Thai retirement funds cannot be touched under any circumstances.

[Baht Simpson]

  On 2/16/2024 at 2:18 AM, KannikaP said:

How can it be cheaper if, on top of the 800/400k in the bank, you also need to transfer money to live from?

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Because you have more flexibility with fx rates, which is the most important financial  factor. 

[KannikaP]

  On 2/16/2024 at 6:47 AM, Baht Simpson said:

Because you have more flexibility with fx rates, which is the most important financial  factor. 

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I hope you mean that transferring MONTHLY as opposed to once a year, you get the flexibility.

[Baht Simpson]

  On 2/16/2024 at 7:18 AM, KannikaP said:

I hope you mean that transferring MONTHLY as opposed to once a year, you get the flexibility.

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Nope.

[KannikaP]

  On 2/16/2024 at 7:58 AM, Baht Simpson said:

Nope.

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Oh, I am surprised.

[up2you2]

Just to clarify from my own experience.
If you are indeed referring to the sums required of either the 400,000 Baht or 800,000 Baht, I to had them in a fixed deposit account, with them being transferred and credit to my savings account the following day.
This practice I was told was totally unacceptable, and I was refused my renewal retirement visa on these grounds.
It was only on appealing to the Head of Immigration in Bangkok, that this judgement was overturned.
I was told in no uncertain terms, that regarding these requested funds there can be no fixed accounts at all - period.
Only solely and only same day access through a normal savings account.

[zzzzz]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:23 AM, up2you2 said:

Just to clarify from my own experience.
If you are indeed referring to the sums required of either the 400,000 Baht or 800,000 Baht, I to had them in a fixed deposit account, with them being transferred and credit to my savings account the following day.
This practice I was told was totally unacceptable, and I was refused my renewal retirement visa on these grounds.
It was only on appealing to the Head of Immigration in Bangkok, that this judgement was overturned.
I was told in no uncertain terms, that regarding these requested funds there can be no fixed accounts at all - period.
Only solely and only same day access through a normal savings account.

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the money needs to be able to be accessed easily

BUT if you Do access it , an it drops below the min limits, you cant get ur next extension<


ahhhh Thailand

[khunPer]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:00 AM, up2you2 said:

To renew my retirement visa annually, the minimum amount that has to held in my account cannot fall below 400,000 Baht for seven months of the year, and not fall below 800,000 Baht for the remaining five months of the year.

Today I was told by a senior Thai Immigration Officer, that even if funds were required for a hospital expense, if my funds in my account fell below the above limits, then I would no longer be able to renew my Thai retirement visa automatically.

When this law and requirement was brought into force, I do remember hearing something about the fact that these funds were to be put aside in the event of health issues.
To pay hospitals bills, but seeming that is not the case, in fact from what I was lead to believe today, they simple cannot be touched if one wishes to renew their retirement visa.

In the event that what I have stated here is incorrect, can anyone point to an English translation of the Thai law, that states categorically that these funds can be used for hospital bills, without denying one's annual visa renewal?
 

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You cannot extend your stay if your fund deposit falls below the required amounts.

 

Yes, you can use money for hospitalization, but then you can not extend your stay and need to return to your home country or make a visa run for a new non-immigrant O-visa, fulfilling the financial requirements.

 

The rules changed about a decade ago, before that you only needed to show the deposit with three month maturing before application for extension of stay, and longer back just show that you had the money.

[mokwit]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:00 AM, up2you2 said:

When this law and requirement was brought into force, I do remember hearing something about the fact that these funds were to be put aside in the event of health issues.

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  On 2/15/2024 at 9:00 AM, up2you2 said:

In the event that what I have stated here is incorrect, can anyone point to an English translation of the Thai law, that states categorically that these funds can be used for hospital bills, without denying one's annual visa renewal?

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Immigration have NEVER stated that the reason for keeping Bt400k year 'round was for providing accessible funds to cover hospital costs. Their stated reason was to stop people using agents. The assumption that the Bt400k was for hospital bills arose because around the same time there was a requirement for OA visa holders to have Bt400k of insurance coverage.

[up2you2]

  On 2/16/2024 at 9:12 AM, mokwit said:

 

Immigration have NEVER stated that the reason for keeping Bt40k year 'round was for providing accessible funds to cover hospital costs. Their stated reason was to stop people using agents. The assumption that the 400k was for hospital bills arose because around the same time there was a requirement for OA visa holders to have Bt400k of insurance coverage.

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Thank you for this clarification, your memory is better than mine.
So easy to get confused, let alone be up to date on the current laws, and more importantly how they are interpreted.

The Damocles sword of who would be prepared to pay for insurance, who could actually afford the premiums, and finally who could actually get cover that includes pre-existing conditions.
Years ago I was told the cut off age was 65.

