me, they would just get told that I am not paying, then I would walk away, what would they do? Handcuff me? Get 2 or 3 guys to kidnap me and drag me to a hospital or whatever, and keep me locked up in some way for 16 days,

That would cost them a lot more than any money they could get from me, or maybe they could have me put in jail.

Edited February 12, 2022 by possum1931

[4MyEgo]

1 hour ago, possum1931 said:

If any such cases involved me, they would just get told that I am not paying, then I would walk away, what would they do? Handcuff me? Get 2 or 3 guys to kidnap me and drag me to a hospital or whatever, and keep me locked up in some way for 16 days,

That would cost them a lot more than any money they could get from me, or maybe they could have me put in jail.

Sounds like a big scam going on.

[servantworker]

I  am waiting for my day1 test n' go result in about an hour. My Tune policy says, "The expenses of Quarantined with no symptoms or treatment is not covered under the policy unless the insured is tested positive to COVID-19 and that government regulation requires hospitalization for monitoring."

 

If I'm positive I'll let you know what happens. ???? 

[BritTim]

8 hours ago, bluemoon58 said:

This ain't no endemic and never will be. They need to get their definitions correct! An endemic is a localised outbreak, which this most certainly is not!

 

adjective

 

1. 1.

   (of a disease or condition) regularly found among particular people or in a certain area.
    
2. 2.

   (of a plant or animal) native and restricted to a certain place.

Endemicity absolutely can refer to pathogens that are global or almost global. As an example, the influenza virus is endemic globally. Whether something is epidemic (an unacceptable pathogenic infection in specific areas), pandemic (similar, but widely distributed), or endemic (present, but considered acceptable without extraordinary health measures) has to do with the pathogen's impact, not its geographical spread. In some countries, SARS-CoV-2 appears already to be changing from epidemic/pandemic status to endemic. Typically, so far, this is in countries with very high levels of vaccination. Examples are New Zealand and Portugal.

[connda]

19 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

That is the point. It is at the discretion of some officials, whether or not you are required to be hospitalized, regardless of whether you have symptoms. Hotels are getting commissions for referring positive tests to hospitals.

 

It appears to be a total hospital/insurance company/hotel/Prayuth/

Anutin scam. Who knows how much money is being made under the table, and how much tourism is being lost, as a result of this cowardice, ignorance and mindless greed. 

And this is a scam. 
And to think that scams are solely the purvey of jet-ski operators and taxi drivers.  At minimum of 100,000 THB per pop.   Hell, every body wants a piece of that action from the top to the bottom of the scam food-cycle! 

[thecyclist]

Would be wise to feign illness :coughing fits, body aches, headache, etc. 

Also what does a perfectly healthy person do for 10 days in a hospital bed?You get sick (it at least mentally) from not being sick. 

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, ding said:

Thanks sandyf. $150 a day sounds good - about 5,000B.

But I've read it's usually 10,000B a day - from a previous post;

https://scandasia.com/warning-against-traveling-to-thailand/

 

AXA advertises they cover asymptomatic quarantine but I haven't seen the policy.

10K/day gets thrown about like it is fact, there are always those that want to make out things are worse than they are. If problems arise you deal  with it.

When I booked to come back I had to  pay for 15 days quarantine, that was reduced to 7 days but Agoda refused a full refund. I got the bank to step in and they got the balance, a pain in the neck but I paid by credit card in case of problems.

A question of being prepared for the worst and hope for the best.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

20 hours ago, dj230 said:

https://www.coverme.com/content/dam/affinity/coverme/english/documents/coverme-covid-19-pandemic-travel-plan-policy.pdf

page 8, I called and specifically asked if I would be covered, they said yes. 

 

Now re-reading it, it actually mentions quarantine due to positive covid test OR contact tracing, so I am guessing if you were in close contact with someone who tested and had to isolate, you'd be reimbursed as well.

 

That appears to be a policy only for Canadian travelers issued by a Canadian insurance company, Manulife.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

19 hours ago, kimamey said:

I'm not sure if this counts from AXA Thailand.

 

 Covid-19 > Is medical expense for COVID-19 treatment in “Field Hospital” and “Hospitel” covered?
Yes. Medical expenses incurred in facilities designated as “Field Hospital” and “Hospitel” by the Ministry of Public Health for treating COVID-19 patient is covered.

