Grey Wire: To White Or Black?

[Sheryl]

I'm trying to replace a fluroescent light fixture.

I know the black (live) wire of the power supply should be connected to the live wire from the fixture. My problem is that those wires are not black and white but grey and white. I'm guessing the grey is the one that should go with the black and then white with white but before risking it though I'd ask....??

[Crossy]

Photos of the fitting may be an idea, as grey / white is not an international code

If there are only two wires then, in reality, it doesn't matter which way round they go, modern fittings are not polarity sensitive

[Sheryl]

I'm referring to the little wires that connect the bulb, ballast and strater. They are white and grey, everywhere in my holuse and also in all the sets sold hereabouts.

the main power wires are white and black.

instruction s I have for hooking up the starter/ballast/bulb stress to hook uop "like with like"i.e. white with white and black with black. Which I can't quite do as I have only gret and white. Are you saying it doesn't matter and will work ewither way?

[Crossy]

Photos would be very useful

Assuming it's not an electronic ballast wire it like this:-

Edited October 21, 2008 by Crossy

[Sheryl]

OK, I see where the confusion came in. It is a circular bulb, so instead of tube ends it has a section that fits to a 4 prongs device with in the center that connect to 4 by wires (white and grey) to the starter, ballast and power supply. 1 set I know goes to the starter and I assume in any order. the other white and grey set of wiores go to the ballast and the power supply (black wire). My question is which with which.

Picture is attached, I'm having trouble inserting it.

Thanks!

Photos would be very useful

Assuming it's not an electronic ballast wire it like this:-

[Sheryl]

OK, I see where the confusion came in. It is a circular bulb, so instead of tube ends it has a section that fits to a 4 prongs device with in the center that connect to 4 by wires (white and grey) to the starter, ballast and power supply. 1 set I know goes to the starter and I assume in any order. the other white and grey set of wiores go to the ballast and the power supply (black wire). My question is which with which.

Picture is attached, I'm having trouble inserting it.

Thanks!

Photos would be very useful

Assuming it's not an electronic ballast wire it like this:-

wires.doc

[Crossy]

Sorry Sheryl, really need a piccie of the ballast too Try to get the whole fitting in one shot.

The thing 'should' have come assembled with two wires going nowhere for the power (or a connector block).

[Sheryl]

OK, try the attached photo. It is not a pic of the exact one I am (for 2 days straight!!) trying to fix, since that one is in pitch darkness, but all the ones in my house are the same.

Circular bulbs with 4 pins that connect to a set of 4 wires of which 1 pair goes to the starter plate, 1 should be spliced to the live (black) wire of the power source and the remaining one to the white (neutral).

I don't know if it matters or not which of the connecting wires goes to the black and which to the white. What I do know is that I have at this point tried evry which way, replaced starter, starter plate, bulb, ballast and the wires that go between them and the bulb, aall to no avail.

I checked with a voltage meter, plenty of juice from the power source but virtually none coming through to the starter plate. Which I have already changed. Certainkly should not be the ballast as I am one #3 of those.....

And the repair books all say fixing fluroescent lifghts is easy.....

[Sheryl]

This time with the attachment....

wires2.doc

[Crossy]

POWER OFF

Remove the plug from the tube. Using your meter set to resistance (Ohms) you should find a circuit between two pairs of pins on the tube (two heaters). Each heater pair is the equivalent of the end of a straight tube, make sure it's wired as my previous diagram. If you don't find two heaters your tube is duff.

POWER ON, CARE PLEASE!!

With the power on and the starter removed there should be about 220V across the starter socket.

If not put one probe on the incoming neutral and start following the 220V round the circuit, through the ballast and a tube heater to one end of the starter.

Then put a probe on the incoming live and follow the neutral voltage (which will again be 220V) through the other tube heater to the other end of the starter.

Where the volts stop is your fault

Please, please be careful. It may be easier to take the fitting down and play with it on the table, run a flex with a plug to power it whilst under test.

Normally the incoming live goes to the ballast, but it will work either way round just fine.

Edited October 21, 2008 by Crossy

[Daffy D]

Sheryl - Sorry to state the obvious but if the others in your house are the same why not have a look at one of those

Having said that just recently I had to replace one of my circular fittings and the white/grey wires confused me also.

