Australian Aged Pension

[Peterw42]

 

11 hours ago, Nemises said:

 

I retired early and I'm still 5 years away from pension age. I will only be spending TWO (2) months each year in Australia up until then. I doubt very much that C'Link will give me instant portability when they see I've been living in Thailand for 10 months for each of the past 9 years....but I'll be applying for it anyway ????

 

My story, with supporting documentation, to C'Link will be that for the last NINE (9) years since retiring I've maintained my Aus residency (Mum's house) and simply "gone travelling". I've kept my Aus driving licences "alive" as well as my Aus car/s and my many Aus sporting club memberships. I'll still be an Australian resident for tax purposes and my Medicare card is still active and used when I'm in Aus. I'll be telling them that I have no overseas family, GF's, property or bank accounts anywhere else in the world and that I started each "holiday" in Thailand and loved the joint so much that I never ventured onto another country in all of my last 9 overseas "world tours" ???? 

 

I'll also be telling them that I never lived in the one place in Thailand and that I was ALWAYS moving from one hotel to another whilst in Thailand .... that's what genuine travelers do...how can they prove otherwise even if I did rent apartments long term in Patts, BKK and Patong etc?

 

I'll be advising them in no uncertain terms that my overseas travelling days are definitely over and that I'm home for good now ("those pretty Thai girls have taken all my money", "I'm not getting any younger, it's time to settle down now", "I want to be with my family, grandchildren now" etc etc etc)

 

Do I expect them to be satisfied that I have maintained  'residency' for C'Link pension purposes and that I don't need to do 2 years "penal service"?  Of course not.... but like I say, I'll give it a crack! 

 

If they grant me portability I'm on the first plane back to the land of smiles. If they don't, I'll be doing 2 years hard labor.... and then grab the first plane back to LOS.

 

I agree with your thinking and its the same way I view my situation. So far as any Australian Government department is concerned, I am outside Australia travelling, Australia is home, I dont live or have residency in any other country. I am travelling the world visiting my facebook friends, and that does not change your residency status. I have a house in Australia, do tax returns in Australia, vote in Australia, I even got a letter for jury duty the other day.

Why limit your story to only Thailand, the Australian Government has no tracking of travel once you leave (unless you are on an interpol watch-list). Maybe that could change if they start storing travel history on the passport chip but for now they would have no idea if you go to Bolivia tomorrow.

[opalred]

i believe you can hold residency if you return every 3 months even for 1day 

and have a address at a house or children's address/ then can hold medicare

if you are living here before pension day and returning every 3months you are a resident of oz /just fill the forms out on a return visit before pension day and give oz address

[opalred]

i do have to add if returning every 3months is questioned about residence 

what about business people spend more time out of the country than in /never questioned 

sometimes years ./

[dinga]

28 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

 

I agree with your thinking and its the same way I view my situation. So far as any Australian Government department is concerned, I am outside Australia travelling, Australia is home, I dont live or have residency in any other country. I am travelling the world visiting my facebook friends, and that does not change your residency status. I have a house in Australia, do tax returns in Australia, vote in Australia, I even got a letter for jury duty the other day.

Why limit your story to only Thailand, the Australian Government has no tracking of travel once you leave (unless you are on an interpol watch-list). Maybe that could change if they start storing travel history on the passport chip but for now they would have no idea if you go to Bolivia tomorrow.

Surely CLink would ask to see your passport - that tells all....

[Peterw42]

21 minutes ago, dinga said:

Surely CLink would ask to see your passport - that tells all....

What will a passport tell them, You dont even get stamped in/out of Australia any more. A passport full of stamps or no stamps still does not show anything. Its a mute point anyway, Centerlink does not ask to see anyone's passport.

Lots of countries dont put stamps in passports anymore, Thai wife has been to Australia 3 times and still has a blank passport.

 

If they happend to see your Thai stamps, it would go in your favor as it says Non immigrant, not a resident etc.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Peterw42

[Nemises]

30 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

You dont even get stamped in/out of Australia any more. A passport full of stamps or no stamps still does not show anything. Its a mute point anyway, Centerlink does not ask to see anyone's passport.

I did not know this. Thanks so much for sharing!!!!

Accordingly, my travel log for today now reads: "Leave Thailand today, headed for Bolivia (BC & Sundance Kid my all-time fav movie). Will then tour other Sth American countries (must put my 6 years of high school Spanish education to good use). I sure do miss MY HOME in Australia. Will be back HOME IN AUSTRALIA soon for Xmas, but will only stay a week or so before commencing another overseas holiday. Am so lucky to be an Australian RESIDENT on holidays and thus eligible for immediate portability upon pension application".

 

 

[madmen]

1 hour ago, dinga said:

Surely CLink would ask to see your passport - that tells all....

