Thailand has strong fire-safety laws, so why do deadly nightclub blazes keep happening?

[bradiston]

28 minutes ago, Archie Baker said:

And insurance to cover any person setting foot in the building, then the owner would not need to offer a pitiful 25k for a dead person.  Not necessary or mandatory for running a business in Thailand.  

Public liability insurance. Should of course be mandatory for all public venues and vehicles. Hard to find in Thailand. Private liability ok. I used to rent out my house. Managed to get cover eventually. Somebody trips over and breaks a leg, slips in the bathroom etc etc, in theory, I was covered. Never put to the test fortunately.

 

Also, so as not to invalidate your cover, it forces you, if required, to look at all your safety precautions, compliance etc.

Edited August 13, 2022 by bradiston

[Lemsta69]

1 hour ago, Joe Farang said:

Stop Whining please.

complaining about the resident moaners and their constant anti-Thailand diatribes is not whining, it's a public service. there should be more of it so that their voices are drowned out. you're welcome ????

[Ralf001]

2 minutes ago, bradiston said:

Public liability insurance. Should of course be mandatory for all public venues and vehicles. Hard to find in Thailand. Private liability ok. I used to rent out my house. Managed to get cover eventually. Somebody trips over and breaks a leg, slips in the bathroom etc etc, in theory, I was covered. Never put to the test fortunately.

The fact many places are operated illegally must provide great wiggle room for the insurance companies.

[law ling]

The OP boasts:

Thailand has strong fire-safety laws

 

.. well, maybe that's not true. Let's see the laws, and we'll tell you if they are strong (enough).

 

... because they are NOT strong enough if exits are locked, soundproofing can be flammable, etc.

[bradiston]

Just now, Ralf001 said:

The fact many places are operated illegally must provide great wiggle room for the insurance companies.

Of course, but the insurers are equally remiss in covering anything without requiring an inspection certificate. Oh wait, I suppose they can be bought too. Well, it's simply down to the owners then. If they refuse to acknowledge the risks then they must pay. Jail, fines and proper compensation. Too late for the poor victims though.

[billd766]

5 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Oh do get off that, it is past, over, and not even the case now!

It is not the past, but the present and I see it every day in rural Kamphaeng Phet. I would think it is the same all over rural Thailand.

[billd766]

3 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Let them do as they wish.... not your business, not your worry, going off topic.

And if it your son or daughter, nephew or niece who has 75% or more burns to their body, will you still say,

 

 

not your business, not your worry, going off topic.

[JimmyJ]

Strong fire safety laws?

 

I was shocked to learn that Smoke Detectors are not required in apartments unless the building is more than 6 stories high

 

(Apparently on the theory that jumping from a 6th floor or lower window is safe).

[Burma Bill]

5 hours ago, Tropicalevo said:

who posts here breaks the law somewhere.

Yes indeed, I used to when living in Thailand - extension of my annual retirement visa courtesy of a brown envelope to my local friendly Immigration Officer!!

[Liverpool Lou]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Although safety rules and building-control laws are in place, operators and authorities still have a casual attitude towards compliance. The result is that avoidable disasters continue to happen on a regular basis, with victims struggling and dying in the flames.

"...avoidable disasters continue to happen on a regular basis..."

Nonsense.  These incidents are not happening "on a regular basis".   The last one was over 13 years ago and it was started by the use of pyrotechnics in the club.

[spidermike007]

The indifference, and ineptitude of the government and the ease with which it's representatives (inspectors) and can be bought. 

 

It is easy to blame the owners. But people will always try to take shortcuts. When it is a public venue, it is on the inspectors to call out the issues, and take action. 

[theoldgit]

8 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"...avoidable disasters continue to happen on a regular basis..."

Nonsense.  These incidents are not happening "on a regular basis".   The last one was over 13 years ago and it was started by the use of pyrotechnics in the club.

Wasn’t there a fire in a nightclub in Phuket ten years ago, that claimed four lives?

[new2here]

On paper, thailand really is very much like most other major countries in terms of the law: what is and is not legal.  

 

As example, Thailand’s law relates to the operation of motor vehicles is actually quite similar to that of the US and most parts of Europe… 

 

So, to that end, Thailand is quite similar to most other places… it’s not that much of an outlier…..

 

but… as noted earlier, it’s the processes of enforcement and administration of these laws that kind of dilutes their impact… and takes them off the rails… 

 

In my view, any laws without real and consistent enforcement are essentially only societal “suggestions” … and laws that are not administered openly, equally and transparently are only subjective punishments to be applied when/where the punisher, in their unquestioned opinion, feels just and against only those the punisher disapproves of, also in their own unquestioned opinion.

 

Lastly, as a cumulative product of years of this reality, there’s a collective public mindset of acceptance which essentially feeds an apathetic viewpoint — the perfect environment for those who operate the system, to continue to do so with little to no accountability or pushback from the public at large.

 

 

Edited August 13, 2022 by new2here

[10baht]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Although safety rules and building-control laws are in place, operators and authorities still have a casual attitude towards compliance.

