Retirement Extension. Money in bank

[Red Phoenix]

23 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

That is a huge statement, chances are very high that  he/she will not accept it. Its in direct violation of the extension rules and although IOs do have some discretion, its by no means certain that they will exercise it and I personally would not stake my extension on it. 

Maybe he should 'test the waters first' and go to Immigration and request talking to the Officer in charge about his options due to this case.  And hopefully the Officer in charge will say that such a small - and immediately corrected - mistake, will not be a hurdle for his application.  As a retirement extension does not need divisional approval, the Officer in charge has the authority to make such decisions. 

However, when Immigration is reluctant, OP would then know that his application would be refused.  And he might hint to the option of whether engaging an Agent willing to do the extension application for him, would be an option. 

If also that option is ruled out, OP should do a border-run - without a Re-Entry Permit - ultimately on the last day of his permission to stay.  And then return VisaExempt, and apply for a 90-day Non Imm O Visa (for reason of marriage or for reason of retirement), followed by a subsequent 1-year extension application at the end of those 90 days.

[somo]

I don't understand why I cannot revert to a marriage extension if the IO choose to deny my retirement extension. Until about 5 years ago that's what I had so can't see a problem reverting to it.

[DrJack54]

27 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

Unfortunately switching to an extension for reason of marriage is not an option.  Because when changing your extension from retirement to marriage, it is a 2-step process:

First IO will check whether you have met the requirements for the 'retirement' extensions Permit to stay, and only when those requirements have been met, will they then check whether you also meet the requirements for the new 'marriage'  extension application.  But in your case you have not fulfilled the requirement for the retirement extension, as you did not meet the 'never slip under 800K' requirement during the last 2 months of your permission to stay. 

I understand what you are pointing out however....

 

Assuming that this 20k withdrawal was done recently, I recall (think it was uj) stating that the balance could be as low as 400k in the 2 months prior to changing from based on retirement to based on marriage. 

 

Folk doing that I always suggest stick with the 800k for two months prior to application just to be on safe side..

 

If withdrawal was recent , don't think issue for the OP.

Edited April 21, 2023 by DrJack54

[somo]

9 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

I understand what you are pointing out however....

 

Assuming that this 20k withdrawal was done recently, I recall (think it was uj) stating that the balance could be as low as 400k in the 2 months prior to changing from based on retirement to based on marriage. 

 

Folk doing that I always suggest stick with the 800k for two months prior to application just to be on safe side..

 

If withdrawal was recent , don't think issue for the OP.

The withdrawal was today and my current ext. runs out on 5th May

[Red Phoenix]

14 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

I understand what you are pointing out however....

 

Assuming that this 20k withdrawal was done recently, I recall (think it was uj) stating that the balance could be as low as 400k in the 2 months prior to changing from based on retirement to based on marriage. 

 

Folk doing that I always suggest stick with the 800k for two months prior to application just to be on safe side..

 

If withdrawal was recent , don't think issue for the OP.

Yes, if his IO allows switching to a Marriage extension without having to meet the +800K requirement during last 2 months of this Retirement extension, that would indeed be an option. 

And I agree with you that any reasonable Imm Office would not make an issue of that 20 minute - and immediately corrected - slip under the required 800K.  Hence my suggestion for first 'testing the waters' by requesting to talk with the Officer in charge to address the issue and discuss the options prior to him doing the actual application.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Red Phoenix

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, somo said:

The withdrawal was today and my current ext. runs out on 5th May

Tick Tock.

Best go asap to find out if the small short time withdrawal will be overlooked.

 

Did you reply to option of supplying 2 bank accounts.

Obviously would need to be in your name only.

 

 

[ningnong]

When you go to immigration be sure you and your wife dress politely, no shorts, no sandals. If it looks like things aren't going to go in your favor have your wife explain what happened and how badly you feel about it and that you are more than willing to pay a fine for any increased workload this will cause.

[somo]

11 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Tick Tock.

Best go asap to find out if the small short time withdrawal will be overlooked.

 

Did you reply to option of supplying 2 bank accounts.

Obviously would need to be in your name only.

 

 

I just have the one account although there is plenty of money in my wife's acc.

[DrJack54]

Just now, somo said:

I just have the one account although there is plenty of money in my wife's acc.

OK skip the idea of two accounts. 

 

One more thing. 

If you have no joy with immigration ...

Have you used your 60 day extension to visit wife.

That would provide 2 months of seasoning. 

Then obtain extension based on retirement. 

