Lax Law Enforcement Cited for Alarming Road Fatalities in Thailand

[Nickcage49]

The police are largely absent here. I see crimes committed in plain sight and they do nothing.

[herfiehandbag]

I noticed yesterday a new (to me at least) police outfit/livery escorting the obligatory VIP van towards Chiang Rai Airport, en route no doubt for the midday flight to Bangkok, after a weekend in the Casinos of the Golden Triangle.

 

Previously it was "Highway Patrol" cars in maroon and beige.

 

Now it is silver cars, marked as "Police Commandos"!

[kimothai]

I've read so many articles about the dangerous roads in Thailand and that they need to do this and that.  Nothing ever happens.  I quit reading these articles about roads.  It was like that before I got here and will like that long after I'm gone.......sadly!

[bigt3116]

6 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

On reality the death rate is much higher than the daily 48. That is because Thailand counts only the deaths at the scene, not those who died on the way or later in hospitals.

 

Bar stool myth

 

In Thailand, a road death is classified according to internationally accepted definitions, which generally refer to any death resulting from injuries sustained in a road traffic crash. Specifically:

Official Classification: A road death includes any person who dies either immediately or within 30 days of a road traffic crash as a result of injuries sustained in that crash.

Practical Challenges in Reporting:

Underreporting: In practice, there may be discrepancies in recording road deaths due to delays in medical care, incomplete data collection, or misclassification of causes of death.
Some deaths that occur outside the initial crash scene, such as at a hospital or later at home, might not always be attributed to the original crash in some records.
 

[Rampant Rabbit]

6 hours ago, Aussie999 said:

Just maybe, those speed limits aren't to annoy you, but to protect the public from you... I'm sure you like thailand, because of the almost no limitations... but hey, they do account for over 25,000 deaths, every year, and that's only those who die, on the road, not once put into an ambulance, or from injuries once in hospital.... but hey, I'm glad you are happy.

• Insufficient evidence

  A 2018 report found that while accident rates tended to fall in 20mph zones, the same was true of comparator zones that remained at 30mph. The report also concluded that there was insufficient evidence to judge whether the 20mph limit reduced casualties. 

   

   
• Police say they don't have evidence

  In September 2023, North Wales Police said they didn't have evidence that the 20mph speed limit had reduced casualties. 

   

   
•  

[NoDisplayName]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

On average, the country registers around 48 road deaths daily.

 

But those are only the victims that expire at the scene of the accident.

 

Anyone so much as loaded into an ambulance retaining a faint pulse, and then passing, is not counted in the road death sadistics.

[quake]

53 minutes ago, Nickcage49 said:

The police are largely absent here. I see crimes committed in plain sight and they do nothing.

 

Well,  they are hardly going to arrest themselves,  are they. 

[Rampant Rabbit]

6 hours ago, edwinchester said:

Maybe you can tell my Thai wife why you're in favour of lax law enforcement on Thai roads. Her brother was helping at the scene of an accident when he was killed by a speeding drunk driver. Clung on to life for a week in ICU before succumbing to horrific injuries. His mother attempted suicide whilst grieving for her dead son.

sure, it  will end up in a  wholly nanny state where ridiculous over the top measures are introduced on  society often only with the sole result of increasing income for the state.......amongst other things. Ask the Welsh how they enjoy theuir 20mph speed limit...............which theyre now slowly  starting to remove and the cost of millions to change all the road signs, money that couldve been better spent. If you want that in Thailand  good for you. I dont.

What youll get down the line is stuff like the ridiculous Welsh speed  limit, half a million people signed a  petition against it...........ignored, Wales has a population of just 3million

Edited yesterday at 07:19 AM by Rampant Rabbit

[newbee2022]

1 hour ago, bigt3116 said:

 

Bar stool myth

 

In Thailand, a road death is classified according to internationally accepted definitions, which generally refer to any death resulting from injuries sustained in a road traffic crash. Specifically:

Official Classification: A road death includes any person who dies either immediately or within 30 days of a road traffic crash as a result of injuries sustained in that crash.

Practical Challenges in Reporting:

Underreporting: In practice, there may be discrepancies in recording road deaths due to delays in medical care, incomplete data collection, or misclassification of causes of death.
Some deaths that occur outside the initial crash scene, such as at a hospital or later at home, might not always be attributed to the original crash in some records.
 

