'The future is here.' Migrants step off buses from Texas into New York homeless shelters By Ray Sanchez, CNN

[Credo]

8 hours ago, KanchanaburiGuy said:

Parents commit crimes and get arrested and jailed thousands of times each day, all across America. Their children are not rounded up and put in jail with them. They are separated.

 

Parent goes to jail; children maybe go to other family members, maybe get collected and processed by Child Protective Services. [CPS]

 

The one thing that doesn't happen virtually ever is............... the children stay with their jailed parents!

 

The kind of separation of children and parents that was being done at the border is THE NORM for what happens with law-breaking parents and their children, not an exception! It's what happens each and every day in America (and pretty much everywhere else in the world!)

 

What happened at the border was the story got HIGHLIGHTED with dramatic pictures and sad stories............. while completely ignoring the fact that virtually the same story happens daily, in cities all across the country! Parents get caught committing crimes............. then are forcibly  separated from their children!

 

--------------

 

The drama wasn't in the incident. There is literally nothing unusual about it! The drama came from how it was EMPAHSISlZED. It was EMPHASIZED knowing full well that people would react emotionally and irrationally.......... completely overlooking how NORMAL those events are, probably occurring regularly right there in their own home town! 

 

Yes, there are better ways to do it, and poorer ways. And the border stories showed us that bigger, difficult-to-manage numbers may inevitably lead in doing things in poorer, less appealing ways.

 

But that's what happens when you get inundated, isn't it? You scrabble to do what you can.......... because there simply is not enough time and resource......... in that moment......... to do all the things you want to do? (And, of course, when you're struggling to manage............ THAT'S when some yahoo comes along and snaps his photos! Murphy's Law!)

 

From what I saw, there was some fair criticism of what was being done. But mostly what I saw was UNFAIR criticism by people who seemed to have great passion........ (some real, but much feigned!).......... but who ultimately had no effin clue what they were talking about!

 

---------------

 

Simply put............. If you're not kicking and screaming about how jailed criminals get separated from their children each and every day in America, right there in your own home town............. then whatever gnashing and crying you're doing about how people have been treated at the border.......... rings terribly, terribly false!

 

----------------

 

Law-breakers get separated from their children when they get caught. That's just how it is! ............That's how it has always been. That's how it should continue to be!

 

And if you're a parent who doesn't  want that to happen?............  simple.......... don't commit the crimes that lead to it!

 

 

That's not exactly correct.  It's not normal for both parents to get arrested and it certainly doesn't happen 'thousands of times a day.'   Just to give you a view on how the Courts go to great extents to keep families intact take a look at the Teresa & Joe Giudice's case.   Simply crossing the border is not a violent offense and would not generally involve incarceration.   

 

The very vast majority of the people who are arriving with children are seeking asylum.  That is a right and should not result in incarceration.   

 

I don't know why you defend this cretin-inspired policy.  It was wrong, it was unnecessary and the results have been disastrous.  The human toll is immeasurable.    

[Hanaguma]

2 minutes ago, Credo said:

Many of the parents were in fact deported quickly after their arrival.  Their children weren't.   You cannot deport someone to a country that is not their home country.   Many, if not most, of the people crossing the border are not Mexican nationals.   Mexico has agreed to allow them to stay, pending the resolution of their immigration case.   

 

There are a lot of ways to approach a problem.  Separating the children was about the poorest.   

 

All the more reason to send them back to Mexico.  The Mexicans have to learn that they cannot let their country be used as a pipeline for people to breach the US border. Up to Mexico to send them home. 

[Hanaguma]

1 minute ago, Credo said:

That's not exactly correct.  It's not normal for both parents to get arrested and it certainly doesn't happen 'thousands of times a day.'   Just to give you a view on how the Courts go to great extents to keep families intact take a look at the Teresa & Joe Giudice's case.   Simply crossing the border is not a violent offense and would not generally involve incarceration.   

 

The very vast majority of the people who are arriving with children are seeking asylum.  That is a right and should not result in incarceration.   

 

I don't know why you defend this cretin-inspired policy.  It was wrong, it was unnecessary and the results have been disastrous.  The human toll is immeasurable.    

Actually, most are not seeking asylum. They are economic migrants.  Asylum seekers generally are those forced to leave their home countries for fear of  persecution, usually political. I am sure that some of the 2 million plus who crossed the border are genuine asylum seekers, but for most it is all about the Benjamins.

