DTV or retirement visa ?

[BrandonJT]

15 hours ago, farang51 said:

 

As I understand it, the DTV is neither a NON O category nor a Tourist category. It is a new category. That people can get a 5 year license renewal seems to clearly say that the visa is not in the Tourist category.

 

Where is that quote from? Is it from something official or from a person trying to explain it in layman's terms?

The Royal Gazette publication for the law that created the DTV very specifically calls it a tourist visa, special classification.

[tgw]

I really like the built-in multiple entries.

no need to ask for a re-entry permit with a DTV, right ?

[BrandonJT]

3 hours ago, tgw said:

I really like the built-in multiple entries.

no need to ask for a re-entry permit with a DTV, right ?

No re-entry permit.  It's a multiple entry visa already. You get a brand new stamp each time you enter.

[Scouse123]

I've been on Non-O with yearly extensions for many years now.

 

And the same as @DrJack54 the pluses seem to definitely outweigh the negatives with DTV hence my thread last week.

 

As it happens my new extension isn't due until July 2025, so I have ample opportunity to see if they change the DTV entry rules or the system of granting the visa.

 

It has all the benefits, No Re-entry payment fees, no turning up at Immigration every year with handfuls of documents.

 

And of course, once you have shown evidence of 500K in any currency, you get the visa fairly easily, without any rules governing any monies have to be retained in the bank, unlike us, where we keep 800K for 2 months before, and three months after, and then it can never fall below 400K blah, blah, blah.

 

 

 

[DrJack54]

21 minutes ago, Scouse123 said:

...I have ample opportunity to see if they change the DTV entry rules or the system of granting the visa.

That's the best option, wait and see how it pans out. 

 

There is thread in Thai news forum discussing some aspects.

https://aseannow.com/topic/1342476-destination-thailand-visa-dtv-success-faces-an-uncertain-future/

 

[Presnock]

On 11/9/2024 at 9:04 PM, DrJack54 said:

Just now back from chit chat at bar young UK guy.

He obtained a DTV in UK with very little effot.

 

 

Mind you he works online and has UK employer so perhaps easy for him.

I'm an old guy and was joking that so jealous of how easy was his DVT.

 

Just this week I renewed my annual extension (retirement)

If you can obtain DTV or LTV go for it 

The only downside alludes to your reference to things such as TDL.

The DTV is classified as "tourist" 

He was asking about opening bank account and ended up though while CW may issue him a certificate of residence bank still may have issue.

Suggested an agent may be able to assist

I agree, the LTR if you can meet the requirements of any of the four qualifications, then to me is the cheapest with the least amount of running around getting any necessary documentation.  I realize too if one does not fit into a financial situation like mine that the LTR might not be as easy or attractive.  No 90-day  reports, in and out of country whenever, no return permit needed, max re-qualify is a the 5-year level, just a residence location possibly each year unless you travel outside the country and then upon reentering, start the one-year to provide residence location (can be done by agent, spouse or friend and free - just turn in the form LTR form).  No bank statements needed yearly or in my case no bank statements whatsoever.  Everything I needed to show qualification I could do on my computer in my house.  Very easy and in the 10-year visa validity even cheaper overall.  Best of luck...I had a retirement O for 20 years so well aware of those requirements and as for the DTV there might be some changes to that too as it is brand new and immigration offices around the country are not totally aware of it - just like consulates/embassies elsewhere seem to look at it differently according to comments we see on those trying to get one. 

[Phillip9]

12 hours ago, Caldera said:

For someone who already qualifies for a non-immigrant visa and subsequent 1-year extensions, not so much in my opinion. Too much uncertainty, the need to leave once per year, just to avoid a yearly visit to immigration?

 

I guess if you really never leave the country, you might prefer a retirement visa.  But for those of us who leave the country at least a couple of times a year anyway, the DTV has quite a lot of advantages.

[zzzzz]

10,000 baht for 5 years
500,000 baht in the bank for a day (dont need leave it there )
1,900 baht/year for the extension
leave country once /year

 

Not a bad deal
 

Edited November 11 by zzzzz

[itsari]

4 hours ago, Scouse123 said:

I've been on Non-O with yearly extensions for many years now.

 

And the same as @DrJack54 the pluses seem to definitely outweigh the negatives with DTV hence my thread last week.

 

As it happens my new extension isn't due until July 2025, so I have ample opportunity to see if they change the DTV entry rules or the system of granting the visa.

 

It has all the benefits, No Re-entry payment fees, no turning up at Immigration every year with handfuls of documents.

