Report Norway Halts Income Letters at Thai Embassy; Retirees Affected

[sandyf]

13 hours ago, gamb00ler said:

The transfers actually don't establish a 'positive net income'.  I'll wager that somewhere someone is simply recycling the monthly transfers every 2-3 months.  The fees become annoying but significantly reduce the cash float required to create the 'proof' of monthly transfers.

Nothing more than an ill thought out assumption. You seem to overlook that some offices may want to see info on the source provider.   eg pension document.

Anyone in difficulty is more likely to turn to an agent than mess about sending money back and fore.

[jerrymahoney]

1 hour ago, EVENKEEL said:

Everyone's situation is different. Agents will always be around. What you call corruption is simply a way of life here. Everyone gets a piece of the pie.

If using an agent in lieu of the below was legal, you wouldn't need an agent.

[Thingamabob]

On 5/26/2025 at 9:15 AM, JoePai said:

Explain .....

Maybe most foreigners have had enough loose talk about tax.

[harryviking]

20 hours ago, BrandonJT said:

They absolutely, 100% will NOT accept any document from you.  There are only TWO options to use income for retirement extension:

 

1) Embassy certified income

2) Proof of 12 months of international transfers of at least 65,000 baht per month in your Thai bank account.

If you still wish to use your income after they stop issuing the letter, start making plans now.  Start the international transfers into your Thai bank account each and every month.  The beginning of the month is better to help avoid any potential issues with transfer delays and such.

I guess starting early to transfere 65k every month seems like a good idea. Will ofcourse have a chat with my local Immigration Office. They are quite helpful and service-minded. (Korat).

[Hummin]

1 minute ago, harryviking said:

I guess starting early to transfere 65k every month seems like a good idea. Will ofcourse have a chat with my local Immigration Office. They are quite helpful and service-minded. (Korat).

You need to put 65k every month, not 30k one and for the next 105k

 

They looking at each month transfer, and not the total. 

 

It would have been so much better if they looked at the total for me, not each month. 

[EVENKEEL]

17 minutes ago, jerrymahoney said:

If using an agent in lieu of the below was legal, you wouldn't need an agent.

That extension in my passport is just as legit whether I do myself or an agent works his magic. 

[Surasak]

On 5/26/2025 at 10:23 AM, JoePai said:

Fair enough but when you complete your Tax return................... ?

When Thai Immigration first asked for Embassy Letters of confirmation of income, foreigners were NOT required to submit tax returns!

How then was it possible to imply, it was done for tax purposes??? I suggest you go back under your bridge and have another think on your postings.

[jerrymahoney]

4 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

That extension in my passport is just as legit whether I do myself or an agent works his magic. 

True. You go through that 'plausible deniability' routine so the IMM official whose signature is in your passport can say ""Money -- what money?"

[Rob Browder]

4 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

Ok, there is one thing here, that you don´t understand. The so called income letter, was not a proof of money. It was just a confirmation by yourself that your embassy blindly put a stamp on. Many people took advantage of this, but now their lies are biting them in their arse. Totally justified!

Most people were not willing to commit a felony by lying on an income affidavit - and many countries embassies which no longer issue them DID check the documentation - were legally allowed to do this, whereas the USA law doesn't permit consulate-staff to do this.  

 

The only people being "bitten" are HONEST people - not those who merely switched to immigration's agent-partners - the only logical-reason why Thai-Immigration initiated this issue with the USA/Australia/UK, some years back.  Norway's recent decision is a separate issue -  no indication Thai immigration were involved - but note they did verify the documents / income.

 

4 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

Another thing you say, that amazes me, is that now some folks have to transfer back money to cover expenses at home. I just have one advice for that. If living on such small margins, then it´s the right choice to stay back in home country instead. This is not sarcasm. It´s only a way to protect people from doing things they actually have no buffer for if something happens.

Where "small margins" means having multiples more than required to live here comfortably in a condo?   The last place one would want to be on a smaller limited income is a country where living expenses are multiples higher.  Why would anyone want to live poor in the West, vs live well here - as their spent-money also employs multiple Thai people?  It's a "win-win" for all concerned.  

 

Of course one needs to have a "buffer" of cash (here, or in one's home-account) to cover an emergency departure, but that is a fraction of what is demanded to avoid being forced to an agent.  Also, a sane person will have health-insurance, or a fund for this, if too old to get it.

[Rob Browder]

55 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Nothing more than an ill thought out assumption. You seem to overlook that some offices may want to see info on the source provider.   eg pension document.

Anyone in difficulty is more likely to turn to an agent than mess about sending money back and fore.

Some offices have agent service - others do not.  Some offices demand "source" documents, which they cannot verify, so could be photo-shopped - as usual, Immigration's actions are only targeting honest / no-agent applicants.  

 

Though, I do agree that most folks choose agent-service over transfer-hassles, given agents are available where the majority of foreigners live.

