How about a full service U.S. bank dedicated to serving expats, digital nomads, etc.?

[Jingthing]

This topic inspired by yet another issue with a U.S. financial institution caused by living abroad.

In this case an account of about 1,000 dollars that has been frozen and requiring me to visit a branch in the U.S. to unlock. I have no plans to travel to the U.S. Without going in details of how this happened, how about this for an idea?

 

Could a wealthy entrepreneur open a U.S. bank with all the standard services dedicated to serving expats, digital nomads, etc.?

An account where U.S. nationals already living abroad could open new accounts with just a passport.

An account where living abroad doesn't make you a suspect and no need to create a fake U.S. residence with U.S. address and cell phone number?

A bank that could somehow finesse with clout and lobbying effort to still comply with "know your customer" laws even to the point of getting those laws changed to accommodate expats?

Can't they "know" us through different means, like Zoom calls, voice prints, official evidence of our foreign address, etc.?

Yes I know there are existing alternatives like State Department Federal Credit Union and that's great as far as it goes, but I'm talking about something even better and even more targeted at us.

It shouldn't be so hard for Americans to live abroad and still manage U.S. finances when needed, and many of us need to. 

A pipe dream for sure but do you think there's a profitable market for this?

I do as Americans moving abroad becomes much more popular for both working age people and retirees.

I know I'm not the only expat who has experienced many nightmares over the years by being treated badly by U.S. financial institutions.

Know any billionaires? 

 

[marin]

I am thinking Sativa as your high seems very clear. Ideas well thought out. But not a chance in hell. 

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, marin said:

I am thinking Sativa as your high seems very clear. Ideas well thought out. But not a chance in hell. 

Why not?

[marin]

7 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Why not?

Same reasons you said. Banking cant be done anymore without all these checks. The USA is the cause of a lot of it. I had to close my American checking and savings account I have always kept. No current US address. Now going back this year to get my money out of saving deposit accounts as well. I wish bro, but its only going to get worse. 

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, marin said:

Same reasons you said. Banking cant be done anymore without all these checks. The USA is the cause of a lot of it. I had to close my American checking and savings account I have always kept. No current US address. Now going back this year to get my money out of saving deposit accounts as well. I wish bro, but its only going to get worse. 

Yes the laws don't favor us. Normal banks want to dump us with good reason. But a specialized bank with the potential to capture the majority of U.S. expats and digital nomads in the world, MILLIONS OF AMERICANS, could potentially have the bandwidth to lobby to change the laws.

Elon Musk? 

[noobexpat]

Think how a bank makes profit.

You probably don't know.

How does that free checking account make a profit. Clue - it doesn't.

[Jingthing]

I have a personal experience with this kind of thing.

i was involved in an internet startup that was dealing with selling a product where each U.S. state had complex different laws about so that nobody else had bothered to deal with it before because of that.

But they had deep pockets and invested in tackling it.

They still exist, decades later, and they are the market leader.

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

Think how a bank makes profit.

You probably don't know.

How does that free checking account make a profit. Clue - it doesn't.

I know enough to know that different banks have different business models but I assume you're talking about loans.

Loans would be a problem for expats, but I assume they could do credit cards, IRA accounts, and pretty much everything else U.S. banks do.

They might even have pricing power for higher fees because of the special service they could offer expats.

[Dan O]

3 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

Think how a bank makes profit.

You probably don't know.

How does that free checking account make a profit. Clue - it doesn't.

Banks make money by floating  the deposits to other banks and institutions. You don't think they actually store your deposits in the vault until you need it do you?

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

Besides the issues raised by the Patriot Act and KYC requirements, licensing and regulatory issues in the expats' countries of residence may still be a deterrent. And as unlikely as it may seem, banks are also afraid of being sued by an account holder in a foreign country under laws and regulations they are not aware of.

 

Yet some banks will still work with expats. I was able to open a checking account with Chase using only my Thai address and mobile phone number along with a copy of a bank statement with my Thai address on it. Their mobile app works just fine on my phone with a Thai SIM and I can perform internet banking on my computer.

[impulse]

5 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

Think how a bank makes profit.

You probably don't know.

How does that free checking account make a profit. Clue - it doesn't.

 

Also think about why most people become expats.  It's not because they have too much money to live in the USA. 

 

Obviously, there are exceptions.  But I suspect the ones with the dosh have figured out banking overseas.

 

[Dan O]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I know enough to know that different banks have different business models but I assume you're talking about loans.

Loans would be a problem for expats, but I assume they could do credit cards.

You do know to be a bank in the USA there are specific federal regulations you must comply with right? You cant just make up your own rules. 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

Besides the issues raised by the Patriot Act and KYC requirements, licensing and regulatory issues in the expats' countries of residence may still be a deterrent. And as unlikely as it may seem, banks are also afraid of being sued by an account holder in a foreign country under laws and regulations they are not aware of.

 

Yet some banks will still work with expats. I was able to open a checking account with Chase using only my Thai address and mobile phone number along with a copy of a bank statement with my Thai address on it. Their mobile app works just fine on my phone with a Thai SIM and I can perform internet banking on my computer.

Yeah but you found a custom solution. They could change their policy tomorrow. I'm talking about making things much easier for ALL expats and digital nomads.

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, Dan O said:

You do know to be a bank in the USA there are specific federal regulations you must comply with right? You cant just make up your own rules. 

I know and I'm suggesting a deep pockets startup could lobby to change laws to specifically make things easier for expats and damn it, we're Americans too!

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Also think about why most people become expats.  It's not because they have too much money to live in the USA. 

 

Obviously, there are exceptions.  But I suspect the ones with the dosh have figured out banking overseas.

