THE WEEK THAT WAS Show some humanity, support Ukraine and don't blame ordinary Russians

[soalbundy]

5 hours ago, jesimps said:

 I bet the author of this tirade votes Democrat or Lab/Lib/Green or Scots Nat in the UK. Most Russians I've ever encountered here have been big miserable troll-like oafs.

 

you visit the wrong porn sites

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Well, that was quite an EPIC rant aimed at expats here...  Someone got up on the wrong side of the bed lately.

 

I'd try to say something in response, but not sure I'd even know where to begin... apart from the headline:

 

Show some humanity, support Ukraine and don't blame ordinary Russians

 

...which I basically agree with, except in the case of those "ordinary" Russians being the ones with super-yachts now fleeing to the Maldives, or the other "ordinary" ones spouting Putin "we're going after the Nazis" propaganda all over the forum.  ????

 

 

Edited March 5, 2022 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[The Hammer2021]

The problem is that every 'ordinary ' Russian I spoke to over the last 15 years love and Putin and take no responsibility  or recognise the the poisonings and murders by Putin's thugs. When they killed an innocent couple in England the Pattaya Russians claimed it was a British  Plot...The Russians I've talked to here are ultra Putin nationalists...

[Jingthing]

I don't have much of a problem with the current Roosterrant^TM but I do have a few comments.

 

I agree don't hate on Russians in general as you don't know their individual stories.

 

HOWEVER, their behavior on Pattaya "baht buses" is notoriously atrocious at least when they used to dominate in numbers.

 

There is no mistaking that of all the f-rang groupings the Russians were the most obvious mask shirkers, indoors and out. 

 

At the time of Putin's theft of Crimea, there was no mistaking the obnoxious chest puffing mood of the Russian tourists here, many sporting pro Putin t-shirts. That was distasteful then but now I reckon I reckon more are ashamed and embarrassed if abroad, but more worried about getting access to cash. 

 

I can't speak for all by as BBQ I can say confidently that I know the Thai word for the baht bus trucks. If I was in Nakhon Nowhere, I would use it. In Pattaya, they really ARE called baht buses,. Deal with it, Roast. It shows your intolerance that you don't get there are localized terms for things.

 

Cheers

Edited March 5, 2022 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, The Hammer2021 said:

The problem is that every 'ordinary ' Russian I spoke to over the last 15 years love and Putin and take no responsibility  or recognise the the poisonings and murders by Putin's thugs. When they killed an innocent couple in England the Pattaya Russians claimed it was a British  Plot...The Russians I've talked to here are ultra Putin nationalists...

Most yes.

It's a myth that most are against him.

But of course if they're abroad they understand the new pariah situation. 

It's like when the allies won WW2 you couldn't find a Nazi in Germany. Mysterious. 

[Jingthing]

1 hour ago, Screaming said:

The problem with this rhetoric is that over ninety percent of Russians support Putin and the desecration of Ukraine.

 

Well at least 70 percent anyway.

[sqwakvfr]

Watching Jens Stoltenberg,  NATO-NO ACTION TALK ONLY director,  speak on TV makes me think he needs to step aside.  In essence Jens said the invasion of Ukraine by Russia is not NATO's business.  He is right on that point.  Then where is the UN?  In the mid 1990's the UN got involved in Yugoslavia.  It is time for the blue helmets to mount a convoy into Ukraine from Poland and see if Vladimir is crazy enough to attack a UN Convoy?  Last time I checked attacking civilian targets by military forces is a war crime.  If Slovodan Milosevic was war criminal then what is Vladimir Putiin? 

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

They are invariably Thai bashers who when challenged say their Buriram girlfriend told them some "secret" home truth backing up their pitiful, ill-informed, rhetoric and hyperbole. They belittle moderate, sensible people as naive.

 

ASEAN NOW has many of them. They are thankfully drowned out by the majority of sensible posters.

I was just thinking that there are all still here. This news forum is nothing like it was a few years back, with hundreds of intelligent replies from people who like living here, it is mostly the Thai bashers who have caused all the sensible posters to go elsewhere. This News forum is a shadow of its former glory. 

[Willy Wombat]

6 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

Watching Jens Stoltenberg,  NATO-NO ACTION TALK ONLY director,  speak on TV makes me think he needs to step aside.  In essence Jens said the invasion of Ukraine by Russia is not NATO's business.  He is right on that point.  Then where is the UN?  In the mid 1990's the UN got involved in Yugoslavia.  It is time for the blue helmets to mount a convoy into Ukraine from Poland and see if Vladimir is crazy enough to attack a UN Convoy?  Last time I checked attacking civilian targets by military forces is a war crime.  If Slovodan Milosevic was war criminal then what is Vladimir Putiin? 

The UN is a feckless organisation.

 

Just ask the Bosnians, especially the ones from Srebrenica

[friendofthai]

1 hour ago, Joules said:

So these Russians who have had their vacations ruined need to go home and do something about it.  

Do exactly WHAT? Man, you should know that the point of no return has already been passed. There is no such choice as "just stop the war now". Because stopping the war means capitulation. You can't expect any Russian to want capitulation for his country.