This a case of too many laws in place which are not being enforced. You do not need new laws just make sure the ones already there are followed. Obviously the end game is control not actually solving the problem. For instance, the new seatbelt and baby seat laws. Are these really intended to save lives? 555  If you want to save lives why not enforce motorbike helmet laws, or not letting the motor bikes run on the wrong side of the road. And worst of all 2 adults and 3 kids on a motorbike - helmets or not NO SEAT BELTS.

So what's more dangerous? Take the GD motorbikes away from offenders, and get the idiots off the roads.

[shackleton]

Because safety laws are not enforced or carried out correctly

When a nightclub is named as a restaurant has under aged people there could go on ????

Brown envelopes cover a multitude of sins ????

[klauskunkel]

Quote

why do deadly nightclub blazes keep happening?

because authorities are not held accountable

why are authorities not held accountable?

because there is no independent oversight

why is there no independent oversight?

because the government prefers to spend money on submarines, etc. instead

[AussieinThaiJim]

The sooner police are moved from one province to another and we get serious policing the better. This situation has to stop. Lock more of the Thai police up for bribes and corruption!

[Ralf001]

Just now, AussieinThaiJim said:

The sooner police are moved from one province to another and we get serious policing the better. This situation has to stop. Lock more of the Thai police up for bribes and corruption!

Thai police are paid very poor salaries, only way to reduce/remove corruption is to pay them more.

 

 

 

[bradiston]

https://www.area.co.th/english/area_announce/area_anpg.php?strquey=press_announcement5383.htm

 

[joecoolfrog]

6 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

that's part of the charm of living here though. makes it a hell of a lot more interesting than boring old Ferrangland ????

Nothing charming about lying in an intensive care unit with 80% burns and a future consisting solely of pain.

[Thunglom]

6 hours ago, lujanit said:

Thailand has strong fire-safety laws, so why do deadly nightclub blazes keep happening?

 

Answer.  Corruption.

Garft, nepotism and corruption.

The results are that because to graft and nepotism, you end up with people in jobs who aren't actually up to the job.

Then you also have police and other officials who simply aren't trained to do their jobs.

Just a short conversation with anyone in a position like this and you soon realise it isn't about enforcing the letter of the law, it is two guys coming to a mutual understanding and then both carrying on about their own business.

To actually strictly enforce a law would basically be in breach of Kreng Jai.

[Thunglom]

1 hour ago, JimmyJ said:

Strong fire safety laws?

 

I was shocked to learn that Smoke Detectors are not required in apartments unless the building is more than 6 stories high

 

(Apparently on the theory that jumping from a 6th floor or lower window is safe).

on the other hand no gas cookers in any condominiums

[Lemsta69]

37 minutes ago, AussieinThaiJim said:

The sooner police are moved from one province to another and we get serious policing the better. This situation has to stop. Lock more of the Thai police up for bribes and corruption!

not gonna happen anytime soon so why get all worked up about it? TIT

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, theoldgit said:

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

"...avoidable disasters continue to happen on a regular basis..."

Nonsense.  These incidents are not happening "on a regular basis".   The last one was over 13 years ago and it was started by the use of pyrotechnics in the club.

Wasn’t there a fire in a nightclub in Phuket ten years ago, that claimed four lives?

OK, so that's three infernos in thirteen years. Wow. I mean... WOW!

 

Sensationalist tag line that only serves to drive another pointless 'debate' about corruption and laziness.

 

Never mind, in a few days we'll be back to ranting about road deaths and the lack of traffic law enforcement.

[Lemsta69]

26 minutes ago, joecoolfrog said:

Nothing charming about lying in an intensive care unit with 80% burns and a future consisting solely of pain.

you can get 80% burns from wearing a mask but no helmet whilst driving a motorcycle? ????

[wombat]

A rhetorical question?

[Sydebolle]

Mysterious are the ways of the East ......

IF, repeat, IF you have laws, then they ought to be enforced. If not, then you live in a lawless society. 

For Thailand both applies, laws, rules, (traffic) regulations etc. are all made so the next Somchai or Yodsak can come along and - whatever he does - the aforementioned are professionally ignored, bent or greased to acceptance. 

[BadSpottedDog]

Officials keep talking about the roof tiles, and other issues. All I need to know is what I've experienced with 99% of Thai wiring. No trip switches. No ground. Cheap outlets that catch fire. it's everywhere! Why aren't they looking at the root of the problem?

[drgoon]

6 hours ago, Lemsta69 said:

that, and some people just love to complain. there was a thread called "why are there so many haters in here" and quite a few members quite bluntly stated that not only do they like complaining in here but they have a right to do so and that we should just "move past". pretty hard to do when there's 7 or 8 pages of whining ????

Makes you wonder though if they are the same at home or out with friends ???? 

[drgoon]

9 minutes ago, BadSpottedDog said:

Officials keep talking about the roof tiles, and other issues. All I need to know is what I've experienced with 99% of Thai wiring. No trip switches. No ground. Cheap outlets that catch fire. it's everywhere! Why aren't they looking at the root of the problem?

Too much bother...