Touchy Subject... Something we don't want to think about...

[AcuDoc]

Okay I know this is a touchy subject and something nobody wants to think about... Myself and a couple of my expats were wondering about this... Worse case scenario and something we all hope never happens...

 

I am 70 years old and my wife is 39 so I am pretty sure and hope and pray that I am going to die before my wife but you never know... A year ago my son died from a heart attack at 47 and he was in relatively good shape... Our son, my wife's thru her first marriage was hit by a drunk driver when he was on his scooter and broke his leg and thankfully that was the extent of it... so again you never know

 

We (I) bought land last year and we are going to build a house so when I die she has her own place... She never asked me to do, my wife is very low maintenance, this is something that I wanted to do for her. I am not a wealthy man, do not have a lot of money in the bank and still working in order to make money to build the house which if I wasn't married that money would be for my retirement...

 

So here is my question... worse case scenario if my wife dies for some reason what happens to the land, does it just go to her family... I know that as a farang I can't own land but is there a legal document that could have the land go to me or that it could be sold... I get along great with my in-laws and believe that they would let me live there until I die which is what I prefer but I would feel better if a legal document was drawn up stating this... maybe it would be in poor taste, I don't know and hope it would not be a slap in the face to my in-laws...

 

I've seen a number of my friends lose everything to their ex-Thai wife or their family... I do not believe that my wife, or I would not have married her, or her family are like this but again you never know... They certainly know that I do not have a lot of money but my wife has a very good life with me and I do take care of her... we just live within our means... but on the other hand like I have stated I've seen things like this happen...

 

Your thoughts I am ready for some of you that might just blast me as a greedy bastard while others might understand where I am coming from...

[CharlieH]

She should have a Will, and generally, you as her husband have 1 year to sell or otherwise transfer into a Thai person.

[JimTripper]

Blunt post (sorry). The "leaving the house to people" stuff is probably about you not wanting to die or get old.

 

Often the property needs to be sold as you get older anyhow if you need assisted living or more care.

 

Whatever is left gets passed on anyway so why does it need to be a house? Are you trying to lock up the funds somehow so you don't spend savings down? That does not work, you end up having to sell off assets.

[AcuDoc]

Jim you are totally off the mark... I am well aware of how fast one can be healthy and things turn around, I am a physician and see it all the time... I have no fear and do not care about about getting old or dying... I'm in good health and I'm not worried about care either I know my wife will do what she can... To be honest I believe that I am going to live longer that I would actually prefer... with my grandkids in their 20's and with my wife I've added a few extra years of that preference... lol

 

And this is even further off the mark... "Are you trying to lock up the funds somehow so you don't spend savings down? That does not work, you end up having to sell off assets." Like I said I am not wealthy but I am not poor either...

 

"Whatever is left gets passed on anyway so why does it need to be a house?"... again as I said I would prefer just to stay on the land and in the house and then pass both to her family once I die... And also like I stated I have seen friends lose everything...  

 

I guess you are the "glass is half empty" guy where I the "glass is half full guy" here... Appreciate your thoughts, you are just off the mark when it comes to me and my thoughts...

[Angus55]

51 minutes ago, AcuDoc said:

Okay I know this is a touchy subject and something nobody wants to think about... Myself and a couple of my expats were wondering about this... Worse case scenario and something we all hope never happens...

 

I am 70 years old and my wife is 39 so I am pretty sure and hope and pray that I am going to die before my wife but you never know... A year ago my son died from a heart attack at 47 and he was in relatively good shape... Our son, my wife's thru her first marriage was hit by a drunk driver when he was on his scooter and broke his leg and thankfully that was the extent of it... so again you never know

 

We (I) bought land last year and we are going to build a house so when I die she has her own place... She never asked me to do, my wife is very low maintenance, this is something that I wanted to do for her. I am not a wealthy man, do not have a lot of money in the bank and still working in order to make money to build the house which if I wasn't married that money would be for my retirement...