[Stevemercer]

Evil, cruelty and bigotry will continue to flourish if good men (or even mediocre men) say nothing. The Thai Government's refusal to name or condemn Russia's actions does seem to hint at a lack of principle or concern for human values.

 

Or maybe it just reflects a lack of care about anything much beyond Thailand's border. Perhaps the government's instincts are to stay out of trouble and hope it all goes away tomorrow

 

Whatever, it is a little sad.

 

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

15 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

Watching Jens Stoltenberg,  NATO-NO ACTION TALK ONLY director,  speak on TV makes me think he needs to step aside.  In essence Jens said the invasion of Ukraine by Russia is not NATO's business.  He is right on that point.  Then where is the UN?  In the mid 1990's the UN got involved in Yugoslavia.  It is time for the blue helmets to mount a convoy into Ukraine from Poland and see if Vladimir is crazy enough to attack a UN Convoy?  Last time I checked attacking civilian targets by military forces is a war crime.  If Slovodan Milosevic was war criminal then what is Vladimir Putiin? 

 

My mother always used to say, "If wishes were horses, beggars would ride."

 

There might be/could be more of a practical role for the U.N. in this, except for the hard/cold reality that both Russia and China, as permanent members, have veto votes on the U.N. Security Council.

 

Which means any concrete action by the U.N. regarding the Russian invasion, which would have to go thru the Security Council, isn't going to happen.

 

 

[KanchanaburiGuy]

Regarding the Opening Post........ 

 

I agree, there are a lot of people who seem bent on tearing down others so they can make themselves appear superior.

 

They frequently confuse aggressiveness, vehemence, and vitriol with awareness, insight and wisdom. 

 

But I'm not sure I understand how behaving the same way talking ABOUT them......   makes one any better than they are. That concept, I must admit, mystifies me, somewhat!

. 

. 

The sad fact is, there are a lot of people who simply don't know how to put happiness into their lives.

 

Unfortunately, a lot of those people use the adrenalin rush that goes along with expressing nastiness toward others..... as their poor substitute.

 

Better to feel something than nothing, right? 

 

And the one characteristic they have in common with the habitual, everyday gossip---a person who could ruin your life, possibly!---is the fact that they don't care if what they are saying is true! Their pleasure.... how they get off.... comes from telling the story! Whether it's true or not is beside the point..... as long as they get to tell the story! 

 

Personally, I'd be thrilled if they could find a way to bring REAL happiness into their lives...... rather than feeding off this seemingly endless stream of adrenaline-inspired faux happiness they pump themselves up with, by constantly being nasty towards others!

 

I find the real thing much more satisfying than the cheap imitation! 

 

Cheers!

 

[ozimoron]

20 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I was just thinking that there are all still here. This news forum is nothing like it was a few years back, with hundreds of intelligent replies from people who like living here, it is mostly the Thai bashers who have caused all the sensible posters to go elsewhere. This News forum is a shadow of its former glory. 

I haven't been here long enough to really know. I know that some probably feel like I've been here forever but I do think the incessant gratuitous Thai bashers are toxic to the forum. Paradoxically, they rant about stuff that occurs every day in their own countries.

[connda]

1 hour ago, Joules said:

Citizens of a country are responsible for their leaders. 

Not really.  The majority within a so-called democratic country are responsible for their leaders.  Considering that I haven't voted for a major party in my adult life, none of the US "leaders" were put into office with my vote - and trust me - I feel no responsibility for their actions on the world stage.

So no.  Citizens of a country are not responsible for their leaders.  There are a minority of us who are simply aghast at our 'home country's' geopolitical agendas.  Especially when our 'home countries' invade and blow apart smaller countries just like Russia. 

One more time.  I absolutely detest Moral Relativism. The West has a blood-soaked history of imperialistic conquest.
And if no one has noticed, the US has troops (an invasion force) embedded in Northern Syria and they refuse to leave that sovereign country as they scream about "Russian Aggression."

3 Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but  do not notice the log that is in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.
Mathew 7:3-5

[bubblegum]

This is an absolute <deleted> article without any facts and should not have been written.

[Jonathan Swift]

5 hours ago, John Drake said:

Hate filled anti-American rant that employs all the bigoted stereotypes the author wants to condemn in those applying similar descriptions to Russians.

I've lived in Thailand 9 years. I'm really surprised at all the stereotype button pushing in this story by a supposed old timer who ought to know better. I've met some of the "typical" characters here, but nowhere near the seeming plague Rooster describes. I afford the story minimal credibility  because of its obvious bias and questionable story examples.

[Rocking Robert]

1 hour ago, Joules said:

I will reiterate:  Citizens of a country are responsible for their leaders.  Yeah some leaders may be tough, hardened killers, but ultimately it is the citizens who must rise up and depose such despots.  Yes, I blame the common Russians, just as I blame the average German citizen of the early 1940's for Nazi atrocities and average American citizens for the unprovoked invasion if Iraq.  

