Electric Vehicles in Thailand

vinny41 · July 8

1 hour ago, Pib said:

Regarding ongoing EV price cuts, a news article in the 8 June 2024 Bangkok Post titled, "Chinese EV Price Cuts Get TCCT Green Light" says the Trade Competition Commission of Thailand (TCCT) has determined the price war amoung EV manaufactuers/dealerships does not violate Thailand trade competition law but rather fosters competitioin.

Summary: the Thai govt is OK-fine with the ongoing price war and those complaining about their vehicle they bought over the last year or so "now" being sold new at a much lower price will have no basis in law in filing a complaint.

Edit: and I just noticed there is a 6 June 2024 Bangkok Post news article titled, "BYD Urged to Shield EV Prices" which talks a meeting between Prime Minister and the BYD Chief Executive (a Mr Wang) on 5 June where better management of customer expectations about pricing was discussed. MR Wang was visiting Thailand and paid a courtesy visit to the PM. Mr Wang gave assurances future pricing would be appropriate and the company would find ways to help affected customers. Sounds like a happy talk meeting where nothing will change.

Both BP articles that you mention are dated July not June

And there is nothing in either article that states "

and those complaining about their vehicle they bought over the last year or so "now" being sold new at a much lower price will have no basis in law in filing a complaint. "

In fact both articles state that if you feel you have been unfairly treated by a business you should file a complaint with the Office of the Consumer Protection Board

The Thailand Consumers Council on Thursday called on BYD Auto to compensate its customers who had bought its battery electric vehicles shortly before it announced price discount campaigns.

The council’s secretary-general, Saree Ongsomwang, said the buyers of BYD cars and SUVs shortly before the price discounts were victims of unfair selling practices and should receive compensation from the manufacturer.

She said BYD’s sales personnel must have been in the know about the upcoming discount campaign and therefore they were obliged by professional etiquette to alert their customers.

The complaints prompted PM’s Office Minister Jiraporn Sindhuprai to instruct the Office of the Consumer Protection Board to conduct an investigation into whether the automaker had taken advantage of buyers, who had bought the EVs at higher prices before the new discount campaign.

https://www.nationthailand.com/business/automobile/40039380

After thw office of the Consumer Protection Board received over 70 complaints and they expect that number to increase they will be inviting Byd Dealers and the complainants in for a meetings to discuss how the issues can be mutually resolved

Edited July 8 by vinny41
add

Pib · July 8

33 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

Both BP articles that you mention are dated July not June

Yea....brain fart (typo) on the month....they are indeed July articles. The titles vs the dates are the key to finding them on the Bangkok Post.

mistral53 · July 8

6 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

They always wheel out Nissan Leafs with CHAdeMO connectors when they talk about V2G, unfortunately Nissan has now moved to CCS a standard which has not been approved for V2G.

I currently use V2L from my EV to power my house at night sometimes. My inverters are Hybrid Off-Grid meaning that they can import from the Grid (if I had a meter) but cannot export. You need an on-grid inverter which synchronizes to the Grid to be able to export.

Thailand has excess energy at night that is why it offers half price TOU rates

In the UK companies like octopus energy offer a number of rates at different times of the day which is great for people with EVs to charge their cars and for people with solar and batteries to sell back at peak demand

I would need a simple export on-grid inverter to sell power back from my EV to the Grid, but PEA prevents me doing that: they only allow a maximum of 5kW of PV on single phase and your inverter needs to be on their approved list.

Do I read this correctly that from 2 to 5 in the morning I could charge my battery from the grid @ 20.24p, and from 16 to 19 hours I could sell it back to the power company @ 38.03p? Quite some arbitrage in that pair.........😂

Bandersnatch · July 9

6 hours ago, mistral53 said:

Do I read this correctly that from 2 to 5 in the morning I could charge my battery from the grid @ 20.24p, and from 16 to 19 hours I could sell it back to the power company @ 38.03p? Quite some arbitrage in that pair.........😂

Yes you are correct.

The daily demand is known as the duck curve. I haven’t found figures for Thailand but it probably looks similar to the UK. The idea is to try and flatten the curve and reduce the need for the most expensive and polluting peaker plants coming online.

