Converting Multi-Entry Non-O (Savannakhet) to a Retirement Extension, - during the final 90-day entry allowed beyond the actual visa expiry date.

[raysunshineray]

I'm currently on a Non-O One-Year Multi-Entry 'wife/family-visit' visa obtained from Savannakhet.

Needless to say, I'll not be getting another one when this one expires, - not now that they've introduced the money in the bank requirement.

 

The actual visa expires on 28^th March, and my current 90-day entry conveniently expires on 26^th March.

My plan is to convert this Non-O family visit visa to a retirement extension.

I've already had a chat with Maneerat Travel in Soi 13, and they said yes they could do it, no problem – they gave me all the costing.

But there was something I failed to ask about – and now I'm back in Ubon for a few months, so I can't go into their office and ask them.

 

This is my query, and I'm hoping that someone might have direct experience with this, and not offer guesswork – my guess is as good as anybody's!

 

If I do my usual border hop at Chong Mek on 26^th March, that would give me around another 90 days beyond the one-year visa expiry date on 28^th March.

So, if I were to apply for a retirement conversion from this Non-O during the 90 days after the visa itself has expired, would that be an obstacle to getting the retirement extension?

 

Just to be clear – the one-year non-o visa has an expiry date of 28^th March.

I would leave Thailand and re-enter before that date and get another 90 days.

At that point – during the next 90 days after the visa has 'expired', - my visa status remains Non-O, even though the visa itself has an expiry date that's already passed.

 

Is there a possibility that in order to convert from this Non-O to a retirement visa, one has to do it within the limits of the visa duration – in my case 28^th March, and not during the 90 days beyond that, or would that not matter?

 

I'm imagining a possible scenario where the agent recognises that I'm in Thailand with Non-O status, but cannot process a conversion to retirement because the actual duration date of the visa has already expired.

 

This confusion only arises because with this multi-entry, one is given 90 days on each and every entry up until the date of expiry of the visa, enabling one to be in the country for another 90 days beyond the duration date of the visa itself.

 

Anyone already been in this situation?

 

It's early days, since it's not been that long since Savannakhet in effect made the Non-O multi-entry route pretty much redundant – and I imagine many more on this non-o visa will decide to convert to retirement when their Non-O expires.

 

Thanks in advance for any relevant information or experience of this situation.

[CharlieKo]

 Actually I think your post is very confusing! Even for a retirement visa you would need to show you have funds in a Thai bank. If by chance you did get another re-entry permit it would be valid for all of 2 days, up to the 28th when your Non-O visa expires. 

 

If you are married why not just apply for a Non-O based on marriage you just need 400,000 in a Thai bank two months prior to applying for it. 

 

Read this, from The Thai embassy website.

 

https://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand-visa/retirement-visa

 

[Lemsta69]

50 minutes ago, raysunshineray said:

But there was something I failed to ask about – and now I'm back in Ubon for a few months, so I can't go into their office and ask them.

 

You can chat with the Maneerat girls via LINE, let me know if you'd like me to DM you their contact details.

 

Or if it's OK with @DrJack54 I can post their business card here in case you didn't get one, or you lost it 😉

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, CharlieKo said:

 Actually I think your post is very confusing! Even for a retirement visa you would need to show you have funds in a Thai bank. If by chance you did get another re-entry permit it would be valid for all of 2 days, up to the 28th when your Non-O visa expires. 

 

If you are married why not just apply for a Non-O based on marriage you just need 400,000 in a Thai bank two months prior to applying for it. 

 

Read this, from The Thai embassy website.

 

https://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand-visa/retirement-visa

 

 

Not confusing at all. The OP is asking if a conversion specifically to RetExt can be done after the visa itself has expired, but he is still in-country legally on the 90-day entry afforded just before the visa expired.

 

If there was a financial issue, the OP will have mentioned it but by already establishing contact with a Pattaya agent, it looks like that's already being addressed.

 

If the OP wanted a Marriage Extension, he wouldn't have created a thread specifically named Converting Multi-Entry Non-O (Savannakhet) to a Retirement Extension.

 

Perhaps the OP doesn't want all the pedantic, bureaucratic overkill, including the wait period that the "budget" Marrriage Extension brings to the table?