 

So here is my question... worse case scenario if my wife dies for some reason what happens to the land, does it just go to her family... I know that as a farang I can't own land but is there a legal document that could have the land go to me or that it could be sold... I get along great with my in-laws and believe that they would let me live there until I die which is what I prefer but I would feel better if a legal document was drawn up stating this... maybe it would be in poor taste, I don't know and hope it would not be a slap in the face to my in-laws...

 

I've seen a number of my friends lose everything to their ex-Thai wife or their family... I do not believe that my wife, or I would not have married her, or her family are like this but again you never know... They certainly know that I do not have a lot of money but my wife has a very good life with me and I do take care of her... we just live within our means... but on the other hand like I have stated I've seen things like this happen...

 

Your thoughts I am ready for some of you that might just blast me as a greedy bastard while others might understand where I am coming from...

rule #1...dont be worth more dead than alive !!!

[AcuDoc]

2 minutes ago, Angus55 said:

rule #1...dont be worth more dead than alive !!!

that rarely happens...most are worth more and i don't care what country you are in...

[JimTripper]

11 minutes ago, AcuDoc said:

Jim you are totally off the mark... I am well aware of how fast one can be healthy and things turn around, I am a physician and see it all the time... I have no fear and do not care about about getting old or dying... I'm in good health and I'm not worried about care either I know my wife will do what she can... To be honest I believe that I am going to live longer that I would actually prefer... with my grandkids in their 20's and with my wife I've added a few extra years of that preference... lol

 

And this is even further off the mark... "Are you trying to lock up the funds somehow so you don't spend savings down? That does not work, you end up having to sell off assets." Like I said I am not wealthy but I am not poor either...

 

"Whatever is left gets passed on anyway so why does it need to be a house?"... again as I said I would prefer just to stay on the land and in the house and then pass both to her family once I die... And also like I stated I have seen friends lose everything...  

 

I guess you are the "glass is half empty" guy where I the "glass is half full guy" here... Appreciate your thoughts, you are just off the mark when it comes to me and my thoughts...

Maybe I mis-phrased. More like needing to 'hold on' in some way. Everyone's different though, it may not apply to you.

 

The over concern with wills and disposition of assets to whom, trying to cover every possible contingency, etc is also another sign of this problem.

 

[AcuDoc]

35 minutes ago, JimTripper said:

Blunt post (sorry). The "leaving the house to people" stuff is probably about you not wanting to die or get old.

 

Often the property needs to be sold as you get older anyhow if you need assisted living or more care.

 

Whatever is left gets passed on anyway so why does it need to be a house? Are you trying to lock up the funds somehow so you don't spend savings down? That does not work, you end up having to sell off assets.

Jim you are totally off the mark... I am well aware of how fast one can be healthy and things turn around, I am a physician and see it all the time... I have no fear and do not care about about getting old or dying... I'm in good health and I'm not worried about care either I know my wife will do what she can... To be honest I believe that I am going to live longer that I would actually prefer... with my grandkids in their 20's and with my wife I've added a few extra years of that preference... lol

 

And this is even further off the mark... "Are you trying to lock up the funds somehow so you don't spend savings down? That does not work, you end up having to sell off assets." Like I said I am not wealthy but I am not poor either...

 

"Whatever is left gets passed on anyway so why does it need to be a house?"... again as I said I would prefer just to stay on the land and in the house and then pass both to her family once I die... And also like I stated I have seen friends lose everything...  

 

I guess you are the "glass is half empty" guy where I the "glass is half full guy" here... Appreciate your thoughts, you are just off the mark when it comes to me and my thoughts...

[AcuDoc]

Just now, JimTripper said:

Maybe I mis-phrased. More like needing to 'hold on' in some way. Everyone's different though, it may not apply to you.

 

The over concern with wills and disposition of assets to whom, trying to cover every possible contingency, etc is also another sign of this problem.

 

thanks for the thoughts... just is not true in my case...

[CharlieH]

Worth mentioning, and something for consideration, your visa status is also impacted by the death if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed, you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

 

 

edit: post edited for accuracy.

[Denim]

This is one of those things that everyone has to deal with to their own satisfaction. What works for one person might not be possible for another.

