Sunak faces Tory meltdown as deputy chairs back Rwanda bill rebellion

[Nick Carter icp]

1 minute ago, Chomper Higgot said:

No, you are accusing me of ‘scare tactics’.

 

I guess there’s no reason for people from other war zones to go to the UK, but they do and for centuries have done.

 

But for some reason you can’t explain Gazan Palestinians will not.

 

 

 

  OK, so Palestinian refugees  might come to the U.K in a few months time or they might not

Thanks for pointing that out  

[mokwit]

On 1/16/2024 at 9:39 PM, Chomper Higgot said:

Here’s the best bit.

 

The Tories and Sunak in particular have chosen of their own volition to promise to deliver the Rwanda policy in the face of consistent advice that it won’t work and will brake both UK law and international laws the IK is bound by.

 

It’s a mess of their own making.

 

They could have focussed on something the general public are concerned about, the NHS, the housing crisis, the economy, education ….. nah, they chose the Albatross and strung it around their own necks.

 

 

Outside of Leftie luvvie circles there is considerable concern regarding legal Immigration numbers and beach assaults by illegal immigrants we know nothing about and who claim to be asylum seekers in order to entitle themselves to the support we give to genuine asylum seekers (which some, but unlikely all, may be). Also the prioritisation of these people for resources like housing ahead of our own citizens.

 

Whether Rwanda is the solution is a separate issue.

Edited January 19 by mokwit

[proton]

13 minutes ago, mokwit said:

Outside of Leftie luvvie circles there is considerable concern regarding legal Immigration numbers and beach assaults by illegal immigrants we know nothing about and who claim to be asylum seekers in order to entitle themselves to the support we give to genuine asylum seekers (which some, but unlikely all, may be). Also the prioritisation of these people for resources like housing ahead of our own citizens.

 

Whether Rwanda is the solution is a separate issue.

 

Approx a million every year including illegals, where are they all going to live? Powell was right when he said in 1968 we must be mad, literally mad. Totally unsustainable. According to my friend who processed asylum claims only about 5% are genuine.

[mokwit]

7 minutes ago, proton said:

 

Approx a million every year including illegals, where are they all going to live? Powell was right when he said in 1968 we must be mad, literally mad. Totally unsustainable. According to my friend who processed asylum claims only about 5% are genuine.

Even with the genuine ones, where in principle many including myself are in principle supportive, how many of them can we realistically take - principle vs pragmatism. It seems the request for even genuine asylum is spread across only a handful of countries.

Edited January 19 by mokwit

[RayC]

58 minutes ago, proton said:

 

 According to my friend who processed asylum claims only about 5% are genuine.

 

Your friend obviously isn't using the same set of criterion as the Home Office in order to identify genuine refugees. 75% of asylum claims are granted on application with another +/-10% granted on appeal.

[youreavinalaff]

1 minute ago, RayC said:

 

Your friend obviously isn't using the same set of criterion as the Home Office in order to identify genuine refugees. 75% of asylum claims are granted on application with another +/-10% granted on appeal.

He's already said, on a previous thread, his friend was working there many years ago.

[RayC]

1 minute ago, youreavinalaff said:

He's already said, on a previous thread, his friend was working there many years ago.

 

So, even if the claim was true at the time, it is now outdated and no longer relevant.

[proton]

26 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

Your friend obviously isn't using the same set of criterion as the Home Office in order to identify genuine refugees. 75% of asylum claims are granted on application with another +/-10% granted on appeal.

 

Being granted does not make them genuine, its a farce.

[RayC]

8 minutes ago, proton said:

 

Being granted does not make them genuine, its a farce.

 

It does in the eyes of the law. 

[proton]

3 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

It does in the eyes of the law. 

 

which is an ass when it comes to giving 'asylum' to liars who have thrown their ID away and then lie about where they are from. NO asylum needs to be granted for those coming from a safe country like France, they are taking the pee and are costing UK tax payers billions a year. Thailand is much more advanced- lock up illegals and leave them there until they pay their own fare home. Almost all those coming to UK legally and illegally are un needed and un wanted economic migrants.

[Chomper Higgot]

55 minutes ago, youreavinalaff said:

He's already said, on a previous thread, his friend was working there many years ago.

Which may or may not be so.

[RayC]

14 minutes ago, proton said:

 

which is an ass when it comes to giving 'asylum' to liars who have thrown their ID away and then lie about where they are from. NO asylum needs to be granted for those coming from a safe country like France, they are taking the pee and are costing UK tax payers billions a year. Thailand is much more advanced- lock up illegals and leave them there until they pay their own fare home. Almost all those coming to UK legally and illegally are un needed and un wanted economic migrants.

