Tiger Boxer

[jdinasia]

Does anyone have one or has anyone ridden one enough to have a solid opinion?

http://www.motorcycle.in.th/article.php?st...ai-Mystery-Bike

[jdinasia]

I bought a Joker my 4th day in Thailand (over 4 years ago) and have liked it. Now I am in the process of looking for something a bit different (but to be honest I like the step-through frame of the Joker and that it uses 16 inch wheels not smaller) It sits a bit higher and is comfy for my jaunts around.

[PeaceBlondie]

jd, I think there is a huge difference between a Tiger Joker (135 cc, step through, imitation chopper) and a Tiger Boxer (200 cc, high frame, big tank, sport style, etc.). Most Thais do not buy Tigers. Well, my boyfriend did buy a Joker in 2003, and then passed it on to the family. They feel that it is acceptable as a scooter, but worse than all the Japanese bikes they have owned. The only bike in the 150-200 class that most of us consider worthwhile, of course, is the CBR150R. But except possibly for RichardBKK, none of us has ridden a Boxer.

[chavy]

Apparently they are sold in Chinatown. One recent posting by a member put a contact number up under my thread alternatives to CBR 150CC.

[jdinasia]

jd, I think there is a huge difference between a Tiger Joker (135 cc, step through, imitation chopper) and a Tiger Boxer (200 cc, high frame, big tank, sport style, etc.). Most Thais do not buy Tigers. Well, my boyfriend did buy a Joker in 2003, and then passed it on to the family. They feel that it is acceptable as a scooter, but worse than all the Japanese bikes they have owned. The only bike in the 150-200 class that most of us consider worthwhile, of course, is the CBR150R. But except possibly for RichardBKK, none of us has ridden a Boxer.

The joker is 120cc or 125cc ... (mine is 125) other than the tiny sissy bar on the back which held the bottom edge of my backpack with my laptop in it when commuting to and from Webster I don't see how you could call it a chopper imitation.

the joker sure isn't fast but it cruises at 80 just fine and that is as fast as I like on any road I do not know well

I am going out to the Tiger dealership where the BMA traffic police get the bikes tmw to take a better look

[Richard-BKK]

The Tiger boxer 200cc is a marvelous bike to ride, it has everything you could want from a bike under the 100,000 Baht range. On the other hand lots of new stuff will happen next week, with lots of surprises. My g/f came home with a 250cc Yamaha scooter, which apparently will also be on show at the Bangkok Motorshow. I can say this with a 250cc scooter who want a 150cc or 200cc sportbike, flat on the tank, playing slippery clutch and still only see the rear light of the 250cc scooter getting smaller by the second.

The only problem is it cost also a bit more.....Therefore under the 100,000 Baht range is the Tiger Boxer, Honda CBR-150R and hopefully the Yamaha R15 nice bikes

Edited March 22, 2008 by Richard-BKK

[jdinasia]

there wer 14 Boxers parked at the condo building near mine today (Police housing) am going to ask one to take me for a ride

[zank]

I have been following this thread with interest as I was considering buying the new Tiger 200PX, same as just delivered to the Thai Police.

I do speak with a couple of the boys in brown, and they tell me it's a great bike to ride, handles very well.

Unfortunately, I also know somebody on the inside who was supplying engines, and parts to Tiger. They have stopped last year as it was losing them lots of money. His advice to me was that Tiger will probably fold in the very near future. He said I won't be able to get parts, or any service. I have already read of this scenario on another forum, and just replied.

Basically, they didn't sell enough bikes to the locals, who are more interested in buying a Jap brand name with pretty colours. Dam shame that!

Some motorcycle shops can order, build and deliver Tigers, and some carry older models in stock. But the future is definitely unclear. I was going to follow up and get my Thai staff to see if they can find anymore information, as I am still interested in the 200PX. If I have anymore news I will post it.