 

And of course, once you have shown evidence of 500K in any currency, you get the visa fairly easily, without any rules governing any monies have to be retained in the bank, unlike us, where we keep 800K for 2 months before, and three months after, and then it can never fall below 400K blah, blah, blah.

 

 

 

You need to show proof of foreign income from clients abroad .

How would a person retired in Thailand manage that if they wish to change to a DTV visa ?

To Mr confused, you need to show a portfolio of work history to show you are a free lancer or demonstrate your profesional activities.

The visas purpose is to remote workers and not tourists or retired people either

Edited November 11 by itsari
person confused

[Briggsy]

29 minutes ago, itsari said:

You need to show proof of foreign income from clients abroad .

How would a person retired in Thailand manage that if they wish to change to a DTV visa ?

To Mr confused, you need to show a portfolio of work history to show you are a free lancer or demonstrate your profesional activities.

The visas purpose is to remote workers and not tourists or retired people either

There are 3 categories under which you can apply. Your post only refers to the "workcation" category.

A retiree could easily apply under the "soft power" category using a medical appointment in Thailand. So I believe it is very possible to change from extensions due to retirement to DTV if the foreigner thinks it works for them.

[itsari]

4 minutes ago, Briggsy said:

There are 3 categories under which you can apply. Your post only refers to the "workcation" category.

A retiree could easily apply under the "soft power" category using a medical appointment in Thailand. So I believe it is very possible to change from extensions due to retirement to DTV if the foreigner thinks it works for them.

I am sorry to say I disagree with you.

What happens if you are a healthy retiree , start making false statements about your medical health situation ?

[farang51]

28 minutes ago, itsari said:

You need to show proof of foreign income from clients abroad .

 

I did not need to do that. I applied in Denmark, and I gave them a screenshot and a link to the website you will find a link to in my profile. I was not asked to prove an income from the website - which was good as I don't really have an income from that.

 

30 minutes ago, itsari said:

To Mr confused, you need to show a portfolio of work history to show you are a free lancer or demonstrate your profesional activities.

 

I was asked for proof of my company's existence, I send them a copy of my VAT registration.

 

No proof was needed for an income. I am retired, and have earlier had NON O multi entry visas, and I was a bit nervous that they would know that I am retired and thus refuse to give me the DTV. However, I got the DTV.

[itsari]

1 minute ago, farang51 said:

 

I did not need to do that. I applied in Denmark, and I gave them a screenshot and a link to the website you will find a link to in my profile. I was not asked to prove an income from the website - which was good as I don't really have an income from that.

 

 

I was asked for proof of my company's existence, I send them a copy of my VAT registration.

 

No proof was needed for an income. I am retired, and have earlier had NON O multi entry visas, and I was a bit nervous that they would know that I am retired and thus refuse to give me the DTV. However, I got the DTV.

Ok, interesting hard evidence you have.

Surprising all the same.

[farang51]

14 minutes ago, itsari said:

Ok, interesting hard evidence you have.

Surprising all the same.

Not really, it does not say anything about income in point 5. The website and the VAT registration was all that was needed for that point. Mind you, the website is about Thailand, and I used to be a professional writer, thus the quality of the website is OK.

Edited November 11 by farang51
Missing word

[Briggsy]

17 minutes ago, itsari said:

I am sorry to say I disagree with you.

What happens if you are a healthy retiree , start making false statements about your medical health situation ?

False statements not required at all. Just book a health check up at a major hospital.

 

If you don't like the DTV, that's fine but please don't say it is not possible for a retiree to obtain one. Because that is not factual.

[Presnock]

3 hours ago, Phillip9 said:

 

I guess if you really never leave the country, you might prefer a retirement visa.  But for those of us who leave the country at least a couple of times a year anyway, the DTV has quite a lot of advantages.

LTR is even better if you leave the country then the 1-year provide the BOI with resident address  (LTR form) and the 1 year resets when you re-enter Thailand no matter how many times by leaving every year, you would not have to visit the BOI check in at all. As for the DTV, what about taxes for remitted income? if you spend over 180 days in any calendar year, you become a tax-resident and thus taxed on remitted income over the minimum assessable amount.  Anyway, for me the LTR  is the perfect visa.  I'm set for the next 9 and 1/2 years anyway unless they do come up with too many changes with the next tax schemes.

[Phillip9]

2 minutes ago, Presnock said:

As for the DTV, what about taxes for remitted income? if you spend over 180 days in any calendar year, you become a tax-resident and thus taxed on remitted income over the minimum assessable amount.  Anyway, for me the LTR  is the perfect visa. 

