Many times, trying to cross various streets in Pattaya, I use the pedestrian crosswalks, with lights. For vehicle traffic, the light is red, for pedestrians, its green, but many many times, the vehicles don't stop. I have even taking a video showing vehicle license plates and the lights to the Pattaya Police station, showing the violations. They took a copy of the video and said they would inform me of the outcome. But the officer also said, that they have to identify and find the driver of the vehicle, not the owner. It seems the law is written so that the driver gets charged not the owner. It's simple for an owner to say he wasn't driving the vehicle and someone, perhaps a ghost, was driving it. Consequently, the Police eventually give-up the chase because their spending too much time on an incident where there is little benefit. Why can't the vehicle owner be charged?

 

 

So you lend your car to a family member and then you become responsible for their every traffic violation and/or crime…?

4 minutes ago, NextG said:

So you lend your car to a family member and then you become responsible for their every traffic violation and/or crime…?

 

It's not that difficult. In many countries it's the owners responsibility to identify the driver. If they can't they are responsible for the violation. Perfectly reasonable.

7 minutes ago, Banana7 said:

Why can't the vehicle owner be charged?

 

Because he /she is not driving Duh? School buses in Thailand do have flashing lights but no one stops for them either.

People that can't cross the road without lights shouldn't be allowed out in public, in Thailand at least. If you want that level of enforcement then go back to your home country.

 

 

I'm shocked.

12 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

 

Because he /she is not driving Duh? School buses in Thailand do have flashing lights but no one stops for them either.

Who the hell stops on both sides of the roads when a school bus stops? Only a stupid American thing from what I understand. Nowhere else in the world.

26 minutes ago, Banana7 said:

Many times, trying to cross various streets in Pattaya, I use the pedestrian crosswalks, with lights. For vehicle traffic, the light is red, for pedestrians, its green, but many many times, the vehicles don't stop.

When have you ever known the Thai police enforce any law.  Have you ever been to Sukhumvit Road in Bangkok - the junction with Soi 3/4?  There's a manned police box there but cars go through the lights at red all the time. Two foreigners were killed at those lights a few years back but still nothing changes.

 

I sympathise with your concerns but I gave up on things changing in Thailand a long time ago. If they're going to let drivers go through red lights right in front of a police box, they're never going to act on your videos - that would mean actually having to work.

1 hour ago, gargamon said:

People that can't cross the road without lights shouldn't be allowed out in public, in Thailand at least. If you want that level of enforcement then go back to your home country.

 

 

 

 

People that can't drive a car without stopping at lights shouldn't have a license, regardless of where they are from. I guess you don't have kids here?

When the light-controlled crossing near the school/temple on Sth Pattaya road was working it was spine-chilling to see kids crossing on the 'green man'. I saw vehicles failing to stop on a red and driving between groups of kids on the crossing!  I think those lights have been deactivated now. Maybe safer not to have any lights rather than lights that drivers ignore (basically a 'trap' for pedestrians).

Its easy to punish infractions. Simply write to the registered owner/'keeper' with a requirement to name the driver within 14 days. If the driver is not named then the owner takes the punishment.  Pretty standard around the world.

1 hour ago, gargamon said:

People that can't cross the road without lights shouldn't be allowed out in public, in Thailand at least. If you want that level of enforcement then go back to your home country.

 

 

So both Foreigners and Thai people should just accept that the roads are highly dangerous and will never change?

32 minutes ago, Woof999 said:

 

 

People that can't drive a car without stopping at lights shouldn't have a license, regardless of where they are from. I guess you don't have kids here?

I don't have kids anywhere. Why would you want one? But that's a whole different topic, so back to this one... 

 

It's called survival of the fittest. If you're not smart enough to cross the road on your own, you shouldn't be allowed to procreate. If you did have offspring and they died like that, it's on you for not teaching them better. 

1 hour ago, NextG said:

So you lend your car to a family member and then you become responsible for their every traffic violation and/or crime…?

Yes and why not?  You have the option of stating who the actual driver was. Or should those who commit offences but are not the registered owner be allowed to get away with it?  Think what would happen in those circumstances........no owner would ever admit to driving the car.

 

If the owner reveals who the driver is, and you'd think they'd know, they don't have a problem.

 

Tell me, if your kid was killed, wouldn't you want someone prosecuting for it?

4 minutes ago, gargamon said:

I don't have kids anywhere.

 

4 minutes ago, gargamon said:

It's called survival of the fittest.

 

Looks like you've already removed your genes from the pool. Job done ✔

 

3 minutes ago, gargamon said:

I don't have kids anywhere. Why would you want one? But that's a whole different topic, so back to this one... 

