I write hoping for reliable advice from UbonJoe / Dr Jack re looming visa overstay issue

1 Facts:

Australian, Entered visa exempt 18/5 & extended to 16/7

Lodged Non O Retirement application 20/6 and their required 20 days notice ends today 10/7.

Under consideration stamp on my receipt says come to immigration 16/7 (next Sat) – verbally told to come 18/7. But I never trust verbal with them.

In any case 18/7 will be 2 days overstay, and

a) I have never overstayed in my prior 20+ years in Thailand, and

b) I sure don’t want a related black mark in my passport or future problems.

Assumption:

When I go to Immigration & ask for my visa Mon 11/7 or Tue 12/7 they will likely say mai mee / not ready. Then they are closed 13 to 17 July.

Therefore, I have to leave Thailand by 16/7 BY AIR and start the whole Visa Exempt to Non O Retirement BS over again. Correct?

If you consider they might(?) waive the overstay because they are closed, is there a regulation reference for this or is it IO “discretion” and can I insist on something to that effect in writing?

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Related:

2 They made me sign a NEW form to agree not to overstay with my application

3 I am in Ranong so thought of a Visa Run to the Andaman Club but the hotel staff told me not possible as Burma Immig closed to foreigners – only for Thais! In any case that would only give me 15 days Visa Exempt?

4 Apparently Ranong Immigration have to refer to Hat Yai for approvals.

5 I found the Immigration help line 1178 beyond hopeless – couldn’t understand Visa Exempt!

Many thanks for any help.

If you have an Under consideration stamp in your passport, you won't be on overstay. It basically allows you to stay until you get the actual extension stamp.

Maybe ...

The under consideration stamp is on the receipt not in my passport

11 minutes ago, chai333 said:

Maybe ...

The under consideration stamp is on the receipt not in my passport

That is the same as it being in your passport.

Another factor is that immigration will be closed from the 13th to the 17th. The 18th will be the first day they will be open and normally that means you would not be on a overstay if your permit to stay was was ending.

Many thanks UJ. Always respect your advice

Therefore I will still try 11 & 12 July but expect to receive the Non O in person 18/7

Being illegal by any measure is stressful to me

Don't you think Immigration could be more careful with their dates ... eg stamping as the last available working day rather than weekends / holidays

Uncle Too's grand (money grab) holiday 15 July also relates!

Cheers

PS   My experience with Ranong is that they don't do "normally"

The reference number says I am number 5/65 applicant for this year!

Must be in the wrong place

15 hours ago, chai333 said:

Don't you think Immigration could be more careful with their dates ... eg stamping as the last available working day rather than weekends / holidays

Immigration can do a lot of things better and more efficiently.

However, this is the way they work, and we have to deal with it.

 

Don't worry. You will be fine on 18th. No overstay.

Under consideration is valid for stay, until you receive your extension.

 

17 hours ago, chai333 said:

2 They made me sign a NEW form to agree not to overstay with my application

3 I am in Ranong so thought of a Visa Run to the Andaman Club but the hotel staff told me not possible as Burma Immig closed to foreigners – only for Thais! In any case that would only give me 15 days Visa Exempt?

4 Apparently Ranong Immigration have to refer to Hat Yai for approvals.

5 I found the Immigration help line 1178 beyond hopeless – couldn’t understand Visa Exempt!

Many thanks for any help.

Virtually all immigration offices have a phone number that you can call to ask about an under consideration stamp and if the visa/extension is ready for collection. 1178 is generic and as you found not very helpful in your case. A Thai speaker can be needed as the English speakers are often busy. The number may be 077 822 016
Under consideration usually (always) goes to the regional HQ for approval.

I have called my local office occasionally to check and always got through and got an answer.

you will need the information on your stamp, that is not always easy to read.

I changed from retirement to marriage a year or so ago. I've now been "under consideration" twice.

The first year, just before the period expired, I rang the IO several times to try to ascertain if the extension had been approved as I didn't want to make the 125km journey only to be told to come back later. Nobody could help, the advice was to just come on the last day. It was ready when I showed up on that day.