[Gottfrid]

36 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

The only people being "bitten" are HONEST people

Nope, nobody is bitten anywhere. Just show the dough and you can stay! But, people have been thinking everlasting freedom and stupidly believed this is not happening to me. But now free, went out the door and dom, became doom. So in short. Bad <deleted> happens to people that can´t see the future because they are drunk on the present.
 

36 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

Where "small margins" means having multiples more than required to live here comfortably in a condo?

Have you read the sad threads about economy and how much members here spend per month? There you get a little wink of the small margins 😂

[Rob Browder]

31 minutes ago, Gottfrid said:

Nope, nobody is bitten anywhere. Just show the dough and you can stay!

Pay the agent, and you can stay even easier.  That is how they operate here.

 

33 minutes ago, Gottfrid said:

Have you read the sad threads about economy and how much members here spend per month? There you get a little wink of the small margins 

Feel free to link to one, and we can continue this discussion there.  Bottom-line figures: Condo rent starts ~5K (cheap 'rooms' less).  Elec water w/ reasonable air-con use  under 2K.  Order food delivered-free from Makro / Lotus - costs more if you want a bunch of imports, but very inexpensive if you LIKE Thai food (which is better than most). 

All the rest is extra - eating out, bars, travel - whatever floats their boat.  Total spend "on the cheap" is still multiple Thai salaries.

Surplus to the crazy 65K can be invested back-home, also - much wiser, economically, than spending it all to "live" (exist) back there.

 

[jerrymahoney]

25 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

Surplus to the crazy 65K can be invested back-home, also - much wiser, economically, than spending it all to "live" (exist) back there.

NB the 65K+ baht monthly and 800K baht yearly required for retirement extensions is the same going back to at least JAN 2008.

[NanLaew]

13 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

A don´t expect everyone who use an agent to be broke. Only the ones that complain. You don´t need that, as you have the money. The ones who complain use the agent for no need to show money.

 

From what I understand, you and many others, adhere to the immigration rules regarding proof of income without recourse to an agent.

 

So, what exactly are YOU complaining about?

[norsurin]

3 hours ago, OJAS said:

 

So what about the equally - if not considerably more - stupid rules which the powers-that-be back in your home country no doubt impose on Thai nationals who want to settle there?

If a thai want to live here after marriage my government only require income from the husband and roof over theit heads.Thais get workingpermit and can start business if they want.Every 2 year renewal of their visa without any problems .Don't have to shove money and report every 3 months.The first 3 years they only allowed to be in Thailand for 7 months.They earning pension from day one when they start working.Compared to Thailand their salary is wery high here 

 

[Felt 35]

The ambassador answers about the income confirmation

We got an interview with the ambassador during the May 17 National day celebration in Pattaya, when she came to give the speech for the day.

 

Most of the talk was about the issue of the income confirmation, which we are getting a lot of inquiries from readers about at the moment.

 

The embassy has announced that they will stop issuing income confirmation to Norwegians living in Thailand from May next year.

 

"This was made known to Norwegians in Thailand via a Facebook message from you on 29 April, while the embassy's ordinary premises were still closed after the earthquake. Did this have anything to do with the earthquake on March 28?

 

"No, this has been planned for several years already.

 

Helle adds regarding the earthquake that it was a frightening experience for the employees. She herself was not present on March 28, but the employees experienced major damage to the premises and the building swayed heavily, she says.

 

She wants some sympathy for the employees, who had to work from home and from the ambassador's residence in the period until the embassy's premises reopened on 7 May. She says that they made a great effort during this period.

 

The building the embassy is located in is old, and there was ambiguity about the building standards that had been used. The ambassador did not want to take any chances until the building was declared safe.

 

"So the end of the issuance of income confirmation has to do with resources?"

 

"Yes, we have a certain number of people and a certain number of resources. It must be used for prioritised and statutory tasks.

 

– How about hiring another intern or a Thai employee, to take care of income verification, and instead increase the fee from 1000 to 2000 Baht?

 

"There are many things you would like to do, but you can't hire new people every time. We have to stick to statutory tasks and to other important tasks in the consular field. And income confirmations are not a consular task.

 

The ambassador says that this is a relationship between the Thai authorities and the individual Norwegian here. She points out that Thailand generally wants to attract resourceful foreign nationals, in order to increase income for the country, and that the country facilitates for many people to live here.

 

– Are you aware that many Norwegians do not live here all year round, but perhaps only 6-7 months, and that it then becomes problematic to have to transfer at least 65,000 Baht every month throughout the year to qualify for a residence permit?

 

"Yes, we are aware of this and other conditions, we have discussed this matter with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs for several years.

 

"What will it take for you and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to turn around in this case?"

 

"That probably won't happen," says Helle. "This decision has been made.

 

But she adds when asked that in general in life, you can never say never.

 

– Does the embassy read the questions that appear on Facebook messages you post and have you considered answering these questions?

 

"Yes, we read Facebook messages and other inquiries to the embassy. But we do not respond to individual cases on Facebook.

 

"But what about general questions?"

 

"We don't do that. But when we see that there are certain topics that occupy many people, we try to inform about this through posts so that this reaches as many people as possible. We also did the same when it comes to income confirmations.