Regards

Zank

[Thanh-BKK]

Hi

I haven't ridden a Boxer but i think they must be reliable and fast - or why would the POLICE use them? And they sure use a lot of them.

Best regards.....

Thanh

[jdinasia]

Hi

I haven't ridden a Boxer but i think they must be reliable and fast - or why would the POLICE use them? And they sure use a lot of them.

Best regards.....

Thanh

21 of them parked today at the next condo building over from me! (many traffic police must have Sundays off!) Too hot for any of them to be hanging around outside so I have yet to bed a ride on one!)

[yoyomo]

My gf's mom and dad have a 175 Tiger at their rural Issan home. Last month I was allowed to ride to the village store after showing them I know how to ride a manual shift motorbike. I liked it more than a Honda Wave because of performance and handling.

So I ask my gf why I've never seen this brand of bike before. She informs me that Tigers are not allowed in the city and if the police saw me riding in the city, they would confiscate the bike. She didn't know if there is a law only that police not allow. Also mentioned that everyone knows not to ride this bike in the city.

Yes, it sits higher than the normal thai scooters. The higher horsepower and beefier suspension interest me. It does makes a bit more noise.

Then I ask why her family has this model bike and not a scooter. A scooter would be easier for mom. She tells me dad wanted this model because of more power.

[jdinasia]

My gf's mom and dad have a 175 Tiger at their rural Issan home. Last month I was allowed to ride to the village store after showing them I know how to ride a manual shift motorbike. I liked it more than a Honda Wave because of performance and handling.

So I ask my gf why I've never seen this brand of bike before. She informs me that Tigers are not allowed in the city and if the police saw me riding in the city, they would confiscate the bike. She didn't know if there is a law only that police not allow. Also mentioned that everyone knows not to ride this bike in the city.

Yes, it sits higher than the normal thai scooters. The higher horsepower and beefier suspension interest me. It does makes a bit more noise.

Then I ask why her family has this model bike and not a scooter. A scooter would be easier for mom. She tells me dad wanted this model because of more power.

That seems odd.

Tigers are legal and I have a greenbook in my name on my now old(ish) Joker that I bought in Dec 2003

[Richard-BKK]

Spare parts for the Tiger boxer 200 are currently in Thailand difficult to obtain, this is mainly because of the changes at Tiger motorcycle Thailand.

In short I will try to explain, Proton Malaysia bought MVagusta, a Italian manufacturer of motorcycle and helicopters. In the brands Cagiva is one of MVagusta motorcycle brands. Proton for domestic production, as import from Italian based MVagusta factories would cost to much, Proton/MVagusta contacted some established motorcycle manufacturers who where struggling to find good selling designs. Proton/MVagusta found in Tiger Motorcycle, what it was thinking, the perfect partner. But it did not take long before Tiger was selling Tiger boxers 200's without paying royalties.

And Proton/MVagusta went to court won the case, and in basic made MVagusta the owner of Tiger motorcycle. At that time Tiger motorcycle stopped paying suppliers, we also have some unpaid invoices.

Around the same time, late 2006, Proton company as a whole got into heavy weather and needed to lose some assets, MVagusta did not made Proton the golden eggs it was thinking, matter of fact MVagusta was pretty good in coloring the books red.

A Italian investment group came around and MVagusta was sold back to the Italians for 1 US$.

Back to the spare parts, MVagusta has a partnership with the Malaysian company Momos, they build some motorcycles for MVagusta. They also in supply spare parts, if necessary by mail order for the 200cc Tiger Boxer.

Momos Spare Parts

Edited March 23, 2008 by Richard-BKK

[PeaceBlondie]

Thanks, RichardBKK, for the background. From what you just wrote, it appears Tigers and Boxers are on very shaky ground as a motorcycle company, regardless of how fine the product appears to be.

I am sorry, but looking at the spec sheet for the boxer, it looks like 1979 technology, less than a Suzuki GS400. Five speeds, 9:2:1 compression, single ohc, air cooled. I am always looking for a seventh gear on my CBR150R!