This year, I didn't bother to check, just went there on the last working day (it expired on a Saturday) and was told quite strongly that I should have rung first because it had only been approved the day before, and it may not have been ready on time!

Same office, typical Immigration inconsistancy.

Do not be too surprised if the authorisation for your local office to issue the Non O visa and associated permission to stay has still not come through on July 18th. It is sometimes late, and there is an increased chance of this because of the long holiday. While irritating, this still will not place you at any risk of an overstay. Assuming Immigration has your phone number, in the unlikely event of any problem with your application, they would contact you. If Immigration has not called you, you can be 100% confident that the visa and fresh 90-day permission to stay will surface at some point. Stop worrying!

22 hours ago, chai333 said:

Don't you think Immigration could be more careful with their dates ... eg stamping as the last available working day rather than weekends / holidays

It would be nice… my recent extension renewal was on a Sunday I went the Friday prior

because of the fear of ohhhhh your late happening… 

Replies n follow up including thanks ………………………..

Resident Alien

Thanks. You are right about dealing with Immig as “that’s the way they work”

Still amazing it has taken me more than 20 years to uncover this cute unwritten rule when “under consideration”

Sometimewoodworker

Thanks. Luckily I did ask for their number. Ranong is 077 826 938 #110 (but the #110 was not needed

My prior guess that I would find local Immig Tel & email on their website was a big fail!

When I called today (11/7) I was answered and passed to a lady with great English. Probably from Burma. I will follow you advice and ring first to save wasting a 160km round trip

She confirmed not overstay while “in the process”

Old Croc

Amazing it has taken me over 20 years here to discover this new piece of lunacy

However you notes appreciated

Brit Tim

Thanks. I liked your “will surface at some point”

That will probably be 1 month since my application was lodged. Recon I could almost walk to Hat Yai & back in a month! Guess they don’t do SMS next day …. or work most days!

Consistent advice from many has relieved my stress

DJ54

Thanks. Yes it is always the fear/stress factor at renewal time.

I have always done my retirement extensions at least a week before the due date and over 20 years had about a 50/50 clear run rate. The old Soi SuanPlu bunfight gave me best success rate although I HATED the waiting etc

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Once again many thanks to all who took the time to reply with their knowledge & experience. I am now resigned to waiting till whenever.

This was only my 3^rd post but I have watched the forum for years and thankfully found many useful contributions – especially with the insanity prevailing during my recent 2 year exile from Thailand

Cheers All

For what it is worth

Here is some real experience with the Visa Exempt to Non O Retirement lunacy

 

Starting from Visa Exempt extended to 16/7/22 (Sat) …

Non O application lodged 10/6/22. Rejected. Insisted on 800k THB deposit. 7 prior months of transfers over 65k THB + over 400k bank balance refused – contrary to item 7 of TM87 Requirements (Combo method allowed)

Non O application lodged again with 800k THB bank deposit 20/6/22 – 26 days before Visa Exempt expiry (Local office required min 20 days) Told to come back 18/7/22. Received Under Consideration stamp on receipt

House inspection by Immig Police 21/6/22 who demanded 3, yes three, witnesses fill more forms + heaps of photos. I always understood this was for marriage related visas, mine is just simple retirement as it has been for 20+ years.

Posted AsianNow topic 10/7/22 when stressed re looming overstay after 16/7/22 visa expiry. Responses reassured me no overstay issue

Phoned immigration 11/7/22 (Mon) & was told Visa not ready yet … come here 18 or 19 July will be OK & no overstay problem as it is “in the process”

Went to immig 18/7/22 7 received the Non O Visa by way of 5 (yes 5 stamps as attached). They state the visa was approved on 30/6/22  and expires 28/9/22.