 

 Covid-19 > If I am tested positive for COVID-19 but I don’t have any symptom. Will AXA pay for the medical expense?
AXA will cover for outpatient and inpatient medical expense incurred based on medical necessity and following the guideline published by Ministry of Public Health.

For hospitalization, AXA uses a combination of factors including symptoms, age and underlying medical conditions to determine if the hospitalization is medically necessary. Only medically necessary inpatient expenses will be covered by AXA.

 

It's still a bit vague but it seems they might. I haven't looked at the "guidelines published by the Ministry of Public Health"

 

The question is, was that guidance issued before or after the TH government recently revised their policy on COVID hospitalizations and its follow-on effect on what local insurers will and won't cover.

 

The other day, I read the entire policy document for AXA Tune, which was listed on the insurance website as covering asymptomatic cases (again, that reference probably posted prior to the government's latest missive).

 

Nowhere in the entire AXA Tune policy document are any of the following terms even mentioned -- COVID, quarantine, hospitel, etc etc.

 

The only language in the policy related to medically necessary treatment provided in a regular hospital or medical facility (with a definition that wouldn't cover hospitels) or medical clinic.

 

Hard to find anything in their policy language that would come even close to covering having an asymptomatic COVID infection quarantined sitting around a hotel room with delivered food for 10 days.

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[dj230]

24 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The question is, was that guidance issued before or after the TH government recently revised their policy on COVID hospitalizations and its follow-on effect on what local insurers will and won't cover.

 

The other day, I read the entire policy document for AXA Tune, which was listed on the insurance website as covering asymptomatic cases (again, that reference probably posted prior to the government's latest missive).

 

Nowhere in the entire AXA Tune policy document are any of the following terms even mentioned -- COVID, quarantine, hospitel, etc etc.

 

The only language in the policy related to medically necessary treatment provided in a regular hospital or medical facility (with a definition that wouldn't cover hospitels) or medical clinic.

 

Hard to find anything in their policy language that would come even close to covering having an asymptomatic COVID infection quarantined sitting around a hotel room with delivered food for 10 days.

 

 

 

my insurance was from Canada, you have to read the policy for the insurance you buy to see if you’re covered 

 

my point was too many people just buy the cheapest travel insurance they can and then are shocked they’re not covered for certain claims. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, sandyf said:

When I booked to come back I had to  pay for 15 days quarantine,

 

What was the actual daily rate for that original 15 day booking? (even  though you didn't end up using all of the days...)

[stigar]

On 2/11/2022 at 9:14 AM, dj230 said:

Get good travel insurance and you'll be covered, you get what you pay for with insurance. 

 

It states in the policy what is covered and what isn't. 

 

Ur rigth.Here is my policy.From my country.

Certificate+of+Insurance+-+Annual+Travel (1).pdf

[ThaiVisaCentre]

Incase anyone wonders what AXA is saying

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

17 minutes ago, dj230 said:

my insurance was from Canada, you have to read the policy for the insurance you buy to see if you’re covered 

 

my point was too many people just buy the cheapest travel insurance they can and then are shocked they’re not covered for certain claims. 

 

I agree with that in general. But, it's also true that the Thai government, its various public communications, and various Thai insurers and agencies have been far less than clear and transparent about just what the various policies will and won't cover.

 

They helped create a marketplace where the customers have a very difficult time figuring out the details of just what will and won't be covered, given all the different scenarios that can come into play -- symptomatic vs asymptomatic, quarantine in a regular hospital vs "hospitel" vs some other kind of facility. What is deemed medically necessary and what isn't, etc etc.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

11 minutes ago, ThaiVisaCentre said:

Incase anyone wonders what AXA is saying

So in short, they're NOT covering asymptomatic or mild symptom cases placed in hotel/hospitel quarantine, and, they're NOT covering quarantine due to "close contact" exposure.

 

The new guidelines from MoPH for COVID hospitalization require quite a bit of symptoms to be present  -- difficulty breathing, high fever, etc... Not just sore throat and runny nose.