 

It's called survival of the fittest. If you're not smart enough to cross the road on your own, you shouldn't be allowed to procreate. If you did have offspring and they died like that, it's on you for not teaching them better. 

I'm not religious but thank god most people won't hold such views.

 

You don't need to be smart to cross the road in Thailand, you need to either have a death wish or be a magician.

8 minutes ago, MangoKorat said:

Yes and why not?  You have the option of stating who the actual driver was. Or should those who commit offences but are not the registered owner be allowed to get away with it?  Think what would happen in those circumstances........no owner would ever admit to driving the car.

 

If the owner reveals who the driver is, and you'd think they'd know, they don't have a problem.

 

Tell me, if your kid was killed, wouldn't you want someone prosecuting for it?

Okay, so you say that your sister borrowed it, but then your sister says that someone else was driving it at that time; she lent it to her husband…

Driving around Pattaya and Jomtien, I was surprised how disciplined Cars and most motorbikes stopped at the pedestrian crossings with red light. Very different to some years ago. However, if nobody is crossing, I do see motorbikes and sometimes Cars too, going wile still red is displayed. 

 

Not respecting the red light are many Tourists crossing the road, even after the light changed to red for them. They still get safe to the other side of the road, nobody is honking or trying to run them over. Much more patient here then back home. 

3 hours ago, bbi1 said:

Who the hell stops on both sides of the roads when a school bus stops? Only a stupid American thing from what I understand. Nowhere else in the world.

Not true, not stopping at school crossings / for school buses / school kids is a very serious offence in Australia.

 

Most drivers are very very careful with this because they don't want the extreme wrath of the community on them plus legal action with strong punishments if there's an acccident and death/injuries with schol kids/buses etc.

 

Before and after school all crossings outside of schools are manned with trained crossing officers with flags etc., and drivers always obey their instructions.

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

Not true, not stopping at school crossings / for school buses / school kids is a very serious offence in Australia.

 

Most drivers are very very careful with this because they don't want the extreme wrath of the community on them plus legal action with strong punishments if there's an acccident and death/injuries with schol kids/buses etc.

 

Before and after school all crossings outside of schools are manned with trained crossing officers with flags etc., and drivers always obey their instructions.

Same in Canada as Australia. In Ontario Canada, not stopping at a pedestrian crossing is a fine up to $1,000 plus 4 demerit points, double fines in safety zones, usually located near schools. Serious injury or killing a pedestrian results in huge penalties ($1,000,000+), plus jail time. Not stopping for a school bus results in First offence: Up to $2000 plus 6 demerit points Each following offence: Up to $4000 plus 6 demerit points plus up to 6 months in jail. (CAD1$=26baht)

 

Thailand is just not serious about protecting pedestrians, especially in school zones, or heavy traffic areas.

Of course not.  You think this is America?  TIT - This is Thailand.

You can b*tch and complain about it until the buffalos come home, but the lesson I learned the first week in Chiang Mai after a near miss: As you cross, keep your eyes on all the traffic, especially behind and in-between the cars where motorcycles are most likely to shoot though, at speed, without stopping.

  "But they are breaking the law!!! Arrggghhh."

But when you get hit by a car, truck, bus, or motorcycle - it's your broken body in the hospital and you'll probably be paying all the bill as half or more will hit and run.  The other 40% will plead poverty and no insurance.  So?  You do what you learned in Kindergarten (or at least my Kindergarten):  Look both ways, look again, and keep scanning for anything moving as you cross.  It's your butt on the line.

  "But they are breaking the law!!! Arrggghhh."

Whatever!  

2 minutes ago, connda said:

You can b*tch and complain about it until the buffalos come home, but the lesson I learned the first week in Chiang Mai after a near miss: As you cross, keep your eyes on all the traffic, especially behind and in-between the cars where motorcycles are most likely to shoot though, at speed, without stopping.

  "But they are breaking the law!!! Arrggghhh."

But when you get hit by a car, truck, bus, or motorcycle - it's your broken body in the hospital and you'll probably be paying all the bill as half or more will hit and run.  The other 40% will plead poverty and no insurance.  So?  You do what you learned in Kindergarten (or at least my Kindergarten):  Look both ways, look again, and keep scanning for anything moving as you cross.  It's your butt on the line.

  "But they are breaking the law!!! Arrggghhh."

Whatever!  

If you get hit by a driver in Thailand with no insurance or a runner, there is a special uninsured drivers fund which can help with hospital bils. You must file a claim within 30 days of the accident. If there is no insurance, the court can order sale of assets, like the motor vehicle, to pay for hospital bills, loss of wages, etc.

 

4 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

So both Foreigners and Thai people should just accept that the roads are highly dangerous and will never change?