[jaideedave]

  On 2/16/2024 at 12:44 AM, Vibora99 said:

I don't know why they make life so complicated. The agents charge 12,000 bahts (they deposit you in money) and give you the visa the next day (whether you have the 800,000 or not).

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V--I did my own visa renewal for several years. Then one year of nit picking BS I snapped (inside) and decided to go the agent route.

The IO like it because it's easy money and they don't have to even see or talk to any of us. I am 100% convinced that the whole shebang is in on it. They can't come out and say it but after 2 decades here It's obvious to me now. A ship's captain I met told me his married visa was up for renewal and he had to leave the country.A senior IO told him to put 18k on the table and he'd have his new visa shortly.

As much as a like living here the whole place is on the take.

How is convict Tony being allowed out of prison he never stayed one night in.The coppers even supplied a chopper for him.What a joke.

[KannikaP]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:23 AM, up2you2 said:

Just to clarify from my own experience.
If you are indeed referring to the sums required of either the 400,000 Baht or 800,000 Baht, I to had them in a fixed deposit account, with them being transferred and credit to my savings account the following day.
This practice I was told was totally unacceptable, and I was refused my renewal retirement visa on these grounds.
It was only on appealing to the Head of Immigration in Bangkok, that this judgement was overturned.
I was told in no uncertain terms, that regarding these requested funds there can be no fixed accounts at all - period.
Only solely and only same day access through a normal savings account.

Expand  

Then whoever told you was wrong. You can, and many do, use Fixed Term Accounts, no more in after opening apart from the yearly interest. You can withdraw from them, but lose your interest. 

[connda]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:00 AM, up2you2 said:

To renew my retirement visa annually, the minimum amount that has to held in my account cannot fall below 400,000 Baht for seven months of the year, and not fall below 800,000 Baht for the remaining five months of the year.

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Welcome to Thailand.  It's been that way for a few years.

[connda]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:17 AM, worgeordie said:

It's always been that way , just don't fall below 400 K and make sure it;s

back up to 800K   " 800,000 Baht for the remaining five months of the year."

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I really hasn't been that way "always."  I can't remember the exact year it happened (201n) but it happened before Immigration started to push those of who were married to Thai women to switch to retirement extensions "for the convenience."  Then they changed the financial requirements the next year to what they are now, and a lot of us changed back to Marriage extensions. 

IO "Why you change to retirement then back to marriage???  I only do this one time.  No change again." 
Me:  🤐  <zip>  🤔 <thinking>  "Ahhhh, because you told guys like me that it would be convenient.  Then ya'll turned around and changed the requirements."  Shhhh

[connda]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:42 AM, khunPer said:

The rules changed about a decade ago, before that you only needed to show the deposit with three month maturing before application for extension of stay, and longer back just show that you had the money.

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From the horse's mouth (or ChatGPT's mouth).  That's about right.  Looks like I changed to a Retirement extension back in 2018 then flipped back to the Marriage extension in 2019.

[connda]

  On 2/16/2024 at 11:06 AM, connda said:

From the horse's mouth (or ChatGPT's mouth).  That's about right.  Looks like I changed to a Retirement extension back in 2018 then flipped back to the Marriage extension in 2019.

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Yep.

 

[scoutman360]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:59 AM, G_Money said:

Why anyone uses this ridiculous method is beyond me.

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 Rich people. Which seems to be the demographic Thailand is trying to attract. (Ummm .. Singapore seems to have figured out how to attract the wealthy.). Regardless, people with lots of money don't care if $22k USD is sitting somewhere in a Thailand bank account.

[arithai12]

  On 2/16/2024 at 6:13 PM, scoutman360 said:

 Rich people. Which seems to be the demographic Thailand is trying to attract. (Ummm .. Singapore seems to have figured out how to attract the wealthy.). Regardless, people with lots of money don't care if $22k USD is sitting somewhere in a Thailand bank account.

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Not that people transferring and spending here 1.8k USD each month are poor... unless one wants to transfer back the unused money each month, oh what fun.

 

[arithai12]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:23 AM, up2you2 said:

Just to clarify from my own experience.
If you are indeed referring to the sums required of either the 400,000 Baht or 800,000 Baht, I to had them in a fixed deposit account, with them being transferred and credit to my savings account the following day.
This practice I was told was totally unacceptable, and I was refused my renewal retirement visa on these grounds.
It was only on appealing to the Head of Immigration in Bangkok, that this judgement was overturned.
I was told in no uncertain terms, that regarding these requested funds there can be no fixed accounts at all - period.
Only solely and only same day access through a normal savings account.

Expand  

Of course you can  have a fixed deposit account with 800k.

What you were doing (moving funds from FD to checking account "the following day", that was what Immigration did not accept. Indeed, in your case you should simply have a "normal savings account" and make sure it doesn't drop below the required 800k/400k depending on the months.