[Richard-BKK]

@PeaceBlondie

And you see the Tiger Boxer as a 1979 technology bike, does it hurt to get beaten on all specs speed, performance, millage...etc by a 1979 technology bike. With others moving into the Thai market, the CBR-150 could find itself at the low-end of the market.

All possible competitions will offer better millage, better performance, cheaper maintenance (high technology cylinder and piston technology have no need for break-ins). Even driving your sporty motorcycle you will be past by people sitting in upright position and driving a new power scooter.

The 250cc Yamaha scooter my wife bring home, had the same 250cc engine as the European X-series, powerfull to the max, able to keep up with European traffic, which means its able to cruise about 120 km/h, with much more to overtake traffic. (note forget 250cc scooters/bike in Europe are seen as motor-vehicles same as cars).

And still somebody want to compare this 250cc scooter, which delivers about a plus 30 horsepower, with a V-belt Variomatic system, which in basic means you need to be a MotoGP rider to beat the take off, and the top speed you can never reach with a CBR-150R.

If love the CBR-150R, or better the CBR-125, it is one of the greatest bike ever made.... and I would buy one soon, my wife learned to drive on a CR150R and parked my Ducati in a car door not long after that.

Me had the pleasure to run around with a new Ducati Hypermotard, which has many similarities with the Tiger Boxer engine, air cooled, SOHC valves and still called by international motorcycle press the wonder of technology.

Maybe Honda CBR-150R users want to forget that there engine is very very old in motorcycle dating, introduced and basically unchanged since 1998.

Edited March 24, 2008 by Richard-BKK

[jdinasia]

LOL .... OK guys ... MINE is bigger .. now back to the bike

I am not looking for optimum performance. I want a mechanically sound bike that goes from point a - point b. I won't be racing it! I would like to be able to keep up with PB and others on fun rides but if they take off like crazy folks I'll happily putt putt putt behind them until I catch up

[Richard-BKK]

Wait after the 29th Bangkok Motorshow, many new product will be available ,......

[jdinasia]

Thanks .. I am not wedded to another Tiger, but I have been quite happy with one for 4.5 years

[Richard-BKK]

Yes good idea, lets start who copied who. And let me bring you back to about 50 years ago, or do we now belief that Honda invented the motorcycle. Everybody copies from everybody, a copy or borrowed technology doesn't make the bike better or worse.

I think the Honda CBR-150r is a nice bike, but it is getting a bit old. Even compared to the 2008 Suzuki Raider 150Ri, which is fully updated with electronic fuel injection, the Honda CBR-150r it is no match.

On the other hand, riding a motorcycle is not all about speed and the Honda CBR-150 has excellent road handling, and is solidly build, with spare part widely available. With this the Honda CBR-150 is the clear winner..... Even as the Honda CBR-150 is a 10 year old bike, I always enjoy riding one.

The Tiger boxer, which, with it looks give the idea that it is also a sport machine, but it is not. It is capable of doing amazing things. But it is sure not a high rev machine. The riding position is more upright and it has more of a cruiser then a racer feeling riding it.

The Suzuki Raider 150Ri is light, good for Bangkok traffic you can easily put it from left to right and it handles very light. The downside is that touring or riding long straight road are not as easy.

[Munchausen]

OK, spoke to the president (Khun Piti Manomaiphibul) of Tiger motorcycles and his secretary (Khun Panadda Lekavuniviset, [email protected], mobile: 0819075814) at the BITEC motorshow earlier last week. Both have been most helpful and informative answering my questions thus far.

Incidentally they have launched a new or modified bike the Tiger Boxer 250 RS which is rather interesting for a company apparently going out of business (if you listen to all the rumours floating about the cyber knitting circles). Costs Bt 69,000 and it looks great by the way though I have yet to test drive it.