 

A subjective opinion with no evidence to support it.

[Chomper Higgot]

14 minutes ago, proton said:

 

which is an ass when it comes to giving 'asylum' to liars who have thrown their ID away and then lie about where they are from. NO asylum needs to be granted for those coming from a safe country like France, they are taking the pee and are costing UK tax payers billions a year. Thailand is much more advanced- lock up illegals and leave them there until they pay their own fare home. Almost all those coming to UK legally and illegally are un needed and un wanted economic migrants.

The simple fix to complex problems that fails every test except being attractive to simple minds.

 

 

 

[mokwit]

1 hour ago, RayC said:

 

It does in the eyes of the law. 

That is the problem.

[proton]

56 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

A subjective opinion with no evidence to support it.

 

several million immigrants support it, more in the past 20 years than the past two thousand. The flood of them is unsustainable.

[RayC]

51 minutes ago, proton said:

 

several million immigrants support it, more in the past 20 years than the past two thousand. The flood of them is unsustainable.

 

"The foreign born made up an estimated 18% of the employed population (5.9 million) in the third quarter (July-September) of 2021" (Source: Migration Observeratory)

 

Latest figures (Source: Commons Library) show 1.46m unemployed in UK.

 

Notwithstanding the slight discrepancy in the dates, assuming (1) all the unemployed are UK-born and (2) they are willing and able to fill all the jobs vacated by 'sending the foreigners back home', that leaves +/-4.4m employment vacancies. 

 

Any ideas how to fill those jobs? 

[Nick Carter icp]

1 hour ago, proton said:

 

several million immigrants support it, more in the past 20 years than the past two thousand. The flood of them is unsustainable.

 

   What do you think of that immigrant Emma Raducanu to top ten tennis player ?

That Chinese/Romania immigrant to went who the U.K when she was 2 years old ?

Send her back ?

 

 

 

[proton]

10 minutes ago, RayC said:

 

"The foreign born made up an estimated 18% of the employed population (5.9 million) in the third quarter (July-September) of 2021" (Source: Migration Observeratory)

 

Latest figures (Source: Commons Library) show 1.46m unemployed in UK.

 

Notwithstanding the slight discrepancy in the dates, assuming (1) all the unemployed are UK-born and (2) they are willing and able to fill all the jobs vacated by 'sending the foreigners back home', that leaves +/-4.4m employment vacancies. 

 

Any ideas how to fill those jobs? 

 

 

plenty of unemployed and benefit scroungers who could do jobs. The enormous numbers are having a devastating effect on housing, education and healthcare, pretending they have come to do vital jobs or that they are mainly asylum seekers is laughable.

 

 statista.com

For the year ending June 2023, approximately 1.18 million people migrated to the United Kingdom, while 508,000 people migrated from the UK, resulting in a net migration figure of 672,000. There have consistently been more people immigrating to the United Kingdom than leaving it since 1993 when the net migration figure was negative 1,000.

[proton]

7 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   What do you think of that immigrant Emma Raducanu to top ten tennis player ?

That Chinese/Romania immigrant to went who the U.K when she was 2 years old ?

Send her back ?

 

 

 

 

One person is not important, a few millions are. She's rubbish anyway.

[Nick Carter icp]

2 minutes ago, proton said:

 

One person is not important, a few millions are. She's rubbish anyway.

 

   So you think that she should be sent home and not allowed to be British ?

[Chomper Higgot]

5 minutes ago, proton said:

 

One person is not important, a few millions are.

How could you claim otherwise?

 

An individual has a personal story, a personal history, a personal reason for becoming a migrant.

 

Individual have to be unimportant to you, otherwise you’d have to engage with their story, worse still their humanity.

 

Much better to refer to millions, to make sweeping derogatory generalizations about vast numbers of people, each an individual, with their own story and their own humanity.

You’re not the first to adopt this tactic.

 

 

[Nick Carter icp]

10 minutes ago, proton said:

 

One person is not important, a few millions are. She's rubbish anyway.

 

   Did you also complain about all those Pakistanis and Indians coming over to the U.K in the 1970's?

Many of those have done very well for themselves and the same British people who didn't do too well for themselves are still going on about stopping people coming over 

[RayC]

23 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   What do you think of that immigrant Emma Raducanu to top ten tennis player ?

That Chinese/Romania immigrant to went who the U.K when she was 2 years old ?

Send her back ?