[bigt3116]

A first extension should be for the same reason as the issuance of the initial visa (marriage in your case), so not sure if an agent can circumvent that rule

[UKresonant]

6 hours ago, CharlieKo said:

. If by chance you did get another re-entry permit it would be valid for all of 2 days, up to the 28th when your Non-O visa expires

Entering before the 28th the non-O ME (married) should give a further 90 Days entry stamp (did that 2020).

 

Edited January 16 by UKresonant

[UKresonant]

Entering before the 28th the non-O ME (married) should give a further 90 Days entry stamp (did that 2020 but left a 3 or 4 day margin before exp date).

 

But if the non-O marraige visa expires on the 28th it probably is then of no use to apply for an extention of stay for 12 months, only perhaps the 60 day extention. (Not done that though) See what the experts suggest.

 

I would squeeze the last 90 day entry on the ME, maybe do a 60day ext. Then pop out and get a single entry Non-O retirement,  and do the retirement extension within that visas validity?

 

I got the impression the COVID, discretion was now fading into history...

[DrJack54]

8 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

I've already had a chat with Maneerat Travel in Soi 13, and they said yes they could do it, no problem – they gave me all the costing.

What is the costing. That will give a good indication what they are doing for you.

Are they also opening a bank account? 

I doubt they will be obtaining a 12 month extension based on marriage.

 

Your first extension should/must be on same reason the original visa is based on.

In this case marriage.

Most likely obtaining extension based on retirement.

Don't know how they are doing that. 

 

Also I doubt Maneerat would do extension based on marriage.

 

As @Lemsta69 pointed out give them a ring or chat LINE.

Google Maneerat and all the contact details are there. 

NAN

 

[Liquorice]

2 hours ago, UKresonant said:

But if the non-O marraige visa expires on the 28th it probably is then of no use to apply for an extention of stay for 12 months, only perhaps the 60 day extention. (Not done that though) See what the experts suggest.

 

I would squeeze the last 90 day entry on the ME, maybe do a 60day ext. Then pop out and get a single entry Non-O retirement,  and do the retirement extension within that visas validity?

Totally incorrect advice.

[Liquorice]

9 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

If I do my usual border hop at Chong Mek on 26^th March, that would give me around another 90 days beyond the one-year visa expiry date on 28^th March.

So, if I were to apply for a retirement conversion from this Non-O during the 90 days after the visa itself has expired, would that be an obstacle to getting the retirement extension?

 

Just to be clear – the one-year non-o visa has an expiry date of 28^th March.

I would leave Thailand and re-enter before that date and get another 90 days.

At that point – during the next 90 days after the visa has 'expired', - my visa status remains Non-O, even though the visa itself has an expiry date that's already passed.

 

Is there a possibility that in order to convert from this Non-O to a retirement visa, one has to do it within the limits of the visa duration – in my case 28^th March, and not during the 90 days beyond that, or would that not matter?

 

I'm imagining a possible scenario where the agent recognises that I'm in Thailand with Non-O status, but cannot process a conversion to retirement because the actual duration date of the visa has already expired.

 

This confusion only arises because with this multi-entry, one is given 90 days on each and every entry up until the date of expiry of the visa, enabling one to be in the country for another 90 days beyond the duration date of the visa itself.

The validity of a visa is the period during which you can enter Thailand.

On entry, you are granted a period of stay for 90 days (permission of stay).

 

You're not converting anything.
You are applying to extend your permission of stay for 1 year based on retirement/Thai spouse, provided you meet the financial requirements.

The validity of the visa is immaterial, it's your status of entering as a Non Immigrant that matters.

[Liquorice]

10 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

I've already had a chat with Maneerat Travel in Soi 13, and they said yes they could do it, no problem – they gave me all the costing.

Maneerat are correct in that it won't be a problem to extend your permission of stay for 1 year.

 

However, be aware the extension will probably be issued by an Immigration office other than the Province you actually reside.

This can lead to issues down the line.

These can be resolved, but you should be aware.

[steve187]

9 hours ago, CharlieKo said:

 Actually I think your post is very confusing! Even for a retirement visa you would need to show you have funds in a Thai bank. If by chance you did get another re-entry permit it would be valid for all of 2 days, up to the 28th when your Non-O visa expires. 