🥱🥱🥱Thai reality is different🥳

[cardinalblue]

8 hours ago, kwilco said:

so that's you cure for Thailand's road safety problems - a sweeping racist generalisation?

I try to stay away from saying Thai drivers this or that but I have been driving in Thailand over 20 years. I can say that I put poor drivers in the 20-25% of all drivers on the roads. Don't know if Thai or foreigner but I observe daily road violations from minor to major to poor judgement errors...Never have seen enforcement proactively to concurrently happening...So the drivers go unpunished thus will continue these illegal/poor decisions in their future behaviours..

 

What Thai police need to do is make a list of top ten most dangerous driving behaviours and enforce..Can be done but the lack of will, lack of police training and providing the necessary resources to accomplish the mission. 

 

The culture refuses to accept how bad driving behaviours are in this country....That is the first step 

[jcmj]

While I agree with the other comments I also know that there are many foreign idiots driving around with no clue about the laws. And like some Thais they don’t care and know that the police are not out patrolling. 

[chilli42]

There is no enforcement of the road safety laws at all as far as I can see. Many think it’s about driver education. Sure that will help a bit but it’s not a solution. People respect what you inspect. A diligent focus on enforcement of the existing laws will get driver attention and compliance.  I have no clue what the the police here do (beyond directing traffic)  if it’s not about enforcing the law.

[cardinalblue]

39 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

sure, it  will end up in a  wholly nanny state where ridiculous over the top measures are introduced on  society often only with the sole result of increasing income for the state.......amongst other things. Ask the Welsh how they enjoy theuir 20mph speed limit...............which theyre now slowly  starting to remove and the cost of millions to change all the road signs, money that couldve been better spent. If you want that in Thailand  good for you. I dont.

What youll get down the line is stuff like the ridiculous Welsh speed  limit, half a million people signed a  petition against it...........ignored, Wales has a population of just 3million

You are comparing apples and oranges and cherry picking one particular bad example to a culture that goes completely unregulated and unenforced on their roads..Targeted and practical enforcement needs to start. You can also throw in an improved road infrastructure like eliminating face to face u-turns and putting smart signals instead of u turns on heavy volume road with speed limits of 90 Km...craziness.....Thai road infrastructure today mirrors the 1950's...It has nothing to do with being a nanny state but rather Thai authorities don't want to spend/invest the money necessary to reduce accidents/near accidents. 

[kwilco]

8 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

On reality the death rate is much higher than the daily 48. That is because Thailand counts only the deaths at the scene, not those who died on the way or later in hospitals.

Every time someone tries to say this - they are WRONG! - there is no time limit set for accounting for road deaths - where do you think they got the statistics from???

Edited yesterday at 09:03 AM by kwilco

[kwilco]

3 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

I have never seen anyone pulled over for speeding or recklessness

Why would you? Would you stop and ask?

I understand you are such a perfect driver and would never have been stopped, not even s speeding ticket - but that doesn't make you a good judge of the 40 million or so road users in Thailand.

[Andycoops]

Law enforcement is a joke here full stop.

My Thai uncle had to pay 20,000 baht for the police to arrest a man in our village who had committed several burglaries.

Despite several villagers also joining the case.

He spent 2 days in the local cells and was released.

A truely corrupt and pathetic police force.

[kwilco]

1 hour ago, cardinalblue said:

I try to stay away from saying Thai drivers this or that but I have been driving in Thailand over 20 years. I can say that I put poor drivers in the 20-25% of all drivers on the roads. Don't know if Thai or foreigner but I observe daily road violations from minor to major to poor judgement errors...Never have seen enforcement proactively to concurrently happening...So the drivers go unpunished thus will continue these illegal/poor decisions in their future behaviours..

 

What Thai police need to do is make a list of top ten most dangerous driving behaviours and enforce..Can be done but the lack of will, lack of police training and providing the necessary resources to accomplish the mission. 

 

The culture refuses to accept how bad driving behaviours are in this country....That is the first step

 

Like most people, you are looking at it from the wrong angle
Worldwide, most accidents are caused as a result of "human error" - but you need to understand what that actually is.
Human error is for all practical purposes a constant - the same in any country.
Road Safety is a public health issue and has to be dealt with by the authorities.

