Researchers found that, in the sunniest countries, solar costs as little as €0.023 to produce one unit of power.

Even in the UK, which sits 50 degrees north of the equator and is infamous for its dreary weather, solar came out victorious as the cheapest option for “large-scale energy generation”.

Due to the price of lithium-ion batteries falling by 89 per cent since 2010, the study also found that making solar-plus-storage systems is now equally as cost-effective as gas power plants.

https://www.euronews.com/green/2025/10/08/solar-energy-named-the-worlds-cheapest-power-source-what-it-means-for-europe

to the title ...

 

... no argument from me, and one of, if not, the best small investment I've made in the past 25 years.  

Thailand would be great for solar, but at less than 5 B/kW, is it worth it.

 

Someone should tell that to the Germans. They have a lot of solar and wind turbines and the most expensive electricity in Europe. In theory it may be cheaper, in real life it's not the case. When the sun is shining and the wind is blowing, they pay that other countries take the surplus they produce. At night they pay again to import electricity, because the moon is just not up to the task to power the many solar panels. That's probably the reason they are called solar panels and not moon panels. 

In OZ, every 4th house has solar

Saves me quite a bit my old bill was coming in at around 250/300$ per month now my grid tied system (no expensive battery) I’m running 20 / 30$ a month and that’s just the infrastructure fee it’s definitely working for me.now if we ever crack the battery problem it will really take off!!then we could use petroleum products for other purposes.

3 hours ago, still kicking said:

In OZ, every 4th house has solar

And some of highest electricity prices in the world.

10 hours ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Researchers found that, in the sunniest countries, solar costs as little as €0.023 to produce one unit of power.

Even in the UK, which sits 50 degrees north of the equator and is infamous for its dreary weather, solar came out victorious as the cheapest option for “large-scale energy generation”.

 

But sells to home owners for 25-35p per unit, while in Thailand I pay 10p per unit.

The cheapest costs 3x more in the UK.

2 hours ago, emptypockets said:

And some of highest electricity prices in the world.

Research has shown that gas prices have historically been a key driver in wholesale electricity prices rises. According to Griffith University, the historical correlation between gas prices and electricity prices was 0.9 over 2012-2021 and gas prices influenced 50%-90% of pricing intervals in the NEM. More recent analysis by CEIG also highlighted the correlation between gas prices and electricity prices.

Recent outages at coal-fired power stations have also been driving up wholesale prices, as highlighted by AEMO in Q4 2024 and Baringa. When these power stations have outages – which occur more frequently as they age – more expensive gas-powered generation will often be used to fill the gap. 

https://ieefa.org/resources/whats-really-driving-high-power-bills-hint-its-not-renewables-and-how-can-we-reduce-them

5 hours ago, still kicking said:

In OZ, every 4th house has solar

I read that there is too much solar power feeding into the grid in Australia. Apparently, it causes 'imbalance' as the flywheel effect of the power stations becomes overshadowed. The solution was to disconnect a certain number of domestic consumers/producers from feeding into the grid.

2 hours ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Research has shown that gas prices have historically been a key driver in wholesale electricity prices rises. According to Griffith University, the historical correlation between gas prices and electricity prices was 0.9 over 2012-2021 and gas prices influenced 50%-90% of pricing intervals in the NEM. More recent analysis by CEIG also highlighted the correlation between gas prices and electricity prices.

Recent outages at coal-fired power stations have also been driving up wholesale prices, as highlighted by AEMO in Q4 2024 and Baringa. When these power stations have outages – which occur more frequently as they age – more expensive gas-powered generation will often be used to fill the gap. 

https://ieefa.org/resources/whats-really-driving-high-power-bills-hint-its-not-renewables-and-how-can-we-reduce-them

Hardly surprising as the base load power stations have to run uneconomically to be available to make up for the shortfall in solar and wind at any given time. Most gas fired stations make more money on standby than they do generating.

Government policy is causing this - who in their right mind would pour money into an old assets when the government wants to shut them down? Of course you will have breakdowns.

Change the government and build more HELE coal fired stations.

Not as though coal is in short supply.

 

Looking forward to a government that drives policy from an economic standpoint and not pure ideology.

 

Ever noticed how new ' initiatives' are introduced shortly after Albanese returns from his visit to Xi in China?

 

Makes one wonder who is running the show.