 

There are a lot of exceptions. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah but you found a custom solution. They could change their policy tomorrow. I'm talking about making things much easier for ALL expats and digital nomads.

 

That's true, but that would also be the case for a bank that specialized in catering to expats. Nobody is safe while the legislature is in session.

[Dan O]

Just now, Jingthing said:

I know and I'm suggesting a deep pockets startup could lobby to change laws to specifically make things easier for expats and damn it, we're Americans too!

There are federal banking laws and regulations for the IRS intermingled so you may want to give up on that idea of deep pockets. Just establish a US address for your acct and tie everything US related to that address. That takes care of 98% of any issue that comes up. 

[Cardano]

51 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

This topic inspired by yet another issue with a U.S. financial institution caused by living abroad.

In this case an account of about 1,000 dollars that has been frozen and requiring me to visit a branch in the U.S. to unlock. I have no plans to travel to the U.S. Without going in details of how this happened, how about this for an idea?

 

Could a wealthy entrepreneur open a U.S. bank with all the standard services dedicated to serving expats, digital nomads, etc.?

An account where U.S. nationals already living abroad could open new accounts with just a passport.

An account where living abroad doesn't make you a suspect and no need to create a fake U.S. residence with U.S. address and cell phone number?

A bank that could somehow finesse with clout and lobbying effort to still comply with "know your customer" laws even to the point of getting those laws changed to accommodate expats?

Can't they "know" us through different means, like Zoom calls, voice prints, official evidence of our foreign address, etc.?

Yes I know there are existing alternatives like State Department Federal Credit Union and that's great as far as it goes, but I'm talking about something even better and even more targeted at us.

It shouldn't be so hard for Americans to live abroad and still manage U.S. finances when needed, and many of us need to. 

A pipe dream for sure but do you think there's a profitable market for this?

I do as Americans moving abroad becomes much more popular for both working age people and retirees.

I know I'm not the only expat who has experienced many nightmares over the years by being treated badly by U.S. financial institutions.

Know any billionaires? 

 

Yes it's called crypto

[marin]

12 minutes ago, noobexpat said:

How does that free checking account make a profit. Clue - it doesn't.

It used to show trust in the client. A benefit. Made you bank more. Between my father and I we go back 75 years in dealing with the same bank. Come May it will be the first time they have not held any of our money. They could not give a <deleted> as you say. Nor do I. 🙃

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Dan O said:

There are federal banking laws and regulations for the IRS intermingled so you may want to give up on that idea of deep pockets. Just establish a US address for your acct and tie everything US related to that address. That takes care of 98% of any issue that comes up. 

I'm here to tell you that it eventually doesn't. 

I've been living abroad long enough to know that.

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, Cardano said:

Yes it's called crypto

Different topic.

I'm talking about traditional banking services. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

10 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Also think about why most people become expats.  It's not because they have too much money to live in the USA. 

 

Obviously, there are exceptions.  But I suspect the ones with the dosh have figured out banking overseas.

 

 

Some types of accounts can't be ported outside the US, such as IRA and 401k accounts. Really wealthy people probably don't rely so much on these accounts, but for middle-class Americans they are anchors to the US financial system. Then there are the US tax laws, particularly regarding ownership of some foreign financial products. 

[Jingthing]

9 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

 

Some types of accounts can't be ported outside the US, such as IRA and 401k accounts. Really wealthy people probably don't rely so much on these accounts, but for middle-class Americans they are anchors to the US financial system. Then there are the US tax laws, particularly regarding ownership of some foreign financial products. 

Not sure what you're talking about. I think Interactive Brokers does IRAs which you can open from abroad. What do you mean by ported? I'm talking about a U.S. based bank specializing in expat customers.

Yes I'm aware you can't buy mutual funds living abroad for IRA by you can by stocks, bonds, and ETFs.

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

6 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Not sure what you're talking about. I think Interactive Brokers does IRAs which you can open from abroad. What do you mean by ported? I'm talking about a U.S. based bank specializing in expat customers.

Yes I'm aware you can't buy mutual funds living abroad for IRA by you can by stocks, bonds, and ETFs.

 

By ported, I meant establishing an IRA account with, or rolling an IRA account over into, a financial institution outside the US.

[biervoormij]

What would you be willing to pay per month for this type of service? I don't think I would want to pay what it would take for the bank to be able to make a profit.

[Prubangboy]

Just not enough of us cheapskates to warrant a single drone sitting at a formica desk.

[Dolf]

Of course there should be foreign banks in the top 7 major places in Thailand. But there should also be a better visa system.

 

The world is run by morons though.

 

 

[Dan O]

38 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I'm here to tell you that it eventually doesn't. 

I've been living abroad long enough to know that.

As have I and never had any issue. No I may not be doing any odd things that would warrant any issue as apparently you implied you had or have had something trigger it

[CartagenaWarlock]

36 minutes ago, Etaoin Shrdlu said:

I was able to open a checking account with Chase using only my Thai address and mobile phone number along with a copy of a bank statement with my Thai address on it.

Can you please post step-by-step instructions on how to do it, including the URL as a starting point. Thanks. 

[Etaoin Shrdlu]

12 minutes ago, CartagenaWarlock said:

Can you please post step-by-step instructions on how to do it, including the URL as a starting point. Thanks. 

 

I was visiting the US when I went into a Chase branch and opened the account.

 

I know this isn't helpful if you aren't planning on going to the US, but it is better than not being able to open an account under any circumstances with only a Thai address.

 

Before I opened the Chase account I did look into trying to open an account in the US without traveling there. If I remember correctly, TD Bank would open an account without me having to be physically present. This could be initiated over the phone using one of their toll-free numbers.