Safe and effective.....but maybe for not under 30's...

[placeholder]

1 hour ago, dotcalm said:

Fully vaccinated are dropping dead from covid infection like flies, in staggering numbers compared to unvaccinated.

The claim that vaccines prevent death is becoming a laughable fallacy.

From the article linked to by Bkk Brian

"There are many more vaccinated people than there are unvaccinated people. And vaccinated and boosted people, on average, are older and more likely to have underlying health conditions that put them at risk for severe COVID outcomes.”

That is why, Cox added, when the CDC statistics are adjusted to account for those differences between groups, “we still see that unvaccinated people are at a much greater risk of death and other severe outcomes than vaccinated and boosted people are.”

https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid-casualties-vaccines-idUSL1N32R1UI

[LosLobo]

11 hours ago, dotcalm said:

70% of covid deaths reported in NSW are in fully/boosted vaccinated. If vaccines save lives, why are the vast majority of covid deaths occuring in the fully vaccinated?

So, if vaccines work to prevent deaths why are they not preventing deaths?

The logic of your critical thinking is demonstrated by :

 

''If seat-belts work to prevent car accident deaths why are they not preventing car accident deaths?''

 

Obviously my statement is nonsense!

[Bkk Brian]

12 hours ago, dotcalm said:

It was widely claimed by many that vaccine prevents transmission & infection, but that go changed to NO, but now they "prevent serious illness and death" except so many vaccinated are dying of covid in NSW, Au. Obviously the vaccines didn't save all these vaccinated dead people, they are dead, from covid, despite being boosted according the the NSW report.

 

Think about it instead of trying to spin it.

 

Accept it after letting the data speak for itself. Don't take my word for it, pay close attention to the data.

That's the problem right there, you are NOT paying close attention to the data.

 

From the chart:

 

 

Now look at the age groups of those that died:

 

 

In that age group 95% of people are vaccinated, consequently 5% are not.

 

"There are many more vaccinated people than there are unvaccinated people, and vaccinated and boosted people are, on average, older and more likely to have underlying health conditions that put them at risk for severe COVID-19 outcomes"

 

To work out the risk you need to calculate deaths per 100,000 people, considering that 95,000 of them are vaccinated and 5,000 are not.

 

In the case of vaccinated it is 69 dead or 0.074%

In the case of unvaccinated it is 12 dead or 0.25%

 

Who is at higher risk of death, vaccinated or unvaccinated? The data clearly shows you are at higher risk of death being unvaccinated in that age group.

 

Where is the data to substantiate your claim:

"The claim vaccines saves lives is contrary to the data"

 

Stop spreading misinformation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BangkokHank]

4 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

That's the problem right there, you are NOT paying close attention to the data.

 

From the chart:

 

 

Now look at the age groups of those that died:

 

 

In that age group 95% of people are vaccinated, consequently 5% are not.

 

"There are many more vaccinated people than there are unvaccinated people, and vaccinated and boosted people are, on average, older and more likely to have underlying health conditions that put them at risk for severe COVID-19 outcomes"

 

To work out the risk you need to calculate deaths per 100,000 people, considering that 95,000 of them are vaccinated and 5,000 are not.

 

In the case of vaccinated it is 69 dead or 0.074%

In the case of unvaccinated it is 12 dead or 0.25%

 

Who is at higher risk of death, vaccinated or unvaccinated? The data clearly shows you are at higher risk of death being unvaccinated in that age group.

 

Where is the data to substantiate your claim:

"The claim vaccines saves lives is contrary to the data"

 

Stop spreading misinformation.

But the whole point of the vaccines is that they were supposed to prevent serious illness and death - not to mention the original claim that they would stop the transmission of COVID. So if you can still die from COVID after being vaccinated, and you can die from and be injured by the vaccines, then who in their right mind would get vaccinated voluntarily? 

[Bkk Brian]

27 minutes ago, BangkokHank said:

But the whole point of the vaccines is that they were supposed to prevent serious illness and death - not to mention the original claim that they would stop the transmission of COVID. So if you can still die from COVID after being vaccinated, and you can die from and be injured by the vaccines, then who in their right mind would get vaccinated voluntarily? 

then who in their right mind would get vaccinated voluntarily? 

 

The millions of people who have been saved.

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/03/scicheck-covid-19-vaccines-have-prevented-deaths-contrary-to-misleading-graphic-on-social-media/

Edited December 31, 2022 by Bkk Brian

[dotcalm]

Need more time, more research, more data before drawing any conclusions and until the mRNA solutions are fully tested and the safety data presented. Until then take your chances,

The median age of covid victims is up around 81.5 years while the average life expectancy in the US is 79.1.

 

The Pfizer bivalent shots are suspected to be linked to brain strokes now in the elderly, 65 years and up. Astra Zeneca is not mentioned to have this potential safety risk

 

U.S. FDA, CDC see early signal of Pfizer bivalent COVID shot's link to stroke

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/us-says-pfizers-bivalent-covid-shot-may-be-linked-stroke-older-adults-2023-01-13/?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

 

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, dotcalm said:

Need more time, more research, more data before drawing any conclusions and until the mRNA solutions are fully tested and the safety data presented. Until then take your chances,

The median age of covid victims is up around 81.5 years while the average life expectancy in the US is 79.1.