The main factory address is 199 Moo 8, Buddharaksa Rd, Tambon Taibanmai, Amphur Muangsamutprakarn, Samutprakarn, 10280, Thailand, tel: 023880868, fax: 023872842 . I suggest the doubting Thomas’s get the answers to their questions direct from the horse’s mouth.

Post up if you contact them as I also want to hear what they have to say. Cheers guys.

[Munchausen]

Also spoke to the main guys at Honda and Yamaha. Don’t expect any surprises so they say, Yamaha will not be releasing a 150cc anytime soon as the market for it in Thailand is small, less than 1 percent, they didn’t even know about it, had to show them on their website, also Honda who will be sticking an ‘i’ on all their new models told me, and this is the Honda designer speaking here, ‘no real changes to the CBR150 other than slight fending and decals’. But hey what do they know right? I get the same feeling talking to these guys as when asking a Thai directions, the accuracy of the answer and the infection of confidence are never equal.

[Badbanker]

I was at the trade only day at the start of the motorshow and had the opportunity to speak to the Owner of Sachs Germany! A very nice German Gentleman. He said that he does not make any motorcycles anywhere except in China! Sachs Motorcycles are no longer made in Germany! The cost of labour and materials prices him out of the market. All designing and R&D is done in Germany. He has an exclusive agreement with The Owner of Tiger Motorcycles in Thailand for distrubution in Thailand.

I also spoke to the Son of the owner of Tiger and was told there is no longer any import duty on any motorcycle that is less than 250 cc! Customs is not making a big noise telling everyone about it but it is now law!

I stopped by Kawasaki and was told that the KX 250 was available in August for 170,000 on road cost.

Given the recent excise changes and free trade agreements coming into force we can now order a NEW 250 from Japan and legally register it in Thailand.

Good news I think!

BB

[Richard-BKK]

Matter of fact, it is a bit old news. Insiders in the motorcycle industry know it for some time, I even reported a few months back that the engine displacement ruling would be raised from 200cc to 250cc.

I personally expected that more manufacturers would react on this 250cc ruling. Guess they need more time to introduce new products, also some, which includes Honda are moving away from the low-engine performance bikes. To some insiders the development is high and the return is low.

[Alter]

Hi there bikes lovers,

I went to the MotorShow yesterday and I too spoke to Tiger management people.

They said that a new 250cc is soon to be released for the thai market and that the price should be around +- 70.000Baht.

As I am not much satisfied with these little bikes that I see around me al the time and as importing a big bike here in Thailand is extremely expensive, I think I will get this new Boxer 250cc.

I don't have experience at all with the old 200cc that the police is now riding but I guess that if they decided to use it for their job,

this Boxer should not be too bad.

Any comment about it?

One last... I am planning a tour around Thailand and am planning to do it with this Boxer 250cc.

Would it handle it?

Best.

Alter

[Richard-BKK]

About the new 250cc Tiger Motorcycle I can say little, did not see it yet, for Cagiva and MV-agusta. I can say that MV-agusta must be a high technology company, as they make NATO light attack helicopters, and are the manufacture of one of the worlds fastest and most expensive motorcycle.

Cagiva is one of the motorcycle brands of MV-Augusta, more concentrated on the smaller displacement engine (less or equal to 650cc).

To be honest I always had a weakness for Cagiva, when people where looked at newly developed 150cc motorcycles, I could not stop laughing, Cagiva had a 150cc DOHC for longer I remember. Even today that old 150cc lady could keep all the young 150cc boys looking from far at her tail light.

I not say that modern 150cc motorcycles are not good, they fuel economics is remarkable. Yes, the Italian boys from Cagiva know how to build a bike. (It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that this bike off the attached picture is the model the Tiger Boxer is shaped at)

Edited April 5, 2008 by Richard-BKK

[Richard-BKK]

@David_boo The Cagiva 150S must be from 1989 or 1990 as it was introduced around the same time as the Cagiva 125C 10 Freccia (which was a ultra high rev 2-stroke machine).

