Sleep problems

[Irrumator]

About 4 weeks ago I started having problems with sleep. I'd get off OK (with some clonazepam (Rivotril), which has had to creep up and up), but I have  constantly starting waking up about 2.45 am.  Not always for the bathroom, but once I was awake, it was very difficult to get back off. I'd normally wake about 6 to 6.30 which was fine.

 

However, recently I went to the doc and explained the problem again. I have had to increase the clonazepam to 4 mgs a night, pretty high yet I always wake up after about 3 to 3 1/2 hours sleep and can't get back off at all.  I know older people sleep less (I'm 74) but this sudden onset is a real PITA.  

 

The last few days I've just got up (this morning 1.45 am, yesterday 2.15, the day before 2.45.  I potter on my PC, maybe watch a film and after breakfast go for a snooze.  However this is really getting to me and I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has this problem and how they deal with it.

 

Tips very welcome, but please don't say have a skinful before bed!  

 

 

 

[Ralf001]

I too suffered similar sleep issues.

 

Doc now has me on low dose Xanax, that's me lights out for 8 hours !!

[EVENKEEL]

Marijuana plus melatonin does it for me before bedtime.

[jvs]

10 minutes ago, Ralf001 said:

I too suffered similar sleep issues.

 

Doc now has me on low dose Xanax, that's me lights out for 8 hours !!

Same here,many years of taking poison like Xanax and the like.

Medical Cannabis has been the answer for me,sleep like a rock.

 

[ozimoron]

Exercise before bed, don't eat for two hours before bedtime and practise intermittent fasting.

[Moonlover]

24 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

Exercise before bed, don't eat for two hours before bedtime and practise intermittent fasting.

I mainly agree with what you say but would caution against exercising too close sleep time. (unless it's sex of course!) It can raise your energy levels and make sleep more difficult. Find a happy medium.

 

I do not eat at all after 6pm and drink very little. And strictly no alcohol.

 

I would also suggest that the O/P stay away from sleep medication. Here's a much better way to help you nod off. As Jim says, it might not work for you the first time, but persist. It works for me every time now.

 

 

[patman30]

avoid food and screens a few hours before sleep
turn off any blue LED lights, dim any lighting
wake up early, don't have an afternoon nap
weed is now legal, you do not need to smoke it but you can ingest it
which takes an hour or so before it starts to take effect
DM me if you need advice on weed oil/butter/edibles hoe to dose etc.

[connda]

Medical marijuana and melatonin works for me too although I only use the ganja occasionally.  Sometime I'll use Atarax as well.

Another thing I do is to listen to Talk Radio at a low volume.  I've noticed by concentrating on the talk show my mind doesn't think and it's the thinking that keeps me awake.  The Talk Radio then becomes a drone in the background and I fall asleep.

On a normal night I'll use melatonin and Talk Radio.  If I wake up, I focus on listening, the the drone of the talk eventually puts me back to sleep.

[Lacessit]

My approach has been to not worry about it. I am up 2 or 3 times a night with BPH. If I don't feel tired, I may be on the internet at 2 or 3 am for an hour before going back to bed. I nap during the day if I feel like it.

 

All medications must be metabolized by the kidneys and liver. For that reason, I limit my use of them as much as possible. I quit using anti-depressants 10 years ago, anti-inflammatories 6 years ago, and anti-hypertensives 2 years ago. Everyone is different, I have quit alcohol because it disrupts sleep anyway, it's a diuretic.

Diet and exercise were important in enabling me to quit.

 

If I really want a good night's sleep, I may take a Codiphen or half a hash cookie once a week, no more. Yes, they are processed by the kidneys and liver too.

 

I can't remember who said the pharmaceutical industry has no interest in making a drug that cures a health condition permanently. They prefer developing pills that create repeat customers.

[Sheryl]

Quick dissolve sublingual melatonin works well for me with middle of the night/too early morning  waking.  I keep it by the bedside. Takes about 10-15 minutes and I'm back asleep. Need to have at least 3 hours left to sleep before taking though, or else I will have trouble getting up.

 

I use Natrol brand 5 mg, you van get it on Lazada

 

 

 

[Adumbration]

I had a very similar problem to you.  But I found a cure using 100% pure coconut massage oil that you can buy in most supermarkets in Thailand.  It most effective when rubbed on you by a girl aged between 18 to 22.

[Irrumator]

2 hours ago, Ralf001 said:

I too suffered similar sleep issues.

 

Doc now has me on low dose Xanax, that's me lights out for 8 hours !!

Xanax doesn't touch me.  Even 4 mgs Rivotril only has me out for 3-4 hours.

[Irrumator]

25 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Quick dissolve sublingual melatonin works well for me with middle of the night/too early morning  waking.  I keep it by the bedside. Takes about 10-15 minutes and I'm back asleep. Need to have at least 3 hours left to sleep before taking though, or else I will have trouble getting up.

 

I use Natrol brand 5 mg, you van get it on Lazada

 

 

 

I've heard a lot about this in America where it seems very popular.  

 

I'm not sure if it's legal or available in the UK, but I'll check.

 

However if Lazada or Shopee has it, I'll give it a try.  What sort of price for how many?

 

 

[Thailand]

1/2 litre of pasteurized milk at bedtime does it for me.

Maybe one overnight pee break but often 10-11 hours sleep each night.

[Lacessit]

44 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Quick dissolve sublingual melatonin works well for me with middle of the night/too early morning  waking.  I keep it by the bedside. Takes about 10-15 minutes and I'm back asleep. Need to have at least 3 hours left to sleep before taking though, or else I will have trouble getting up.

 

I use Natrol brand 5 mg, you van get it on Lazada

 

 

 

Melatonin does absolutely nothing for me. I can't become addicted to morphine either. OTOH, give me Demerol and they'd be hauling me down from the ceiling.