AND I was told to come again on 11/9/22 when they will give me the forms they require, complete the 1 year extension application and do my 90 day report

So …

1 Immigration lied 11/7/22 when they told me the visa was not ready. It was approved 11 days ago!

2 I was short changed on the Non O duration. 16/7/22 (Exempt expiry) to 28/9/22 is only  74 days. In reply to my query, “My Capitan” as they call her insisted 90 days from 30/6/22 approval is correct.

I will try to attach the 5 stamps including #2 and 5 in Thai so I have no idea what they are about.

My Conclusion:

NEVER recommend this process to anyone unless they plan to use a larger (BKK/tourist area) immigration office who might(?) know & follow the rules. AND they are staying near that office. Otherwise, like me, they will risk 7 visits to immigration, home inspection, costs of over 10,000THB, including over 1000km travel, etc and much associated stress due to crazy procedures & language issues which I have no time to detail here.

Attach: 220720peim Visa Exempt to NonO Stamps

220720peim Visa Exempt to NonO Stamps.pdf

2 hours ago, chai333 said:

For what it is worth

Here is some real experience with the Visa Exempt to Non O Retirement lunacy

 

Starting from Visa Exempt extended to 16/7/22 (Sat) …

Non O application lodged 10/6/22. Rejected. Insisted on 800k THB deposit. 7 prior months of transfers over 65k THB + over 400k bank balance refused – contrary to item 7 of TM87 Requirements (Combo method allowed)

Non O application lodged again with 800k THB bank deposit 20/6/22 – 26 days before Visa Exempt expiry (Local office required min 20 days) Told to come back 18/7/22. Received Under Consideration stamp on receipt

House inspection by Immig Police 21/6/22 who demanded 3, yes three, witnesses fill more forms + heaps of photos. I always understood this was for marriage related visas, mine is just simple retirement as it has been for 20+ years.

Posted AsianNow topic 10/7/22 when stressed re looming overstay after 16/7/22 visa expiry. Responses reassured me no overstay issue

Phoned immigration 11/7/22 (Mon) & was told Visa not ready yet … come here 18 or 19 July will be OK & no overstay problem as it is “in the process”

Went to immig 18/7/22 7 received the Non O Visa by way of 5 (yes 5 stamps as attached). They state the visa was approved on 30/6/22  and expires 28/9/22.

AND I was told to come again on 11/9/22 when they will give me the forms they require, complete the 1 year extension application and do my 90 day report

So …

1 Immigration lied 11/7/22 when they told me the visa was not ready. It was approved 11 days ago!

2 I was short changed on the Non O duration. 16/7/22 (Exempt expiry) to 28/9/22 is only  74 days. In reply to my query, “My Capitan” as they call her insisted 90 days from 30/6/22 approval is correct.

I will try to attach the 5 stamps including #2 and 5 in Thai so I have no idea what they are about.

My Conclusion:

NEVER recommend this process to anyone unless they plan to use a larger (BKK/tourist area) immigration office who might(?) know & follow the rules. AND they are staying near that office. Otherwise, like me, they will risk 7 visits to immigration, home inspection, costs of over 10,000THB, including over 1000km travel, etc and much associated stress due to crazy procedures & language issues which I have no time to detail here.

Attach: 220720peim Visa Exempt to NonO Stamps

220720peim Visa Exempt to NonO Stamps.pdf 1.15 MB · 0 downloads

I appreciate that this was frustrating, but the officials at your local office did nothing wrong except, perhaps, an over zealous home visit which is sometimes done for Non O applications, but is usually pretty relaxed if done at all. The idea is to verify your address, and see if neighbours had anything bad to say about you that could justify rejection of the visa application.

 

When your local immigration office stated that the paperwork had not yet been returned to them, this was almost certainly truthful. When division headquarters sign off on the application, they do not hurry to return the paperwork to your local office. It gets added to a stack of applications to be sent back to various offices.

 

Finally, the Non O visa application does not work like an extension in terms of dates. It is totally standard that the approval date starts your 90 days. Really, that is a small matter anyway. It just means that your 800k baht will be seasoned ready for the one-year extension a bit earlier.

 

I hope you did not give your local officials a hard time. They were just following the procedure that had been given to them.