Fire Breaks Out at Pattaya Condo, Hundreds Evacuated, Several People Injured

[BigStar]

2 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

I was not aware of that. 

Of course not, hence the nonsense in your posts. All that blathering about aesthetics, drilling. I had mentioned that indirectly in my early post, however. And that's a reason it's not SO expensive to retrofit.

 

2 hours ago, Longwood50 said:

For apartment buildings or hotels that have gone through two years of Covid, I doubt they have money just laying around for installing a sprinkling system.  

The law's been in effect since 1992, two decades before COVID, plenty of time. And, as I mentioned earlier, money doesn't have to be laying lying around.

 

<SNIP! Irrelevant USA info>

 

 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by BigStar

[BigStar]

On 2/5/2023 at 1:03 PM, Doctor Tom said:

We have a nightly ritual in our 'house'.  Gate locked. all chargers off, no unnecessary electrical items left on and plugged in, gas turned off, doors locked, Try that in a condo building,

Whoops.

 

 

[mikeymike100]

5 hours ago, steven100 said:

what does  'I though cooking with gas' mean  ?

It means I accidentally left the 'T' off the word thoughT

[Longwood50]

1 hour ago, BigStar said:

The law's been in effect since 1992, two decades before COVID, plenty of time. And, as I mentioned earlier, money doesn't have to be laying lying around.

I am not sure what law you are referring to however if it merely requires new buildings built after 1991 to have sprinkling systems then there should be no buildings in the past 20 years that don't have them since the law would prohibit their construction.

If the law says retrofit then it begs the question why it has not been enforced for upwards of 20 years. 

As to money laying around, I beg to differ with you.  When you contact the installation company they are going to ask for payment before proceeding.  

As with your own personal expeditures on your residence, you only have two choices take it out of money you have in reserve or you borrow it.  Given covid I doubt that hotels, and apartments that were impacted by covid have substantial reserves left after they tapped whatever money they saved to tide them over for two years. 

As to borrowing it, that assumes that the person could do that, and that they could then raise the community fees or apartment rates sufficient to cover payments back on the loan.  It is exteremely naive to believe that all the buildings that would require retrofitting would have access to money to pay for it.  And I seriously doubt any contractor would start installing a sprinkler system without being paid. 

 

[BigStar]

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

I am not sure what law you are referring to

Oh, the 1992 Building Safety Control Act.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

then there should be no buildings in the past 20 years that don't have them since the law would prohibit their construction.

Yup, but the law doesn't specify ALL buildings. Why not read the law?

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

If the law says retrofit then it begs the question why it has not been enforced for upwards of 20 years. 

Being enforced, as I told w/ the example of my own building. Inspectors came by and required a retrofit.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

As with your own personal expeditures on your residence, you only have two choices take it out of money you have in reserve or you borrow it.

Finances not your strong suit I guess. Third choice: allocate part of future income. Fourth: draw on other outside sources of revenue to which you have access.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

Given covid I doubt that hotels, and apartments that were impacted by covid have substantial reserves left after they tapped whatever money they saved to tide them over for two years. 

Actually you don't have a clue. They may or may not. They may have other sources of income from which to draw. Yawn.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

As to borrowing it, that assumes that the person could do that,

Why, yes, it does.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

and that they could then raise the community fees or apartment rates sufficient to cover payments back on the loan. 

Not necessarily. They could borrow based on reallocation of current income.

 

25 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

It is exteremely naive to believe that all the buildings that would require retrofitting would have access to money to pay for it. 

ALL buildings is another straw man. But what buildings (covered under the law) built since 1992 have not been able to do so? You must know (like you did about the pipes), so let's have your evidence, not just hot air.

 

Now, suppose the apt/hotel didn't and closed. So what? Business is business and has risks. Is there a shortage? At least one poster has recently based his entire posting oeuvre about the "oversupply."  

Edited February 6, 2023 by BigStar

[Longwood50]

16 minutes ago, BigStar said:

Yup, but the law doesn't specify ALL buildings. Why not read the law?

I don't need to read the law.  As stated. If it says that certain buildings built after 1992 must have sprinkling systems, there should be none, since construction should not have been permitted after that. 

If the law stipulates that certain buildings must be retrofitted, then it begs the question why has it not been enforced for the past 20 years. 

One way or another the passage of a law does not solve the issue of how to pay for such sprinkling systems.  The law may issue a judgement against a person for 10 million baht.  But it the person does not have the 10 million baht such a judgement is meaningless. 

The same is true of a regulation that mandates that a building own must have a sprinkling system.  If that owner lacks the money or the ability to borrow it then the regulation is unenforceable. 

[BigStar]

45 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

If the law stipulates that certain buildings must be retrofitted, then it begs the question why has it not been enforced for the past 20 years. 

Rather, you yourself have begged the question and provided a complex question fallacy.  It's up to you to provide evidence that it hasn't, as I said already and you ignored. And I gave you an excellent example of it's being enforced.

 

45 minutes ago, Longwood50 said:

  If that owner lacks the money or the ability to borrow it then the regulation is unenforceable. 

???? Laughable. Then the regulation is enforced by requiring the closure of the building. I guess your problem now is that you're having a hard time accepting that, after all this, you had no real point to make. So, just going around in circles.

 

 

Edited February 6, 2023 by BigStar

[Leaver]

 

Many condo blocks here are now being used as hotels, but without hotel licenses, and without hotel safety standards, and I use he words "safety standards" loosely when discussing Thailand. 

 

You now have aging condo blocks, with cooking facilities inside, and lacking modern safety standards, being used by holidaying tourists.  What could possibly go wrong?   

[Tony M]

On 2/5/2023 at 2:05 PM, Photoguy21 said:

Do the sprinklers work? I had 2 condos in Jomtien Beach Condo and the sprinkler system was never maintained to my knowledge.

Yes, the sprinklers work. Was my earlier post not clear ?  

[Rimmer]

 

From the forum rules:

 

7. Do not quote more than three multiple nested quotes. Only quote the person you are replying to, and only quote the relevant section that you are discussing.

[Photoguy21]

On 2/6/2023 at 6:28 AM, jacko45k said:

Difficult things to test fully... run the pumps and alarm system by bleeding it somewhere. I have little confidence that such a system would be maintained very well here....

I doubt if it was ever maintained when I lived there. Just a hunch but possibly a good hunch.

[Photoguy21]

8 hours ago, Tony M said:

Yes, the sprinklers work. Was my earlier post not clear ?  

As long as the system is regularly tested everything should be ok

[Tony M]

2 hours ago, Photoguy21 said:

I doubt if it was ever maintained when I lived there. Just a hunch but possibly a good hunch.

It was, and is, maintained. If you don't know, then please don't badmouth out condo building. Why would you do that ?