Yep.  After your here for a decade or more, you'll simply accept reality.  Doesn't mean you have to stop being incensed about it.  I still comment on it quite often.  But when I'm on the road, whether in a car, on a motorcycle, or crossing the street - I'm completely focused on my surroundings and in 100% defensive mode.  Expect the unexpected.  What gets you will come for the direction you weren't looking.  That's just freaking reality here. 

"But it's unfair and against the law!!! Errrrrgggghh!"

Yep - learn to adapt or suffer the consequences.  It does suck.  But it is what it is.  This ain't the West.

1 minute ago, Banana7 said:

If you get hit by a driver in Thailand with no insurance or a runner, there is a special uninsured drivers fund which can help with hospital bils. You must file a claim within 30 days of the accident. If there is no insurance, the court can order sale of assets, like the motor vehicle, to pay for hospital bills, loss of wages, etc.

 

Yeah.  If you are in ICU completely broken racking up a 1,000,000+ and counting hospital bill?  It ain't gonna cover your injuries or rehabilitation.

So, try your best to never get into an accident in the first place.  You gotta be highly vigilant and 100% focused on the road, including 360 degrees around you.  It's difficult. 

5 minutes ago, Banana7 said:

If there is no insurance, the court can order sale of assets, like the motor vehicle, to pay for hospital bills, loss of wages, etc.

Of course they can.  But try to collect. 

Just now, connda said:

Of course they can.  But try to collect. 

There is actually a government department dedicated to property forfeiture in Thailand.

1 minute ago, connda said:

Yep.  After your here for a decade or more, you'll simply accept reality.  Doesn't mean you have to stop being incensed about it.  I still comment on it quite often.  But when I'm on the road, whether in a car, on a motorcycle, or crossing the street - I'm completely focused on my surroundings and in 100% defensive mode.  Expect the unexpected.  What gets you will come for the direction you weren't looking.  That's just freaking reality here. 

"But it's unfair and against the law!!! Errrrrgggghh!"

Yep - learn to adapt or suffer the consequences.  It does suck.  But it is what it is.  This ain't the West.

What I mean is not accept in concept - i.e. the police should be enforcing all laws and to push for them to do so.

 

In everyday life - of course, realise that's the way things are and act accordingly.

 

I learned as a kid in the UK, that I needed 'eyes in my a@%e' to stay safe riding my motorbike.  In Thailand I double that and I don't think "that car might pull out on me" - I know it will. That attitude, I have not the slightest doubt, has kept me alive.

 

I used to think I was doing the right thing by stopping at a pedestrian crossing in Thailand to allow people to cross.  I've since realised that doing that can actually create a dangerous situation because when you stop, the cars and bikes behind you will come down the side of you and flatten anyone who takes advantage of your courtesy.

 

That doesn't its acceptable for drivers to break the law and people should still push for enforcement - however, for now, its what you have to do.

47 minutes ago, Banana7 said:

Same in Canada as Australia. In Ontario Canada, not stopping at a pedestrian crossing is a fine up to $1,000 plus 4 demerit points, double fines in safety zones, usually located near schools. Serious injury or killing a pedestrian results in huge penalties ($1,000,000+), plus jail time. Not stopping for a school bus results in First offence: Up to $2000 plus 6 demerit points Each following offence: Up to $4000 plus 6 demerit points plus up to 6 months in jail. (CAD1$=26baht)

 

Thailand is just not serious about protecting pedestrians, especially in school zones, or heavy traffic areas.

Furthermore, you could also be convicted of careless driving, in addition to the above offenses, which can result in the following penalties:

If you endanger other people because of any kind of distraction. This includes distraction caused by both hand-held (e.g., phone) or hands-free (e.g., Bluetooth) devices. If convicted of careless driving, you may receive:

• six demerit points
• fines up to $2,000 and/or
• a jail term of six months
• a licence suspension of up to two years

You could even be charged with dangerous driving – a criminal offence that carries heavier penalties, including jail terms of up to 10 years for causing bodily harm or up to 14 years for causing death.

 

It is very common for Police to lay multiple charges when an accident occurs, especially involving a pedestrian.

 

These are real deterrents to bad driving and Thailand should adopt similar penalties.

4 hours ago, Woof999 said:

 

 

Looks like you've already removed your genes from the pool. Job done ✔

 

Nasty.

5 hours ago, Woof999 said:

Some of the dumbest comments I have seen today and there have been some classics. Stupid juvinille, assenine bickering crap, that belongs in the 5 nyear olds forum. Oh, thats right, there isn;t one.

 

People that can't drive a car without stopping at lights shouldn't have a license, regardless of where they are from. I guess you don't have kids here?