 

To get a realistic viewpoint of road safety in Thailand you can't just rely on personal, anecdotal evidence as it is too full on cognitive errors.
This is the problem with most opinions expressed on Thai rod safety - they are based on the premise "I drive so I must be an "expert"".

then they decide they have a single solution - they pick out some issue they see as "wrong" and try to imply that is "they" did something about it everthing would be OK or improve - they are fai;ing to understand the full picture - as are the media and local authorities.

I too have been driving for over 20 years in Thailand and have driven extensively in Europe Australia as well as America and even Morocco. The length of time I've been driving and the mileage covered would put be above the average Thai driver.
This is only important if it is accompanied with a good knowledge of road safety and how it works. This is not guaranteed by just "driving" - you need to understand the statistics and the theory behind road safety and it is NOT just about driving - that is the first mistake commentators make.
Also people talk about Thai driving in some kind of universal sweeping tones - this is of course racist but wildly inaccurate. Half the vehicles on Thai roads are 2-wheelers - if you are in a 4-wheeled vehicle you re statistically LESS likely to die than in a 4-wheeled vehicle in the States - yet so many people accuse Thai drivers of being "the worst". They are of course just making assumptions based on their own cognitive biases.
Most Thai drivers are experienced at driving in  Thailand, most foreigners aren’t and they are culturally unaware and inept as well.

  

 

Edited yesterday at 09:35 AM by kwilco

[kwilco]

Many people either don't understand why or try to deny that their comments on road safety in Thailand are basically racist. All you need to do is review the use of the third person plural - a typical racist trope. ..with the overuse of the third person plural ("they," "them," "their") in racist discourse they attempt to generalize and dehumanize groups of people. This rhetorical strategy can create a sense of "othering," portraying the targeted group as monolithic and distinct from the speaker or their intended audience.

Edited yesterday at 10:34 AM by kwilco

[geisha]

12 hours ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

Having spent 4  months in the UK and seeing the ridiculous speed limits especially in Wales where you can go from 60mph (100kmh) to 20mph (32kmh)  then to 40mph to 60mph in the space of a few hundred yards and  for going over that by 4mph = ticket and 4500 baht fine + 3  points on licence Im ALL for a  lax  approach and long.........long may it continue.

Many of the speeding laws are there to catch the total moron driver who goes fast past a  school at 4pm and ends up catching the guy doing 10-20mph  over at 3am in the morning.

The real problem is not the speed its the total an utter lack of concentration.

Anyway I for one  hope it doesnt become like Europe..............just re taxed the car yet again with unpaid speeding tickets.

What a ridiculous post. Why don’t you compare the 1700 deaths a year on UK roads to the 18 000 in Thailand ? The rules are there to save lives. 
thailand must start from the beginning with obligatory driving lessons, real driving tests, big fines and confiscation of cars/ bikes/ taxis and tucs and especially lorries and buses . Regular safety checks , speed limits, cameras that work on every crossing, manned pedestrian crossings , the list is long. 
It’s not only the 18000 lives that are taken, but the ones who do not die at the scene ! This is not reported in Thailand , devastating life long disability, families ruined and their rice and soup taken away. Poverty. Thailand is still living in the dark ages where driving is concerned.

Shame on all the countries leaders , politicians, authorities, who have NEVER lifted a little finger to stop this. 

[giog]

I see a lot of indifference on Thai roads: you should drive in the left lane but a very high percentage of vehicles with four or more wheels, including the police, travel in the overtaking lane. You honk and flash them and they put on their right indicator to let you know that they are staying there, forcing you to overtake them incorrectly and risk finding a car that is driving regularly. They fine those who do not wear a helmet but I have never seen cars stopped and fined for driving in the overtaking lane...!

[kingstonkid]

On 11/18/2024 at 4:29 AM, Phil1964 said:

Most Thais, sorry, but they're idiotic drivers with an insane belief that Buddha will be giving them a better life if they wrap their vehicle round a lamp post or into a ditch and kill themselves off.

Education is poor, life is cheap, cars can be poorly maintained and still allowed on the roads, Thai males all think they're the next F1 world chumpion.