 

So the insurance exclusion wouldn't necessarily only apply to those without any symptoms, but likely would also apply to those with mild symptoms who would still fall short of the hospitalization policy.

 

 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[dj230]

13 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I agree with that in general. But, it's also true that the Thai government, its various public communications, and various Thai insurers and agencies have been far less than clear and transparent about just what the various policies will and won't cover.

 

They helped create a marketplace where the customers have a very difficult time figuring out the details of just what will and won't be covered, given all the different scenarios that can come into play -- symptomatic vs asymptomatic, quarantine in a regular hospital vs "hospitel" vs some other kind of facility. What is deemed medically necessary and what isn't, etc etc.

 

 

If that is the case why would you trust that insurance company to insure you? 
 

I would never buy insurance from a company that isn’t transparent about their coverage. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

27 minutes ago, ThaiVisaCentre said:

Incase anyone wonders what AXA is saying

https://www.axa.co.th/faq-sawasdee-thailand-inbound

 

From their FAQ document linked to above:

 

"Covid-19 > If I am tested positive for COVID-19 but I don’t have any symptom. Will AXA pay for the medical expense?

 

AXA will cover for outpatient and inpatient medical expense incurred based on medical necessity and following the guideline published by Ministry of Public Health.

 

For hospitalization, AXA uses a combination of factors including symptoms, age and underlying medical conditions to determine if the hospitalization is medically necessary. Only medically necessary inpatient expenses will be covered by AXA."

 

 

Covid-19 > If I’m tested positive for COVID-19 and have to be quarantined in the hotel. Will AXA pay for this hotel cost?

No, AXA will not cover for hotel accommodation cost. AXA will however cover for other medical costs such as physician fees and medicine,"

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 minutes ago, dj230 said:

If that is the case why would you trust that insurance company to insure you? 
 

I would never buy insurance from a company that isn’t transparent about their coverage. 

 

I don't. And that's part of the reason why, I haven't traveled internationally or left Thailand for the past two+ years.  Because the whole environment has been fraught with uncertainty.

 

My own  health insurer HAD been reasonably clear -- my policy covered MEDICAL expenses required if I happened to contract COVID, which is what I needed to know as someone living in Thailand.

 

But the whole inbound travel scheme and the varying government policies about what happens when someone returning to Thailand happens to test positive for COVID created an entirely new and different set of unknowns.

 

 

Edited February 12, 2022 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Em150]

20 hours ago, kimamey said:

I'm not sure if this counts from AXA Thailand.

 

 Covid-19 > Is medical expense for COVID-19 treatment in “Field Hospital” and “Hospitel” covered?
Yes. Medical expenses incurred in facilities designated as “Field Hospital” and “Hospitel” by the Ministry of Public Health for treating COVID-19 patient is covered.

 

 Covid-19 > If I am tested positive for COVID-19 but I don’t have any symptom. Will AXA pay for the medical expense?
AXA will cover for outpatient and inpatient medical expense incurred based on medical necessity and following the guideline published by Ministry of Public Health.

For hospitalization, AXA uses a combination of factors including symptoms, age and underlying medical conditions to determine if the hospitalization is medically necessary. Only medically necessary inpatient expenses will be covered by AXA.

 

It's still a bit vague but it seems they might. I haven't looked at the "guidelines published by the Ministry of Public Health"

So does anybody know if AXA is ok and can recommend? Thanks. Got 15 people coming for a beach wedding in Samui in April and would like to recommend a good policy 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 minutes ago, Em150 said:

So does anybody know if AXA is ok and can recommend? Thanks. Got 15 people coming for a beach wedding in Samui in April and would like to recommend a good policy 

Read their FAQs document via the link in my post just above.

 

[ding]

6 hours ago, stigar said:

I have incurance from my home country that covers everyhing.It only cost about 6000 bath a year.

I really dont understand why people buy incurance from a thai company.

Clearly you're not from the country I'm leaving- America. ????

 

Insurance here doesn't cover what it's supposed to, where it's supposed to, when you need it to.

 

Medical insurance here is actually much better than it used to be years previous. Premiums are tax subsidized up front and about 75% cheaper in my case. They can't deny coverage to people with pre-existing conditions like they used to now (which is most Americans).

Cheers!

Edited February 12, 2022 by ding