 

 

 

 

No exceptions. She's got to go.

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, Nick Carter icp said:

 

   Did you also complain about all those Pakistanis and Indians coming over to the U.K in the 1970's?

Many of those have done very well for themselves and the same British people who didn't do too well for themselves are still going on about stopping people coming over 

Absolutely.

 

I have never met anyone who’s made a success of their own life who spews bile on immigrants.

 

Every single person I know who engages in anti immigrant rants has failed in their own life.

 

People who are happy with what they’ve made of their own life don’t need to prop themselves up by attacking people on the lower rungs human misery. Such behavior is without exception the reserve of people who have failed at life and know they’ve failed at life.

 

 

 

 

[RayC]

18 minutes ago, proton said:

 

 

plenty of unemployed and benefit scroungers who could do jobs. The enormous numbers are having a devastating effect on housing, education and healthcare, pretending they have come to do vital jobs or that they are mainly asylum seekers is laughable.

 

 statista.com

For the year ending June 2023, approximately 1.18 million people migrated to the United Kingdom, while 508,000 people migrated from the UK, resulting in a net migration figure of 672,000. There have consistently been more people immigrating to the United Kingdom than leaving it since 1993 when the net migration figure was negative 1,000.

 

I assume that you didn't read my post before embarking on your rant?

 

There are 5.9 million foreign born workers in the UK

 

There are 1.5 million unemployed in the UK

 

There are 2.4 people on long-term sickness benefits (all "scroungers"? Not a genuine one amongst them?)

 

If we send all the foreigners back home and get all the long-term sick back to work there will be still be, at least, 2 million unfilled job vacancies (5.9 - (1.5+2.4))

 

So, same question as before: How do we fill those 2 million jobs?

[RayC]

3 hours ago, proton said:

 

 Almost all those coming to UK legally and illegally are un needed and un wanted economic migrants.

 

Leaving aside the illegal migrants for the time being, what is it about the legal migrants that you object to? In what way are they unneeded if they are coming to the UK to work?

[thaibeachlovers]

On 1/17/2024 at 10:47 AM, Georgealbert said:

You are a kiwi with limited knowledge of British politics, but you still feel the need to post your BS everyday on as many threads as possible, even when those comments offer nothing constructive.

 

What we get is your closet racism, you try to disguise as an opinion. 

 

Your knowledge on everything is so limited, because you ignore everyone that disagrees with you, and what happens is that you are an empty echo chamber, only hearing yourself.

 

I pity you, as your lack the intellectual ability for critically thinking, hence leading you to blame everyone, but yourself, for your failings.

The only reason I'm responding to you here is that I saw it quoted on someone else's post. I was amused at how much you got wrong in the rant.

 

The reason you are on ignore is that you choose to insult rather than debate in a reasonable manner, and do it continually. I do not have to put up with it.

 

If there is any pitying to be done, it is I that pity you for having so little to say that you resort to insults. Does it make you feel happy to diss someone you know nothing about? I'll bet you wouldn't say those things to my face.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, proton said:

 

One person is not important, a few millions are. She's rubbish anyway.

Does the UK actually need tennis players? They need doctors, nurses etc, people that do real jobs, they don't need someone that bats a ball back and forth.

[Nick Carter icp]

9 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Does the UK actually need tennis players? They need doctors, nurses etc, people that do real jobs, they don't need someone that bats a ball back and forth.

 

   Could have a new immigration rule ?

All new immigrants need to study at university for jobs where workers are in short supply and new immigrants cannot play any sports games ?

[Georgealbert]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The only reason I'm responding to you here is that I saw it quoted on someone else's post. I was amused at how much you got wrong in the rant.

 

The reason you are on ignore is that you choose to insult rather than debate in a reasonable manner, and do it continually. I do not have to put up with it.

 

If there is any pitying to be done, it is I that pity you for having so little to say that you resort to insults. Does it make you feel happy to diss someone you know nothing about? I'll bet you wouldn't say those things to my face.

 

55555

 

The reason I am on ignore, is because you have zero to back up your posts, no links or facts, and you are unable to debate anything. Using IMO is not the same as the truth, and placing everyone on ignore creates your own empty echo chamber.

 

I do not suffer fools lightly and yes I would tell you to your face, same as anyone else, or was that you attempt to try and bully me.
 

I have values, morals and ethics, unlike people who live in their own alternative reality and get upset when people disagree with them.

 

Have a good day, I am sure you'll find someone or something to blame if it is not.

 

Clear your ignore list and you will find I am not the only one with the same view.