You are talking about the four wires that come from the little plug that goes into the tube. The white ones go to the starter and one grey goes to one side of the ballast while the other grey goes to one of the main wires. The other main wire goes to the other side of the ballast. You have to make a connection between the one grey and mains, twisting and black tape will do.

It does not matter which mains goes to ballast or the grey wire, though I think if you connect the live to the ballast you won't get the little glow from the tube when it is switched off.

One thing to be sure of is that the wires into the starter base are right in. They are only push fit and tend to make a poor connection. Once you have it all wired up just before switching on the power just give those two wires an extra push in.

As "Crossy" says may be better to take the whole thing down and get it working first, just remember if you do that make sure the wires are pushed firmly into the starter base after you fix it up again.

[Sheryl]

Sheryl - Sorry to state the obvious but if the others in your house are the same why not have a look at one of those

Having said that just recently I had to replace one of my circular fittings and the white/grey wires confused me also.

You are talking about the four wires that come from the little plug that goes into the tube. The white ones go to the starter and one grey goes to one side of the ballast while the other grey goes to one of the main wires. The other main wire goes to the other side of the ballast. You have to make a connection between the one grey and mains, twisting and black tape will do.

It does not matter which mains goes to ballast or the grey wire, though I think if you connect the live to the ballast you won't get the little glow from the tube when it is switched off.

One thing to be sure of is that the wires into the starter base are right in. They are only push fit and tend to make a poor connection. Once you have it all wired up just before switching on the power just give those two wires an extra push in.

As "Crossy" says may be better to take the whole thing down and get it working first, just remember if you do that make sure the wires are pushed firmly into the starter base after you fix it up again.

Daffy, I did look at the others but on the others all the wires are white so it didn;t help.

But BLESS you because you have given me the answer at last!!! I had put one grey and one white to the starter, then one of the 2 remaining ones to ballast and one to the live wire, tried boith possible combos of that bto no avail but it never occurred to me that both whites should be to the starter.

So knock on wood you've solved my dilemma (haven't tried it yet) if so I owe you one....

[Crossy]

The final piece of the jigsaw, an illustration of what each pin on a circular tube does

It really is simple

Note that A1 'choke output' means 'ballast', choke is another word for ballast.

By the way, twist and tape is NOT an adequate way to connect the wires, use a screw connector or wire nut, please !

Edited October 26, 2008 by Crossy

[PEP]

The final piece of the jigsaw, an illustration of what each pin on a circular tube does

It really is simple

Note that A1 'choke output' means 'ballast', choke is another word for ballast.

By the way, twist and tape is NOT an adequate way to connect the wires, use a screw connector or wire nut, please !

Crossy. As you are the reccognised electrical Guru for all electrical matters on Thai Visa Forum would you please help with an explanation of the "correct" polaities for wiring here in Thailand:-

EG. I have Red, Black, Yellow, Grey, Brown, White also the Universal Green for "Ground / Earth"

Thanks form a confused ex, "sparkie"

[Crossy]

Crossy. As you are the reccognised electrical Guru for all electrical matters on Thai Visa Forum would you please help with an explanation of the "correct" polaities for wiring here in Thailand:-

EG. I have Red, Black, Yellow, Grey, Brown, White also the Universal Green for "Ground / Earth"

Thanks form a confused ex, "sparkie"

Once a sparks, always a sparks, no such thing as an 'ex' sparkie

The colour codes used in Thailand are most definately confused

You will find :-

US standard - Black=live, white or grey=neutral, green=earth (most common)

IEC standard - Red=live, black=neutral, green=earth

Euro standard - Brown=live, blue=neutral, green/yellow=earth

Along with just about any other 'code' depending upon the cable that the electrician had (or was on offer) at the time, a total nightmare Internal wiring inside appliances, fittings etc. follows no recognised standard (hence this thread).

Even if you find a recognisable code, don't assume that the functions actually follow the colours, 'neutrals' can bite.

Outlets follow US standards, live is on the left with ground at the top, two-pin outlets should have the neutral connected to the wider pin (but I've not seen US style polarised 2 pin plugs here).

If you've not already found it, useful information here http://www.crossy.co.uk/wiring/

Edited October 26, 2008 by Crossy

[Sheryl]

Hallelujah I see the light! (literally -- success!!!)

Thanks to all for help