 

Those of us with businesses based in our home country don't have to worry about taxes in Thailand.  Business income is generally only taxed in the country where the business is physically located, and that is clearly stated in my county's tax treaty with Thailand.

[Presnock]

53 minutes ago, Phillip9 said:

 

Those of us with businesses based in our home country don't have to worry about taxes in Thailand.  Business income is generally only taxed in the country where the business is physically located, and that is clearly stated in my county's tax treaty with Thailand.

But the new Thai taxclaws say that even if the money is earned outside of Thailand, if it brought or sent into Thailand then it is taxable (unless of course one's DTA is specific about that earned income).  Previously, as long as it was not brought into Thailand in the same year that it was earned, then it was not taxed.  

[DrJack54]

Off topic posts regarding taxation will be removed.

 

[RoninTech]

20 hours ago, Liquorice said:

Just border runs every 180 days for a new 180 day entry.

Of course, I would assume you will have to provide evidence on each entry of the reason.
For digital nomads/remote workers I would imagine the same portfolio as used for the initial DTV.
For the softer options, a letter of appointment or booking for a class.

I've entered twice on my 5 year "approved for remote work but no intention to work" DTV with no questions asked.  No proof of income was required, just 500K THB in my Canadian account, certificate of incorporation of my 2-person (me and wife) Canadian tech corp. and a letter from my company CEO (me) saying I have permission to work remotely anywhere.  Wife has also entered twice with no questions (follower on my DTV).  The questions will come if you try to extend at an immigration office with their unique rules.  We both switched from our retirement non-o's as the DTV fits our situation so much better.  Plan is to stay below 180 days in '24 and '25 and observe.  Can always switch back to non-o retirement if there is an issue with DTV.  🙂

[DrJack54]

16 minutes ago, RoninTech said:

....certificate of incorporation of my 2-person (me and wife) Canadian tech corp. and a letter from my company CEO (me) saying I have permission to work remotely anywhere

I'm jealous springs to mind.

 

The fact that you genuinely have a company and can easily provide that side of the application paperwork made it simple.

Guessing  various agents will have a get around for that part for those that do not. 

 

 

[Rob Browder]

22 hours ago, Phillip9 said:

 

Why would you assume that?  No other visa requires anything remotely similar.  

 

So you think immigration is going to start denying people entry without warning if they aren't carrying all the documents they used to apply for the visa?  Absolutely ridiculous.

We have seen immigration "invalidate" METV Visas - telling folks they cannot use their visa any more. 

If going with the DTV, I would budget for an "agent fee" per entry - similar to those using serial visa-exempt entries pay.  

If Immigration Do NOT start throwing up "agent-payoff or hassle" roadblocks, be pleasantly surprised and carry-on - spending that money into the Thai economy, where all "agent fees" would otherwise be spent.

[Scouse123]

4 hours ago, itsari said:

You need to show proof of foreign income from clients abroad .

How would a person retired in Thailand manage that if they wish to change to a DTV visa ?

To Mr confused, you need to show a portfolio of work history to show you are a free lancer or demonstrate your profesional activities.

The visas purpose is to remote workers and not tourists or retired people either

 

 

Soft power visa for either catering/cooking or music/live venue promotions.

 

I have skills, experience and resume in both. Long time ago now I agree, but kept relevant documents.

[Scouse123]

A big question I have for any of you guys that have switched from retirement extensions to DTV, did you wait until your retirement extension had fully expired, or did you apply successfully before the expiry date of your extension??????

 

Lastly, did you apply in home country or over this way, in a neighbouring country, such as Laos or Cambodia? 

 

@DrJack54 I think this could possibly have relevance to us.

 

Incidentally, as well as qualifying for the soft power visa on the grounds of catering or live music, I go every few months to get a voice prosthesis changed by a doctor in Khonkaen hospital. I have regular appointments and proof of this.

 

This is a medical procedure which requires an experienced ENT doctor to do it, and will be necessary for life, I suppose I could request a visa on these terms? 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 11 by Scouse123

[RoninTech]

11 minutes ago, Scouse123 said:

A big question I have for any of you guys that have switched from retirement extensions to DTV, did you wait until your retirement extension had fully expired, or did you apply successfully before the expiry date of your extension??????

 

Lastly, did you apply in home country or over this way, in a neighbouring country, such as Laos or Cambodia? 