[Scott]

2 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

All the more reason to send them back to Mexico.  The Mexicans have to learn that they cannot let their country be used as a pipeline for people to breach the US border. Up to Mexico to send them home. 

It's not legal to do that.  Deportation occurs to the country of origin. 

 

Advocating illegal activity is against the forum rules.

 

Troll post removed.

 

Edited September 15, 2022 by Scott

[Scott]

2 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Actually, most are not seeking asylum. They are economic migrants.  Asylum seekers generally are those forced to leave their home countries for fear of  persecution, usually political. I am sure that some of the 2 million plus who crossed the border are genuine asylum seekers, but for most it is all about the Benjamins.

  In 2021, there were 130,863 asylum applications. 

[Hanaguma]

6 hours ago, Scott said:

  In 2021, there were 130,863 asylum applications. 

Yes, perhaps true, but given that more than 1.6 MILLION people were apprehended by the border authorities, it is less than 10% of the total number of border crossers.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Yes, perhaps true, but given that more than 1.6 MILLION people were apprehended by the border authorities, it is less than 10% of the total number of border crossers.

Link please.

[EVENKEEL]

34 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Link please.

I added a link earlier you already had a chance to view which showed the numbers.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

I added a link earlier you already had a chance to view which showed the numbers.

Sorry Even’ I don’t always give your posts the attention you perhaps believe they deserve.

 

Now did the ‘apprehensions’ include ‘circular migrations’ and what constitutes an ‘apprehension’?.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

Be compassionate and open your home up.

Why does anyone need to provide a home to someone who’s come to America to work?

[EVENKEEL]

https://nypost.com/2022/09/15/marthas-vineyard-in-chaos-after-desantis-ships-migrants-to-liberal-enclave/

Roughly 50 migrants were flown to the famed Massachusetts island — constituting what the local tourism board called a “humanitarian crisis’’ Thursday.

 

Our border cities get 1000's daily.......daily and MV is agast over 50 migrants. San Francisco should be next

[EVENKEEL]

11 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Why does anyone need to provide a home to someone who’s come to America to work?

Where do the 1,000's who cross daily sleep. Do you expect border towns to do this? Of course no one gives this a thought. So now sanctuary cities can have a taste.

[Hanaguma]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Link please.

Of course. From the CBP website...

 

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/cbp-enforcement-statistics

[Hanaguma]

22 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

https://nypost.com/2022/09/15/marthas-vineyard-in-chaos-after-desantis-ships-migrants-to-liberal-enclave/

Roughly 50 migrants were flown to the famed Massachusetts island — constituting what the local tourism board called a “humanitarian crisis’’ Thursday.

 

Our border cities get 1000's daily.......daily and MV is agast over 50 migrants. San Francisco should be next

I am sure that the good liberals who live in the Vineyard would be more than happy to show compassion and open their homes to these fellow humans in need. Particularly people who have summer homes that are now empty- what a waste of a valuable resource!  Compassion is meaningless without action.  

[SunnyinBangrak]

2 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

I am sure that the good liberals who live in the Vineyard would be more than happy to show compassion and open their homes to these fellow humans in need. Particularly people who have summer homes that are now empty- what a waste of a valuable resource!  Compassion is meaningless without action.  

Some of these good liberals up in Martha's have huge estates. I can think of one that has a 30 acre waterfront property. Can you even imagine how many migrants could be settled in tents and camped there, I'm thinking ten thousand souls plus. And I'm certain the owner and his neighbors would be proud to help the desperate people that get bussed or flown up to Martha's. 

 All in a good plan, well thought out. Good luck to the residents and migrants this will be interesting.

[Hanaguma]

Another option would be for the federal government to fund and construct refugee camps for those who are apprehended crossing the border. Keep them housed and accounted for until their claims are processed.

 

I think the "catch and release" strategy only incentivizes people and encourages them to come.  If all asylum seekers and border crossers were kept in detention until their claims could be fairly evaluated, the numbers would soon drop. It removes the number one draw for people to cross the border illegally- the chance to make money. 

[Rimmer]

Some inflammatory troll posts have been removed also replies

[LarrySR]

Typical election year right wing scare tactics. Trigger the bigots with news of diseased, murdering drug dealing, rapist,  Immigrants invading the country. And taking the jobs!!!