1 hour ago, emptypockets said:

Hardly surprising as the base load power stations have to run uneconomically to be available to make up for the shortfall in solar and wind at any given time. Most gas fired stations make more money on standby than they do generating.

Government policy is causing this - who in their right mind would pour money into an old assets when the government wants to shut them down? Of course you will have breakdowns.

Change the government and build more HELE coal fired stations.

Not as though coal is in short supply.

 

Looking forward to a government that drives policy from an economic standpoint and not pure ideology.

 

Ever noticed how new ' initiatives' are introduced shortly after Albanese returns from his visit to Xi in China?

 

Makes one wonder who is running the show.

Good for you for ignoring the high price of coal and gas and the extremely high cost of building HELE coal fired power stations.

4 hours ago, BritManToo said:

But sells to home owners for 25-35p per unit, while in Thailand I pay 10p per unit.

The cheapest costs 3x more in the UK.

10p per unit is twice what the company's charge. I pay 4.7 directly to PEA. Your landlord is laughing all the way to the bank.

13 hours ago, FlorC said:

Thailand would be great for solar, but at less than 5 B/kW, is it worth it.

 

For the expat, only if you own your home, or plan of living at, for about 5 yrs, and should at least break even.   For locals or expats settled in for the long haul, ROI should be fast, especially if home during the day and or use EV for transport.

 

Size the system right, which we went a little overboard, adding the 2nd ESS, as not needed at all, but will add longevity to the ESSs, so not a loss, just cost a bit more than necessary as prices for, are lower now.  Without the extra ESS (battery) our system has almost paid for itself already in just 3+ years.  But we're home 24/7, with ACs going and have BEVs exclusively for transport.

 

If everyone is out of the house during day time, work & school, then probably not good ROI, unless living in same house long term.  3-5kW system is quite inexpensive and would supplement most electric bills nice over the years, if in the budget to install.

Does that cost include cleaning up after used/destroyed solar panels and the eradication of productive land for solar use that could be used for agriculture or environmentally helpful forests?

26 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

10p per unit is twice what the company's charge. I pay 4.7 directly to PEA. Your landlord is laughing all the way to the bank.

I pay 4bht to the PEA for 1 unit =10p in the UK currency

(Assuming 40bht to 1 pound)

Well if it's profitable the market will take care of it as long as it's free of government mandates and subject to the same environmental rules as its competition

30 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

10p per unit is twice what the company's charge. I pay 4.7 directly to PEA. Your landlord is laughing all the way to the bank.

 

His wife?

11 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I pay 4bht to the PEA for 1 unit =10p in the UK currency

(Assuming 40bht to 1 pound)

So sorry, I read it as Bht 10 per unit. I must try better!

Why are the stupit Chinese still building coal-fired plants?

 

Where’s @placeholder when you need him?

1 hour ago, Alan Zweibel said:

Good for you for ignoring the high price of coal and gas and the extremely high cost of building HELE coal fired power stations.

Coal burners are not expensive. The can be built on existing sites using existing infrastructure.

Solar and wind cannot.

Read recently that Australia will be building around 43,000 kilometres of access roads just for pv and wind sites. Scars on the landscape.

1 hour ago, KhunLA said:

For the expat, only if you own your home, or plan of living at, for about 5 yrs, and should at least break even.   For locals or expats settled in for the long haul, ROI should be fast, especially if home during the day and or use EV for transport.

 

Size the system right, which we went a little overboard, adding the 2nd ESS, as not needed at all, but will add longevity to the ESSs, so not a loss, just cost a bit more than necessary as prices for, are lower now.  Without the extra ESS (battery) our system has almost paid for itself already in just 3+ years.  But we're home 24/7, with ACs going and have BEVs exclusively for transport.

 

If everyone is out of the house during day time, work & school, then probably not good ROI, unless living in same house long term.  3-5kW system is quite inexpensive and would supplement most electric bills nice over the years, if in the budget to install.

Works where the uptake is relatively small. I get 44 cents per kw/h that I export to the grid as I was an early adopter - 18 years ago. That number is around 8 cents now for new installs and likely to go lower. In some jurisdictions they are charging people for export when supply exceeds demand. You pay them.

 

The Australian government has a battery subsidy in place where they pay part of the cost of purchase and installation. The catch is they will use the battery to prop up the grid when required. Quite an admission of a failed system.

The batteries will derate much quicker than normal use. I bet the government won't be paying for their disposal and purchase of new ones.