Unfortunately in Thailand the feed-in rate is a flat ฿2.2/kWh throughout the day so there is no incentive for arbitrage.

Edited July 9 by Bandersnatch

JBChiangRai · July 9

I have 18Kw of grid-tied inverters with 22Kw of panels, the grid won't take more than about 10 or 11Kw but I flatten the curve by exporting more before 9:30 and after 15:30. They are cadenced in their shutdown voltages by 1v each. They will all stay on if I am charging the car in full sunshine. I usually charge the car between 9:30 and 15:30. They also all stay on in cloudy days.

I peak about 95 Kwhr per day and average about 62.

Edited July 9 by JBChiangRai

Bandersnatch · July 9

14 hours ago, Pib said:

here in my large Bangkok moobaan of around 900 standalone homes owned by middle to high income folks that only a handfull have any type of solar, some solar panels on the roof, etc. I guess there is just no monetary incentive to do such.

One factor is that electricity is cheap in Thailand - too cheap in my opinion. EGAT has ฿1.3B of debt due to subsiding electricity prices for all. I feel that subsidies should only be directed to the poorest. Of course EGAT’s debt is nothing compared to the Oil Fuel fund which in the red about 100 billion baht from subsidising the diesel price.

Solar prices are falling. 6 years ago this panel was ฿20/W you can now pay ฿6/W

Inverter and batteries are also getting cheaper

This is the first quote I got for a Li battery ฿26,785/kWh!

If you can charge your EV at home during the day, then solar definitely makes sense.

BritManToo · July 9

8 hours ago, mistral53 said:

Do I read this correctly that from 2 to 5 in the morning I could charge my battery from the grid @ 20.24p, and from 16 to 19 hours I could sell it back to the power company @ 38.03p? Quite some arbitrage in that pair.........😂

Don't forget to add the 400bht/month charge for getting off peak electricity.

Charging my EV from solar at this very moment.

I need about 150whr, which will take 90 minutes.

Edited July 9 by BritManToo

KhunLA · July 9

16 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Don't forget to add the 400bht/month charge for getting off peak electricity.

Chrging my EV from solar at this very moment.

I need about 150whr, which will take 90 minutes.

Be careful ... it's addicting, me...

... started with drones

... then DIY drones

... more toys; RC cars & boats

... then ebike ... check

... on to E-MC

... then solar system ... check

... finally EV (car)

... constantly tempted to buy more, so far the addiction is under control, but it's one day at a time

2 down for you ... what next :coffee1:

Edited July 9 by KhunLA

BritManToo · July 9

17 minutes ago, KhunLA said:

Be careful ... it's addicting, me...

... started with drones

... then DIY drones

... more toys; RC cars & boats

... then ebike ... check

... on to E-MC

... then solar system ... check

... finally EV (car)

... constantly tempted to buy more, so far the addiction is under control, but it's one day at a time

2 down for you ... what next

I'm giving electric cars a miss at the moment.

1. I don't like driving cars.

2. I worry about price drops, maybe when they're less than 500kbht.

3. I worry about the battery warranty/life/replacement cost/fire risk.

I read these stories about manufacturers refusing to honour battery warranties, 'you hit the curb', 'you flooded the battery', then all the cars sitting quietly and bursting into flames stories, then think how often do I hit a curb in Thailand, how often does a road I drive down get flooded in monsoon ......... then think NO, I don't need that trouble, my 1997 Nissen Diesel doesn't care about any of those things.

If my eMTB battery bursts into flames, I can just hop off and walk away, it gets charged away from the house so no problem there, and when the battery wears out (after 800-1000 charges, 2-3 years) a new one costs about 6,000bht (48v 750whr).

Edited July 9 by BritManToo

mistral53 · July 9

This idea looks better by the minute...... the question is, will supply outstrip demand and prices will drop further?

My problem is - I have a Huawei inverter and they don't lend themselves for this application, just their own batteries, and they sell them for gadzillions $$$

- a total of 100 kWh between the two retired car batteries in this installation.