Talking about Ninja's, it is where you live, the 250R is great for downtown traffic, it is very easy to handle. The 6N is a bit heavier, and therefore it is great if you do a lot of rural riding.

[Alter]

About the new 250cc Tiger Motorcycle I can say little, did not see it yet, for Cagiva and MV-agusta. I can say that MV-agusta must be a high technology company, as they make NATO light attack helicopters, and are the manufacture of one of the worlds fastest and most expensive motorcycle.

Cagiva is one of the motorcycle brands of MV-Augusta, more concentrated on the smaller displacement engine (less or equal to 650cc).

To be honest I always had a weakness for Cagiva, when people where looked at newly developed 150cc motorcycles, I could not stop laughing, Cagiva had a 150cc DOHC for longer I remember. Even today that old 150cc lady could keep all the young 150cc boys looking from far at her tail light.

I not say that modern 150cc motorcycles are not good, they fuel economics is remarkable. Yes, the Italian boys from Cagiva know how to build a bike. (It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out that this bike off the attached picture is the model the Tiger Boxer is shaped at)

@Richard_BKK

Hi Richard....

I just wanted to show you and the other guys the new Cagiva 125cc.

For your own curiosity and pleasure.

Best,

Alter

[Richard-BKK]

The 200cc ruling is indeed changed too 250cc, the larger engine bikes need to pay register fee's 600cc about 40 to 60,000 Baht. Similar to what we see with other manufacturers. (And Kawasaki Vulcan 900 Custom).

Personal, I'm not looking to buy a Ninja 250R.. I'm much more interested in a Kawasaki D-tracker 250. Which is a good motard style bike.

@Alter I seen the new Cagiva's but riding a 125cc 2-stroke is for me a bit over, anyway still nothing wrong with the Italian styling....

Edited April 6, 2008 by Richard-BKK

[PeaceBlondie]

I have been thinking about this MVAgusta connection with Cagiva. MVAgusta went out of business in the 1950's and has not raced in MotoGP since then, right? The reborn name is just that, a purchased name, yes? Cagiva was not MVAgusta when it designed the Boxer, was it? As I have already pointed out, the Boxer 200 technology is twenty years behind the CBR150R. Furthermore, what is the build quality of a Boxer? The mere fact that a government entity in a corruption-filled country bought lots of Boxers says nothing about their quality or even the future of the sales and service network in Thailand.

I am often mistaken, and I am more ignorant than many Thais. I am glad to see the Japanese Big Four bring bigger bikes here, and Triumph. Sachs and JRD and Royal Enfields from India, however, do not excite me.

[dave_boo]

I have been thinking about this MVAgusta connection with Cagiva. MVAgusta went out of business in the 1950's and has not raced in MotoGP since then, right? The reborn name is just that, a purchased name, yes? Cagiva was not MVAgusta when it designed the Boxer, was it? As I have already pointed out, the Boxer 200 technology is twenty years behind the CBR150R. Furthermore, what is the build quality of a Boxer? The mere fact that a government entity in a corruption-filled country bought lots of Boxers says nothing about their quality or even the future of the sales and service network in Thailand.

I am often mistaken, and I am more ignorant than many Thais. I am glad to see the Japanese Big Four bring bigger bikes here, and Triumph. Sachs and JRD and Royal Enfields from India, however, do not excite me.

So basically, Cagiva=Indian....just a purchased name that they like to use to try and draw a line to an exciting past? I can't comment on the build quality nor the actual technological level of the Boxer, but I've been insistent that the government buying them does not equate with a quality product. However, I'm not going to slag the brand; I just want people to realise that just because the government bought them doesn't necessarily mean they were the best to own. After all, we went to the moon based on the parts/assembly by the lowest cost contractors.

Even if there is a register fee of 40-60 000 Baht, if there's no import fee it still is quite a value in my book. Maybe I'm overlooking another fee/tax, but an ER-6N for ~340 000 Baht is better deal than what you can even get from Yamaha.