A New Era in UK-Germany Relations: Starmer and Scholz Pledge Ambitious Treaty

[candide]

38 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

 

Good point, Germany is indeed the only country to contract in Q2. The main reason for this is that German politicians have steered Germany worse than the other countries. Germany was uniquely dependent on Russian oil, but the knee jerk reaction by leftist politicians in Germany after the Ukraine invasion was to boycott their own main energy source. This not only cost enormous sums, as Germany had to build brandnew infrastructure to store different types of fuel, but it also caused German industry to ring the alarm bell due to unpredictable energy costs and general energy insecurity. This in turn scared off investors who don't want to invest in a place where energy security is not given or energy prices are through the roof, as they were in Germany thanks to decisions by German politicians. All this after they closed German needlessly with lockdowns which cost the German economy, many  many milions.

 

To fund the gigantic Nordstream project, only in order to cancel it at the last minute, beggars belief in terms of squandering tax payer money.

 

Then of course there is the total insanity of countless billions handed over to Ukraine which cannot go into funding subsidies for foreign investments, infrastructure or other measure that benefit the economy. It was a boost for Rheinmetall, but a loss for other sectors of the economy. Despite Scholz big words, of course he's finally realised he needs to cut the free handouts to Ukraine., but he'll still pour a few billion in. Crazy.

 

Germany was already suffering from Chinese competition, German car makers make the best electric vehicle but in the mass market they are unable to compete with China. Same with solar and many other industries. 

 

I was just in Germany a few weeks ago, the high street is dying because Germans have no money to shop. All the quality shops disappeared and are replaced with nail shops, doner joints and the like, much like in Britain the fried chicken shops are taking over. It's not quite as bad as Harlow, but Germany too is going that way.

 

 

I 'm not particularly defending Germany. It was a strategic mistake to depend so much on one source of energy, and in particular from Russia. They saw it coming.

However, on the positive side, its debt ratio is still around half of other large European countries's ratio (incl. UK), and It's still rated AAA.

Edited August 29 by candide

[Cameroni]

21 minutes ago, candide said:

I 'm not particularly defending Germany. It was a strategic mistake to depend so much on one source of energy, and in particular from Russia. They saw it coming.

However, on the positive side, its debt ratio is still around half of other large European countries's ratio (incl. UK), and It's still rated AAA.

 

Germany will improve again. Good decisions are also being made, like building semi-conductor factories. It  wasn't just energy where Germany depended on one source, also in many other areas of the economy, semi-conductors, like the rest of the world. But the good side of this is that Germans have realised they have to be more self reliant. They will build their own semi-conductor factories.

 

What worries me is the lack of ability of the German ruling class, which is now permeated with people like Annalena Baerbock. These are people who lack the most basic achievements in economic or other fields, they have never demonstrated leadership, wisdom or ability. And their recent record underscores their lack of guile.

 

Another knew jerk reaction if you recall was the total boycott of nuclear energy. A source which China is now heavily investing in and France was always smart enough to foster.

 

There are many smart people in German inudstry, but in politics very , very mediocre people are in charge, and that's being charitable. They are driven by ideology and squander countles hours and efforts, not to mention tens of millions of Euro, on holocaust debates, memorials, immigration debates, equality and diversity nonsense. If you were to look at the time the German parliament squanders on nonsense it is most likely the majority. Like diverting motorways to save frogs. You can't make it up.

 

 

[sungod]

2 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

Chomps thinks everyone who has money was gifted it.

 

Doesn't seem to realize some people bust their balls for it and don't appreciate then giving it away to people who spend their life on the sofa/posting on internet forums. 

 

Just teaches people that hard work and saving are not worthwhile if 2 tier Kier wants to tax you on your earnings and then again on anything you want to give your kids so total strangers benefit. If I could have my time again I'd just hold my hand out and do sweet FA.

[RayC]

We all agree that it is important for the UK to have good relations with its' nearest  neighbours ... wait a sec, that needs changing ...

 

Some of us think that it is important for the UK to have good relations with its' nearest  neighbours. Just a shame that it will just be bi-lateral talks.

 

If only there was an organisation which brought together most of the European states where co-ordinated agreements on trade, safety standards, foreign policy, etc could be discussed and made .... oh, hold on ...

[candide]

8 hours ago, johng said:

Wonder how the Germans feel about Ukraine blowing up the gas pipeline leading to hugh energy price increases for them and across Europe....oops!

It seems you are not informed about this subject.

 

The Nord Stream 2 pipeline never entered service before the sabotage, and deliveries through Nord Stream 1 were already stopped at that time. Actually, the B pipeline of Nord Stream 2 could still be used, but Germany is banning direct gas imports from Russia.

 

So it was not the cause of the huge price increase.