Edited July 9 by mistral53

Bandersnatch · July 9

Total car registrations in the 100% electric vehicle group (BEV: Battery Electric Vehicle) in June 2024 total 5,773 cars (accounting for 13.1% of the total car registrations in Thailand, R.Y.1 total 43,147 cars)

Top 15 highest registrations in June 2024

BYD Atto3 819 cars
BYD Dolphin 754 units
ChangAn Deepal S07 703 units
Aion Y Plus 587 units
Tesla Model 3 457 units
NETA V 437 cars
MG 4 Electric 425 units
BYD Seal 249 cars
ORA Good Cat 238 units
Volvo EX30 120 cars
Volvo EC40 111 cars
MG EP 105 cars
GWM ORA 07 103 cars
97 Tesla Model Ys
Aion ES 90 units

ExpatOilWorker · July 9

July 1, 2024 EV summary Thailand 🇹🇭.

Total EV registrations: 126,458

Total EV miles driven: 691.9 million miles

June Highlights:

- Suzuki is ceasing manufacturing and leaving Thailand.

- Subaru is leaving Thailand by December 2024.

- Seals are highly hydrophobic, but still loved ❤️ by many except for the rear suspension and weak aircon. It jumps like a frog 🐸. The aircon can be fixed with a jewel cooler.

- Rats 🐀 like the taste of Atto 3 batteries 🔋.

- EV owners enjoy endless software updates with Bluetooth and phone call bugs 🐛. But fear not, the old Microsoft trick of turning the car of and on still works.....sometimes.

- If you spotted a farang with a ruler crawling around the gutters of western Bangkok, no need to alert the authorities. He is reportedly safely at home, but a comprehensive registry of curb height is available on demand.

- You can now pimp your EV with an illuminated BYD logo 🤪.

- Do not wear nail polish or perfume in your BYD, the interior will disintegrate. What will happen if you spill beer 🍺, asking for a friend 🤔?

Thai EV fire 🔥 risk: 10.1 fire/billion miles

Tesla global: 5 fire/billion miles

ICE (USA): 55 fires/billion miles

1. Tesla 3 - September 20th, 2021, power pole collision Rama 2.

2. BYD Atto 3 - January 21st, 2023, house fire, Songkran. Traction battery did not burn.

3. BYD Seal - March 14th, 2024, Ratchaburi roll-over.

4. Porsche Taycan - May 24th, 2024, battery explosion, Paradise Car Showroom.

5. Neta-V - June 11th, 2024, median accident and fire, Saraburi.

6. Neta-V - June 12th, 2024, accident and fire at towing area, Tha Phra, Khon Kaen.

7. MG ES - June 22nd, 2024, hit axle part on the road, Chonburi motorway.

UWEB · July 9

1 hour ago, mistral53 said:

This idea looks better by the minute...... the question is, will supply outstrip demand and prices will drop further?

My problem is - I have a Huawei inverter and they don't lend themselves for this application, just their own batteries, and they sell them for gadzillions $$$

- a total of 100 kWh between the two retired car batteries in this installation.

I just have replaced my Huawei Inverter and have now 2 x Deye 10K Hybrid and for now 10 kw ESS as back up, next week I get additional 20 kw storage installed. For the old Huawei I have got 35.000 THB as credit on my total installation of Inverters, 20 new Panels 575W and ESS.

matchar · July 9

3 hours ago, mistral53 said:

This idea looks better by the minute...... the question is, will supply outstrip demand and prices will drop further?

My problem is - I have a Huawei inverter and they don't lend themselves for this application, just their own batteries, and they sell them for gadzillions $$$

- a total of 100 kWh between the two retired car batteries in this installation.

Will that be covered by home insurance in the event of a fire? Also these batteries are designed to be horizontal in cars...changing them to a vertical orientation could have undesirable effects over the long term.

JBChiangRai · July 9

4 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

July 1, 2024 EV summary Thailand 🇹🇭.

Total EV registrations: 126,458

Total EV miles driven: 691.9 million miles

June Highlights:

- Suzuki is ceasing manufacturing and leaving Thailand.

- Subaru is leaving Thailand by December 2024.

- Seals are highly hydrophobic, but still loved ❤️ by many except for the rear suspension and weak aircon. It jumps like a frog 🐸. The aircon can be fixed with a jewel cooler.

- Rats 🐀 like the taste of Atto 3 batteries 🔋.