 

If you are married why not just apply for a Non-O based on marriage you just need 400,000 in a Thai bank two months prior to applying for it. 

 

Read this, from The Thai embassy website.

 

https://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand-visa/retirement-visa

 

he has a visa, so he can do a border bounce using the multi entry visa and get a new 90 day entry stamp, that takes him past the visa expiry date, nothing to do with a re-enty permit

op the entry that extends past the expiry date of the visa is as good as one that doesn't, so the agents could still obtain a 1 year extension

[sandyf]

10 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

If I do my usual border hop at Chong Mek on 26^th March, that would give me around another 90 days beyond the one-year visa expiry date on 28^th March.

So, if I were to apply for a retirement conversion from this Non-O during the 90 days after the visa itself has expired, would that be an obstacle to getting the retirement extension?

Your position following the border run would be no different to someone entering on a SE Non O visa, they expire on the first entry rather than after the last.

I have done a 12 month marriage extension from a ME Non O well after the visa itself had expired, and another when the ME visa still had 5 months to run.

[DrJack54]

7 minutes ago, steve187 said:

......so the agents could still obtain a 1 year extension

Based on ? 

My understanding is that his first extension needs to be same as the visa he entered on. In op case marriage.

This comes up more commonly with someone doing first extension from a Non O-A and wanting to do the extension based on marriage.

Seems agents have the recipe for 7 herbs and spices 

[steve187]

Just now, DrJack54 said:

Based on ? 

My understanding is that his first extension needs to be same as the visa he entered on. In op case marriage.

This comes up more commonly with someone doing first extension from a Non O-A and wanting to do the extension based on marriage.

 

he stated the agents could do it, see here ''I've already had a chat with Maneerat Travel in Soi 13, and they said yes they could do it'' 

i don't think its allowed, but the point i was making is that if the agent said it can be done, then it makes no difference if the permission to stay extends past the visa expiry date, which is what the op asked, see here '' So, if I were to apply for a retirement conversion from this Non-O during the 90 days after the visa itself has expired, would that be an obstacle to getting the retirement extension?''

[sandyf]

30 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

The validity of a visa is the period during which you can enter Thailand.

On entry, you are granted a period of stay for 90 days (permission of stay).

 

You're not converting anything.
You are applying to extend your permission of stay for 1 year based on retirement/Thai spouse, provided you meet the financial requirements.

The validity of the visa is immaterial, it's your status of entering as a Non Immigrant that matters.

The OP is looking to convert his current visa status from Non O family to Non O retirement.

However not sure he will get away with that on first extension from the visa.

[steve187]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

The OP is looking to convert his current visa status from Non O family to Non O retirement.

However not sure he will get away with that on first extension from the visa.

agents can work miracles

[Liquorice]

6 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

My understanding is that his first extension needs to be same as the visa he entered on. In op case marriage.

This comes up more commonly with someone doing first extension from a Non O-A and wanting to do the extension based on marriage.

Seems agents have the recipe for 7 herbs and spices 

There is nothing denoting whether a Non Imm O visa was issued based on retirement or Thai spouse that I've witnessed.

The Non O-A is a different kettle of fish, as it can only be applied for on the basis of retirement.

[sandyf]

2 minutes ago, steve187 said:

agents can work miracles

Miracles have been known to come back and bite, case of pay the money and take a chance.

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, steve187 said:

he stated the agents could do it,......

I was more making the point that it must be the agents assistance that's making this possible and I'm not referring to the funds in the bank.

The OP also states, as you pointed out...,.

"So, if I were to apply for a retirement conversion from this Non-O during the 90 days after the visa itself has expired, would that be an obstacle to getting the retirement extension?''

He uses "conversion" incorrectly.

I'm happy to be corrected but my understanding is that his first extension needs to be based on marriage 

[Liquorice]

5 minutes ago, sandyf said:

The OP is looking to convert his current visa status from Non O family to Non O retirement.

There is nothing denoting whether a Non Imm O visa was issued based on retirement or Thai spouse that I've witnessed.

[sandyf]

1 minute ago, Liquorice said:

There is nothing denoting whether a Non Imm O visa was issued based on retirement or Thai spouse that I've witnessed.