[Doctor Tom]

1 hour ago, somo said:

I am not risking anything by applying in the usual way. You do seem full of doom and gloom or have you personally fallen foul in such a situation. As someone said above I am sure they have some discretion in the matter. Worst case is reverting to a marriage ext. then going back to retirement next year.

While I am here it is worth pointing out that here I have never been told to keep the account topped up for 4 months and never been asked to show statements for more than 6 months before an application so it seems there is a variation in the rules.

Perhaps it would be best if you actually went onto the immigration website and read the rules for yourself. You seem to be replacing fact with wishful thinking.  Good luck with that. 

[somo]

6 minutes ago, ningnong said:

When you go to immigration be sure you and your wife dress politely, no shorts, no sandals. If it looks like things aren't going to go in your favor have your wife explain what happened and how badly you feel about it and that you are more than willing to pay a fine for any increased workload this will cause.

Yeah, I always go well dressed. Been here long enough to know not to piss people off if you want reasonable treatment. Wife willl do the grovelling for me ???? As I said above I think as so often here in Thailand it can all revolve around the mood of the IO at the time. Generally they are a friendly bunch up here and they know me as it is not a busy office with so few farangs around town.

If they turn me down I will go through a Pattaya agent which a friend uses.

[DrJack54]

6 minutes ago, Doctor Tom said:

Perhaps it would be best if you actually went onto the immigration website and read the rules for yourself. You seem to be replacing fact with wishful thinking.  Good luck with that. 

The rules for the financials is crystal clear and OP is aware of them.

Zero point in reading the requirements on website. 

[ningnong]

12 minutes ago, somo said:

As I said above I think as so often here in Thailand it can all revolve around the mood of the IO at the time. Generally they are a friendly bunch up here and they know me as it is not a busy office with so few farangs around town.

I always shoot for Wednesdays or Thursdays in the morning when dealing with Immigration, banks etc. folks tend to be in a decent mood. Monday is a definite no-no.

 

Khon Kaen office is friendly too and easy to have a conversation with.

[somo]

34 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

OK skip the idea of two accounts. 

 

One more thing. 

If you have no joy with immigration ...

Have you used your 60 day extension to visit wife.

That would provide 2 months of seasoning. 

Then obtain extension based on retirement. 

Ah, now that sounds like an idea. No need to go on a visa run then which would be a right pain. So if I understan correctly I would be entitled to a 60 day extension regardless after which I can extend for retirement. - Brilliant ???? 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

As usual, I think DrJack has given good suggestions for options above...

 

I'll just add, my impression from past cases reported here is that Immigration in general seems to have been pretty unforgiving when it has come to even brief lapses in meeting the financial requirement for retirement extensions... The OP certainly isn't the first soul to have fallen afoul of this thru various kinds of mishaps.

 

Not saying he and the wife shouldn't try to persuade their local Immigration chief or at least give it a try.... But in the past, the odds of such things succeeding don't seem to have been very good.

 

[DrJack54]

9 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I'll just add, my impression from past cases reported here is that Immigration in general seems to have been pretty unforgiving when it has come to even brief lapses in meeting the financial requirement for retirement extensions... The OP certainly isn't the first soul to have fallen afoul of this thru various kinds of mishaps.

That's so true and weird in my thinking. 

If rejected he should ask to see the higher level io.

 

At CW they are the ones at rear of L desks.

 

The OP's  immigration office surely has similar set up on much smaller scale. 

 

Perhaps the OP could mention he plans to switch to marriage if retirement not an option.

Might give the io incentive as much less paperwork for retirement. 

Edited April 21, 2023 by DrJack54

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Perhaps the OP could mention he plans to switch to marriage if retirement not an option.

Might give the io incentive as much less paperwork for retirement. 

 

Not knowing the workings of his particular Immigration office, but if needed, he could also consider humbly offering to pay a "fine" of some modest amount to make up for the financial boo-boo. You never know...

 

[somo]

8 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

That's so true and weird in my thinking. 

If rejected he should ask to see the higher level io.

 

At CW they are the ones at rear of L desks.

 

The OP's  immigration office surely has similar set up on much smaller scale. 

 

Perhaps the OP could mention he plans to switch to marriage if retirement not an option.

Might give the io incentive as much less paperwork for retirement. 

"The OP's  immigration office surely has similar set up on much smaller scale. "

Yeah, he signs off all the extensions and the nice lady IO I dealt with last year laughed when I called him "the big boss upstairs"

 

"Might give the io incentive as much less paperwork for retirement. "

Too right and why I switched to retirement extensions.

[DrJack54]

4 minutes ago, somo said:

"Might give the io incentive as much less paperwork for retirement. "

Too right and why I switched to retirement extensions

What I meant is much less work for immigration.