- EV owners enjoy endless software updates with Bluetooth and phone call bugs 🐛. But fear not, the old Microsoft trick of turning the car of and on still works.....sometimes.

- If you spotted a farang with a ruler crawling around the gutters of western Bangkok, no need to alert the authorities. He is reportedly safely at home, but a comprehensive registry of curb height is available on demand.

- You can now pimp your EV with an illuminated BYD logo 🤪.

- Do not wear nail polish or perfume in your BYD, the interior will disintegrate. What will happen if you spill beer 🍺, asking for a friend 🤔?

Thai EV fire 🔥 risk: 10.1 fire/billion miles

Tesla global: 5 fire/billion miles

ICE (USA): 55 fires/billion miles

1. Tesla 3 - September 20th, 2021, power pole collision Rama 2.

2. BYD Atto 3 - January 21st, 2023, house fire, Songkran. Traction battery did not burn.

3. BYD Seal - March 14th, 2024, Ratchaburi roll-over.

4. Porsche Taycan - May 24th, 2024, battery explosion, Paradise Car Showroom.

5. Neta-V - June 11th, 2024, median accident and fire, Saraburi.

6. Neta-V - June 12th, 2024, accident and fire at towing area, Tha Phra, Khon Kaen.

7. MG ES - June 22nd, 2024, hit axle part on the road, Chonburi motorway.

I wouldn't describe my Seal Aircon as weak, nor do I have any complaint about the suspension. I have seen Thais changing the suspension all round for 40,000 baht, I drove one, it's a downgrade.

So @ExpatOilWorker, not wishing to gloat BUT the percentage of cars sold being EV continues to climb, every month from February What does that suggest to you? That suggests to me that Thais are switching their allegiance from ICE to EV. {{GLOAT}} {{GLOAT}}

PS I lied, I am gloating with a big smirk.

Edited July 9 by JBChiangRai
Spellification

Bandersnatch · July 9

59 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

I wouldn't describe my Seal Aircon as weak

I agree. I haven’t added any window film as I felt it wasn’t necessary. Having the cooled seats is a real bonus.

ExpatOilWorker · July 9

3 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

I wouldn't describe my Seal Aircon as weak, nor do I have any complaint about the suspension. I have seen Thais changing the suspension all round for 40,000 baht, I drove one, it's a downgrade.

So @ExpatOilWorker, not wishing to gloat BUT the percentage of cars sold being EV continues to climb, every month from February What does that suggest to you? That suggests to me that Thais are switching their allegiance from ICE to EV. {{GLOAT}} {{GLOAT}}

PS I lied, I am gloating with a big smirk.

Yes, June was a great month for EV sales (registrations), most likely fueled by the eye-watering discounts. I even gave EVs a 13.4% fraction (5,773/43,147). I still don't understand why autolife only list it as 13.1%, but maybe someone smarter than me, which according to some shouldn't be hard to find, can answer that question 🤔.

Gloat away, you certainly deserve it, since it is your birthday 🎂 month. Save a bit of gloating for July, that should be another growth month, especially with the Atto 3 discount. September onwards might be a bit tougher 😬.

You live in the high north where hardly any AC is needed. The AC comments are from a link that was shared in June, so the problem is real, at least for some.

The jewel cooler is a quick fix, if u want to see it.

Pib · July 9

1 hour ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

..... I even gave EVs a 13.4% fraction (5,773/43,147). I still don't understand why autolife only list it as 13.1%, but maybe someone smarter than me, which according to some shouldn't be hard to find, can answer that question 🤔.

As you said there is a small difference between the DLT stats and the AutoLife chart regarding the number of EVs registered in the RY1 category for June. DLT reports 5,657 while Autolife reports 5,773 which is a 116 difference.

Autolife and DLT agree exactly on the total number vehicle registered in June as 43,157, but don't agree on the number of EVs registered (i.e., that 116 difference). So, 5657 divided by 43,157 leaves us with a 13.1% based on DLT stats and 5,773 divided by 43,147 leaves us with 13.4% based on the Autolife chart.