 

 

The easiest way to educate is for police to enforce the rules.  The basr place to start is outside schools. Limit the number of kids on a bike.  Mandate helmets and if jids aren't wearing them confiscate the bike until they show up with a helmet and purchase receipt 

 

That is where you will make the most impact pulling somchai over slapping his wrist is not going to make a point.

[kwilco]

Lots of posts insulting the Thai people, showing that the poster knows nothing about road safety or even how to drive themselves.

[transam]

4 minutes ago, kwilco said:

Lots of posts insulting the Thai people, showing that the poster knows nothing about road safety or even how to drive themselves.

You have no idea regarding the Thai poor driving habits, they are untrained with limited policing to keep them in some sort of road use sensibility.

 

After being here driving for a very long time, I should know..😬

 

But you carry on covering for them...........

[Rampant Rabbit]

22 hours ago, geisha said:

What a ridiculous post. Why don’t you compare the 1700 deaths a year on UK roads to the 18 000 in Thailand ? The rules are there to save lives. 
thailand must start from the beginning with obligatory driving lessons, real driving tests, big fines and confiscation of cars/ bikes/ taxis and tucs and especially lorries and buses . Regular safety checks , speed limits, cameras that work on every crossing, manned pedestrian crossings , the list is long. 
It’s not only the 18000 lives that are taken, but the ones who do not die at the scene ! This is not reported in Thailand , devastating life long disability, families ruined and their rice and soup taken away. Poverty. Thailand is still living in the dark ages where driving is concerned.

Shame on all the countries leaders , politicians, authorities, who have NEVER lifted a little finger to stop this. 

whats more stupid getting to a "reasonable level" cuz  the UK is aiming for ZERO deaths and just like zero emnissions it wont happen............unless they put square wheels  on cars which they may as well do as the rate speed limits are gping the man with the red flag will be  passing you. Its over the top and uneccesary 

[Rampant Rabbit]

23 hours ago, kwilco said:

Many people either don't understand why or try to deny that their comments on road safety in Thailand are basically racist. All you need to do is review the use of the third person plural - a typical racist trope. ..with the overuse of the third person plural ("they," "them," "their") in racist discourse they attempt to generalize and dehumanize groups of people. This rhetorical strategy can create a sense of "othering," portraying the targeted group as monolithic and distinct from the speaker or their intended audience.

get over yourself  looking for nonsense when none is there, go join Jing Thing , youd  make a great couple.

[kwilco]

32 minutes ago, Rampant Rabbit said:

get over yourself  looking for nonsense when none is there, go join Jing Thing , youd  make a great couple.

Road Safety Misconceptions; here are some myths that need exploding

 

A Public Health Perspective on Road Safety

Thailand’s road safety crisis stems from rapid industrialization, increased vehicle ownership, and a lack of informed policymaking. To address this, a paradigm shift is needed: viewing road safety as a public health issue and adopting a "Safe System" approach, which has proven effective globally.

 

Here are some of the most common misconceptions about road safety in Thailand

Commentators overestimate their own driving skills
Most drivers, especially foreigners in Thailand, overestimate their own abilities while criticizing others. This phenomenon, highlighted by the Dunning-Kruger effect, reveals widespread misjudgement of personal competence.

 

Foreign Drivers and Cultural Bias
Foreigners often blame Thai drivers for road safety issues, perceiving themselves as superior. This reflects a global tendency for drivers to see themselves as "above average," exacerbating stereotypes and ignoring shared responsibilities.

 

Self-Centred Judgments
Many drivers consider slower vehicles as "idiots" and faster ones as "maniacs," demonstrating subjective perceptions rather than objective assessments of driving behaviour.

 

Misplaced Arrogance
Some foreign drivers view campaigns and road safety measures as unnecessary for themselves, believing accidents are caused solely by others. This mindset hinders collective progress in improving road safety.

 

Human Universality in Driving Errors
Thai drivers are no less capable than drivers in other nations. Historical data shows high death rates during phases of increased vehicle ownership in Europe and the U.S., illustrating that Thailand's situation is part of a broader global pattern.

 

Accidents Aren’t Random
Most crashes result from minor human errors, not reckless behaviour. The aftermath of such errors—determined by road design, emergency response, and vehicle safety—significantly influences survival rates.