 

But if you do need the money tied up in the property then Charlie has covered it.  Get a her to make a simple will that covers your requirements.

 

41 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

She should have a Will, and generally, you as her husband have 1 year to sell or otherwise transfer into a Thai person.

 

[Liverpool Lou]

12 minutes ago, Angus55 said:

rule #1...dont be worth more dead than alive !!!

Gawd....    Such original profundity.

[Lacessit]

Just now, AcuDoc said:

that rarely happens...most are worth more and i don't care what country you are in...

It depends on circumstances. I have a steady income from a pension and investments. My Thai GF gets a lump sum in cash when I die, which will have to last her for the rest of her life.

 

Therefore, it is in her best interest for me to live for as long as possible.

 

Rule #1 in Thailand is never put in more money here than you can afford to lose.

 

To answer the OP's question, not much can be done if things go pear-shaped with the relatives of your wife. As a lawyer once told me, money brings out the worst in people.

[scubascuba3]

The house will go to you and you have 1 year to sell to a thai or thai company (which can be you) 

[impulse]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

Worth mentioning, and something for consideration, your visa status is also impacted by the death if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

 

Not meaning to be morbid, but when does that 7 day clock start?  Is it upon declaration of death, after the funeral, or exactly what triggers the clock?

 

 

[Angus55]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

It depends on circumstances. I have a steady income from a pension and investments. My Thai GF gets a lump sum in cash when I die, which will have to last her for the rest of her life.

 

Therefore, it is in her best interest for me to live for as long as possible.

 

Rule #1 in Thailand is never put in more money here than you can afford to lose.

 

To answer the OP's question, not much can be done if things go pear-shaped with the relatives of your wife. As a lawyer once told me, money brings out the worst in people.

How if she is just a GF and therefore not legally a parter?

[NorthernRyland]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

OMG seriously? That's so cruel of them and for what? pathetic.

[CharlieH]

3 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Not meaning to be morbid, but when does that 7 day clock start?  Is it upon declaration of death, after the funeral, or exactly what triggers the clock?

 

 

Generally when the person is certified deceased, that's what is entered on official paperwork etc. 

[Lacessit]

Just now, Angus55 said:

How if she is just a GF and therefore not legally a parter?

I have a Thai will, and an Australian will.

 

The Thai will leaves all assets ( mostly cash ) in Thailand to her. The Australian will leaves all assets there to my son.

[billd766]

53 minutes ago, AcuDoc said:

Okay I know this is a touchy subject and something nobody wants to think about... Myself and a couple of my expats were wondering about this... Worse case scenario and something we all hope never happens...

 

I am 70 years old and my wife is 39 so I am pretty sure and hope and pray that I am going to die before my wife but you never know... A year ago my son died from a heart attack at 47 and he was in relatively good shape... Our son, my wife's thru her first marriage was hit by a drunk driver when he was on his scooter and broke his leg and thankfully that was the extent of it... so again you never know

 

We (I) bought land last year and we are going to build a house so when I die she has her own place... She never asked me to do, my wife is very low maintenance, this is something that I wanted to do for her. I am not a wealthy man, do not have a lot of money in the bank and still working in order to make money to build the house which if I wasn't married that money would be for my retirement...

 

So here is my question... worse case scenario if my wife dies for some reason what happens to the land, does it just go to her family... I know that as a farang I can't own land but is there a legal document that could have the land go to me or that it could be sold... I get along great with my in-laws and believe that they would let me live there until I die which is what I prefer but I would feel better if a legal document was drawn up stating this... maybe it would be in poor taste, I don't know and hope it would not be a slap in the face to my in-laws...

 

I've seen a number of my friends lose everything to their ex-Thai wife or their family... I do not believe that my wife, or I would not have married her, or her family are like this but again you never know... They certainly know that I do not have a lot of money but my wife has a very good life with me and I do take care of her... we just live within our means... but on the other hand like I have stated I've seen things like this happen...

 

Your thoughts I am ready for some of you that might just blast me as a greedy bastard while others might understand where I am coming from...