 

As mentioned I have PV power and it has it's place.

Grid scale generation is not one of them.

52 minutes ago, Yagoda said:

Well if it's profitable the market will take care of it as long as it's free of government mandates and subject to the same environmental rules as its competition

Many wind farms are not being proceeded with. The financiers are pulling out.

The primary problem with solar is storage.

 

It’s great for homeowners, but for solar to be viably, you have to have a redundant system. 

 

They can’t even make it work in California. In California, they have to pay other states to take their excess power during the day, and buy the power they need at night from the same states they pay to take their excess during the day.

 

 

 

36 minutes ago, mogandave said:

The primary problem with solar is storage.

 

It’s great for homeowners, but for solar to be viably, you have to have a redundant system. 

 

They can’t even make it work in California. In California, they have to pay other states to take their excess power during the day, and buy the power they need at night from the same states they pay to take their excess during the day.

 

I'm as big fan of solar done right, but like John Drake, I worry about the cradle to grave costs of the components that will eventually need to be disposed of and replaced.  And the land it takes to do it on a commercial scale.  All of that is factored into the cost of a gas powered plant because we have decades of history.  Not so with solar projects, where the technology is changing so fast.  Including storage tech. 

 

I'm forecasting landfill fires out the wazoo as they start receiving more and more flammable batteries.  Legally and illegally dumped. I hope I'm wrong, but time will tell.  

 

2 hours ago, KhunLA said:

For the expat, only if you own your home, or plan of living at, for about 5 yrs, and should at least break even.   For locals or expats settled in for the long haul, ROI should be fast, especially if home during the day and or use EV for transport.

 

Size the system right, which we went a little overboard, adding the 2nd ESS, as not needed at all, but will add longevity to the ESSs, so not a loss, just cost a bit more than necessary as prices for, are lower now.  Without the extra ESS (battery) our system has almost paid for itself already in just 3+ years.  But we're home 24/7, with ACs going and have BEVs exclusively for transport.

 

If everyone is out of the house during day time, work & school, then probably not good ROI, unless living in same house long term.  3-5kW system is quite inexpensive and would supplement most electric bills nice over the years, if in the budget to install.

Yeah but we can't own our home, even when married.

I'm all for solar , even have my own 40 W panel to play with. 

Even in the hottest months I don't go over 8kW a day = 40 B.

 

Interesting Placeholder.

44 minutes ago, FlorC said:

Yeah but we can't own our home, even when married.

I'm all for solar , even have my own 40 W panel to play with. 

Even in the hottest months I don't go over 8kW a day = 40 B.

 

You can own a condo here, though may be restricted to use solar panels.   If long term rental, then a small system would pay for itself, and possibly be able to take with you, if planned right.

 

Point taken, as does take a trusted partner to invest in home (non condo) ownership.  Also if retiring at later stage in life, 60-65-70, do you really want to invest in a future you might not be around for.

 

First 2 house builds were temp living arrangements, (not even sure if remaining in TH) though solar not really feasible then anyway.  Present house (remaining & last house) solar was contracted before house was done, with roof design (very slight pitch) just for solar installation.

 

Moving forward, next year or after, and electric is free onward, as system will have paid for itself from PEA & petrol savings.  Less than 4 yrs, and still have warranties in place.  We can save up to 10k THB  a month, depending how abusive we are with the AC and driving around exploring locally.  Adds up quick.

 

Nice walking into a house that's constantly cool.  No power cuts, and steady voltage to our appliances.  If feasible and in the budget, really can't recommend enough for folks to peek at having solar.

Nuclear Power is the Most Reliable Energy Source and It's Not Even Close

https://www.energy.gov/ne/articles/nuclear-power-most-reliable-energy-source-and-its-not-even-close

 

Solar is fine for homeowners that want to wait for decades to recoup their investment. But Nuclear is the only power source so far that is robust and will power into the future. 

This just the beginning. The cost is following the usual experience curve and will further decrease.

 

https://research.brighton.ac.uk/files/40900055/PhD_Revised_Thesis_Bdour_Sbeih_Minor_corrections.pdf?__cf_chl_tk=AdCnwSPrg7mYB1VibBTFB4GR9fvqldL_mthcp7TuUrs-1759999128-1.0.1.1-Ugp9L2_ZRqRkCP2UG7g0f.wdA6BFCWrliJECCQcJKUI