Really motivates those morons to get to the polls and vote for tax breaks for the rich. 
 

Next week will it  be transvestites using the girls bathroom or antifa/BLM, or cancel culture, or the woke, or 2nd amendment, or socialism, or  statues……? 

 

 

Edited September 16, 2022 by LarrySR

[Hanaguma]

38 minutes ago, LarrySR said:

Typical election year right wing scare tactics. Trigger the bigots with news of diseased, murdering drug dealing, rapist,  Immigrants invading the country. And taking the jobs!!!

Really motivates those morons to get to the polls and vote for tax breaks for the rich. 
 

Next week will it  be transvestites using the girls bathroom or antifa/BLM, or cancel culture, or the woke, or 2nd amendment, or socialism, or  statues……? 

 

 

So, none of the 'migrants' fall into any of those categories? Murderers, drug dealers, rapists....

 

According to the CBP, they arrested 60 murderers and nearly 500 rapists, plus more than 2,000 people on drug offenses.   Last year alone.

 

Plus seized nearly 100 TONS of meth, 50 tons of coke, 5 tons of fentanyl....

 

Scare tactics?

 

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/cbp-enforcement-statistics/criminal-noncitizen-statistics

[MrJ2U]

On 9/10/2022 at 8:36 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

I expect even the Texas coach drivers are pleased to arrive in NY and enjoy the benefits of a functional and reliable power grid.

Texas.

 

What a sh*t ho*e.

 

Busses or not.  Most migrants don't want to live in that State. There just using it as a way station. 

 

Edited September 16, 2022 by MrJ2U

[Eric Loh]

24 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

So, none of the 'migrants' fall into any of those categories? Murderers, drug dealers, rapists....

 

According to the CBP, they arrested 60 murderers and nearly 500 rapists, plus more than 2,000 people on drug offenses.   Last year alone.

 

Plus seized nearly 100 TONS of meth, 50 tons of coke, 5 tons of fentanyl....

 

Scare tactics?

 

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/cbp-enforcement-statistics/criminal-noncitizen-statistics

So by your logic, stop the migrants and you stop murders, drug, raping etc in good old USA. 

[sanqing]

On 9/10/2022 at 8:36 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

I expect even the Texas coach drivers are pleased to arrive in NY and enjoy the benefits of a functional and reliable power grid.

like the one in California?

https://fortune.com/2022/09/05/california-power-grid-emergency-heat-wave-labor-day-electricity-blackout/

Edited September 16, 2022 by sanqing

[Hanaguma]

50 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

So by your logic, stop the migrants and you stop murders, drug, raping etc in good old USA. 

Please, dont be deliberately obtuse.  Where did I say that? 

 

But you do stop a good number of crimes, along with drugs, along with the attendant social problems caused by unrestricted migration. Just ask the mayors in NYC or Washington how they like it!

[Hanaguma]

55 minutes ago, MrJ2U said:

Texas.

 

What a sh*t ho*e.

 

Busses or not.  Most migrants don't want to live in that State. There just using it as a way station. 

 

I guess you havent read the stats for internal migration in the US.  Florida and Texas are the two most popular states for people to migrate TO.  Strangely, the places that are being abandoned are.... California and New York. Wonder why.

[Chomper Higgot]

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

I am sure that the good liberals who live in the Vineyard would be more than happy to show compassion and open their homes to these fellow humans in need. Particularly people who have summer homes that are now empty- what a waste of a valuable resource!  Compassion is meaningless without action.  

I suspect they might help the immigrants out by paying them to do jobs.

 

Jobs need doing, immigrants are looking for work.

 

Win win.

 

Just like it always was.

[placeholder]

25 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

Please, dont be deliberately obtuse.  Where did I say that? 

 

But you do stop a good number of crimes, along with drugs, along with the attendant social problems caused by unrestricted migration. Just ask the mayors in NYC or Washington how they like it!

So, are you claiming that these migrants are more likely to commit felonies than are native born Americans?

[LarrySR]

38 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:

I guess you havent read the stats for internal migration in the US.  Florida and Texas are the two most popular states for people to migrate TO.  Strangely, the places that are being abandoned are.... California and New York. Wonder why.

Silly. Right wing media likes to portray Ca. and its progressive polices as a failure...and many believe it apparently...