[arithai12]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:29 AM, zzzzz said:

the money needs to be able to be accessed easily

BUT if you Do access it , an it drops below the min limits, you cant get ur next extension<


ahhhh Thailand

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Either you have 800k in a FD account, or in a checking account where it does not drop below the given limits. What's so "ahhhh" ?

[Simon1287]

  On 2/16/2024 at 8:42 AM, khunPer said:

You cannot extend your stay if your fund deposit falls below the required amounts.

 

Yes, you can use money for hospitalization, but then you can not extend your stay and need to return to your home country or make a visa run for a new non-immigrant O-visa, fulfilling the financial requirements.

 

The rules changed about a decade ago, before that you only needed to show the deposit with three month maturing before application for extension of stay, and longer back just show that you had the money.

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Yes, I was thinking it changed about a decade ago or something like that.

Until then I used to spend the 800,000 every year, get more if needed but whatever happened made sure the full amount was back in the Thai bank three months (?) before the next retirement extension was due. 

No one at immigration cared back then if there was only one Baht left in the account three months and one day before the next extension. 

 

[bigt3116]

  On 2/16/2024 at 9:12 AM, mokwit said:

Their stated reason was to stop people using agents.

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Just where did Immigration state this?

 

[zzzzz]

  On 2/16/2024 at 11:38 PM, bigt3116 said:

Their stated reason was to stop people using agents.

 

Just where did Immigration state this?

 

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i'd say its the complete opposite, before it was easy,
1, borrow 800,000 put it in the bank for one day, get extension, withdraw
2. Than get a letter from the US, UK embassy , others stating you had a pension of 65,000/month

3. Than had to stay in the bank 3 months+2 months
in came the agents!! and now that immigration is making serious $$$, they will remain.

[lopburi3]

  On 2/16/2024 at 9:11 PM, arithai12 said:

Either you have 800k in a FD account, or in a checking account where it does not drop below the given limits. What's so "ahhhh" ?

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Guess you don't live in Thailand.  Almost no private bank users have a checking account - what they have are passbook savings accounts.

[thaibreaker]

Interesting that it states 3 months after and 2 months prior.

I thought it was the other way around, 3 months prior, and 2 months after.

 

Not only me, I guess.

[lopburi3]

  On 2/17/2024 at 1:13 AM, thaibreaker said:

Interesting that it states 3 months after and 2 months prior.

I thought it was the other way around, 3 months prior, and 2 months after.

 

Not only me, I guess.

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It was always 2 months prior (but several offices required 3 months - and for marriage it was suggested to keep in account during review process making it 3 months) - there was no requirement for money in account after extension was issued.

[Hamus Yaigh]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:59 AM, G_Money said:

Sent via WISE using “Long term stay in Thailand “. so the funds show as coming from abroad.

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How can this be true if the funds are already in Thailand for your international transfers? I thought Wise does not actually transfer the funds internationally, but instead uses a network of local bank accounts in different countries. When you send money using Wise, they will use their network of local accounts to transfer the funds from a bank account in your country to a corresponding account in the recipient's country. This way, they can avoid the costly international wire transfer fees that banks usually charge.

[lopburi3]

  On 2/17/2024 at 2:13 AM, Hamus Yaigh said:

 

How can this be true if the funds are already in Thailand for your international transfers? I thought Wise does not actually transfer the funds internationally, but instead uses a network of local bank accounts in different countries. When you send money using Wise, they will use their network of local accounts to transfer the funds from a bank account in your country to a corresponding account in the recipient's country. This way, they can avoid the costly international wire transfer fees that banks usually charge.

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But the funds used to pay the local Thai baht are from another country.  It is recorded by Bangkok Bank as a foreign telegraphic transfer (FTT),

[Henryford]

I can understand Thailand wanting expats to have some funds available so they are not a burden on the country if they get ill etc. But it's bizarre that expats can not use these funds for such purposes (or any purpose).  So in effect the minimum funds you need are 1.5-2.0 million (as a buffer for any illness/accident).

[Henryford]

  On 2/15/2024 at 9:59 AM, G_Money said:

Why anyone uses this ridiculous method is beyond me.

 

 I happily pay the monthly transfer fees to send the monthly requirement (and more) amount needed for a retirement extension.  Currently the minimum is 65,000 baht per month.  
 

Sent via WISE using “Long term stay in Thailand “. so the funds show as coming from abroad.

 

I can use my money whenever and for whatever reasons I want.

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Many banks don't show the money as coming from abroad, my Krungsri doesn't (even though i use WISE as well).  Plus you only need to miss one month as being clearly from abroad and you risk losing your visa.

[lopburi3]

  On 2/17/2024 at 2:28 AM, Henryford said:

I can understand Thailand wanting expats to have some funds available so they are not a burden on the country if they get ill etc. But it's bizarre that expats can not use these funds for such purposes (or any purpose).  So in effect the minimum funds you need are 1.5-2.0 million (as a buffer for any illness/accident).

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Or have adequate medical insurance.