First line of the thread.

"I'm currently on a Non-O One-Year Multi-Entry 'wife/family-visit' visa obtained from Savannakhet."

[Liquorice]

5 minutes ago, sandyf said:

First line of the thread.

"I'm currently on a Non-O One-Year Multi-Entry 'wife/family-visit' visa obtained from Savannakhet."

Yes, but there isn't any kind of notation on the visa that states it was applied for based on Thai spouse or retirement.

The only notation on a Non O visa is the wording 'Employment prohibited'.

Certain Thai Embassy put such notations on the visa, whilst others don't.

In either case, 'employment is prohibited' as you require a separate work permit.

[sandyf]

10 hours ago, raysunshineray said:

I'm imagining a possible scenario where the agent recognises that I'm in Thailand with Non-O status, but cannot process a conversion to retirement because the actual duration date of the visa has already expired.

 

This confusion only arises because with this multi-entry, one is given 90 days on each and every entry up until the date of expiry of the visa, enabling one to be in the country for another 90 days beyond the duration date of the visa itself.

You are a little confused over the function of the visa. Visas provide you with visa status, the visa itself cannot be used inside the country so it is a bit irrelevant if it has some validity as could be the case with a ME visa ,or it became "Used" on entry as is the case of single entry visas.

[bigt3116]

33 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

There is nothing denoting whether a Non Imm O visa was issued based on retirement or Thai spouse that I've witnessed.

 

A Non-O issued for retirement will have "employment prohibited", that will not be on a Non-O for marriage - there is your difference.

 

[Liquorice]

17 minutes ago, bigt3116 said:

 

A Non-O issued for retirement will have "employment prohibited", that will not be on a Non-O for marriage - there is your difference.

 

Not all Thai Embassy put such a notation on a Non O visa that was applied for based on retirement.

Employment is prohibited regardless of the reason for a Non O visa, you require a work permit.

 

Immigration officers barely speak an understandable broken English, let alone read English.

How many expats have reported when applying for their very first extension, based on retirement or Thai spouse, the IO asked on what basis their Non O was issued?
Immigration orders simply state must have Non Imm.

Edited January 17 by Liquorice

[sandyf]

3 hours ago, Liquorice said:

Yes, but there isn't any kind of notation on the visa that states it was applied for based on Thai spouse or retirement.

The only notation on a Non O visa is the wording 'Employment prohibited'.

Certain Thai Embassy put such notations on the visa, whilst others don't.

In either case, 'employment is prohibited' as you require a separate work permit.

When you apply for a non O visa you do so on a particular basis and you are perfectly free to believe that immigration has no idea what basis was used, that doesn't make it fact.

Only the foolhardy wouldn't err on the side of caution, then come and complain.

[Liquorice]

14 minutes ago, sandyf said:

When you apply for a non O visa you do so on a particular basis and you are perfectly free to believe that immigration has no idea what basis was used, that doesn't make it fact.

Only the foolhardy wouldn't err on the side of caution, then come and complain.

For an extension based on retirement or Thai spouse, Immigrations orders only stipulate;
(1) The alien must have been granted a non-immigrant visa (NON-IM).

All they check is the visa type and category.

[UKresonant]

8 hours ago, Liquorice said:

The only notation on a Non O visa is the wording 'Employment prohibited'.

Certain Thai Embassy put such notations on the visa, whilst others don't.

 

E-visa does not show that notation. (Marriage basis)

Nor does the previous  sticker in the passport type. (Marriage basis)

Just checked both versions.

 

Yes, agree,  Marriage or Retirement basis is not stated on the Visa either. So maybe MFA keep the basis of issue from RTP  

 

Edited January 17 by UKresonant

[sandyf]

18 hours ago, Liquorice said:

For an extension based on retirement or Thai spouse, Immigrations orders only stipulate;
(1) The alien must have been granted a non-immigrant visa (NON-IM).

All they check is the visa type and category.

You are assuming that Line No1 in categories 18 & 22  is stand alone and does not relate to the respective category in any way whatsoever.

https://www.immigration.go.th/en/?p=14714

 

You shouldn't be putting that assumption out as fact.