 

Ca. attracts more investment capitol the the other 49 states combined.

Ca. is the worlds 6th largest economy?

Ca. pays 17% of the Federal taxes.

10% of the Fortune 500 companies located there.

Ca. has a $97 billion budget surpluss.

 

Ca. is the most desirable place to live on the planet.  And therefore... it's very expensive. 

The average home in California is over $860,000 .66% higher than national average......so some are moving to cheap states like Texas where housing is 6% lower than average.. 

Texas is cheap because it's a <deleted>hoIe.

The chart below show a steady rise in population with a 0.44% drop in population in 2021.

 

 

Ca population:
2011	37,703,593
2012	38,055,785
2013	38,342,642
2014	38,644,802
2015	38,913,507
2016	39,127,855
2017	39,328,926
2018	39,476,064
2019	39,529,566
2020	39,541,786
2021	39,368,613

Edited September 16, 2022 by LarrySR

[Scott]

4 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Yes, perhaps true, but given that more than 1.6 MILLION people were apprehended by the border authorities, it is less than 10% of the total number of border crossers.

Not exactly.  There is a difference between the number of people and the number of encounters.  1.6 million encounters does not equate to 1.6 million people.   For the past 35 years, the number of people crossing has been around 1 million a year.  That said, regardless of how you cut it, it is a huge number of people.  

 

Mexico agrees to allow only migrants from 4 countries to be returned to Mexico.  All other nationalities have to go through normal deportation.  Family groups are a particularly tricky issue.  The Mexican state of Tamaulipas (which borders south Texas), would not accept the expulsions under Title 42 of Mexican, Guatemalan, Honduran, or Salvadoran parents with children under the age of 7.  Mexican immigration officials in Chihuahua (bordering El Paso) permitted CBP to expel families under Title 42, regardless of the age of their children.

 

The demographics at the border has changed.  Years ago, it was single, adult Mexican males crossing.  Deporting them was easier and quicker with most being willing to self-deport in exchange for not going to jail.   Now we have families for Central and South America and deporting them is not easy.  

 

There are a number of sources of good information on the situation, here's one:

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/rising-border-encounters-in-2021

 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

So, none of the 'migrants' fall into any of those categories? Murderers, drug dealers, rapists....

 

According to the CBP, they arrested 60 murderers and nearly 500 rapists, plus more than 2,000 people on drug offenses.   Last year alone.

 

Plus seized nearly 100 TONS of meth, 50 tons of coke, 5 tons of fentanyl....

 

Scare tactics?

 

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/stats/cbp-enforcement-statistics/criminal-noncitizen-statistics

So were the tons of drugs being brought into the US by immigrants looking for asylum/work or were they transported by drug mules?

 

Me thinks you are conflating drug smuggling with immigrants.

 

Just as you are implying immigrants are a crime threat because 60 out of 1,600,000 are murderers and 500 out of 1,600,000 are rapists.

 

Oh I get it.

 

Gross negative generalizations of a whole mass of people based on the actions of a tiny minority.

 

Right up your street.

Edited September 16, 2022 by Chomper Higgot

[Hanaguma]

3 minutes ago, LarrySR said:

Silly. Right wing media likes to portray Ca. and its progressive polices as a failure...and many believe it apparently...

 

Ca. attracts more investment capitol the the other 49% combined?

Ca. is the worlds 6th largest economy?

Ca. pays 17% of the Federal taxes.

10% of the Fortune 500 companies located there.

Ca. has a $97 billion budget surpluss.

 

Ca. is the most desirable place to live on the planet.  And therefore... it's very expensive. 

The average home in California is over $860,000 .66% higher than national average......so some are moving to cheap states like Texas where housing is 6% lower than average.. 

Texas is cheap because it's a <deleted>hoIe.

The chart below show a steady rise in population with a 0.44% drop in population in 2021.

 

 

Ca population:
2011	37,703,593
2012	38,055,785
2013	38,342,642
2014	38,644,802
2015	38,913,507
2016	39,127,855
2017	39,328,926
2018	39,476,064
2019	39,529,566
2020	39,541,786
2021	39,368,613

I see virtually zero growth for 5 years, followed by a fall that is continuing. If it were such a great place, why is this happening?

 

Like you said, ridiculous housing costs, ditto for gas, tens of thousands of homeless on the streets.  The best days for Cali are over. It is declining into the future.