We applied for non-o retirement visas in late July while in Canada.  At the time, we had no active visa as we did not get a re-entry permit for our previous non-o's.  The day after we were approved for our non-o's, the YouTube video from Retired Working For You (RW4U) that explained a lot of the mystery behind the DTV came out and we realized it was perfect for us.  We called the Vancouver consulate and they told us to re-apply for the DTV and they'd let us switch if approved or stay on the non-o's if declined.  I immediately applied for the DTV and 2 hours later I was approved and the next day so was my wife. 

 

All this happened while we were in Canada.

 

EDIT:  Apologies, just realized you said "switched from retirement extension".  We had been approved for the 90 day non-o and were not yet on an extension.  Our previous non-o retirement extensions had lapsed as we didn't get re-entry permits.

Edited November 11 by RoninTech

[khunPer]

On 11/9/2024 at 2:45 PM, tgw said:

I've had a non-B for over 10 years and now comes the time where I should probably switch to either a retirement visa or DTV.

 

I read DTV isn't a non-imm visa type, so I could run into problems doing things that typically require a non-imm, such as renewing my driving licenses.

 

What would you say are the pros and cons of each ?

In my view you should not change visa, but just change the reason for extension of stay from "work/business" to "retirement". It's relative easy with retirement-extension if you can afford the 800k baht in a Thai bank account, and you don't need to leave the Kingdom and re-enter to extend you stay.

The benefit with the new visa is that you don't need funds locked in a Thai bank account. The con is that you cannot stay more than 180+180 days without leaving the country.

Re. DL: One shall have a Thai DL when staying longer than 3 month and (of course) driving; so, no change there.

[itsari]

1 hour ago, Scouse123 said:

A big question I have for any of you guys that have switched from retirement extensions to DTV, did you wait until your retirement extension had fully expired, or did you apply successfully before the expiry date of your extension??????

 

Lastly, did you apply in home country or over this way, in a neighbouring country, such as Laos or Cambodia? 

 

@DrJack54 I think this could possibly have relevance to us.

 

Incidentally, as well as qualifying for the soft power visa on the grounds of catering or live music, I go every few months to get a voice prosthesis changed by a doctor in Khonkaen hospital. I have regular appointments and proof of this.

 

This is a medical procedure which requires an experienced ENT doctor to do it, and will be necessary for life, I suppose I could request a visa on these terms? 

 

 

 

 

 

Wishfull thinking 

[Scouse123]

33 minutes ago, itsari said:

Wishfull thinking 

 

 

You seem bitter and very quick to trash ideas when there is an overwhelming amount of information pointing to the opposite of what you are saying.

 

That includes people on retirement extensions who have already switched, so where is your proof that it is wishful thinking?

 

Or is it just sour grapes?

 

Recently, a woman got one for a week-long intensive cookery course!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited November 11 by Scouse123

[Scouse123]

50 minutes ago, khunPer said:

In my view you should not change visa, but just change the reason for extension of stay from "work/business" to "retirement". It's relative easy with retirement-extension if you can afford the 800k baht in a Thai bank account, and you don't need to leave the Kingdom and re-enter to extend you stay.

The benefit with the new visa is that you don't need funds locked in a Thai bank account. The con is that you cannot stay more than 180+180 days without leaving the country.

Re. DL: One shall have a Thai DL when staying longer than 3 month and (of course) driving; so, no change there.

 

 

The six-month rule would be of no issue to me as I like to get out of here every six months for a few days. For those that don't, they can apply for a further 180 days at their local immigration office.

 

A Thai driving license is of no consequence to me either, I've just renewed for five years.

 

I love the no locking funds, why should we keep 800K permanently (more or less) in the bank when a DTV allows you to use outside funds with no such restriction AND a far lower limit of 500K.

 

ICING ON THE CAKE, NO YEARLY REPORTING FOR NEW RETIREMENT EXTENSION NOR APPLYING FOR RE-ENTRY PERMITS.

 

 

[NanLaew]

I am married, been here forever and have used marriage extensions and retirement extensions. Most recently, I used the 1-year multi-entry Non-O (spouse) from Savanakhet. With both passports needing renewing within the next 4 months, I have been taking advantage of the current 60-day visa-exempt entry. After I renew the passports, I will be looking at a long-term visa.

 

I am out of the country about 6-8 months of the year on regional offshore work, with my contracts assigned out of a global agency's Perth WA office. I don't work in Thailand.

 

I am not sure if I would qualify for the DTV under the 'workation' but as a working professional based in Thailand, maybe it's feasible? Although I'm British and my contracts are issued out of Australia, it may be possible for the visa support letter to be issued by their UK office. I would apply while I am in the UK, just after my passport renewal.

 

Possible?