 

Driving Doesn’t Equal Expertise
Road safety is a broader concept encompassing road user behaviour and infrastructure. Being a skilled driver (or not!) doesn’t necessarily translate to an understanding of systemic safety issues.

 

Anger on the Road Signals Risk
Persistent anger or frustration with other road users may indicate that someone is unfit to drive safely.

 

Comparative Risk Perceptions
Driving a car in Thailand is statistically as safe as in the U.S., with vulnerable road users like motorcyclists and pedestrians accounting for 80% of fatalities.

 

The plural of Anecdote isn’t Data
Individual experiences can’t substitute for robust data analysis when forming opinions about road safety.

 

Beware of Confirmation Bias
Many drivers interpret information to confirm their existing beliefs, leading to distorted perceptions of road safety issues.

 

Avoid False Logic – e.g. false syllogisms
Misinterpreting connections between unrelated facts undermines rational understanding. Logical fallacies often distort discussions around road safety.

 

Statistics Need Context
Data on road safety, such as fatalities or crash rates, require careful analysis to derive meaningful insights. Misinterpretation of numbers can lead to flawed conclusions.

 

Diverse Metrics of Road Safety
Measuring road safety involves multiple statistics: vehicle kilometres travelled (VKT), deaths per 100,000 vehicles, crash types, weather impacts, and more. Focusing on the usual single measure (deaths per 100k pop) gives an incomplete picture.

 

Economic Impact of Crashes
Road traffic crashes cost Thailand 3–5% of its GDP annually, underlining the need for systemic reform.

 

Incomplete Data Reporting
Road death statistics in Thailand come from diverse sources like hospitals, police, and insurers. Inconsistent reporting hampers accurate analysis, while crash investigations remain inadequate.

 

Key Data Sources
Multiple agencies contribute to crash data in Thailand, including the Royal Thai Police, Ministry of Transport, and Ministry of Public Health. Integration and transparency in data sharing are critical for improvement.

 

The Safe System’s “5 Es”
Effective road safety strategies require a comprehensive approach, encompassing:

Education: Raising awareness among road users.

Enforcement: Strengthening laws and their application.

Engineering: Designing safer roads and vehicles.

Emergency: Improving response systems.

Evaluation: Continuously assessing interventions.

 

Shared Responsibility
Blaming drivers alone ignores systemic flaws. Viewing roads as workplaces highlights the need for preventive measures, emphasizing that crashes are avoidable.

Cultural Context and Solutions
Discussions of "Thai driving culture" often border on stereotyping. A better metaphor is likening road behaviour to navigating a river, where adaptability and shared responsibility ensure safety.

 

To conclude…

Thailand must adopt evidence-based reforms to align with global best practices in road safety. Key actions include:

• Implementing the Safe System's "5 Es."
• Strengthening governance, including a separation of legislative, executive, and judicial powers.
• Reinvesting in road infrastructure and safety measures.
• Not listening to the nape of the neck arguments of ageing expats, uninformed media and politicians

 

To build political will, citizens must demand safer roads and reject the "blame and shame" approach. A Safe System recognizes that human errors are inevitable but preventable deaths and serious injuries are not acceptable. Creating safer environments requires a societal commitment to shared responsibility, systemic reforms, and prioritizing public health over punitive measures.

 

[kwilco]

51 minutes ago, transam said:

You have no idea regarding the Thai poor driving habits, they are untrained with limited policing to keep them in some sort of road use sensibility.

 

After being here driving for a very long time, I should know..😬

 

But you carry on covering for them...........

"After being here driving for a very long time, I should know" - but, as ever you don't -  totally  out of touch - I look forward to a post from you that actually has a modicum of reason or logic - but the years indicate otherwise.

Edited 1 hour ago by kwilco

[transam]

2 minutes ago, kwilco said:

"After being here driving for a very long time, I should know" - but, as ever you don't -  totally  out of touch - I look forward to a post from you that actually has a modicum of reason or logic - but the years indicate otherwise.

Yet again, you are mistaken, plus, you are a Thai apologist, nothing more, nothing less.....

[kwilco]

16 minutes ago, transam said:

a Thai apologist,

Whatever that may be!