[candide]

8 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

But they had enough money for the winter allowance for pensioners in EU https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/pensions/article-13788141/British-pensioners-living-EU-winter-fuel-allowance-thanks-Brexit-catch.html

 

As an aside, Can Germany make treaties with the UK? Doesn’t it need to be an EU wide Treaty or is Germany the EU nowadays?

No, it cannot make treaties on anything really significant (i.e. not a trade deal), as it is a EU prerogative. It can only be symbolic, such as developing cooperation, blah blah...

 

However, defense and security not being a EU prerogative, it can develop any relation it wants with UK on these matters, as France already does.

 

[Cameroni]

22 minutes ago, candide said:

but Germany is banning direct gas imports from Russia.

 

But still importing it via Belgium and Netherlands, lol.

[candide]

6 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

 

But still importing it via Belgium and Netherlands, lol.

Yes it still imports some Russian gas indirectly as LNG gas. Estimated around 4-5% of its gas consumption (compared to 55% before the invasion) so not that much.

[Cameroni]

3 minutes ago, candide said:

Yes it still imports some Russian gas indirectly as LNG gas. Estimated around 4-5% of its gas consumption (compared to 55% before the invasion) so not that much.

 

Yes, quite the reduction. All paid for by the German consumer who's had energy bills to pay that would give the average elephant a heart attack. 

 

There's no solution to the German energy issue still, importing gas from Norway and the middle east, very doubtful this could ever be cheaper than Russian gas.

 

Hopefully they'll revive the Nordstream pipleine when the Ukrainians and Russians have negotiated peace, as they undoubtedly will.

[johng]

15 hours ago, candide said:

It seems you are not informed about this subject.

 

Actually it seems you are "misinformed" about the subject.

 

Remember before the sabotage  one of the pipelines was shut for maintenance and the Germans would not release vital parts to enable a pump to be repaired   due to stupid sanctions  they then "cut of their own noses to spite their face" by totally rejecting Russian oil and gas...soon the German manufactures where hurting badly  in need of the energy  having to pay extortionate price from alternative countries....it was rumoured that the German government was about to  relax the sanctions on Russian energy  then what do you know ?

 

Russia blew up the pipeline to teach those Germans a lesson ?    errr  probably not !

 

Zelensky and Co  hatched plot to blow up the pipeline  but the CIA got wind of the plan and "persuaded" him not to do it...however a bunch Ukrainians who hatched the plot where not happy and on a drunken whim  hired a yacht  and carried out their plan successfully ?

 

Or was it someone else who   said that if Russia invades Ukraine the pipeline will be brought to an end.  

 

[candide]

3 hours ago, johng said:

 

Actually it seems you are "misinformed" about the subject.

 

Remember before the sabotage  one of the pipelines was shut for maintenance and the Germans would not release vital parts to enable a pump to be repaired   due to stupid sanctions  they then "cut of their own noses to spite their face" by totally rejecting Russian oil and gas...soon the German manufactures where hurting badly  in need of the energy  having to pay extortionate price from alternative countries....it was rumoured that the German government was about to  relax the sanctions on Russian energy  then what do you know ?

 

Russia blew up the pipeline to teach those Germans a lesson ?    errr  probably not !

 

Zelensky and Co  hatched plot to blow up the pipeline  but the CIA got wind of the plan and "persuaded" him not to do it...however a bunch Ukrainians who hatched the plot where not happy and on a drunken whim  hired a yacht  and carried out their plan successfully ?

 

Or was it someone else who   said that if Russia invades Ukraine the pipeline will be brought to an end.  

 

Deflection!

Fact is that, contrary to your claim, it was not the sabotage which stopped gas deliveries to Germany, as there were no deliveries at that time using  Nord Stream 1 and 2.

[John Drake]

Scholz and Starmer getting together to plot more immigration. Getting their marching orders from somebody.

 

 

[johng]

6 hours ago, candide said:

Deflection!

Yes that is what you do   the sabotage stopped any chance that Germany would make a deal for the return of cheap Russian energy  instead they had to relay on the saboteurs to supply the energy !!!!

 

no comment on the prime suspect saying he would 

"bring the pipeline to an end" ???   yes "deflection"    💩

[johng]

5 hours ago, John Drake said:

Getting their marching orders from somebody.

2 tier Starmer chose Davos over Westminster.

[candide]

9 minutes ago, johng said:

Yes that is what you do   the sabotage stopped any chance that Germany would make a deal for the return of cheap Russian energy  instead they had to relay on the saboteurs to supply the energy !!!!

 

no comment on the prime suspect saying he would 

"bring the pipeline to an end" ???   yes "deflection"    💩

Wrong again, 🤣

The Nord Stream 2 B pipeline can still be used, if they want.

[Cameroni]

1 minute ago, candide said:

Wrong again, 🤣

The Nord Stream 2 B pipeline can still be used, if they want.

 

The entire Nord Stream project can be revived if Germany so desires in the future.