I thought maybe Autolife actually may have added in some EV numbers from some of the RY categories (i.e., RY2, RY3, RY6, etc...etc...etc) but when looking at all the other RY categories I can't find any combination that equals that 116 diffreence Now several months ago the Autolife EVs numbers once again did not agree with the DLT stats...had a small difference again. But I could exactly match that difference by counting EV numbers from three other RY categories to add to the RY1 category although Autolife implied they only used the RY1 category.

But that 116 difference is a mystery to me...I gave up trying to figure where the disconnect is. However, if the Autolife number is in error on the number of EVs registered (if we accept the DLT registered number as the gospel) at least the error is small.

JBChiangRai · July 9

2 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

Yes, June was a great month for EV sales (registrations), most likely fueled by the eye-watering discounts. I even gave EVs a 13.4% fraction (5,773/43,147). I still don't understand why autolife only list it as 13.1%, but maybe someone smarter than me, which according to some shouldn't be hard to find, can answer that question 🤔.

Gloat away, you certainly deserve it, since it is your birthday 🎂 month. Save a bit of gloating for July, that should be another growth month, especially with the Atto 3 discount. September onwards might be a bit tougher 😬.

You live in the high north where hardly any AC is needed. The AC comments are from a link that was shared in June, so the problem is real, at least for some.

The jewel cooler is a quick fix, if u want to see it.

What is a jewel cooler?

For 2 months of the year, Chiang Rai does have exceptional temperatures over 40C but most of the year it's temperate, daily 21-28C.

Bandersnatch · July 10

11 hours ago, Pib said:

As you said there is a small difference between the DLT stats and the AutoLife chart regarding the number of EVs registered in the RY1 category for June. DLT reports 5,657 while Autolife reports 5,773 which is a 116 difference

While we’re discussing registration figures looks like Thais are putting off buying a pickup until they can buy an electric one 😎

Edited July 10 by Bandersnatch

Yellowtail · July 10

1 hour ago, Bandersnatch said:

While we’re discussing registration figures looks like Thais are putting off buying a pickup until they can buy an electric one 😎

Perhaps, or it could just be that there are no new models.

KhunLA · July 10

1 hour ago, Bandersnatch said:

While we’re discussing registration figures looks like Thais are putting off buying a pickup until they can buy an electric one 😎

That would definitely be my choice, if ready to upgrade my pick up. It should be just around the corner. Late 2025 I think, if not sooner, and 1 or 2 may be on offer.

Pib · July 10

6 hours ago, Bandersnatch said:

While we’re discussing registration figures looks like Thais are putting off buying a pickup until they can buy an electric one 😎

No doubt a few protentila truck buyers are probably waiting until EV pickups become common, but since Toyota and Honda dominate the pickup truck market in Thailand and since Toyota/Honda don't have any EV trucks now...if fact, they are just now beginning to dip their toes into selling hybrid pickup trucks I don't see "waiting to buy an EV truck" as a significant reason for the pickup truck sales slump. I see it predominately as Thai personal/business debt level and tougher financing requirements....banks have really been tightening up on car/truck financing requirements.

Additonally, I think there is a continuing slow transition from pickup trucks to cars as more people slowly move from rural to city locations, move from rural jobs to city jobs, move from having a phyical storefront to instead just an online storefront, etc.....just less need and/or desire for a pickup truck.

Now I don't know what DLT vehicle categories AutoLife used for its article numbers (several categories I expect to include RY3 and RY1) but if just looking at the main category for pickup trucks which is RY3, pickup truck sales have been in a slump all year. The RY3 category is basically "two" door (i.e., no back seat, no extended cab, green letters/numbers license plates). Per DLT public stats registrations for RY3 in 2024: Jan - 11,291.......Feb 9,303.....Mar - 9754.....Apr 8,033......May - 8995....Jun - 8,544.

See the DLT RY3 definition below....seems to be for predominately 2 door pickup trucks used to carry out business...and just needing enough seating room that a front seat provides for a driver and maybe a helper or two. Now 4 door pickups used for "passengers, having a back seat, and having 4 doors are part of the RY1 category which is also the category for passenger cars that most of us drive, do our Lotus/Big C runs in, etc.