Everyone is different, I guess it's a matter of individuals finding what works for them.

I have heard kratom is a sedative in higher doses. I haven't tried it myself for sleep, as I understand it is addictive.

[Sheryl]

28 minutes ago, Irrumator said:

I've heard a lot about this in America where it seems very popular.  

 

I'm not sure if it's legal or available in the UK, but I'll check.

 

However if Lazada or Shopee has it, I'll give it a try.  What sort of price for how many?

 

 

https://www.lazada.co.th/natrol/?spm=a2o4m.searchlist.funnel_filter.4.3fa92184L8xCdF&q=melatonin&_keyori=ss&from=input&catalog_redirect_tag=true

 

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, Irrumator said:

Xanax doesn't touch me.  Even 4 mgs Rivotril only has me out for 3-4 hours.

These are all benzos and tolerance (and addiction) develops with constant use. Continually raising the dose just gets you in deeper trouble.

 

You have already developed tolerance (and would suffer withdrawal effects if you tried to stop on your own - do so under medical supervision). Which is why it no longer works.

 

For anyone else taking or thinking of taking these drugs a good rule of thumb is:  Not more than 2-3 times a week and never 2 nights in a row

 

 

 

 

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

Melatonin does absolutely nothing for me. I can't become addicted to morphine either. OTOH, give me Demerol and they'd be hauling me down from the ceiling.

Everyone is different, I guess it's a matter of individuals finding what works for them.

I have heard kratom is a sedative in higher doses. I haven't tried it myself for sleep, as I understand it is addictive.

??

 

I don't think you meant to say "can't become addicted" ???

 

Anyone can and will become addicted to morphine if they take it regularly.

 

 

[Irrumator]

15 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

https://www.lazada.co.th/natrol/?spm=a2o4m.searchlist.funnel_filter.4.3fa92184L8xCdF&q=melatonin&_keyori=ss&from=input&catalog_redirect_tag=true

 

Thanks for that.  I see they come in different dosages.  I assume it would be better to start small and test  it out rather than before starting on the maximum dose?

Or could you suggest a recommended  starting level for a 74 year old male, 65 kgs body weight?

 

[ezzra]

Circadin® Melatonin Tablets, this is pharmaceutical grade melatonin put you to sleep fast and safe every time, not sure you can get in Thailand though.

https://www.circadin.com.au/circadin-melatonin-tablets/

[Sheryl]

Just now, Irrumator said:

Thanks for that.  I see they come in different dosages.  I assume it would be better to start small and test  it out rather than before starting on the maximum dose?

Or could you suggest a recommended  starting level for a 74 year old male, 65 kgs body weight?

 

Everyone is different.

 

There is no specified maximum dose or recommended dose but conventionally, people do nto usually take more than 10mg at once.

 

It is a substance naturally present in the body.

 

For me, I need larger doses. I take 10 mg before bedtime and if I waken in the middle of the night I take another 5,mg sublingual fast acting. But that is me and everyone responds differently.

 

I would suggest you try 5 mg. But you can try 3 if you prefer.

[scubascuba3]

Get a going to sleep time routine, if i get up in the night fine, go for a piss, don't put lights on, back to bed and sleep, 2 or 3 times no problem, 6-7 hours sleep seems to be my sweetspot 

[indyo]

I solved a similar issue for my 80 years old father with cbd oil(10%), 20mg cbd before bed time worked great. 

[bkk6060]

If a person does not have a sex partner, masturbation before bed time seems to work well to help with sleep.

Edited April 7, 2023 by bkk6060

[BigStar]

4 hours ago, Irrumator said:

However, recently I went to the doc and explained the problem again. I have had to increase the clonazepam to 4 mgs a night, pretty high yet I always wake up after about 3 to 3 1/2 hours sleep and can't get back off at all.  

Well, you're addicted and dependent already. Best thing to do, unpleasant as it will be, is to taper off the benzo and quit. Start over w/ other methods as suggested here.

[JensenZ]

4 hours ago, ozimoron said:

Exercise before bed, don't eat for two hours before bedtime and practise intermittent fasting.

I suppose if you wipe yourself out with a very stenuous exercise session it might help you to get to sleep, but if the exercise is too extreme, it will also interfere with your sleep.

 

If you do mild exercise it should be many hours before you sleep as it usually makes you feel more active.

 

However, a regular exercise program suited to your age (not too stenuous) will generally improve the quality of sleep.

[JensenZ]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

Get a going to sleep time routine, if i get up in the night fine, go for a piss, don't put lights on, back to bed and sleep, 2 or 3 times no problem, 6-7 hours sleep seems to be my sweetspot 

I started using a bottle next to the bed to cut down on the interuption of a trip to the bathroom. My sweetspot is about 5 hours.

[JensenZ]

4 hours ago, Irrumator said:

Tips very welcome, but please don't say have a skinful before bed!  

I don't know your personal situation, but awhile back I had some financial distress which made it impossible to sleep more then 4 hours a night - for months on end. Stange thing is that I never felt sleepy either. 

[homeseeker]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

https://www.lazada.co.th/natrol/?spm=a2o4m.searchlist.funnel_filter.4.3fa92184L8xCdF&q=melatonin&_keyori=ss&from=input&catalog_redirect_tag=true

 

Thank you, Sheryl. Worth a try.

My doctor gave me Lorazepam but melatonin more natural....right?

 

[Sheryl]

1 minute ago, homeseeker said:

Thank you, Sheryl. Worth a try.

My doctor gave me Lorazepam but melatonin more natural....right?

 

Absolutely. As well as nonaddictive. 

 

Lorazepam is a benzo. Addictive and one builds a tolerance such that it stops working. If yoy must take it keep to glthe rule I mentioned before.