 

The ambassador wants to point out two important points for Norwegians who come to Thailand.

 

"Even though Thailand is regarded as a peaceful holiday country, you should still use travel registration.

 

The scheme, which is voluntary, makes it easier for the Foreign Service to establish contact in the event of a crisis situation.

 

The second thing she points out is that tourists must be very careful to make sure that they are covered by travel insurance throughout their stay. She says that there are a lot of traffic accidents in Thailand, and many Norwegians are exposed to it.

[Gottfrid]

46 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

From what I understand, you and many others, adhere to the immigration rules regarding proof of income without recourse to an agent.

 

So, what exactly are YOU complaining about?

I am not complaining. Living the dream, dude!

[ChicagoExpat]

It's been interesting to watch the embassies slowly begin to push back against all the Thai bureaucratic nonsense.  The U.S. stopped income letters in 2019, and a bunch of other stupid crap that some random Thai official mandated that the Embassy should waste time on.

 

I hope they go after the marriage affidavit next and refuse to do that -- a huge waste of time and money.

[jaideedave]

17 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

You need to emphasize one thing.

You showed WISE transfers for 12 months.

That's all that was required.

The citizens of countries that do not provide income letter can show transfers. No problem 

In hindsight I suppose you are correct.I probably didn't need to show my gov't income tax file. Only the Kbank book deposits and the Wise monthly deposit slips. Thats all they ask for is proof of 65k deposits monthly. 

[DrJack54]

34 minutes ago, jaideedave said:

Only the Kbank book deposits and the Wise monthly deposit slips. Thats all they ask for is proof of 65k deposits monthly

That's correct. In fact you can just show 12 month bank statement from Kasikorn. 

Tip: request the statement in Thai language. 

[jerrymahoney]

Some office still ask for a "source of income" letter as per this -- 4. does not equal 3 and some use 'and' instead of 'or'.

 

[gamb00ler]

9 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

Ok, there is one thing here, that you don´t understand. The so called income letter, was not a proof of money. It was just a confirmation by yourself that your embassy blindly put a stamp on.

You shouldn't generalize how embassies/consultates perform their duties.  In my case, the CM Canadian consulate would only accept official pension benefit documents from US SSA and Service Canada as 'proof' of pension income when asked for the income letter.  I hardly call that 'blindly'.  Fortunately both US and Canada  make such documents easily available.

[jerrymahoney]

As I remember things, not only did the US Embassy know that a large portion of the affidavits were sworn falsely (per conversation with a consul I had at an outreach) but Thai Immigration all of a sudden realized that the US Embassy made no effort at all to confirm as to the income being sworn.

When Thai IMM told the US embassy they would have to so corroborate, the US said: Forget about it:

[WDSmart]

The USA did this over 10 years ago. All you need to do is show immigration that you are making deposits of over THB 65,000 in a Thai bank account each month. Your bank will give you the proof of that. 

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, Rob Browder said:

Some offices demand "source" documents, which they cannot verify, so could be photo-shopped - as usual, Immigration's actions are only targeting honest / no-agent applicants.  

Take it you never noticed over the years the US citizens posting how easy it was to get an income letter from their embassy.

[gamb00ler]

7 hours ago, OJAS said:

 

I was under the impression that most immigration offices were already accepting - nay insisting on - bank statements. And what an earth do you mean by "entitlement letters"?

 

The term entitlement is a synonym for benefit.  Recipients are entitled to their pension payments.

[gamb00ler]

6 hours ago, sandyf said:

You seem to overlook that some offices may want to see info on the source provider.   eg pension document

Do you think that repatriating funds implies that the extension applicant doesn't have documentation of income?

That's not a logical deduction.

 

If I choose to do repatriation of a portion of the 65K transfer for a retirement extension it would be to retain more of my investment income rather than accumulating funds in Thailand where investments are less secure and less productive.

[sandyf]

14 minutes ago, gamb00ler said:

Do you think that repatriating funds implies that the extension applicant doesn't have documentation of income?

That's not a logical deduction.

 

If I choose to do repatriation of a portion of the 65K transfer for a retirement extension it would be to retain more of my investment income rather than accumulating funds in Thailand where investments are less secure and less productive.

Rabbit hole comes to mind.

[BrandonJT]

7 hours ago, norsurin said:

If a thai want to live here after marriage my government only require income from the husband and roof over theit heads.Thais get workingpermit and can start business if they want.Every 2 year renewal of their visa without any problems .Don't have to shove money and report every 3 months.The first 3 years they only allowed to be in Thailand for 7 months.They earning pension from day one when they start working.Compared to Thailand their salary is wery high here 

 

What's your point? If a foreign woman comes to Thailand and marries a Thai man, most of this same applies.  There is no financial requirement as the husband is expected to provide for their wife, and they can apply for citizenship after a couple of years.  How many Thai men are going to your country after marrying women from there?

[gamb00ler]

3 hours ago, sandyf said:

Rabbit hole comes to mind.

Actually rat holing is a more appropriate term.  Non-gamblers will likely have to google that term.