RY3 Definition per DLT

Edited July 10 by Pib

Bandersnatch · July 10

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

don't see "waiting to buy an EV truck" as a significant reason for the pickup truck sales slump. I see it predominately as Thai personal/business debt level and tougher financing requirements....banks have really been tightening up on car/truck financing requirements.

I agree with you, just looking for an excuse to post the truck sales figures :hit-the-fan:

digbeth · July 10

7 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Perhaps, or it could just be that there are no new models.

Surprised the new boxy, cheap(er) toyota champ aren't flying off the dealer, rare on the roads

usually when either Toyota or Isuzu launch a new model the big fleet buyers has them the next day

the first current body hilux 'revo' is around 9 years old now but in this economy they don't need replacing as yet

All the Hilux Champ I see are either used by independent contractor or boys' toy to go camping

not many fleet use or even as food truck to use in markets, for use as market truck, the toyota champ and even the current model Suzuki flatbed truck seem almost too big, and for market traders, even at swanky hipster markets in Bangkok they seem quite content to buy 2nd hand truck rather than new

There are no currently proper small truck/van like the Japanese K-cars, there used to be a few petrol models imported from China of dubious quality, if there's some proper box van/pickup as ev this could be another section of market that's untapped

Yellowtail · July 10

26 minutes ago, digbeth said:

Surprised the new boxy, cheap(er) toyota champ aren't flying off the dealer, rare on the roads

usually when either Toyota or Isuzu launch a new model the big fleet buyers has them the next day

the first current body hilux 'revo' is around 9 years old now but in this economy they don't need replacing as yet

All the Hilux Champ I see are either used by independent contractor or boys' toy to go camping

not many fleet use or even as food truck to use in markets, for use as market truck, the toyota champ and even the current model Suzuki flatbed truck seem almost too big, and for market traders, even at swanky hipster markets in Bangkok they seem quite content to buy 2nd hand truck rather than new

There are no currently proper small truck/van like the Japanese K-cars, there used to be a few petrol models imported from China of dubious quality, if there's some proper box van/pickup as ev this could be another section of market that's untapped

I like the look, but they are a bit bare-bones for most, and pretty cramped as well. The front looks a bit like the new Land Cruiser, which I think is what the new Vigo and Fortuner will look like.

I think the plan is for the Land Cruser, the Fortuner, and the Vigo on the same platform.

ExpatOilWorker · July 10

On 7/9/2024 at 9:52 AM, mistral53 said:

This idea looks better by the minute...... the question is, will supply outstrip demand and prices will drop further?

My problem is - I have a Huawei inverter and they don't lend themselves for this application, just their own batteries, and they sell them for gadzillions $$$

- a total of 100 kWh between the two retired car batteries in this installation.

Another BYD fuel tank attached to a wall in Roi-et, with a 20 kW inverter.

vinny41 · July 10

Starting in Thailand, MG has announced that they will be starting a program wherein EV models will have a lifetime warranty for 3 critical components of the EV drive system: the high voltage battery assembly (HV Battery Assy), the electric drive unit (EDU), and the power electronic block (PEB). That practically covers all the major components of the drive system, and provides unprecedented peace of mind for EV owners.

Initially, MG Thailand will start offering this for four of their existing models: the MG4, the MG Maxus 9, the MG Maxus 7, and the MG Cyberster. MG says the warranty will be retroactive to customers in Thailand who already own any of the 4 MG models mentioned. Critically, they say that the warranty carries over even when the ownership of the vehicle has changed. The warranty is attached to the vehicle, not the first owner.

https://www.autoindustriya.com/auto-industry-news/gamechanger-mg-has-begun-to-offer-lifetime-ev-battery-warranty.html

JBChiangRai · July 11

13 hours ago, ExpatOilWorker said:

Another BYD fuel tank attached to a wall in Roi-et, with a 20 kW inverter.

Any details on this, I'm interested for our next new build.

ExpatOilWorker · July 11

1 hour ago, JBChiangRai said:

Any details on this, I'm interested for our next new build.

Next build??

You already have two houses 🏘. Are you adding a mia noi?

It is made by the below guy 👦, I guess you can reach out to him on FB.

https://www.facebook.com/share/H8xMJYryWDWMMYB6/?mibextid=qi2Omg

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