They are linked to immigration and your arrival departures pop up on screen with a mouse click

[Will27]

5 minutes ago, Nemises said:

I did not know this. Thanks so much for sharing!!!!

Accordingly, my travel log for today now reads: "Leave Thailand today, headed for Bolivia (BC & Sundance Kid my all-time fav movie). Will then tour other Sth American countries (must put my 6 years of high school Spanish education to good use). I sure do miss MY HOME in Australia. Will be back HOME IN AUSTRALIA soon for Xmas, but will only stay a week or so before commencing another overseas holiday. Am so lucky to be an Australian RESIDENT on holidays and thus eligible for immediate portability upon pension application".

 

 

At the end of the day, Centrelink don't really care where you are TBH.

 

Like they ATO, they will take other factors into account, but the real thing they

will focus on is time spent outside of Australia.

 

I go back to Oz to vote and have ties etc.

But the bottom line is, if you're spending the vast majority

of your time outside of Oz, you will be pushing poo uphill

trying to convince them you're a resident.

 

I'm 10 years away from the pension age.

I think the "2 year "thing" is <deleted>.

IMO, you're either entitled to the pension or not.

 

Anyway, you're talking about residency to satisfy Centrelink, not the ATO.

[Peterw42]

8 minutes ago, Nemises said:

I did not know this. Thanks so much for sharing!!!!

Accordingly, my travel log for today now reads: "Leave Thailand today, headed for Bolivia (BC & Sundance Kid my all-time fav movie). Will then tour other Sth American countries (must put my 6 years of high school Spanish education to good use). I sure do miss MY HOME in Australia. Will be back HOME IN AUSTRALIA soon for Xmas, but will only stay a week or so before commencing another overseas holiday. Am so lucky to be an Australian RESIDENT on holidays and thus eligible for immediate portability upon pension application".

 

 

My journal also mentions leaving/returning on a cruise ship whenever I arrive or depart Australia (only photo ID required, not passport), then leaving/joining the cruise in Noumea to fly to other locations. 

[Peterw42]

11 minutes ago, Will27 said:

At the end of the day, Centrelink don't really care where you are TBH.

 

Like they ATO, they will take other factors into account, but the real thing they

will focus on is time spent outside of Australia.

 

I go back to Oz to vote and have ties etc.

But the bottom line is, if you're spending the vast majority

of your time outside of Oz, you will be pushing poo uphill

trying to convince them you're a resident.

 

I'm 10 years away from the pension age.

I think the "2 year "thing" is <deleted>.

IMO, you're either entitled to the pension or not.

 

Anyway, you're talking about residency to satisfy Centrelink, not the ATO.

Yes it probably would be a task to convince them, but technically just being outside Australia doesn't make you a non-resident, being a resident somewhere else is what makes you a non-resident. You could get your passport stamped departed, sit in a boat in international waters just off the coast of Australia and still be a resident.

[Nemises]

3 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

My journal also mentions leaving/returning on a cruise ship whenever I arrive or depart Australia (only photo ID required, not passport), then leaving/joining the cruise in Noumea to fly to other locations. 

HAHAHAHAHA. More fantastic news. THANK YOU!!!!!

Am downloading different shipping lines arr/dep schedules SYD-NOU as we speak ????

 

[opalred]

when i was going in and out never showed passport/  as they knew all airport  i came and went from the computer linked to immigration 

[Will27]

1 minute ago, Peterw42 said:

Yes it probably would be a task to convince them, but technically just being outside Australia doesn't make you a non-resident, being a resident somewhere else is what makes you a non-resident. You could get your passport stamped departed, sit in a boat in international waters just off the coast of Australia and still be a resident.

I don't really agree with that TBH.

 

For example, if you spent 50 weeks a year in Thailand or anywhere outside of Australia

really, year on end, pretty sure you would be classed as a non-resident for tax purposes (in the majority of cases).

 

Anyway, getting off topic I guess as Nemesis it talking about satisfying Centrelink not the ATO.

 

 

[madmen]

1 minute ago, Will27 said:

I don't really agree with that TBH.

 

For example, if you spent 50 weeks a year in Thailand or anywhere outside of Australia

really, year on end, pretty sure you would be classed as a non-resident for tax purposes (in the majority of cases).

 

Anyway, getting off topic I guess as Nemesis it talking about satisfying Centrelink not the ATO.

 

 

You arre correct. Im on a disability pension unlimited portability and was made a non resident after several years away. Easy to get it back just go back to oz and show a lease and utilities, bank accounts etc

[UncleMhee]

Centrelink catch you out for residency with questions 18 & 19 in the application form. They use your Passport No. to cross reference your comings & goings.

https://www.humanservices.gov.au/individuals/forms/sa002

..

[scorecard]

4 hours ago, Will27 said:

I don't like your chances but good luck.

 

One thing though, I wouldn't be telling Centrelink you're a resident for tax purposes.