AFAIR you can make a Thai will together with your wife and nominate who the house and land will do to if she dies before you. If you have legally adopted your wife's son by her first marriage (here I am not 100% certain), he will get the first chance, followed by her parents, followed by blood relatives (brothers and sisters in age), and then uncles and aunts, then your wife's cousins.

 

If your wife's son is underage he can still inherit the house and land though the court may appoint someone in the family as his guardian.

 

In a will any of them can be written out.

 

If the house and land are left to you alone, you are allowed 1 year to dispose of it.

 

Here is one link which you may find useful.

 

https://www.thailandlawonline.com/thai-family-and-marriage-law/legal-aspects-of-a-last-will-and-testament-in-thailand

 

You can also do an internet search along the lines of "What happens if my wife dies before me".

 

I hope that this is of some use to pointing in the right direction.

[Sophon]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

Worth mentioning, and something for consideration, your visa status is also impacted by the death if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

 

You are wrong about that, an extension based on marriage remains valid until it expires in the case of the spouse's death.

[Denim]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

Worth mentioning, and something for consideration, your visa status is also impacted by the death if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

 

Yes good point.  I always do my 90 day reports in person so that I now know all the staffs first names and have built up friendly relations.

 My hope is that although they have to abide by the rules as do I  , they will at least be sympathetic and hopefully give me a short extension of some sort. Should my wife die before me , my own plan is to leave Thailand ASAP with as many convertable assets as possible. The house and land can go to my son in law and his wife and kids....lovely deserving family.

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, AcuDoc said:

here is my question... worse case scenario if my wife dies for some reason what happens to the land, does it just go to her family... I know that as a farang I can't own land but is there a legal document that could have the land go to me or that it could be sold...

As her husband (a registered marriage, presumably) your wife's intestate estate would be split between you and your son but, as someone else pointed out, you'd have to dispose of any land you inherited, being a foreigner.   There is no document or provision for a foreigner to own the land in the intestate circumstance that you forsee.

[TroubleandGrumpy]

Does not a Usufruct Agreement allow you to occupy the house for a period of time and on a commercial basis (free), if your Partner who owns the house was to pass away?  I believe that the house would pass over to whoever in the family the Wife has left it to, but your 'right of occupation' under the Usuafruct Agreement (and as stated in her Will), does not cease when she dies? 

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

Will + Usufruct.

 

Usufruct will put your name on the back of the Chanote.

A little protection so relatives can't "legally" force you out.

 

The will could put the property in the son's name with the stipulation that you continue to reside there.

 

 

[CharlieH]

1 hour ago, Sophon said:

 

You are wrong about that, an extension based on marriage remains valid until it expires in the case of the spouse's death.

Happy to be corrected, and if you have something to support that it would be of great benefit here for others reading this topic. Thanks

 

**post edited and corrected.

[PJ71]

21 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

Generally when the person is certified deceased, that's what is entered on official paperwork etc. 

I thought the visa or extension was valid until the date given, but perhaps i'm wrong?

[Angus55]

1 hour ago, CharlieH said:

Worth mentioning, and something for consideration, your visa status is also impacted by the death if you have a visa extension based on marriage, that will need to be addressed you have until the expiry date on your visa to make alternate arrangements.

Of course . As soon as you die you are no longer bringing money into the country .

[Khyron]

I have wondered about this exact scenario; but my wife is a few years older than me. I believe the Will and Usufruct is probably the way to go. 

The most difficult thing we are facing is who to put in the will to own the land if my wife goes before me.

 

Her brothers and sister we trust 100% (I've known them for more than 30 years, never ask for a dime) but they may go early as well, the nieces and nephews we mostly trust, but you never know.

 

What I would like to know is, if the land goes into their name, the house is in mine with an Usufruct, what is to stop them from getting a loan on the land and not paying it? Is that possible?

 

Sorry If I hijacked the thread, but I think it is a pertinent question for the OP.

 

Thanks.

[Sophon]

25 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

Happy to be corrected, and if you have something to support that it would be of great benefit here for others reading this topic. Thanks