 

Some two bit Ukrainian swim instructors can't stop the will of the German government. 

[candide]

1 minute ago, Cameroni said:

 

The entire Nord Stream project can be revived if Germany so desires in the future.

 

Some two bit Ukrainian swim instructors can't stop the will of the German government. 

You should tell that to johng! 😃

[johng]

6 minutes ago, candide said:

Wrong again, 🤣

Comment on the prime suspect saying  he would bring the pipeline to an end ?   nope none at all.

 

9 minutes ago, Cameroni said:

Some two bit Ukrainian swim instructors can't stop the will of the German government. 

@candide  obviously  does not not understand sarcasm 😋  

[candide]

1 hour ago, johng said:

Comment on the prime suspect saying  he would bring the pipeline to an end ?   nope none at all.

 

@candide  obviously  does not not understand sarcasm 😋  

Deflection again.

You were wrong as there were no Russian gas deliveries any more using NS at the time at the time of the sabotage. Then you claimed it prevents Germany from resuming Russian gas deliveries, and you were wrong again as they could still do it using the NS2 B pipeline.

You have been factually proven 2 times wrong. 😃

 

Oh and stop truncating my posts to alter their meaning.

Edited August 30 by candide

[johng]

 

15 hours ago, candide said:

You have been factually proven 2 times wrong.

Factually In your own mind yes of course.

 

15 hours ago, candide said:

Oh and stop truncating my posts to alter their meaning

I have quoted  for brevity  not to alter meaning.

[candide]

34 minutes ago, johng said:

 

Factually In your own mind yes of course.

 

I have quoted  for brevity  not to alter meaning.

Of course, you don't like uncontested facts proving you wromg:

- There were no deliveries at the time of the sabotage: NS 1 deliveries were halted by Gasprom and NS 2 did not enter service. The sabotage did not stop anything.

- NS2 B can still be used, so Germany could have resumed NS deliveries if it wanted. It did not want it.

 

You may not have done it on purpose, but hiding the facts on which a post is based alters the significance of a post.

Edited August 31 by candide

[NativeBob]

German economy so f***ed up! from the strongest one now its third world country. I haven't seen such a decline ever. 

[Cameroni]

4 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

German economy so f***ed up! from the strongest one now its third world country. I haven't seen such a decline ever. 

 

What is remarkable is that Germany is doing much worse than France and the UK in Q2. This can only be explained as the poor decisions of German politicians exacting their price.

 

They can point to the pandemic, the Ukraine war and Israel, but ultimately it is only Germany that is contracting in Q2.

 

It's quite shocking incompetence by Germany's rulers.

[nauseus]

On 8/29/2024 at 7:58 AM, JonnyF said:

 

But the pensioners are British. Mainly white. Possibly even working class and god forbid, Conservative. 

 

Meaning Starmer and Labour as a whole doesn't give a monkeys about them. 

 

A form of far left racist thuggery really.

[nauseus]

On 8/29/2024 at 8:20 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

I almost agree with you Jonny.

 

Though this is not the first step, that already taken by Sunak, with the Windsor framework. 
 

As I said at the time, to the consternation of some, BREXIT is being slowly but surely wound back.

 

I’ve also said, and will repeat it her, the EU will not engage with the UK on meaningful rejoin talks until the Tories have returned to some semblance of rationality.
Grim as it is, this inevitably pivots on a few more ‘Boomers’ shaking of their mortal coil,  it it is an inevitability that the Tories will return to center ground politics where EU membership resides.

 

Meanwhile, Labour will continue to engage in all the necessary moves that are not ‘joining the EU’ but are necessary to ‘rejoin the EU’.

 

It’s good to see rational sense in charge again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

It is illogical to use the words or terms: Labour, Starmer and EU, together with rational, in the same sentence, Captain.

 

 

[nauseus]

On 8/29/2024 at 8:58 AM, Chomper Higgot said:

That was never anything the EU insisted on.

 

Go back, read all the damn treaties, and we can talk again next year. 

[Chomper Higgot]

9 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

Go back, read all the damn treaties, and we can talk again next year. 

You might want to do likewise:

 

https://www.bmi.bund.de/EN/topics/migration/law-on-foreigners/freedom-of-movement/freedom-of-movement-node.html#:~:text=As EU citizens%2C all nationals,in any EU Member State.&text=This right to freedom of,of the EU (TFEU).

[nauseus]

14 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You might want to do likewise:

 

https://www.bmi.bund.de/EN/topics/migration/law-on-foreigners/freedom-of-movement/freedom-of-movement-node.html#:~:text=As EU citizens%2C all nationals,in any EU Member State.&text=This right to freedom of,of the EU (TFEU).

 

I knew you would waste time, even though you have so much readiing ahead!.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

25 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

I knew you would waste time, even though you have so much readiing ahead!.

 

 

Sorry for providing a link that demonstrates the truth of my statement.