 

So these Russians who have had their vacations ruined need to go home and do something about it.  

OK so it’s the people of North Korea glad you straighten that out for me

[Lacessit]

39 minutes ago, Jonathan Swift said:

 

 

I'm hoping someone will explain to me the difference between many Russians believing Ukrainians are Nazis, and many Americans believing Trump won the 2020 election.

 

I guess if one looked at the socio-economic position of both groups, the results would be very similar.

Calling Zelensky a Nazi when he is Jewish should be a bridge too far for anyone with two brain cells.

 

I'm also battling to understand how Ukraine can be considered to be part of Russia, when it has a different language and alphabet. That's like saying Greece and Albania are one country.

 

I have sympathy for those Russians who are opposed to the war in Ukraine. I have none for those who have swallowed Putin's lies, and probably use the BS term "special military action".

[Tropposurfer]

2 hours ago, Thai Dan said:

Rant accepted.  Many valid points that people, and indeed the people that make up governments, need to consider.  I don't like censorship and I didn't see you call for that.  Kudos.  There are far too many geopolitical unknowns for just about anybody to think they have all or even most of the facts.  Racism is always ugly, and for what?  I don't even think it makes the instigators happy when they fall in that direction of diatribe.  For the rest of your points: A little self-reflection, people?  At this moment I'd hate to be either Russian or Ukrainian; it's not like any of the citizens from either was consulted by their governments, anymore than I am by mine.

 

 

Now there's a sane and balanced post Bravo. 

[RocketDog]

5 hours ago, jesimps said:

 I bet the author of this tirade votes Democrat or Lab/Lib/Green or Scots Nat in the UK. Most Russians I've ever encountered here have been big miserable troll-like oafs.

 

You may have made a valid point in that word salad somewhere but I couldn't see it. Near as I can tell you just verified the OP thesis.

 

Hope you feel better though.

[Wuvu2]

2 hours ago, Atlantis said:

@BostonRob2

Hey Rooster, nice long post, analysis and all that, but what I wanna know is:

When can I get my own column / space on aseannow where I can flout forum rules and etiquette, explicit and otherwise, without consequence?

Sure sells a lot of newspapers ???? 

[Tropposurfer]

52 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

Do exactly WHAT? Man, you should know that the point of no return has already been passed. There is no such choice as "just stop the war now". Because stopping the war means capitulation. You can't expect any Russian to want capitulation for his country.

Sadly friendofthai, the day of the Russian people being able to actually "do something" about the slow decline into autocratic insanity and national gulag has long passed. Unless millions upon millions of Russian refuse to work and stage mega-mass sit-ins, and walk out onto the streets, and stay on the streets, the arrests torturing and murders of thousands of Russian protestors by Putins neo-KGB will and most certainly would continue unabated as it has for many years. 

[Tropposurfer]

57 minutes ago, friendofthai said:

Do exactly WHAT? Man, you should know that the point of no return has already been passed. There is no such choice as "just stop the war now". Because stopping the war means capitulation. You can't expect any Russian to want capitulation for his country.

Sadly friendofthai, the day of the Russian people being able to actually "do something" about the slow decline into autocratic insanity and national gulag has long passed. Unless millions upon millions of Russian refuse to work and stage mega-mass sit-ins, and walk out onto the streets, and stay on the streets, the arrests torturing and murders of thousands of Russian protestors by Putins neo-KGB will and most certainly would continue unabated as it has for many years. 

[onthedarkside]

Various off-topic and diversionary posts and comments have been removed, along with ensuing replies.

 

[Whale]

1 hour ago, sqwakvfr said:

Then where is the UN?  In the mid 1990's the UN got involved in Yugoslavia.  It is time for the blue helmets to mount a convoy into Ukraine from Poland and see if Vladimir is crazy enough to attack a UN Convoy?

They can't, Russia have veto on the security council. Russia is the UN, its a collective of nations all equal except for on the Security council where the permanent 5 all have veto power of any Security Council proposal. Russia is one of the permanent 5. 

[sqwakvfr]

1 hour ago, Willy Wombat said:

The UN is a feckless organisation.

 

Just ask the Bosnians, especially the ones from Srebrenica

NATO is not much better.  The world is in a very sad state.

[The Hammer2021]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

I haven't been here long enough to really know. I know that some probably feel like I've been here forever but I do think the incessant gratuitous Thai bashers are toxic to the forum. Paradoxically, they rant about stuff that occurs every day in their own countries.

Exactly. Well said.

[Shocked farang]

4 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

Ordinary Russians?

 

Far and few between.   The few Russians I've met are rude and aggressive. 

 

I'm sure there are a few nice ones.

It's just I haven't met any.

I have had the same experience with Russians in Thailand (mostly Pattaya and Jomtien areas), there are some nice ones, they're are usually younger and have English language skills. 

[The Hammer2021]

2 hours ago, Atlantis said:

@BostonRob2

Hey Rooster, nice long post, analysis and all that, but what I wanna know is:

When can I get my own column / space on aseannow where I can flout forum rules and etiquette, explicit and otherwise, without consequence?

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