For a start, It's not relevant as different government departments have different interpretations

of residency.

 

Secondly, if you're living in Thailand, in most cases you won't be a resident for tax purposes and the 

less government departments know, the better IMO.

 

 

"I don't like your chances but good luck."

 

Would you please share your thoughts as to why 'I don't like your chances' but good luck..

 

Thanks.

[UncleMhee]

24 minutes ago, madmen said:

You arre correct. Im on a disability pension unlimited portability and was made a non resident after several years away.

Do you have that in writing? Because unless you do your DSP UP status should let you enter the country again at anytime and have full payments reinstated on crossing immigration, for the full length of your stay and up to six weeks after you leave. There is no need to notify Centrelink of leaving on DSP UP, however OAP must contact them. Failure to do so can see a suspension after six months away.

 

A member from another forum recently got their changeover letter through MyGov and started the process. They got blocked, told to go to an office. Currently negotiating that as they have been in the Philippines for six years on DSP UP and now reconsidering the need, as payments are the same and DSP keeps NDIS options open. 

Aged Pension Chanegover division didn't even know about UP status.

 

[Old Croc]

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

My journal also mentions leaving/returning on a cruise ship whenever I arrive or depart Australia (only photo ID required, not passport), then leaving/joining the cruise in Noumea to fly to other locations. 

Umm, no.

Some cruises starting and finishing in Australia no longer require immigration processing.  The passengers are considered to still be in Australia even though the ship temporarily visits other countries.  If you were to leave such a cruise overseas your status would change. The shipping company would be required to report any missing passengers.

Outside such round trip cruises, people arriving and departing by ship still require normal immigration processing as if they were at an airport.

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Old Croc

[norbra]

5 hours ago, Nemises said:

In addition to having a 10 month holiday in Thailand every year, I'll be reminding (and showing passport confirmation to) CentreLink, that whilst on said extended overseas holidays, I return home to Aus for special occasions such as funerals, births, marriages and even football grand finals and other big sporting events such as Melbourne Cups and NSW V Qld State of Origin matches. Will this convince them that I'm an Aus resident? As I already mentioned above, and as you agree...I doubt it very much - but no harm in asking is my theory.

Thanks Will for the advice about not telling another Government dept's details. I'll certainly be limiting my information to them based on what they ask me, nothing more!

Do not offer information about special events. You are returning to your home and family affairs!

[Will27]

2 hours ago, scorecard said:

"I don't like your chances but good luck."

 

Would you please share your thoughts as to why 'I don't like your chances' but good luck..

 

Thanks.

Because he's living in Thailand for 10 months of the year.

Would more than likely fail the residency test IMO.

[madmen]

2 hours ago, UncleMhee said:

Do you have that in writing? Because unless you do your DSP UP status should let you enter the country again at anytime and have full payments reinstated on crossing immigration, for the full length of your stay and up to six weeks after you leave. There is no need to notify Centrelink of leaving on DSP UP, however OAP must contact them. Failure to do so can see a suspension after six months away.

 

A member from another forum recently got their changeover letter through MyGov and started the process. They got blocked, told to go to an office. Currently negotiating that as they have been in the Philippines for six years on DSP UP and now reconsidering the need, as payments are the same and DSP keeps NDIS options open. 

Aged Pension Chanegover division didn't even know about UP status.

 

It was via a phone call with a supervisor in Thailand.. he might have tricked me though and confirmed by CL when I went back for a holiday and wasn't able to receive a pensioners card without announcing my permanent return. unless the bitch got it wrong.as I am UP. we got into a fight when she scolded me for not ringing CL on my return and wouldn't back down

Edited November 20, 2019 by madmen

[giddyup]

14 minutes ago, madmen said:

It was via a phone call with a supervisor in Thailand.. he might have tricked me though and confirmed by CL when I went back for a holiday and wasn't able to receive a pensioners card without announcing my permanent return. unless the bitch got it wrong.as I am UP. we got into a fight when she scolded me for not ringing CL on my return and wouldn't back down

I had a female C'link officer actually stop my payments when I first moved to Thailand because before I'd left she told me the aged pension wasn't portable and I told her she didn't know what she was talking about, so she stopped my payments out of spite.

[Nemises]

7 minutes ago, Will27 said:

Because he's living in Thailand for 10 months of the year.

 

"Because he's living in Thailand for 10 months of the year"

 

Not anymore he isn't! There's been 2 additional posts since the "10 months of the year in Thailand" that you've overlooked:

1: He's leaving Thailand today for Sth America and returning to his home in Australia for Xmas with his family, and leaving to go another country after Xmas... refer post #3436 

2: He also returns to his home in Australia to attend funerals, births and marriages as required, and also returns home to Australia to spend time with his family and friends every year at major Australian sporting events (plural)... refer post #3420

 

So just to clarify, he goes back to live in his Australian residence for 2 continuous months every year. In addition to the 2 continuous months, he also goes back home for Xmas and for 2 football Grand Finals, 3 State of Origin matches, The Melbourne Cup, The Golden Slipper and every time a close friend or family member has a baby, a marriage or a funeral. He will no longer be spending much time in Thailand if any, instead travelling elsewhere around the world.