 

The Pfizer bivalent shots are suspected to be linked to brain strokes now in the elderly, 65 years and up. Astra Zeneca is not mentioned to have this potential safety risk

 

U.S. FDA, CDC see early signal of Pfizer bivalent COVID shot's link to stroke

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/us-says-pfizers-bivalent-covid-shot-may-be-linked-stroke-older-adults-2023-01-13/?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

 

From the link:

 

"Although the totality of the data currently suggests that it is very unlikely that the signal in VSD (Vaccine Safety Datalink) represents a true clinical risk, we believe it is important to share this information with the public," the health authorities said.

This safety concern has not been identified with Moderna's (MRNA.O) bivalent shot and both the CDC and FDA continue to recommend that everyone aged 6 months and older stay up-to-date with their COVID-19 vaccination.

[dotcalm]

5 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

Moderna's (MRNA.O) bivalent shot and both the CDC and FDA continue to recommend that everyone aged 6 months and older stay up-to-date with their COVID-19 vaccination.

therein lays the problem.

[dotcalm]

5 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

From the link:

 

"Although the totality of the data currently suggests that it is very unlikely that the signal in VSD (Vaccine Safety Datalink) represents a true clinical risk, we believe it is important to share this information with the public," the health authorities said.

This safety concern has not been identified with Moderna's (MRNA.O) bivalent shot and both the CDC and FDA continue to recommend that everyone aged 6 months and older stay up-to-date with their COVID-19 vaccination.

I don't think you get it, or just don't want to get it. Would you recommend a drug that may make you MORE susceptible to the disease it's designed to protect you from. If you answer yes.....okay, I understand you.

[Bkk Brian]

5 hours ago, dotcalm said:

I don't think you get it, or just don't want to get it. Would you recommend a drug that may make you MORE susceptible to the disease it's designed to protect you from. If you answer yes.....okay, I understand you.

I do get that the article you posted is not suggesting that. So your question is irrelevant. 

[rabas]

4 hours ago, dotcalm said:

I don't think you get it, or just don't want to get it. Would you recommend a drug that may make you MORE susceptible to the disease it's designed to protect you from. If you answer yes.....okay, I understand you.

You continue to repeat the nonsensical idea that vaccines 'cause' people to get infected, or that 'a person' is more susceptible after vaccination.  In support, you post poorly interpreted media statements and publications like the Cleveland study, which does not say  this.

 

To be clear. There is no scientific evidence showing vaccines make an individual physically more susceptible to catching or dying from Covid, nor have scientists suggested they do. None.

 

As oft explained, there are many reasons a vaccinated cohort may be more susceptible to Covid than an un-vaccinated cohort. Trivial reasons include they were vaccinated because they were more exposed, like hospital workers, or because they were more susceptible to begin with. Even the Cleveland study explains this, did you read it?

 

So before you repeat this false claim again, the burden of proof is on you to prove it, not others to prove a negative. I await your proof.

[dotcalm]

I notice that the reports from Oxford Our World in Data indicate that the countries with the highest vaccination rates also have the highest covid death rates. (see charts below)

it's just a coincidence perhaps.

 

web link Oxford

 

FYI and further assessment:

"Covid deaths are rising sharply in the UK, but an increasing proportion of these are actually due to something else, BBC analysis suggests.

That's because some people die with Covid rather than from it."

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-60000391

Edited January 15, 2023 by dotcalm

[Rimmer]

A misleading post has been removed

[dotcalm]

On 1/15/2023 at 1:35 AM, rabas said:

You continue to repeat the nonsensical idea that vaccines 'cause' people to get infected, or that 'a person' is more susceptible after vaccination.  In support, you post poorly interpreted media statements and publications like the Cleveland study, which does not say  this.

 

To be clear. There is no scientific evidence showing vaccines make an individual physically more susceptible to catching or dying from Covid, nor have scientists suggested they do. None.

 

As oft explained, there are many reasons a vaccinated cohort may be more susceptible to Covid than an un-vaccinated cohort. Trivial reasons include they were vaccinated because they were more exposed, like hospital workers, or because they were more susceptible to begin with. Even the Cleveland study explains this, did you read it?

 

So before you repeat this false claim again, the burden of proof is on you to prove it, not others to prove a negative. I await your proof.

Wait and see if mice are your friend after this result and warning from this peer reviewed study out of China.

After four shots, Covid jabs sharply REDUCED immune function in mice.
Chinese researchers reported the results in a peer-reviewed paper published in December, The finding has gotten no attention and needs attention.

Mice who received more than four covid vaccine jabs had a collapse in their ability to fight the coronavirus, uncovered by Chinese researchers.

The damage extended past antibodies, the immune system’s front line of defense against viruses and bacteria, to the T-cells that form the crucial backup.
The researchers reported the finding in a peer-reviewed paper published December 22 in the journal iScience. In surprisingly clear language, they warned:
“Our findings demonstrate potential risks with the continuous use of SARS-CoV-2 vaccine boosters, providing immediate implications [emphasis added] for the global COVID-19 vaccination enhancement strategies.”

Do you want to risk taking more covid booster jabs and suffer the fate of the mouse?

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2589004222017515?utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email

 

 

[rumak]

On 12/30/2022 at 8:32 PM, dotcalm said:

I gotta jet, think about what I have shared with you and be objective.

two impossibities in one post    LOL