 

[foreverlomsak]

2 hours ago, somo said:

but out here in the sticks they are not so unfriendly as the Bangkok lot.

I wouldn't bet on it if I was you and yes I know betting is illegal in Thailand, even though the majority do it.

[Jingthing]

I recall multiple reports here over

the years of going under but fixed the SAME DAY being accepted.

 

If it was me I would just apply as normal.

Edited April 21, 2023 by Jingthing

[Red Phoenix]

1 hour ago, somo said:

I don't understand why I cannot revert to a marriage extension if the IO choose to deny my retirement extension. Until about 5 years ago that's what I had so can't see a problem reverting to it.

This just for your info as you wrote that you did not understand the why > The permission to stay from your 1-year extension for reason of retirement has been provided ON THE CONDITION that during that 1 year you would keep +800K on your personal Thai bank-account during the first 3 months, you are then allowed to lower to +400K in the next 7 months, and need to top up again to +800K during the last 2 months. Failure to meet that condition, means your Permit to stay became invalid from the moment of the breach.  And you would not be able to extend such invalid Permit.  

Note 1: In your case, the IO can be lenient as the breach happened during the last 2 months and when you state that you intend to switch to a Marriage extension (which only needs +400K during the 2 months preceding its application - which you meet), this might be accepted.  And considering that a Marriage extension is much more work for them, they would probably be inclined to overlook the minor 20 minute breach that was immediately corrected.

Note 2: If you have not used yet your one-time 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting your wife during your unbroken chain of Permits to stay, applying for such extension would provide you with sufficient time to meet the '2 months 800K' prior to application for your 1-year 'retirement' extension. But hopefully it will not be necessary for you to use that ultimate escape.

[somo]

27 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

Note 2: If you have not used yet your one-time 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting your wife during your unbroken chain of Permits to stay, applying for such extension would provide you with sufficient time to meet the '2 months 800K' prior to application for your 1-year 'retirement' extension. But hopefully it will not be necessary for you to use that ultimate escape.

Thanks Phoenix - weel explained. I have never use a 60 day extension so worst comes to worst that looks like my get out jail card. I will go see immigration next week and explain my 'accidental' breech of the rules and hope they take the easy way out for both sides.

 

Thanks all for your input.

[Bangkok Barry]

19 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

They are usually scrupulous in the matter, so don't take the risk. No good explaining to them.  I have heard of them turning down an extension when such a mistake was rectified immediately.

Yes. Absolutely no common sense allowed. Doesn't exist in Thailand.

[NoshowJones]

21 hours ago, TaoNow said:

Don't know about Chaiyaphum, but in Bangkok, Immo/CW would probably consider the dip below 800K to be a violation of the terms.

 

I would go to you local Immo office ahead of time to see what their position is.

Best advice, as some IO's have different rules from others, and even make up their own.

[Doctor Tom]

19 hours ago, somo said:

and hope they take the easy way out for both sides.

What?  There are no 'both sides' to this, you have to care, they don't care at all. As it's you that has broken the rule, their 'easy way out', as you oddly put it, is to just refuse an extension.

 

Sorry to say this, but I think you need to wake up a bit to the reality of Thailand and your own position.  I wish you luck, I think that you may need it. 

Edited April 22, 2023 by Doctor Tom

[rwill]

If they are nice they may give you a 60 day extension to season your money again.

 

When I first retired here I opened a joint account with my wife because I didn't know it had to be just your name on the account.  They gave me a 60 day extension to rectify it.

[DrJack54]

1 minute ago, rwill said:

If they are nice they may give you a 60 day extension to season your money again.

Why "if they are nice" ? 

The OP is entitled to obtain 60 day extension to visit wife.

Nothing nice about it. 

It's immigration rules. 

[somo]

22 hours ago, Doctor Tom said:

What?  There are no 'both sides' to this, you have to care, they don't care at all. As it's you that has broken the rule, their 'easy way out', as you oddly put it, is to just refuse an extension.

 

Sorry to say this, but I think you need to wake up a bit to the reality of Thailand and your own position.  I wish you luck, I think that you may need it. 

I have lived here for 25 years so am well versed in the 'realities of Thailand' and have learned they vary from place to place and person to person. I do not subscribe to the 'them and us' version of reality.

[somo]

16 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

Why "if they are nice" ? 

The OP is entitled to obtain 60 day extension to visit wife.

Nothing nice about it. 

It's immigration rules. 

That's good to know. I still feel they may well forgive the small break in the rules but 60 days would be fine and knowing this stops me worrying.