 

Would he still fail the residency test in your opinion?

[Will27]

1 hour ago, Nemises said:

"Because he's living in Thailand for 10 months of the year"

 

Not anymore he isn't! There's been 2 additional posts since the "10 months of the year in Thailand" that you've overlooked:

1: He's leaving Thailand today for Sth America and returning to his home in Australia for Xmas with his family, and leaving to go another country after Xmas... refer post #3436 

2: He also returns to his home in Australia to attend funerals, births and marriages as required, and also returns home to Australia to spend time with his family and friends every year at major Australian sporting events (plural)... refer post #3420

 

So just to clarify, he goes back to live in his Australian residence for 2 continuous months every year. In addition to the 2 continuous months, he also goes back home for Xmas and for 2 football Grand Finals, 3 State of Origin matches, The Melbourne Cup, The Golden Slipper and every time a close friend or family member has a baby, a marriage or a funeral. He will no longer be spending much time in Thailand if any, instead travelling elsewhere around the world.

 

Would he still fail the residency test in your opinion?

To start with, it's 5 years away and we really don't know what Centrelink will do

next month, let alone in 5 years time.

 

IMO, it won't matter much where you say spend your time away from Australia, it will depend on

how much time you spend away. I wouldn't get caught up with the other post saying

you're going to travel elsewhere. I don't think it will make much difference. Especially year after year.

Misleading Centrelink is one thing. Actually lying to receive a benefit is another thing altogether.

 

Now you've gone from saying you spend 10 months in Thailand by saying you will return for other occasions.

Going by your post, you will visit Australia on a minimum of 8 other times.

 

That does change things but I doubt you will be travelling back to Oz 10 or 12 times a year.

 

I hope you do get it.

Then, I will give the 2 months in Oz thing a crack myself

 

But like I said, it's 5 years away so who really knows?

 

 

 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Will27

[Nemises]

30 minutes ago, Will27 said:

That does change things but I doubt you will be travelling back to Oz 10 or 12 times a year

Yes that does change things, and yes I am already going back home to Aus for the MANY OTHER aforementioned occasions... and will continue to do so. 
 

As suggested by another poster I will also get back

on the Electoral Roll to further increase my chances. 
 

There will be no dishonesty because apparently C’Link don’t want to know exactly where about overseas I visit. If so I won’t need to mention any countries. 

Thanks for your kind wishes of hoping I’ll qualify for immediate portability. ????

Good luck to you also. 
 

Edited November 20, 2019 by Nemises

[Goinghomesoon]

14 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

My journal also mentions leaving/returning on a cruise ship whenever I arrive or depart Australia (only photo ID required, not passport), then leaving/joining the cruise in Noumea to fly to other locations. 

Doesn't matter... cruise ships log their pax list with Immigration and your movements can still be logged by C'link.  Yes I worked in a place (not C'link) where we used this data. No different to airplane movements in terms of where the records are kept, just looks different to you as the customer.

[RJRS1301]

18 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

 

I agree with your thinking and its the same way I view my situation. So far as any Australian Government department is concerned, I am outside Australia travelling, Australia is home, I dont live or have residency in any other country. I am travelling the world visiting my facebook friends, and that does not change your residency status. I have a house in Australia, do tax returns in Australia, vote in Australia, I even got a letter for jury duty the other day.

Why limit your story to only Thailand, the Australian Government has no tracking of travel once you leave (unless you are on an interpol watch-list). Maybe that could change if they start storing travel history on the passport chip but for now they would have no idea if you go to Bolivia tomorrow.

They would know by the entry stamps, and you passport does get recorded by countries upon entry. What happens with that info upon entry I am unsure.

[4MyEgo]

On 11/20/2019 at 1:25 AM, Nemises said:

If they grant me portability I'm on the first plane back to the land of smiles. If they don't, I'll be doing 2 years hard labor.... and then grab the first plane back to LOS.

I reckon you would be better off returning 2 years earlier, less hoopla hoops to jump through, i.e. you did your time, no questions asked, as opposed to declined and having to go through the appeals process, but up to you, and best of luck. 

[nev]

My main worry is that they move the goalposts again and increase the pension receiving  age. 

I have gone from 65 to 67 and they upped it to 67 and a half not so long ago. 

[RJRS1301]

7 hours ago, nev said:

My main worry is that they move the goalposts again and increase the pension receiving  age. 

I have gone from 65 to 67 and they upped it to 67 and a half not so long ago. 

Depends on your year of birth, they set that out years ago.